"But Alabama's 27-20 overtime loss to Michigan in the CFP semifinal at the Rose Bowl on Jan. 1 was a hard one for Saban to digest."
Anyone else smile when they read this? And think "OMG, Michigan really did win a national championship! Michigan beat Bama and sent Nick Saban to retirement as a loser". Holy fuck.
I think the only way we keep the scheme is if we co-DC Clink and Elston. If either one of those guys leave, it seems way harder to keep this going. Wade fired the LB coach. Elston is DL. Clink is DBs. And *supposedly* Clink doesn't want to call plays. So he's already Co-DC and is happy with the role he has there. That means we have to hope Elston wants to call plays and is good at it.
If we can get through the next 1-2 years with those guys, the candidate pool will grow with at least three NFL teams running the amoeba. We just need to bridge the gap somehow.
I am happy for MacDonald, but doesn't this potentially seem bad for Michigan? Since there appear to be a limited number of people who know the Ravens' defense, it seems like it will be harder for us to keep running the scheme if any more defensive coaches leave. If both Clink and Elston leave, it seems like it will be impossible to keep it going. MacDonald is certainly going to bring Ravens' staff defensive with him. JH is trying to build the same thing in LA. John needs to now plug holes in Balt (Oor as DC perhaps?). Who would Michigan have left to hire? We need to open the checkbook to keep our defensive coaches here or we'll lose some key players too.
I am quite conflicted. I am tired of this “show me the love” game Jim plays every year. I don’t understand how being Michigan’s coach isn’t good enough for him. That being said, I have no idea what’s going on behind the scenes and why he isn’t “feeling the love”. If I had to choose who to believe, regents (politicians) and the AD or Jim Harbaugh, I believe Jim. This university cannot help making dumb decisions so I would not be surprised if they are doing something stupid *again*. So yeah, I could see them balking at demands that the “for cause” clause of new contract be modified. I look at such a modification as low risk. If the NCAA does indeed overreach and do something stupid like ban Jim, then I think it’s time to part ways with the NCAA. Are you just gonna wait for them to go after the next coach that dares to challenge their stranglehold? Are they that cowardly? At that point you are dealing with open corruption on a massive scale and it’s time to look at alternatives.
And I’ll admit that if JH leaves under such circumstances I will greatly lose enthusiasm for Michigan football. I’ll take the joy of the NC and move on.
Harbaugh is a grown man who as accomplished great things. I find it impossible to believe this is about Warde “liking” him or anyone else in the administration. When he says he wants them to “show the love” it’s obviously in other ways. Not more money for himself. Not hugs. Etc. So what *is* “the love”? I’m not sure. Money for staff? Probably. Bigger NIL commitment? Sure, although I don’t think this means buying players. Support when the usual bad guys come trying to take him down because he’s pushing for players to get a market wage? Absolutely. There may be other things I can’t think of. But it’s not salary and hugs. It’s “love” in the form of support. If Michigan can’t give him that after an NC, it’s really sad and will damper my enthusiasm post-Harbaugh. I am sure if he leaves the U will spin it as “Jim just wants a Super Bowl.” But we have heard the same message over and over from multiple sources: he wants to stay but he wants to be shown “the love”. I don’t think this is about the NFL. He truly loves Michigan but it has to grate on him he was out six games this season for BS reasons. He doesn’t want that to happen again.
I believe the Washington athletic department has a lot of debt and is lucky to break even nowadays. It’s one of the reasons they felt they *had* to take the Big Ten’s lowish offer - still better than what the PAC was offering - and leave. I don’t see how they have the resources to approach Bama. Now maybe DeBoer is just using this as a negotiation tactic to get more for his program. It suggests he doesn’t really want to leave but wants a commitment for increased spending. Still I wonder where that money would come from. They don’t have a rich Nike alum who is willing to commit funds.
This is such a strange obsession Sparty has with Michigan fans and degrees. Who cares if someone rooting for a school got a degree there? And if you are that concerned with it, are you not admitting it's quite the accomplishment?
That would be great but the Lions are already grooming Hendon Hooker to take over. They could certainly swap one for the other, and it would be a smart thing marketing-wise (local hero on Lions). Not sure which is a better pro prospect, however. I believe HH is more accurate but less mobile.
I compare this to what Klatt had to say and it’s sad. Paul is a talking head shill. He is asked specifically “how did this happen” and offers no specifics at all. He knows next to nothing about Michigan…even now. “I was wrong”. Of course you were because your takes are super shallow and not even based in a deep knowledge of the game.
