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|1 hour 47 min ago||pretty solid confim that things are happening wrt contract?||
I would not say that at all. At best it is a rumor of circumstantial evidence. Hoke is obviously facing heat and (probably wisely) may be leaning on his agent for some help navigating this stuff. Or maybe he is clarifying what his contract terms are and preparing for whatever inevitabilities might occur.
Doesn't mean anything is being negotiated or that action is imminent.
Interesting info, but doesn't need to be overstated.
|15 hours 35 min ago||SMDH at Baumgardner||
"Brandon threw Hoke under the bus, and hung him out to dry."
I guess if you throw someone under the bus, the least you can do is hang them up to let them dry. Maybe Dave Brandon is turning a new leaf making this situation clear as mud on a cold winter's day as the crow flies with the downhill running back that is caught between a rock and a henhouse.
|1 day 4 hours ago||Sounds like he'd make a helluva OC||
But probably not ready for HC at Michigan.
|1 day 7 hours ago||Like Chip Kelly?||
"Once you get to UM level the only jobs you really are leaving UM for are places like Alabama or Texas."
Man, I wish that was true but I don't think it is. There's really no reason anymore for Michigan to be held above so many other programs. We have tradition and a top 10 salary and a large stadium and big fanbase. Other programs can offer a top 20 salary, large stadiums, loyal fanbases, stability, security, weather, etc.
There's really no reason that he would leave ASU to be coach at Michigan. What does he gain at Michigan that he doesn't have at ASU? Maybe a salary bump, maybe more media attention (though I wonder what coach really wants that.)
There are a few things, but most of them are offset by having good weather, a fertile recruiting area next door, and a fanbase that can appreciate a 9 win season and a bowl invitation, media that isn't out to get him, no pressures to conform to a culture he doesn't care about, no rigorous acadmic/character expectations. I could go on but... we fired the last coach for not fitting in, despite improving every season. We're about to fire another coach for letting a guy play with a concussion (something that shouldn't happen but does ALL THE TIME). Our AD is a total douchebag, the media and ex-players and fans all can't wait to get in line to complain about this or that, the weather sucks, the recruiting is strong but takes a lot of work to manage because none of it is local, and the conference has huge perception problems.
If Graham did leave ASU for Michigan and had success he would be gone to the NFL or whatever SEC school decides to pay him even more money.
Still - I appreciate your effort. It's a good discussion to have because it's getting to be "look to the future" time...
|1 day 7 hours ago||Florida's FEI rank for D by year.||
2011: 33 (with Quinn)
2012: 1 (with Quinn)
That's a nice improvement under Quinn's direction, and an immediate dropoff after. Some solid evidence to support him, albeit not for very long. Impressive candidate.
The question is: why would he come to Michigan?
I would add to the Cons that he has no local ties and almost no experience at elite/winning college programs.
|4 days 6 hours ago||No OC. No DC. No Head Coach||
Hoke - Program Manager / Recruiting Director
Stitt - Head Coach of the Offense
Mattison - Head Coach of the Defense
|5 days 10 hours ago||oops||
Yeah. I was on a B-kick. Kalis, Magnuson, Bars, Braden -- only one of them looks like a solid player right now.
It takes time, yes. You have to give that time to Williams just as you do for those guys though.
The bigger issue is: OF COURSE IT TAKES TIME. Hoke acted like it didn't, not Rodriguez. Hoke could have reacted to the situation he inherited and elected not to.
Taking only 4 guys when you know that you need to get a couple starters out of RS Freshamn and then a few more as RS Sophomores is dumb..... should have taken 6 OLmen at least, as Rich Rod did in 2008. Some are not going to pan out at all, some are going to take time, very few will be ready to go in year 2.
What we've seen is totally expected. The result of the recruiting strategy. Predicatable completely (I was bitching about the 2014 OL two years ago!)
The reaction to it is what is inexplicable, as it was when Rodriguez messed up the defense in '09 and '10. Both coaches were way too slow in recognizing an obvious problem and then failed to develop talent to address it when it got acute.
Rodriguez grabbed offensive guys. Hoke grabbed Running backs, big WRs, FBs, LBs, and SDE/DT hybrids at the expense of other positions. Both guys have completely bungled the 'other' side of the ball because they assumed "This is Michigan" and talent will take care of that.
At least Rodriguez could somewhat blame injuries (Woofolk, Heininger, Floyd, etc.) in 2010.
|5 days 11 hours ago||Things Gardner does that Morris can't||
run the ball and avoid sacks. THAT helps negate some of the passs blocking woes.
Gardner does not lack for arm strength. Zip is not the problem. Zip was not the problem when Ryan Mallet replaced Chad Henne either.
You can point to highlights for Morris at his best, but they are not nearly up to the same for Gardner.
