OT: Pace of Nebraska Recruiting
Good article from Rittenberg on the slower pace of Nebraska recruiting due to their geographic isolation and consequent need to rely on official (university-paid) visits rather than unofficial (prospect-paid) visits. I don't know about you guys, but I've always wondered why Nebraska - despite consistently ranking among the top 25 recruiting classes nationally and in the top 3 recruiting classes in the conference - always seems to have such a sluggish start in receiving verbals.
Of course, it will be interesting to see if Nebraska is able to sustain their recruiting success with now even elite prospects feeling tremendous pressure to commit before their senior year of high school.
http://espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_/id/76405/nebraska-must-be-patient-in-recruiting
Back in the day, they used to be able to feed their no-name farmboys steaks laced with 'roids. Add some weight training and they had everything they needed to slowly wear down just about any team.
Quite often, the scores of games against Iowa State, Kansas, et al. were 14-0/17-0 at halftime. Check back midway through the 4th quarter (when the other team was completely spent) and it would be 55-0/63-0.
Dean Steinkuhler sends his regards.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1126832/
It's weird to read that the Outland winner only weighed 273 - and bench-pressed 350. And that was an admitted steroid user. Offensive linemen today are routinely 40-50 pounds heavier than that and can bench a lot more than that. Makes you wonder...
I mention this often. The legend of the 175 pound freshman who turns into a "corn-fed," 325 pound senior starter faded rather quickly once the NCAA started testing for steroids.
I really love the penalty for a "double clutch" on the save button.
College football has changed, and Nebraka geographically and demographically is being put behind the eight ball. Not to mention the recruiting game has changed, and depending on official visits from a prospects senior season is putting them way behind in the race for the best as well.
If that were true, Chris Peterson couldn't have had Boise State winning for as long as he has. They're no less isolated, and they don't have the history.
Is Nebraska anymore "isolated" than Oklahoma or Wisconsin? Kansas State put together some pretty decent teams while being "isolated". I'm not discounting the article's points, but the assumption which some people are making is that Nebraska is doomed, and I don't believe that at all.
Oklahoma borders Texas, one of the most fertile recruiting grounds in the nation, and gets a lot of prospects from there. Kansas St popped up the last two years, and did previously during the Sproles years; Snyder is a good coach. But even they haven't reach the consistancy. And yes, UW is the exception to the isolated, low "talent", team that everybody always points to (which also plays in the terrible B1G). But there's a reason they're the exception: it's because they're like the only one whose been able to do that. I wouldn't want to have to be the exception to the rule if I were Nebraska.
Snyder has historically recruited lower rated players. He's the anti-Urban Meyer, in that he could give a rip how the services rank/rate a player. He watches in-depth film and evaluates the player's character. The results have been very good.
He's one of the greatest college football coaches ever. Doing what he did at K-State (twice) is amazing.
I'm too lazy to go look up all of them, but I'd be willing to bet a good percentage of those players were high profile recruits their senior year of high school.
It looks like in 2012 he signed 8.
I agree with that completely. But it has nothing to do with being far away from HS football talent.
True, but isn't there something to the idea that Nebraska just feels isolated? I mean, it's Nebraska fergodsakes... home of Children of the Corn. Not to mention that Madison is a well reputed college town while Lincoln is... ehm... have I mentioned Children of the Corn?
as many PEOPLE. Nebraska is one of the least-populous states.
And Madison is not that far from heavily populated areas like Chicago.
Madison has a lot more talent nearby than Lincoln, NE. For one thing, Illinois is literally in their back yard, and that's a fairly talent-rich state.
I'm pretty sure Illinois is not literally Madison's backyard.
Norman is about as close to Dallas as Austin is. Madison is a short drive from Chicago. There is no major city within a 5-6 hour drive from Lincoln, NE.
My friend and I flew to Nebraska for the game last season. The only time we didn't feel like we were out in the middle of nowhere was when we were in Memorial Stadium.
The state of OK has way (way) more talent than NE, and they're very close to Dallas which has tons and tons. Wisconsin is a better example, but they usually start slow as well and don't typically recruit all that well (all four of their recruits right now are in-state). And Kansas State takes more JUCO transfers than any school in the country, but K-State also doesn't recruit well.
The article didn't say Nebraksa is bad because they are isolated, just that their recruiting gets delayed. K-State has a very good coach that makes the most of their lesser talent, and Wisconsin has done a good job of that lately as well.