Klatt had a very thoughtful, well thought out take grounded in a deep understanding of Michigan and football in general.
Look at how little credit many here gave MSU during their run of dominance. Brian and all saw the issues - domination at the LOS - but we had many posters every season expecting to beat MSU and return things to "normal". I think things are worse over at 11W. They've dug in on some narratives to protect their precious egos. But we weren't THAT far off here during peak MSU.
I found out from Eleven Warriors that the starting center (Hinzman) was held out. It apparently had something to do with an interview he gave that told too much truth - an interview that apparently never aired because OSU squashed it. Anyhow this resulted in a player being moved to center who had very limited experience there. And it showed. OSU could not setup protections all game long on passing plays. Run blocking was inconsistent at best. Asked after the game why Hinzman didn’t play, Day said “he practiced poorly” or some other throw away comment and wouldn’t talk further. That seems like an unlikely reason.
I find I still have the old expectations. On that last drive I was sure the Vikes would score. It wasn’t “if”. It was “how”. Because the Lions have lost so many games at Minny and last year was a classic Lions collapse. I know they aren’t SOL logically but I have three decades of emotional conditioning to overcome.
OSU fans: "The Cheaters are gonna lose so many players next season will be a rebuild. We are gonna win!"
Michigan fans every year of the early 2010s: "MSU loses so many guys we are definitely gonna win next season!"
Turns out player development is really important and teams that can do that reload. Also creating a sense of loyalty gets players to return who could transfer or go pro.
From what I've seen from OSU those two things are lacking at this point.
I concede this is possible. I guess we will see as the season progresses and Juwan's role increases. But did the bigs last season play great defense? I know 1-on-1 he's considered a great bigs coach. But as HC, does he get much time to do this? Not sure.
Sherrone rocks and all. Did amazing stuff. But after Saturday, it's hard to say anyone does more with less than Parker. How many of those guys will get drafted? Can you imagine him at OSU?
Yeah. Supposed to be. You know, I'm not one of those "fire the coach" knee jerk people, but when the team doesn't even succeed at the head coach's supposed strength, you have to wonder what the next step is. I had to go back and look at the last four years to give me some perspective because I'd forgotten most of this but:
20-21 Big Ten regular season champs; Elite Eight in NCAA
21-22 Mediocre regular season with Sweet Sixteen NCAA run that sort of salvaged it.
22-23 18-16 overall, 11-9 Big Ten, lost in 2nd round of NIT
23-24 4-4 with best win over SJU
I know CBB has changed dramatically during that stretch. NIL and transfers have changed roster management completely. But Michigan appears to be stuck in a medicore trajectory. I'm not entirely sure changing coaches would net us much unless we got a homerun hire. And I just don't see that happening. I mean, we could. We have the money. But Michigan has never seemed as committed to basketball as football. So - throws up hands - I dunno man. I just know the winter and spring are way more enjoyable when Michigan basketball is good.
I was coming to post exactly this. Beilein's defenses were pretty terrible until he hired Yaklich and gave him D control. It's too important to be a shared responsibility IMO. And defense is the great equalizer since it's less variable than offense.
It's funny. Fox is already tagging its videos with "JH to the NFL?" even when there are zero rumors of any NFL interest and the NFL season isn't close to done. But it will generate clicks from Michigan, OSU and MSU fans for different reasons.
This is a good hire for Indiana. JMUs been very successful under Cignetti, even after moving from FCS to FBS. Frankly I am surprised Cignetti is interested. I would have thought he could do much better than IU.
Yes. It's still "we are better than you except our coach keeps blowing it". Which is *super* simplistic. It allows osu fans to keep thinking they are "superior" so no major changes are needed, just minor tweaks. Well, when your biggest rival is consistently outperforming you in player development, game preparation, in-game adjustments, offensive and defensive lines, execution, etc you have a problem.
This reminds me of how Michigan fans behaved during the MSU domination stretch in the late 00s and early 2010s. We were in a similar state of denial. We had better recruits and we had owned MSU for a long time. We "deserved" to win and every year we'e look forward to that game assuming things would return to "normal.". But it didn't happen. Why? Similar reasons: MSU did a better job of developing talent (more with less), was better on the lines, out prepared us, made better adjustments, etc. Things didn't turn back our way until we adjusted those things and MSU slid back to its mean.
All of this is to say, OSU has some things that are broken that need fixing. It is not nearly as simple as a few gameday tweaks. Ffs, we kept MHJ in check even after Will Johnson went down. We kept successfully running the ball after the Zinter injury. We played lots of depth all season long in anticipation of this game. That's preparation, player development, etc. None of it is flukey.
