UM-MSU Snowflakes Thread
It is probably not too early to start this up. I love the team and the success they have had this year so far, but in order to go far in the tournament they've got to step it up.
The lack of physicality on this team is a noticeable issue - they have gotten eaten up inside by teams with a halfway decent big man.
Trey Burke is the only one who can create offense for others. No other players can penetrate to the hole with regularity. You slow Burke down and Michigan suffers.
You're not going to get very far on jump shots alone. Take it to the hole.
EDIT: The defense is average at best. Get in front of someone and cut off drives to the hoop...PLEASE.
Enough said.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:34 PM ^
I actually think our OOC schedule was one of the best. Maybe not at the top, but Pitt, K-State, and NC State have all been solid teams. MSU played Kansas (overrated) and UConn, and lost to Miami which now looks a lot better but still doesn't count as a win.
We'll be fine. Stop sinking the ship guys.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:49 PM ^
None of the other non-conferernce foes are worth a crap.
February 13th, 2013 at 7:19 AM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:26 PM ^
Horford is done. Bielfeldt or bust. Morgan is still banged up, really questionable having him out there. Robinson is a shell of himself. He's having THJ's first two seasons bundled into one. Don't have to worry about him going to the NBA. THJ could probably stick around too, he'd be the face of the program next season. Just a sloppy game overall. Obviously, we are not this bad, but you have got to question Beilein's ability in this big road games.
Penn State-Illinois-Penn State? That's just what we need right now.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:26 PM ^
I hate to quote George Pearles, but the tougher team won.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:27 PM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:29 PM ^
Honestly, are there any B1G teams we would win a fight against? Maybe Northwestern? Maybe.... We are soft, soft, soft.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:32 PM ^
A common meme when we look bad is that we have major contribution from freshmen. True and noted.
But at the same time, I ask where we can actually expect to grow? I doubt Stauskas will magically get good at defense by the end of this year. I doubt GRIII grows up to play the 4 against physical teams by the end of this year. Then we probably lose Burke and THJ at the end of this year. Gone with them is essentially the entirety of this team's shot creation on offense.
I know I'm all gloom and doom and preparing for my flamebait ending thought, but until we start cloning McGarys and Burkes, I fear that we've seen this team (and future teams with this core of players) hit its ceiling.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:31 PM ^
Kate Upton is on Letterman tonight....wish I didnt just smash my TV to pieces
February 12th, 2013 at 11:32 PM ^
I hate my life.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:33 PM ^
Rebound!
February 12th, 2013 at 11:34 PM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:35 PM ^
One: MSU easily played their best game of the year - they earned it tonight.
Two: No conference allows as much hand checking and bumping as the Big Ten (except the ACC's allowance for Duke). The tournament will open up some space.
Three: This team is playing game 4 of an obscene 4-game stretch. This team looked tired. Go lose at Wisconsin 3 days ago the way these kids did and see how you show up at your next game - on the road.
Four: No team in the conference has had a stretch like this. State has near the equivalent with 2 at home and 2 away. If they're better than 2-2 in that stretch, they'll have deserved the regular season crown.
Five: all the big ones are at home the rest of the way out - and there's only 2. And the next 3 games are cake-tastic; a change to get healthy.
They'll sweep their way to the finale against Indiana for a chance to share the crown. That one I'm not predicting. And Belien is tough to prepare for - we are not the most upsetable team in the country. Barring injury, I still expect a very good March
February 13th, 2013 at 7:10 AM ^
You can let that Wisconsin game beat you twice or you can use it as a valuable teaching moment.
February 13th, 2013 at 11:27 AM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:36 PM ^
What I wouldn't give to still have Stu and Novak on the team. The Wolverines lack leadership and the on-court smarts of experience. I just don't get the sense that Burke or Hardaway understand how to steady a game when things begin to spin out of control. I have no doubt that the freshmen are mentally worn out after this stretch which means they must rely even more on Hardaway and Burke to keep the game broken down into pieces they can handle, instead within the first few minutes they looked helpless against an avalanche they saw rolling their way.