The difference you HOPE Morris has is better decision-making, faster decision-making, and more accuracy. The problem is he has exhibited none of those.
|5 days 11 hours ago||The OL is the BIGGEST problem with this team||
And it's not even close. People like to blame Rich Rod but he had the OL filled with NFL linemen in 2010 and returning for 2011 - the run game results reflected it. People like to blame the QB but EVERY ONE OF THEM (Robinson, Bellomy, Gardner, Morris) has looked turnover prone.
Rodriguez had Schofield, Lewan and Omameh all ready to play by their 3rd year on campus. Hoke has gotten nothing out of his '12 class and is given a pass for the '11 class.
At TE, OK blame Rich Rod - he didn't want any. That doesn't excuse zero effective blockers coming through 4 recruiting classes now. ESPECIALLY if you're going to play 2 TEs. Funchess did not get better. Williams is not getting better. Butt is doing fine, but he did fine last year too.
This is coming off as an anti-hoke rant and I don't intend that to be the case. My point is stop blaming other things (QBs, RBs, WRs, size, youth) -- developing effective blockers is something this coaching staff has done a horrible job off. Blame Hoke, blame Funk, blame Ferrigno, whatever - but somewhere in that group there is gross incompetance happening on the offensive side of the ball.
If it continues, the entire offensive staff should be fired and a "Head Coach of the Offense" should be installed to do as he see fits, while Hoke runs the rest of the program and Mattison keeps building this D into a juggernaut.
|5 days 12 hours ago||"Intolerable" vs "Bound to happen"||
"This was bad enough when Williams was a true freshman thrust on the field; as a junior it is intolerable"
Braden, Bosch, Bars all came in at the same time/same class as Williams.
|5 days 12 hours ago||"This was always going to happen, because both tackles are fresh||
Well, they are not freshman. Braden is a junior (RS Soph), 2 classes above Cole. He just plays like one. Which tells you something about something.
It tells me that hoping things will get better just because these guys age is a bit questionable.
|5 days 13 hours ago||it has not improved||
sacks are up, pressure is up, the pass game is down and it ain't all on the QB
the run blocking does look better though
Just ask yourself if it makes any sense that going from Lewan/Schofield to Cole/Braden can be an improvement, even with adding a year for the guys inside.
|5 days 13 hours ago||some evidence||
is some evidence.
I didn't say it was conclusive. The point was that Nussmeir hasn't yet developed Gardner and so assuming he is doing so for Morris is a huge leap.
|5 days 13 hours ago||the red zone is an arbitrary line||
We drove into FG range multiple times against ND and Utah too. Wile missing kicks is not the QBs fault. The only TD against KSU came in garbage time.
Objectively, our offense was more effective in those two games than against KSU. And KSU came with a month of prep time to draw up a bunch of quirky gimmick plays on the first couple drives. Once those dried up it was doom on par with Nebraska and MSU games.
|5 days 13 hours ago||it ain't the QB...||
Morris did worse than Gardner, Speight would presumably do worse than Morris, the walk-ons would presumably worse than that. Grabbing some players Mom from the stands would be worse than that.
Change for change's sake is dumb.
|5 days 13 hours ago||except||
there is a very obvious upside. performances against OSU, ND, etc.
the upside for Shane is [insert your hopes and dreams based on zero evidence, scratch that - ignoring all available evidence]
|5 days 14 hours ago||an OC who is known for developing QBs||
uhhhh...we have some evidence he might not be that good at that thing
|5 days 14 hours ago||but there is evidence that he can be worse||
He started a game! He sucked. This was immediately after Gardner's brilliant game against OSU.
This year he has come in and been worse than Gardner in each game.
|5 days 14 hours ago||There is no reason to assume these two are equal.||
This is your hypothesis and far from true. Devin has shown he can make plays and win games. Shane has not. Devin has beaten out Shane at every step of the way and the team has done better with him than with Shane.
Playing vs cupcakes is not critical for development. It certainly didnt help Bellomy.
At least we agree the decision is a no brainer!
|5 days 16 hours ago||the bowl was...||
"a start where he gets 1st team reps during the week and gameplanning built around him. " and actually it was a lot more than 3 weeks.
This is the dumbest meme Mgoblog commentators have had in a while... or at least since the Nussmeir is a panacea meme.
|5 days 16 hours ago||It could hurt a lot||
Devin's been better every step of the way. There is literally zero evidence, not only that shane is better, but that shane is nearly as capable as Devin.
|5 days 16 hours ago||the bowl game was horrible||
on par with Utah and Notre Dame
maybe worse since we actually did move the ball a little better in those games (as measured by yardage and 1st downs)
|5 days 16 hours ago||ditto for Morris||
sample size of 1, but the other evidence says it'll hold
|6 days 9 hours ago||33-3 Michigan||
Utah is good. These guys are terrible. We are OK.
|6 days 13 hours ago||Interpretations and moving the goal line||
You chose to interpret it as not "useful" instead of "popular" when you accused me of "talking out of my ass".