Eh. This is a well-written, eloquent article with not much to say, and boy does it take a long time to get there. Summary: Day doesn't "get it"; he shrunk in the moment.
It's a lot of feelingsball that just trots out the same narrative everyone is pushing. He comes up with some plays cherry-picked as "evidence" to support the narrative; more so than other OSU articles have done thus far. But he doesn't do much to sway me to his opinion. As others have mentioned, if MHJ gets a TD on the last OSU possession, does Day suddenly "get it"? Does Moore "not get it" cuz he kicked a FG on 4th and 6?
What's notably lacking is any football technical analysis AT ALL. Which really just makes it his opinion, man.
Michigan has won because it's done a tremendous job of developing talent that on paper wasn't as good as OSU's when it was recruited. Michigan has taken an inordinate number of 3 stars and made them into NFL players. It's developed many of its 4 stars into draftable players for the top few rounds of the draft. Is this sustainable? I hope so. Next year will be an interesting litmus test with the max exodus about to unfold.
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This place has Detroit teams, no college. Recently bought some stuff and I’m happy with it.
https://www.vintagedetroit.com/
"But Alabama's 27-20 overtime loss to Michigan in the CFP semifinal at the Rose Bowl on Jan. 1 was a hard one for Saban to digest."
Anyone else smile when they read this? And think "OMG, Michigan really did win a national championship! Michigan beat Bama and sent Nick Saban to retirement as a loser". Holy fuck.
What about ECU? Wasn’t that Peacock only?
Games are on: CBS, NBC, Peacock, BTN, Fox. No longer on ESPN.
3
This is obviously untrue. Warde would never share any of his precious bacon with a dog.
Not so fast my friend. I still see nothing official like a signed contract. And now he has other options: Seattle and Baltimore.
I think the only way we keep the scheme is if we co-DC Clink and Elston. If either one of those guys leave, it seems way harder to keep this going. Wade fired the LB coach. Elston is DL. Clink is DBs. And *supposedly* Clink doesn't want to call plays. So he's already Co-DC and is happy with the role he has there. That means we have to hope Elston wants to call plays and is good at it.
If we can get through the next 1-2 years with those guys, the candidate pool will grow with at least three NFL teams running the amoeba. We just need to bridge the gap somehow.
I looked and there is nothing official. No contract signed. Suddenly he has three jobs to choose from. Minter is now the hottest DC on the market.
I hope. I have no idea how deep the talent pool that knows the Ravens' D is. Maybe there are many guys out there.
I am happy for MacDonald, but doesn't this potentially seem bad for Michigan? Since there appear to be a limited number of people who know the Ravens' defense, it seems like it will be harder for us to keep running the scheme if any more defensive coaches leave. If both Clink and Elston leave, it seems like it will be impossible to keep it going. MacDonald is certainly going to bring Ravens' staff defensive with him. JH is trying to build the same thing in LA. John needs to now plug holes in Balt (Oor as DC perhaps?). Who would Michigan have left to hire? We need to open the checkbook to keep our defensive coaches here or we'll lose some key players too.
I am quite conflicted. I am tired of this “show me the love” game Jim plays every year. I don’t understand how being Michigan’s coach isn’t good enough for him. That being said, I have no idea what’s going on behind the scenes and why he isn’t “feeling the love”. If I had to choose who to believe, regents (politicians) and the AD or Jim Harbaugh, I believe Jim. This university cannot help making dumb decisions so I would not be surprised if they are doing something stupid *again*. So yeah, I could see them balking at demands that the “for cause” clause of new contract be modified. I look at such a modification as low risk. If the NCAA does indeed overreach and do something stupid like ban Jim, then I think it’s time to part ways with the NCAA. Are you just gonna wait for them to go after the next coach that dares to challenge their stranglehold? Are they that cowardly? At that point you are dealing with open corruption on a massive scale and it’s time to look at alternatives.
And I’ll admit that if JH leaves under such circumstances I will greatly lose enthusiasm for Michigan football. I’ll take the joy of the NC and move on.
Ok. Thanks Rams.