My biggest hope is that this drubbing embarrasses and pisses them off enough that they figure out, like I posted previously, how to play with a "get-the-fuck-off-my-court" attitude. More than anything, that's what State brought tonight.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:37 PM ^
tell Red to get the hockey team out of the MBB team locker room.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:38 PM ^
When it got tough, they quit. No fight tonight.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:39 PM ^
I didn't realize Lloyd Carr was with Hoke at the game. Makes it worse, somehow.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:41 PM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 5:49 AM ^
-Rod Tidwell
February 12th, 2013 at 11:42 PM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 7:00 AM ^
If you've ever been to an Izzo practice and compared it to Beileins these outcomes would not surprise you.
There is a HUGE difference in intensity and that carries over to the games. Our intensity the past few years was player driven and those players are gone.
Don't get me wrong, I love Beilein and these players may grow into great competitors, but they aren't right now and so we'll cower in the corner while the more intense teams pound us.
I hate to say it but it is not a coincidence that OSU, MSU, Wisconsin and IU all had great games against us. They play harder and we're terrible on defense.
If Izzo or Coach K had our players I have no doubt that we'd be a lockdown defensive unit. We are not too small to accomplish that. These players just have to care more. Until then, we'll be a talented team who wins every game except games against teams that play defense. Defense gives us the heebie jeebies
February 12th, 2013 at 11:46 PM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:47 PM ^
was outcoached in the last two games. The offense has been terrible, it's the same pick and roll play 90% of the time and if that doesn't work the ball just gets flung around the arc until someone jacks up a shot. Movement toward the basket, both with and without the ball is nearly non-existent. Thus we draw no fouls and we can't score for shit unless we're scorching from the 3pt line. I can't understand how Beilein is unable to get this group to score.
On defense, well, I think the problem is more systemic. Beilein's 3-heavy system depends on a four who can shoot threes. Unfortunately, three-point shooting and rebounding are not commonly found in the same player (praise be Novak). To over come that you need either (1) a dominate 5 to control the boards; or (2) a lot of hustle and gang rebounding by perimeter players. Lately, we've got neither. The lack of shot blocking makes on-ball defense of the upmost importance, although I don't see anything in Beilein's system that would tend to a lack of shot-blocking, except maybe hesitancy to foul. The on-ball defense has been horrible, but that's completely on the players, not the system.
I'm not sure it's fair to blame the problem on the team being a "finesse" team on offense, since you can have a "finesse", which I suppose means non-post based, offense without having horrible on ball defenders. Both the Heat and Spurs run what would be considered a finesse offense, but their defenses are very good. But notice that the forwards on those teams, namely Kawahi Leonard and LeBron, are good rebounders. Our forwards, GRIII and Stauskas, are pretty shit rebounders (but good 3pt shooters) and I think that's part of the problem. The other part is just lazy on ball defense.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:08 AM ^
The offense is what is so frustrating to me. It's like you said they're either doing a 3 man weave on the perimeter or pick and roll on the perimeter. Do not they not have any set plays to free someone up? No one is moving without the ball. They rarely if ever throw the ball into the low post. For a coach that is supposed to be really good with the x and o's, you'd think he'd come up with a few tweaks here and there over this tough stretch.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:37 AM ^
I don't know if I'd call them a "finesse" team. I think of them more as a team that likes to get out and run, led by a PG who can fly and makes good decisions in transition. Slow them down with a physical, in your shorts type defense though and they grind to a halt. I don't understand this though since JB is known for his offense. It's as if he threw all of those concepts out the window when he saw what Morris could do with a pick and roll. I don't know if that's on Burke, if the freshmen have yet to grasp what has been described as a difficult to learn offense or what. This team cannot seem to think beyond one pass and from what I know of the offense that JB brought to Ann Arbor it was about multiple decisions on each pass, depending on what action they got from the defense. I don't see them thinking the game like this at all.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:48 PM ^
No shouting or suicide drills. Just make the point that until you stop being so soft , your name is not going on a UM jersey. Kicking PSU's butt doesn't count either. Beilein must in his own way get these boys to grow up.