I live in Omaha, and my positions requires I cover all of the wonderful central states (NE, IA, KS, MO, OK, IL, MN, ND,SD,etc). It takes about 2.5hrs to get to Kansas City and around 6hrs to get to St Louis from Lincoln or Omaha. Manhattan KS is about 45min closer to each, but has nowhere near the facilities, funding, tradition or fan support that Nebraska has.
I think that the big challenge is more around Pellini and his personality/recruiting at the moment than anything else. I also get the feeling that he is close to being in a position to have a Big Ten Championship or else in Lincoln or he may be out the door. He was brought in here for his supposed defensive prowess and I think that pretty much began and ended with Suh and now that Osborne has retired and a new AD in place, I can see that changing. Callahan could recruit but he and the AD at the time were even more out of touch with the tradition and history in Lincoln than Rodriquez in AA.
If Pellini wins at least a Big Ten Championship, they will most likely at least maintain a battle with Penn State on 3/4 in the conference in recruiting when PSU exits purgatory. Even last year they had plenty of visits from big talents from CA, TX, etc during the season, so it is definitely possible to recruit to Lincoln, but the fact that Pellini is neck and neck with the doucebag in South Bend for potential to have a sideline aneurysm does not win him any points picking up the recruits. Winning more games and the backing is there to do well in Lincoln.
He was comparing Nebraska to Oklahoma, not Kansas State.
Nebraska will not win a Big Ten championship anytime soon. Their shot was last year when everything fell into place for them (which obviously fell way out of place during the championship game). They'll make their share of championship games, but they will then lose to whoever was better between us and OSU.
They have a pretty good shot this year at the Legends Div.
Don't know if they can win the B1G Championship game against OSU, but things happen. If something happens to Braxton Miller, OSU is crap.
Nebraska is surrounded by absolutely nothing for hundreds of miles in any direction, and its not like the state produces a lot of top-flight talent anyway.
Something else that hasn't been brought up, but for any Texas recruits that are thinking about going up north to Oklahoma/KSU, well they're still gonna play like 2-3 games per year in Texas.
^ This.
I'm not sure that the move to the Big Ten was a good one for Nebraska football. Actually, I'm pretty sure it was a bad one.
They lose their annual presence in TX which is a key recruiting ground for any Big XII team. Now they are just an out-of-the-way team that is out of sight out of mind in TX. They are reduced to having to fight for scraps in OH after OSU, Michigan, and even MSU are done there.
Nebraska must have really hated the University of Texas to put themselves in this postiton.
It has been mentioned already but it all depends on where you're recruiting base is. Oklahoma recruits Oklahoma and Texas, Wisonsin recruits Wisconsin, Chicago, and Ohio while Nebraska recruits Nebraska??? They used to draw quite a bit from Texas but with the recent move to the BIG that has changed.
Madison isn't isolated at all. In fact, it's not really all that hard to get to, given that Chicago is less than 2.5 hrs away.
Not exactly the same situation. The state of Oklahoma has a pretty solid base of recruits every year, almost comparable to Michigan. Then there's Texas, its border state, which is one of the 3 biggest recruiting states in the country. Texas may be large and spread out, but Michigan's recruiting spread is very comparable to Oklahoma's spread. Nebraska is literally in the middle of nowhere.
Here's a list of Nebraska's border states:
South Dakota, Iowa, Kansas, Colorado and Wyoming.
You could maybe include Missouri, which is probably the best recruiting state among those remotely close to them (Missouri or Colorado). Not to mention that the state of Nebraska isn't exactly known for it's elite football either. Sure, some eliteish guys can pop up here and there, but not near as frequent as even states like Michigan or Oklahoma.
Short story: The current recruiting trend does not assist Nebraska in any way.
Yes, during the Bill Calahan era they recruited very well. Pelini is the opposite of Calahan in just about every way there is possible.
That's not a bad thing.
Their aggregate recruiting class ranking to Rivals has put them in the top 3 of the Big Ten for the last four seasons (every year since 2009). So while they might not be recruiting well by historic Nebraska standards, they are still consistently outrecruiting 75% of the Big Ten.
Yeah, but that's not saying much. We had uncharacteristically mediocre classes for two of those four years (2010 and 2011) because of [**REDACTED**], and Penn State was running on autopilot for about the last 10 years of JoePa's career.
A program like Nebraska should be compared against the top-recruiting programs nationally, not to the rest of the Big Ten.
Recruiting is coaches working their tails off to get into recruits ears, heads and convince them this is the place for them no matter what school they are recruiting for.
Nebraska seems like they are way behind in the evaluation period as well not just sending out offers. They have litte buzz in recruiting so they are in trouble. Nebraska used to have the entire state run it's option offense for hs football so they could take walk on's on offense every yr that were tailor made to step in. That allowed them to focus a little heavier on defense in recruiting.
