Hey, I've had a lot of people ask about access to the History course or some version of the course catered to more seasoned fans. I even chatted with mgoSeth about the concept and he gave me some ideas. I'm going to consider putting something together this summer
Hey, it's only for undergrads but I do plan on sharing insight on the course as we go along on MVictors.com and Twitter (@MVictors). That said, down the road maybe there's an opp to bring the class to like-minded folks - your not the first to ask.
MICHIGAN (4)
* Don Canham (Michigan)
* Bump Elliott (Iowa)
* Bill Orwig (Indiana – former Michigan hoops and football player and assistant coach).
* Paul Giel (Minnesota – said he voted for Michigan).
OHIO STATE (6)
* Ed Weaver (Ohio)
* Cecil Coleman (Illinois)
* Tippy Dye (Northwestern)
* George King (Purdue)
* Elroy Hirsch (Wisconsin – played for Michigan via the V12 program from 1943-44)
* Burt Smith (Michigan State – U-M graduate)
I can't speak for Kryk of course, but I don't believe he found a lot on Yost being concerned over Rockne's recruiting habits. Speaking of the rules, a major beef of Yost's, which Maisel doesn't really hit on, was Rockne's use of "the shift". Kryk wrote in Natural Enemies and explained some of that here in this post:
A big reason why no one would schedule the Gophers was that Minnesota’s coach, Doc Spears, ran his offense out of “the shift”. Spears was buds with Knute Rockne—the man who perfected it. Here’s how Rockne’s official page on the Notre Dame website sums it up:
In the shift, all four backs were still in motion at the snap. Opponents were so dumbfounded by the shift that they couldn’t find a consistent way to handle it. The rules board finally enacted a law against the shift.
The leading conference coaches (including Fielding Yost, Illinois’ Bob Zuppke and Chicago’s AA Stagg) felt it was not so much dumbfounding as it was illegal. Opponents saw the shift effectively giving the backs a head start (or at least momentum) when the ball was snapped, putting the defense at a disadvantage. Naturally Notre Dame fans argued (and still argue) it was brilliant strategy, while Yost and others said was cheating. [Ed. And speaking of brilliant, check out John Kyrk’s excellent rundown of the politics of the shift in Natural Enemies.]
re: "and they discuss an unpublished Michigan Daily editorial covering the incident by Arthur Miller, but do not show it (I am not sure it exists, but if it does it would have been really interesting to see)."
I've tried. Nothing at the Daily and I contacted the library holding the Arthur Miller archives last year. They looked but found nothing.
You can support the project and get the DVD here (with free shipping):
Yes, Rothstein didn't write that headline and once again, it doesn't really fit the piece yet causes overwhelming criticism. I don't get why that happens again and again. Anyway, he hedged his bet against any MVictors wrath by quoting me in the artice :)
Here's the Buckeye reaction to the 3-3 tie with Michigan in 1910 via the Michigan Daily:
“When the timer’s whistle made it certain that Michigan had indeed been tied, the Ohio rooters, who packed the stands, rushed onto the field and danced madly while their band played and the student clowns capered about “Berky” the mule, that was advertised as ‘having Michigan’s goat’. Factory whistles screamed and cannons boomed in honor of what the Ohio backers felt to be a triumph.”
He said that. I might have the audio somewhere. Someone asked him why he wasn't there (at the workouts) - he said working on academics (paraphrase). He didn't say that was an excuse.
I think the whole contract is up in the air at this point. I definitely want to hear Brandon comment on this, hopefully he'll be at the media event Monday. Last I heard Brandon said as much, but I figure it was just a matter of sorting out the changes. We'll see in light of the Big Ten division talks/9 conference game schedule.
Was indeed considered "Site A" for a while (vs. the "Miller Tract", aka Site B - the current site of the stadium), but I don't recall that site ever being denied. IIRC the contours of the current site seemed more favorable for construction and it was/is closer to campus. They didn't have Stadium Blvd yet but knew it was coming.
That's one of many Michigan myths, according to Dr. Robert Soderstrom, author of the The Big House. I mentioned this in HTTV '10 as well. The guy pored through records, memos, docs, and news stories -- while the spring they hit during the dig was a giant disaster, he found no evidence of a steam shovel or crane sinking and not recovered.
Coach Devine has strong ties to the state of Michigan, coaching at East Jordan (big in manhole covers) High School way up in northern Michigan before joining former Fritz Crisler player and assistant Biggie Munn at Michigan State.
Devine moved on from East Lansing for a brief stint at Arizona State which led to the Missouri gig which he held for 13 seasons starting in 1958. One of Devine’s players at Missouri was Lloyd Carr,
The University of Michigan football team begins preparation for its 131st season of gridiron action on Monday, Aug. 9. Head coachRich Rodriguez will meet with the media following the first practice at approximately 6 p.m. A few players will also be made available after Rodriguez.
Not caught on film, but after Henne tossed that pass, he took a wide loop back toward the sideline in the direction of the MSU student section. Without breaking stride he gave the MSU student a how-you-like-me-now shoulder and head shimmy.