Ok that’s more like it—OH FUCK
Harbaugh is a grown man who as accomplished great things. I find it impossible to believe this is about Warde “liking” him or anyone else in the administration. When he says he wants them to “show the love” it’s obviously in other ways. Not more money for himself. Not hugs. Etc. So what *is* “the love”? I’m not sure. Money for staff? Probably. Bigger NIL commitment? Sure, although I don’t think this means buying players. Support when the usual bad guys come trying to take him down because he’s pushing for players to get a market wage? Absolutely. There may be other things I can’t think of. But it’s not salary and hugs. It’s “love” in the form of support. If Michigan can’t give him that after an NC, it’s really sad and will damper my enthusiasm post-Harbaugh. I am sure if he leaves the U will spin it as “Jim just wants a Super Bowl.” But we have heard the same message over and over from multiple sources: he wants to stay but he wants to be shown “the love”. I don’t think this is about the NFL. He truly loves Michigan but it has to grate on him he was out six games this season for BS reasons. He doesn’t want that to happen again.
I believe the Washington athletic department has a lot of debt and is lucky to break even nowadays. It’s one of the reasons they felt they *had* to take the Big Ten’s lowish offer - still better than what the PAC was offering - and leave. I don’t see how they have the resources to approach Bama. Now maybe DeBoer is just using this as a negotiation tactic to get more for his program. It suggests he doesn’t really want to leave but wants a commitment for increased spending. Still I wonder where that money would come from. They don’t have a rich Nike alum who is willing to commit funds.
They will claim it's fake. 0% chance they pay.
This is such a strange obsession Sparty has with Michigan fans and degrees. Who cares if someone rooting for a school got a degree there? And if you are that concerned with it, are you not admitting it's quite the accomplishment?
More like a third base.
It's not stealing. It's the transfer portal!
That would be great but the Lions are already grooming Hendon Hooker to take over. They could certainly swap one for the other, and it would be a smart thing marketing-wise (local hero on Lions). Not sure which is a better pro prospect, however. I believe HH is more accurate but less mobile.
I compare this to what Klatt had to say and it’s sad. Paul is a talking head shill. He is asked specifically “how did this happen” and offers no specifics at all. He knows next to nothing about Michigan…even now. “I was wrong”. Of course you were because your takes are super shallow and not even based in a deep knowledge of the game.
Klatt had a very thoughtful, well thought out take grounded in a deep understanding of Michigan and football in general.
Look at how little credit many here gave MSU during their run of dominance. Brian and all saw the issues - domination at the LOS - but we had many posters every season expecting to beat MSU and return things to "normal". I think things are worse over at 11W. They've dug in on some narratives to protect their precious egos. But we weren't THAT far off here during peak MSU.
I believe those are the roles he has *now* and the fanbase wants it to change.
Nope. Pilar blonde rum. Delicious.
I found out from Eleven Warriors that the starting center (Hinzman) was held out. It apparently had something to do with an interview he gave that told too much truth - an interview that apparently never aired because OSU squashed it. Anyhow this resulted in a player being moved to center who had very limited experience there. And it showed. OSU could not setup protections all game long on passing plays. Run blocking was inconsistent at best. Asked after the game why Hinzman didn’t play, Day said “he practiced poorly” or some other throw away comment and wouldn’t talk further. That seems like an unlikely reason.
I find I still have the old expectations. On that last drive I was sure the Vikes would score. It wasn’t “if”. It was “how”. Because the Lions have lost so many games at Minny and last year was a classic Lions collapse. I know they aren’t SOL logically but I have three decades of emotional conditioning to overcome.
Yes, Richard sometimes gets his info from Harold Beaver, who is said to be very well connected and willing to do whatever it takes to get a story
OSU fans: "The Cheaters are gonna lose so many players next season will be a rebuild. We are gonna win!"
Michigan fans every year of the early 2010s: "MSU loses so many guys we are definitely gonna win next season!"
Turns out player development is really important and teams that can do that reload. Also creating a sense of loyalty gets players to return who could transfer or go pro.
From what I've seen from OSU those two things are lacking at this point.
Ha. I read this as rapture and it made even more sense to me.
As Al Borges said, "if McCord raced a pregnant woman, he'd come in third".
I concede this is possible. I guess we will see as the season progresses and Juwan's role increases. But did the bigs last season play great defense? I know 1-on-1 he's considered a great bigs coach. But as HC, does he get much time to do this? Not sure.
Sherrone rocks and all. Did amazing stuff. But after Saturday, it's hard to say anyone does more with less than Parker. How many of those guys will get drafted? Can you imagine him at OSU?
Yeah. Supposed to be. You know, I'm not one of those "fire the coach" knee jerk people, but when the team doesn't even succeed at the head coach's supposed strength, you have to wonder what the next step is. I had to go back and look at the last four years to give me some perspective because I'd forgotten most of this but:
20-21 Big Ten regular season champs; Elite Eight in NCAA
21-22 Mediocre regular season with Sweet Sixteen NCAA run that sort of salvaged it.