Nebraska isn't that far from texas, or certainly no further from texas than alabama is and other sec schools tha regularly recruit Texas....they just have to get out and work it., though Pelini has never been known for being a bigtime recruiter.
Your last paragraph just isn't true. Nebraska is certainly much farther away from Texas than nearly every SEC West team, certainly the ones that recruit Texas heavily (and Alabama is really not one of them, 2011-2014 they have 4 guys from Texas, two of which are from Houston which is way closer to Tuscaloosa than Lincoln).
Plus, the SEC West has the benefit of playing in Texas every other year, and a handful of games very close (LSU, Arkansas) and Nebraska can't offer that. Nebraska has actually started recruiting Ohio a lot more than Texas because they'll play closer to home (and Pelini is from there).
A major advantage Nebraska had in recruiting Texas was that they played in the Big 12 and usually had multiple road trips to the various Texas schools to sell. With Nebraska leaving the Big 12, Texas A&M joining the SEC, and TCU joining the Big 12, Texas will become a very difficult place for them or anyone else outside those 2 conferences to recruit consistently.
about 15 different schools, every one of them lacking Nebraska's geographic disadvantage.
That's pretty much it exactly. Most of the top schools, to one degree or another, have both tradition and a rich recruiting base, some more than others in either of those categories, and nearly all of the top top schools have both. Nebraska is one of the only schools that thinks it should be in that top group that has almost no recruiting base to work with (though Oregon is kind of in that same boat).
Oregon doesn't have much of an in-state recruiting base, but it does border on California.
It does border CA, but the closest football talent is the Bay Area which is over 500 miles away, and LA is almost 900 miles away. So although their states border, it's really about the same distance as Nebraska is to Texas (Lincoln to Dallas is about 600 miles).
Yeah, there's not much between Eugene and Sacramento on I-5. Still, it seems like most of the players on any Pac-12 team are going to be from California.
Here is Oregon's 2012 roster. There are a lot of California players but it does appear that they pull from all over.--though I am not familiar enough with Oregon's players to know which of these guys are walk-ons with no realistic hope of playing.
1 | Josh Huff | WR | 5-11 | 200 | JR | HOUSTON, TX |
2 | Bryan Bennett | QB | 6-3 | 199 | SO | ENCINO, CA |
3 | Dior Mathis | CB | 5-9 | 177 | SO | DETROIT, MI |
3 | Jake Rodrigues | QB | 6-3 | 205 | FR | ROCKLIN, CA |
4 | Erick Dargan | DB | 5-11 | 208 | SO | PITTSBURG, CA |
5 | Issac Dixon | DB | 5-11 | 196 | FR | MIAMI GARDENS, FL |
6 | De'Anthony Thomas | RB | 5-9 | 173 | SO | LOS ANGELES, CA |
7 | Keanon Lowe | WR | 5-9 | 179 | SO | PORTLAND, OR |
8 | Reggie Daniels | DB | 6-1 | 185 | FR | CHANDLER, AZ |
8 | Marcus Mariota | QB | 6-4 | 196 | FR | HONOLULU, HI |
9 | Arik Armstead | DL | 6-8 | 297 | FR | SACRAMENTO, CA |
9 | Byron Marshall | RB | 5-10 | 195 | FR | SAN JOSE, CA |
10 | Rahsaan Vaughn | WR | 6-2 | 193 | SR | OAKLAND, CA |
11 | Bralon Addison | WR | 5-10 | 185 | FR | MISSOURI CITY, TX |