(That he recovered it.) Anyone confirm that? I'm checking with my contacts. I think it's likely that'll they get it if the police engaged the store. Based on what I've learned from Pawn Stars/Chumley, those shops pretty much back down if anything smells funny with the merchandise.
* Pollack's defense of the "empty" suites comment is partly this: he argues many of the suites were taken by U-M groups/schools (med school, b-school, regents, alumni association, AD dept, President's office, etc.) so that the 75% figure doesn't accurately reflect the true percentage of sold suites (of the publicly available). He mentioned this as we were concluding the interview but I didn't put it in there.
* FWIW, Pollack is a season ticket holder.
* As mentioned in the post I don't feel the historical/Yost argument holds any water based on everything I know about Yost and the original stadium construction (plug --> see HTTV 2010)!
A lot of ways to go with this. Of course prior to 1998 no one officially "played" for the national title, so in the purest form the question is restricted to those years since when Michigan closest to reaching the BCS title game - 2006.
Other guys mentioned the biggest close-but-no-cigar years. 1925 was arguably Yost's best team (I think he said as much at one point) and got a horrible break in 1925 with the brutal field conditions and the 3-2 loss to NW.
Bump's 1964 team just missed it as mentioned. Bob Timberlake stopped just short on a two point conversion, falling to Bob Griese and Purdue.
There are other outlets that have declared Michigan national champion in more recent years:
1973 - Both the "National Championship Foundation" and "Poling" declared U-M champion.
1985 - Both Jeff Sagarin and "Matthews" slotted Michigan #1.
You may recall that in 2004, USC actually did this kind of exercise, looking back over the years and finally declaring themselves 1939 national champion on the strength the Dickinson system, a formula used to pick the champ in the 30s (including Michigan's back-to-back titles in '32 and '33). They weren't recognized as champs in '39 because the AP poll was the method of choice starting in 1936. USC AD Mike Garrett at the time, I love this:
“It was brought to our attention by various individuals that we should be claiming the 1939 Trojans among our national champions in football,” said Garrett. “We took this matter seriously, did significant research and determined this to be true."
I think it was Drew Sharp who asked the question about the clause in RR's contract about major violations allowing U-M to fire him. I don't recall Albom asking about that.
Emailed media relations, response here. The gist, yes there will be a response 5/24 (that's required by the NCAA) and it will include self-imposed sanctions.
Recent Comments
Hey, I've had a lot of people ask about access to the History course or some version of the course catered to more seasoned fans. I even chatted with mgoSeth about the concept and he gave me some ideas. I'm going to consider putting something together this summer
The name of my upcoming memoir
Big time
Unfortunately, there is a height restriction in this classroom (school of Ed was built in the 1920s)
No, but I'm all business FWIW
My $.02 on this topic: (short answer - yes, IMO it should be on the line)
https://mvictors.com/jug-dont-lie/
I'd love to see that paper if you still have it!
Hey, it's only for undergrads but I do plan on sharing insight on the course as we go along on MVictors.com and Twitter (@MVictors). That said, down the road maybe there's an opp to bring the class to like-minded folks - your not the first to ask.
tough to argue with this
..have anything better to do with your time? Sheesh
...a man who did not maintain his dignity, the white-shirted gent was AD Jim Phillips > http://www.nusports.com/school-bio/nw-athdir.html
..to the post with this shot
...was worth the price of HTTV '13 alone. FWIW here's the assumed breakdown of the vote:
MICHIGAN (4)
* Don Canham (Michigan)
* Bump Elliott (Iowa)
* Bill Orwig (Indiana – former Michigan hoops and football player and assistant coach).
* Paul Giel (Minnesota – said he voted for Michigan).
OHIO STATE (6)
* Ed Weaver (Ohio)
* Cecil Coleman (Illinois)
* Tippy Dye (Northwestern)
* George King (Purdue)
* Elroy Hirsch (Wisconsin – played for Michigan via the V12 program from 1943-44)
* Burt Smith (Michigan State – U-M graduate)
..is working on a piece on the history of the helmet & wanted something from Hoke. That's my gut feeling
FWIW, here's post on what U-M's Lion Kim had in his bag via an interview prior to the 2011 Masters.
Damn you Cook
...to periodicly remind folks that Steele left eventual MVP Brandon Graham completely off his MIDSEASON all Big Ten teams (1st, 2nd and 3rd - no BG) in 2009.
I can't speak for Kryk of course, but I don't believe he found a lot on Yost being concerned over Rockne's recruiting habits. Speaking of the rules, a major beef of Yost's, which Maisel doesn't really hit on, was Rockne's use of "the shift". Kryk wrote in Natural Enemies and explained some of that here in this post:
re: "and they discuss an unpublished Michigan Daily editorial covering the incident by Arthur Miller, but do not show it (I am not sure it exists, but if it does it would have been really interesting to see)."
I've tried. Nothing at the Daily and I contacted the library holding the Arthur Miller archives last year. They looked but found nothing.