And does anyone think Hardaway is ready for the pros?
February 13th, 2013 at 12:08 AM ^
February 12th, 2013 at 11:49 PM ^
Let's lick our wounds and get back at it. Nothing like Penn st. to get ya back on track. MSU took the first of four at home, the season isn't over yet.
February 12th, 2013 at 11:59 PM ^
Another issue I see is a lack of physicality and want to play tough on both ends of the floor. It almost comes off as an attitude problem. I notice way too many easy buckets inside the paint and too many second chance points. I know coach B's teams have never been known for defense, however if we could buckle down and play great defense we would be almost un-beatable. I'm not ready to give up because we're so young and the 5 game stretch we just went through was brutal as hell. Hopefully we learn from it and become better for it. Go blue.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:18 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 12:22 AM ^
KenPom was a little off tonight.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:33 AM ^
It's probably no coincidence that at least right now the top 3 teams in the conference standings (IU, MSU and Wisky) have the 3 biggest road wins in conference play - IU in Columbus, Wisky in Bloomington and Sparty in Madison.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:35 AM ^
If we're playing this poorly at NCAA time, we're going to need a fortunate draw to make it out of the first weekend. I wouldn't put a nickel on this team right now.
February 13th, 2013 at 7:04 AM ^
going to call into WTKA this morning? Tell me when so I can turn it to 97.1.
February 13th, 2013 at 12:40 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 2:40 PM ^
If MSU could beat us up on the inside like that, what would the Fab Five have done?
February 13th, 2013 at 1:21 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 1:49 AM ^
I was at the game in the middle of the inbreds. Don't give up yet on this team, still a lot of Big Ten Season and Tourney time left to bounce back from a 2 game meltdown.
February 13th, 2013 at 3:31 AM ^
- Team didn't win a single loose ball tonight. The 10 day stretch obviously had them on fumes tonight
- Played the tough stretch with their most experienced big man barely able to contribute. Love him or hate him, we all knew they needed JM against MSU's inside game
- Whine much? I know I do. But the first 4 minutes of the 2nd half, the whistle took this game from a 10 point game to a 20 point game very quickly with Burke's terrible 3rd foul call (is that a foul on Nix every time he puts a 'gentle' shoulder into a defender to move him?) and Payne landing on Stauskas on the pump fake. I have always believed 2 or 3 bad calls, timed right, can change a close game into a blowout.
- In a world where UM, MSU, Ind, OSU, Wisky, and Minn don't lose at home and beat everyone else, UM and MSU are still on pace for 4 B1G losses and another shared title.
February 13th, 2013 at 5:05 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 6:10 AM ^
College basketball can be impacted by player emotion and state had a lot more. That is disappointing. I still expect great things from the team this year. I don't have an analysis as to why but I think Robinson gets a second wind and the coaches come up with the right adjustments. Or maybe too much sun is messing with my logic.
February 13th, 2013 at 7:26 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 7:40 AM ^
I really think that this 2 week stretch was the worst possible way the schedule could have played out. For a young team looking to build/maintain confidence, the fact that they were on the road for 3/4 with the middle game a killer against OSU meant there was no breather, no time to recover, etc. Now the onslaught is over, however I think their confidence has been affected in a way that a more spread out schedule would not have caused.
It's not an excuse, the B1G schedulers weren't trying to screw anybody, just bad luck imo
February 13th, 2013 at 8:02 AM ^
Hope our HR rep doesn't care if I have to resort to punching a Sparty in the face this morning for their big mouths.
February 13th, 2013 at 9:08 AM ^
February 13th, 2013 at 8:05 AM ^
/kidding
/ducks
February 13th, 2013 at 8:19 AM ^
At least we didn't wear alternate uniforms? #snowflake