12 | Devon Blackmon | WR | 6-1 | 194 | FR | FONTANA, CA |
12 | Brian Jackson | DB | 5-10 | 202 | JR | HOOVER, AL |
13 | Troy Hill | DB | 5-11 | 167 | SO | VENTURA, CA |
14 | Ifo Ekpre-Olomu | CB | 5-10 | 190 | SO | CHINO HILLS, CA |
14 | Dustin Haines | QB | 6-3 | 208 | JR | EUGENE, OR |
15 | Colt Lyerla | TE | 6-5 | 238 | SO | HILLSBORO, OR |
16 | Daryle Hawkins | WR | 6-4 | 198 | JR | OMAHA, NE |
17 | Jeff Lockie | QB | 6-2 | 180 | FR | DANVILLE, CA |
17 | James Scales III | DB | 5-10 | 184 | SO | GREENSBORO, NC |
18 | Dwayne Stanford | WR | 6-5 | 210 | FR | CINCINNATI, OH |
19 | Eric Dungy | WR | 6-1 | 181 | SO | TAMPA, FL |
21 | Chance Allen | WR | 6-2 | 191 | FR | MISSOURI CITY, TX |
21 | Avery Patterson | CB | 5-10 | 185 | JR | PITTSBURG, CA |
22 | Derrick Malone | LB | 6-2 | 205 | SO | COLTON, CA |
23 | B.J. Kelley | WR | 6-2 | 179 | FR | FRESNO, CA |
25 | Boseko Lokombo | LB | 6-3 | 225 | JR | ABBOTSFORD, BC |
26 | Ben Butterfield | WR | 6-0 | 193 | JR | SHERWOOD, OR |
27 | Terrance Mitchell | DB | 6-0 | 185 | SO | SACRAMENTO, CA |
28 | Eric Amoako | DB | 5-11 | 190 | FR | ARLINGTON, TX |
29 | Stephen Amoako | DB | 5-11 | 190 | FR | ARLINGTON, TX |
30 | Dylan Ausherman | K | 6-3 | 180 | JR | VISALIA, CA |
30 | Ayele Forde | RB | 5-7 | 177 | SO | VICTORVILLE, CA |
30 | Bronson Yim | DB | 5-10 | 181 | FR | HONOLULU, HI |
31 | Kenny Bassett | RB | 5-9 | 176 | SO | BEVERLY HILLS, CA |
31 | Oshay Dunmore | DB | 6-2 | 195 | FR | NEWPORT, OR |
32 | Evan Baylis | TE | 6-6 | 232 | FR | CENTENNIAL, CO |
32 | J.R. Maffie | DB | 5-11 | 193 | JR | DIAMOND BAR, CA |
33 | Tyson Coleman | LB | 6-1 | 217 | FR | LAKE OSWEGO, OR |
34 | Rahim Cassell | LB | 6-0 | 215 | FR | LAKEWOOD, CA |
34 | Lane Roseberry | RB | 6-1 | 230 | FR | -- |
35 | Anthony Wallace | LB | 6-0 | 231 | SO | DALLAS, TX |
36 | Carlyle Garrick | LB | 6-2 | 221 | FR | CASTRO VALLEY, CA |
36 | Jennings Stewart | TE | 6-3 | 225 | SR | GRANTS PASS, OR |
37 | Michael Manns | WR | 5-11 | 165 | FR | MOLALLA, OR |
37 | Jordan Thompson | RB | 0-0 | 0 | FR | -- |
38 | Bill Chimphalee | RB | 6-0 | 210 | JR | -- |
38 | Mike Garrity | LB | 6-1 | 222 | SO | SAN CARLOS, CA |
39 | Drew Howell | LS | 6-2 | 218 | JR | TEHACHAPI, CA |
39 | Jimmy Musgrave | TE | 6-0 | 220 | FR | VICTORVILLE, CA |
40 | Brett Bafaro | LB | 6-2 | 225 | FR | HILLSBORO, OR |
41 | Alejandro Maldonado | K | 5-10 | 190 | JR | COLTON, CA |
41 | Blake Stanton | WR | 5-11 | 210 | SO | LOS ANGELES, CA |
42 | Cody Carriger | DL | 6-6 | 230 | FR | BUTTE, MT |
43 | Keloni Kamalani | LB | 5-11 | 208 | JR | KIHEI, HI |
44 | DeForest Buckner | DL | 6-7 | 230 | FR | HONOLULU, HI |
45 | Austin Daich | DB | 6-3 | 185 | FR | -- |
45 | Terrence Daniel | TE | 6-6 | 230 | FR | OAKLAND, CA |
48 | Rodney Hardrick | LB | 6-1 | 237 | SO | COLTON, CA |
48 | Eric Solis | K | 5-10 | 192 | SO | SHERMAN OAKS, CA |
49 | Jackson Rice | P | 6-3 | 223 | SR | MORAGA, CA |
50 | Ryan Hagen | DT | 6-3 | 292 | JR | BREA, CA |
51 | Isaac Ava | LB | 5-10 | 243 | SO | EWA BEACH, HI |
52 | Dawson Housley | LB | 6-3 | 200 | FR | -- |
54 | Hamani Stevens | OL | 6-3 | 305 | SO | HEMET, CA |
55 | Hroniss Grasu | OL | 6-3 | 284 | SO | ENCINO, CA |
56 | Alex Balducci | DL | 6-4 | 275 | FR | PORTLAND, OR |
57 | Trevor Fox | OL | 6-5 | 280 | JR | TEMECULA, CA |