You can support the project and get the DVD here (with free shipping):
Yes, Rothstein didn't write that headline and once again, it doesn't really fit the piece yet causes overwhelming criticism. I don't get why that happens again and again. Anyway, he hedged his bet against any MVictors wrath by quoting me in the artice :)
for holding your clocks to standard time. Daylight time is for the suckers
...Brandon Graham completely off his 2009 mid-season Big Ten teams (1st, 2nd, 3rd):
http://www.philsteele.com/fbsinfo/FBSAllConf/2009midssnallconf/Midseaso…
Here's the Buckeye reaction to the 3-3 tie with Michigan in 1910 via the Michigan Daily:
“When the timer’s whistle made it certain that Michigan had indeed been tied, the Ohio rooters, who packed the stands, rushed onto the field and danced madly while their band played and the student clowns capered about “Berky” the mule, that was advertised as ‘having Michigan’s goat’. Factory whistles screamed and cannons boomed in honor of what the Ohio backers felt to be a triumph.”
Man, I've been standing by patiently to break this out. The Horace Prettyman Experience:
More on Prettyman here.
Clans 2.0. Need to add a favorite song column in v2.5. A start - Decatur Clan: "Love the One You're With."
As usual. Natural Enemies is fantastic and I'm sure the new book will be the same
OK, snagged the relevant audio from the show, posted here.
Probably will use the canes but we'll see.
He said that. I might have the audio somewhere. Someone asked him why he wasn't there (at the workouts) - he said working on academics (paraphrase). He didn't say that was an excuse.
Was asked by Angelique
Cheers guys.
Posted the clip here.
about the practice ban....
I think the whole contract is up in the air at this point. I definitely want to hear Brandon comment on this, hopefully he'll be at the media event Monday. Last I heard Brandon said as much, but I figure it was just a matter of sorting out the changes. We'll see in light of the Big Ten division talks/9 conference game schedule.
Was indeed considered "Site A" for a while (vs. the "Miller Tract", aka Site B - the current site of the stadium), but I don't recall that site ever being denied. IIRC the contours of the current site seemed more favorable for construction and it was/is closer to campus. They didn't have Stadium Blvd yet but knew it was coming.
That's one of many Michigan myths, according to Dr. Robert Soderstrom, author of the The Big House. I mentioned this in HTTV '10 as well. The guy pored through records, memos, docs, and news stories -- while the spring they hit during the dig was a giant disaster, he found no evidence of a steam shovel or crane sinking and not recovered.
and Michigan ties, etc:
Not caught on film, but after Henne tossed that pass, he took a wide loop back toward the sideline in the direction of the MSU student section. Without breaking stride he gave the MSU student a how-you-like-me-now shoulder and head shimmy.
here:
http://mvictors.com/?p=4968
(That he recovered it.) Anyone confirm that? I'm checking with my contacts. I think it's likely that'll they get it if the police engaged the store. Based on what I've learned from Pawn Stars/Chumley, those shops pretty much back down if anything smells funny with the merchandise.
I'm owed a nickel each time someone writes the phrase "ebay watch", maybe a dime if it's in ALL CAPS.
Great discussion. A couple things:
* Pollack's defense of the "empty" suites comment is partly this: he argues many of the suites were taken by U-M groups/schools (med school, b-school, regents, alumni association, AD dept, President's office, etc.) so that the 75% figure doesn't accurately reflect the true percentage of sold suites (of the publicly available). He mentioned this as we were concluding the interview but I didn't put it in there.
* FWIW, Pollack is a season ticket holder.
* As mentioned in the post I don't feel the historical/Yost argument holds any water based on everything I know about Yost and the original stadium construction (plug --> see HTTV 2010)!
A lot of ways to go with this. Of course prior to 1998 no one officially "played" for the national title, so in the purest form the question is restricted to those years since when Michigan closest to reaching the BCS title game - 2006.
Other guys mentioned the biggest close-but-no-cigar years. 1925 was arguably Yost's best team (I think he said as much at one point) and got a horrible break in 1925 with the brutal field conditions and the 3-2 loss to NW.
Bump's 1964 team just missed it as mentioned. Bob Timberlake stopped just short on a two point conversion, falling to Bob Griese and Purdue.
There are other outlets that have declared Michigan national champion in more recent years:
1973 - Both the "National Championship Foundation" and "Poling" declared U-M champion.
1985 - Both Jeff Sagarin and "Matthews" slotted Michigan #1.
You may recall that in 2004, USC actually did this kind of exercise, looking back over the years and finally declaring themselves 1939 national champion on the strength the Dickinson system, a formula used to pick the champ in the 30s (including Michigan's back-to-back titles in '32 and '33). They weren't recognized as champs in '39 because the AP poll was the method of choice starting in 1936. USC AD Mike Garrett at the time, I love this:
More on this stuff here:
For the end zone to say "WOLVERINES"? Yeeesh. The chorus of The Victors?
steal Gov. Granholm's car and it wouldn't make the front page today.
I think it was Drew Sharp who asked the question about the clause in RR's contract about major violations allowing U-M to fire him. I don't recall Albom asking about that.
-G
Emailed media relations, response here. The gist, yes there will be a response 5/24 (that's required by the NCAA) and it will include self-imposed sanctions.