22-23 18-16 overall, 11-9 Big Ten, lost in 2nd round of NIT
23-24 4-4 with best win over SJU
I know CBB has changed dramatically during that stretch. NIL and transfers have changed roster management completely. But Michigan appears to be stuck in a medicore trajectory. I'm not entirely sure changing coaches would net us much unless we got a homerun hire. And I just don't see that happening. I mean, we could. We have the money. But Michigan has never seemed as committed to basketball as football. So - throws up hands - I dunno man. I just know the winter and spring are way more enjoyable when Michigan basketball is good.
I was coming to post exactly this. Beilein's defenses were pretty terrible until he hired Yaklich and gave him D control. It's too important to be a shared responsibility IMO. And defense is the great equalizer since it's less variable than offense.
I have heard this said but he's not a mobile QB. And I think the last few years have shown us what a mobile QB means to the running game.
Ryan Day sitting in a bar. With an 11W poster dispensing wisdom to him.
#7 didn't even try to tackle Robinson.
So someone educate me on the rule. Why isn't that pass interferance on that screen pass? Behind LOS?
Big12 wants a CFP team.
Ha. Good catch. No it's REAL Al, not an AI version.
It's funny. Fox is already tagging its videos with "JH to the NFL?" even when there are zero rumors of any NFL interest and the NFL season isn't close to done. But it will generate clicks from Michigan, OSU and MSU fans for different reasons.
This is a good hire for Indiana. JMUs been very successful under Cignetti, even after moving from FCS to FBS. Frankly I am surprised Cignetti is interested. I would have thought he could do much better than IU.
Not sure where to drop this but Al Borges had an interesting take on Ryan Day. Start at 32:00.
Yes. It's still "we are better than you except our coach keeps blowing it". Which is *super* simplistic. It allows osu fans to keep thinking they are "superior" so no major changes are needed, just minor tweaks. Well, when your biggest rival is consistently outperforming you in player development, game preparation, in-game adjustments, offensive and defensive lines, execution, etc you have a problem.
This reminds me of how Michigan fans behaved during the MSU domination stretch in the late 00s and early 2010s. We were in a similar state of denial. We had better recruits and we had owned MSU for a long time. We "deserved" to win and every year we'e look forward to that game assuming things would return to "normal.". But it didn't happen. Why? Similar reasons: MSU did a better job of developing talent (more with less), was better on the lines, out prepared us, made better adjustments, etc. Things didn't turn back our way until we adjusted those things and MSU slid back to its mean.
All of this is to say, OSU has some things that are broken that need fixing. It is not nearly as simple as a few gameday tweaks. Ffs, we kept MHJ in check even after Will Johnson went down. We kept successfully running the ball after the Zinter injury. We played lots of depth all season long in anticipation of this game. That's preparation, player development, etc. None of it is flukey.
Eh. This is a well-written, eloquent article with not much to say, and boy does it take a long time to get there. Summary: Day doesn't "get it"; he shrunk in the moment.
It's a lot of feelingsball that just trots out the same narrative everyone is pushing. He comes up with some plays cherry-picked as "evidence" to support the narrative; more so than other OSU articles have done thus far. But he doesn't do much to sway me to his opinion. As others have mentioned, if MHJ gets a TD on the last OSU possession, does Day suddenly "get it"? Does Moore "not get it" cuz he kicked a FG on 4th and 6?
What's notably lacking is any football technical analysis AT ALL. Which really just makes it his opinion, man.
Michigan has won because it's done a tremendous job of developing talent that on paper wasn't as good as OSU's when it was recruited. Michigan has taken an inordinate number of 3 stars and made them into NFL players. It's developed many of its 4 stars into draftable players for the top few rounds of the draft. Is this sustainable? I hope so. Next year will be an interesting litmus test with the max exodus about to unfold.
Hey, this article managed not to mention SignGate while reporting positive things about JH. Amazing!
Just dumb. Nearly threw two picks. Then takes a sack when they could have run and then called timeout.
Official song of Buckeyes everywhere:
https://youtu.be/lhekcaRcpVo?si=xoWtL1xlFHwGnwKT
Fuck off, OSU.
The official song of OSU fans:
https://youtu.be/lhekcaRcpVo?si=kACHewrAU4H-1age
Offensive key IMO is run JJ. You have to get that threat out there. It's a risk - his ankle - but you have to win this game.