57 | Ryan McCandless | DE | 6-2 | 213 | FR | SANTA ROSA, CA |
58 | James Euscher | OL | 6-7 | 291 | FR | ALOHA, OR |
59 | Jeff Palmer | LS | 5-10 | 187 | SR | DANA POINT, CA |
59 | Grant Thompson | LB | 5-11 | 220 | SO | COTTAGE GROVE, OR |
60 | Ryan Clanton | OL | 6-5 | 296 | SR | BAKERSFIELD, CA |
61 | Nick Cody | OL | 6-5 | 309 | SR | BRUSH PRAIRIE, WA |
62 | Matt Pierson | OL | 6-6 | 251 | FR | WEST LINN, OR |
63 | Mana Greig | OL | 5-11 | 297 | JR | KAILUA, HI |
64 | Tyler Johnstone | OL | 6-6 | 271 | FR | CHANDLER, AZ |
66 | Taylor Hart | DT | 6-6 | 289 | JR | TUALATIN, OR |
68 | Jamal Prater | OL | 6-4 | 278 | FR | ETIWANDA, CA |
70 | Matthew McFadden | OL | 6-4 | 303 | SR | -- |
71 | Everett Benyard | OL | 6-7 | 319 | JR | SAN DIEGO, CA |
72 | Andre Yruretagoyena | OL | 6-5 | 264 | FR | SCOTTSDALE, AZ |
75 | Jake Fisher | OL | 6-6 | 279 | SO | TRAVERSE CITY, MI |
77 | Carson York | G | 6-5 | 293 | SR | COEUR D ALENE, ID |
78 | Karrington Armstrong | OL | 6-3 | 286 | JR | RENO, NV |
80 | Koa Ka'ai | TE | 6-4 | 249 | FR | HONOLULU, HI |
81 | Aaron Lee | WR | 6-1 | 195 | SO | -- |
82 | Christian French | DE | 6-5 | 231 | FR | CEDAR RAPIDS, IA |
84 | Stetzon Bair | DL | 6-9 | 265 | SO | SAINT ANTHONY, ID |
84 | Chad Delaney | WR | 6-0 | 181 | JR | ELMIRA, OR |
85 | Pharaoh Brown | TE | 6-6 | 230 | FR | LYNDHURST, OH |
86 | Brian Teague | TE | 6-3 | 267 | JR | PORTLAND, OR |
87 | Nick Morrison | DL | 6-4 | 258 | JR | EVERETT, WA |
88 | Jeff Bedbury | WR | 6-0 | 195 | SO | EUGENE, OR |
89 | Will Murphy | WR | 6-2 | 186 | SR | ALBANY, OR |
90 | Ricky Heimuli | DT | 6-4 | 321 | JR | GLENDALE, UT |
91 | Dane Ebanez | WR | 5-9 | 178 | JR | NORTH POLE, AK |
91 | Tony Washington | DE | 6-3 | 252 | SO | RANCHO CUCAMONGA, CA |
92 | Patrick Acosta | WR | 5-8 | 167 | JR | -- |
92 | Wade Keliikipi | DT | 6-3 | 300 | JR | WAIANAE, HI |
93 | Rob Beard | K | 6-0 | 218 | SR | FULLERTON, CA |
94 | Axel McQuaw | OL | 6-6 | 275 | JR | YACHATS, OR |
97 | Hayden Crook | K | 5-10 | 155 | FR | BEND, OR |
97 | Jared Ebert | DT | 6-5 | 267 | JR | IOWA CITY, IA |
98 | David Kafovalu | DE | 6-3 | 250 | SO | RIVERSIDE, CA |
99 | Sam Kamp | DL | 6-4 | 236 | FR | MESA, AZ |
Thanks for that post. I'm glad you posted that asinine table instead of, say, just fucking linking to the roster.
I have a theory that Oregon and Boise have risen as Washington collapsed in the wake of the Don James scandal. I'm pretty sure they used to compete with USC/UCLA as the dominant school in the Pac 10 by getting the highly ranked kids from SoCal that USC/UCLA didn't have room for and filling in from the PacNW.
It does seem pretty clear that the rise of Oregon and the decline of Washington are pretty closely linked. Boise may be a different story.
They very well should be in that top group. Nebraska's geographic isolation is nothing new, yet they were borderline invincible in the mid-90's. Between '93 and '97, Tom Osborne went 60-3 or something and came within a missed field goal of three consecutive perfect seasons. Though it might be unrealistic for them to expect to duplicate that level of dominance now, there's no reason why they shouldn't be competing for national championships. Given the resources and tradition of that program, it's hard not to think that Pelini has underachieved, geography notwithstanding.