Should the Big Ten Consider Removing Penn State From the Conference?

Submitted by bryemye on November 6th, 2011 at 1:35 PM

Pretty simple question. This is the most heinous case I have seen come out of college sports that involved the entire chain of command up to the president of the university. The university's reaction to this has been whatever the word for appalling but a thousand times more is. A thousand times appaling. Writing this I'm getting nauseous.

Point being: this does not represent the values of the Big Ten or any conference but especially the Big Ten. I don't see a gray area here but I'm happy to have someone investigate to see if there is one. If things are as bad as they seem, then I don't want to be associated with that place in any way shape or form. I think there should at least be an investigation with the threat of removal present.



1 percent

November 6th, 2011 at 1:43 PM ^

If this happened to 40 kids or whatever the insane number is and everyone knew, from coaches to president then sure think about it. Not sure it will happen though.

turd sandwich

November 6th, 2011 at 2:01 PM ^

While I don't think PSU should be removed from the conference, you seriously need to think about your comment. You can't put a number on something like this. I don't care if it was one or 100 kids, it's absolutely beyond heinous regardless. You can't say "oh it was only a few kids." No that's not how it works. You can't say "oh wow they did this to 40 kids, that's too many." Just no. Sorry but for real the number shouldn't affect the decision in a case like this.

1 percent

November 6th, 2011 at 2:31 PM ^

True but I think it is safe to assume someone faces more time in prison by molesting 40 kids than 1. I also think it is safe to assume the NCAA will come down harder on a program with 40 violations instead of one violation. 

I also never said oh wow they did this to 40 kids, thats too many. I said they did this to 40 kids because they face 40 counts, I have no idea how many and Im not downgrading kids victim 1-39 either.. 40 counts of anything is a lot and is an insane number in a case like this.. Molesting one child is wrong in every way. Molesting 40 kids in wrong in every way, as well, but the judicial system and NCAA tend to give harder punishment for 40 counts on anything as opposed to 1.


November 6th, 2011 at 3:36 PM ^

Really, for what? Did he not report it to his boss? Did he try and protect his friend? You don't have an answer for the first besides your own inner anger at roaming college sports blogs, for the second the answer is no, and the third is also no. 

You might think he should have followed up, but let me tell you a little secret about looking at someone else's decision and saying you'd have done better. NO YOU WOULDN'T HAVE, YOU'D HAVE DONE WORSE. 



November 6th, 2011 at 1:46 PM ^

And I share it.  Who would ever harm a child?  It is even worse to harm those challenged youths.

But there are a lot of bad characters in good places.  Think of the Catholic Church where it is fair to say that molestation was unbelievably common.

Do not think of Ohio State, where there are many bad characters in bad places.  That would seem to be a place where the lack of institutional control was systemic.


November 6th, 2011 at 4:00 PM ^

100% right.  Not to jump to conclusions (of perhaps maybe to do just that), if you read the GJ indictment, and the allegations are in deed true, this was not a "nobody" could have known situation, and the allegations are that of prolonged, to some degree visible, improper conduct on the athletic campus.  It makes you wonder about Sandusky's conduct toward other individuals connected with the program.  The kids in these reports are in some cases not that much older than incoming freshman football players.

Paterno will not be the coach at the end of this season, he may not be the coach by next weeks game.  You though SMU had its program "shut down."  This program may actually be shut down.  I am not sure if a lot of posters on here know how serious this is and is going to be.


November 6th, 2011 at 4:58 PM ^

Just to clarify, the victims in this case were NOT older than incoming college freshman.  In at least one case, the abuse began when the victim was ten and continued for four years.  I don't think that this is what you meant, but sometimes when the victims are seen as older teens it can mitigate the blame put on the perpetrator.  These victims were definitely children.


November 6th, 2011 at 5:48 PM ^

You're right that it's a different of magnitude, but Ohio and PSU are also categorically much different in my mind.

Ohio involves dishonesty and cheating....  the reality is what happened there was wrong, but no one's life is permanently fucked up as a result.

PSU on the other hand......  Man.  I read part of the grand jury report, and in 2002 a grad. assistant walked into the shower of the PSU locker room and saw Jerry Sandusky raping a 10 year old boy.  

The Ohio and PSU things are apples and oranges, the PSU thing being way, way, way worse.  They're not even in the same category.  PSU is something that goes beyond athletics and involves multiple individuals being scarred for life. 

JoPa knew about the 2002 incident.  How he is off the hook and the Athletic Director is not is something I don't understand.

Until now JoePa has been someone that I think has been well-liked by every college football fan (me at least and many I know).....  hearing him say "Come to Penn SHHHHTTATE!!!" on those BTN commercials was legendary and the man was an institution in college football.  

This whole situation is just sad.  At the very least it tarnishes his reputation....  and at the end of this it could be even worse for hiim, if he winds up being charged with or convicted of a crime in this.

But regardless of what happens to JoePa, about a dozen kids are now traumatized for life from sexual abuse. This is way worse, and way different, than what happened at Ohio.


November 6th, 2011 at 6:52 PM ^

 regarding the Catholic Church abuses....

Since the mid-1980s, insurance companies have offered sexual misconduct coverage as a rider on liability insurance, and their own studies indicate that Catholic churches are not higher risk than other congregations. Insurance companies that cover all denominations, such as Guide One Center for Risk Management, which has more than 40,000 church clients, does not charge Catholic churches higher premiums. "We don't see vast difference in the incidence rate between one denomination and another," says Sarah Buckley, assistant vice president of corporate communications. "It's pretty even across the denominations." It's been that way for decades .. 


block quote fail, but the point is there is no greater percentage of priests who abuse children vs. any other profession in the world.  It is only that the Catholic church gets more press for its abuses than doctors or teachers or coaches.  Parents actually fall into the category of highest percentage of abusers.  But nobody thinks that it is  "common" for the average household to have abusive parents.



Steve in PA

November 7th, 2011 at 10:35 AM ^

The B10 really has no jurisdiction in this matter, but if they had a mechanism in place before hand they would be in a position to act now.  Pa state law requires allegations be reported to law enforcement, B10 could make this apply across all schools and provide a sanction mechanism if that doesn't occur even if it is not state law.

Unfortunately, we live in a society where many have to be explicitly instructed what is the correct response for an action that has occurred.  How many times are we going to hear about sexual assaults that were handled internally, for example?  

Some things are beyond the scope of Athletic Departments.


November 6th, 2011 at 1:58 PM ^

Would there be any NCAA penalties? I mean it's against the law for sure, but thats not against the NCAA rules persay? 

Ex. MSU players beating everyone up in a dorm, get jailtime. MSU itself doesn't face any discipline


November 6th, 2011 at 1:55 PM ^

This is pretty much a non-discussion. No reason to punish the rest of PSU and the rest of the B1G by removing them from the conference. In a situation like this, it's best for Delany to get completely out of the way so the NCAA can handle any and all punishments accordingly (hopefully).