Old-fashioned - yes. Not popular - yes. Not useful - depends on which issue we are discussing, but certainly on some of them yes.
To RBs, because that's the one you seem to take the most issue with.
I did not say there was zero use for big backs. I took issue with the single-minded targeting of them at the expense of other areas.
Their personnel does not reflect what most elite college offenses look like to me. If you are arguing they are running a spread-heavy scheme, than the personnel should fit that. It doesn't appear to do that. Ohio State is a good argument for big AND fast, but they still recruit a bunch of space players, mobile QBs, and seem to value speed at least as much as brawn.
I am not sending you on wild goose chase for NFL stats. I gave the best stat I could think of to tell a story of what productive backs look like in today's NFL. Again, a 4 game sample size is far less convincing than 16.
It seems fairly obvious to me that running backs are generally smaller than they used to be. Here is some random blogpost that talks about height going down and provides data to support it. https://www.bsports.com/statsinsights/nfl/why-have-nfl-running-backs-got...
People still say stuff like "Denard is too small for RB" despite CJ2K, Charles, Bush, Spiller and others having plenty of success with similar physical size. I never hear anybody say "Green is too big for RB". I don't believe either FWIW, but I think our coaches do.
I never really argued that that 215-220 was a problem, but that's on the high end of what the best NFL backs look like and on the low end of what Michigan is recruiting. Michigan is targeting a lot of backs that are taller than 6' when that is becoming increasingly rare. Michigan is targeting a lot of backs that are over 220 when that is becoming increasingly rare. Look at the top athletes and running backs in the Recruiting list and chances are, if they are big, Michigan is going after them. If they are not, Michigan is probably not. Again, there are exceptions, but as a generality it is true. Michigan likes bigger backs -- like were more common in the past.
In 2013, Michigan offered 8 running backs. All but two were either >215 or >6'. Keith Ford was an elite 5-star back. Kyle Hicks was the lone outlier (5'10/195). Wilkins, Green, Issac, Davis, Smith, Shallman - these guys are either tall and lean (Wilkins, Davis, Issac) or straight-up power (Shallman, Smith) or just elite prospects (Green, Ford).
Michigan is on the far end of the curve here. Plus, you're ignoring that these guys are typically going to add 5-10 pounds in college if not more. So comparing HS weights to NFL is a bit disingenuous.
The idea that a RB needs to be "between the tackles" is in itself a bit antiquated in modern football - no? Sure you want that, but you want the guy who gets "outside the tackles" too. Why limit yourself? Isn't that antiquated?
I want backs who can run between the tackles, but it's more important that they be thick and hard to bring down (a la Hart, Ray Rice, Jamal Anderson, Emmit Smith) than tall with straight-line speed (a la Foster, Peterson, Forte). Michigan's done (and is doing) fine on this front in terms of the guys they've gotten, but they've targeted (and missed) on a lot of taller thinner dues (like Dunn, Davis, Wilkins.) that are reminiscent of the Dickerson-Wheatley-Thomas model of years past. Shallman hints they have interest in going even further back to Okoye-Means-Hoard type backs.
The bigger issue is just totally passing on the CJ Spillers, Jamal Charles of the world all together unless it is absolutely abundantly clear that they are elite (Harris) or from a local pipeline (Weber). To me, those type of players are more useful than the Jeron Dukes and CSonte Yorks and Demario Jones' of the world. We could really use another Vincent Smith and have another Norfleet waiting in the wings. It's certainly not a priority for our staff.
|6 days 14 hours ago||It is usually bad. Not||
It is usually bad. Not always.
Rodriguez spread innovation was inspired by looking back.
Stanford has made themselves different by looking back.
The main thing is you still have to move forward while being inspired by the past. You can't be all backwards.
Not trying to fight, but Coyote got my guns up with his tone. No insult intended to you.
|6 days 14 hours ago||agreed||
He is not a cave-man. I mean, obviously they tried with Denard to do some things.
It can be overstated - but it's still truth in there.There is a certain cave-manish component and it comes leaking out in a lot of different areas that look like they end up doing more harm then good. There is a resistance to change (spread punt for example) that flat out doesn't make sense.
I'm with Nuss on the tempo thing - Rich Rod did the same thing actually - you have to wait till the offense is installed and stable.
But the other stuff...it makes us look antiquated. Antiquated is fine when it works, but right now we dont have that.
|6 days 14 hours ago||it took too long||
His catches nearly doubled from 2012 to 2013. He should have had a much bigger role in 2012.
|6 days 14 hours ago||Who else has Michigan||
Who else has Michigan targeted who's tall and thin? Shallman, Smith, Ball. I'm sure I could dig through and find others. You are right about Harris and Weber. They have indeed mitigated my concern here, but don't forget Harris is indisputably elite and Weber was slow-played until Nuss came on.
Safeties used to be bigger, now they are smaller. Michigan is on the 'used to be' side. Which is my whole point.
Desmond Howard won a Heisman. (Guessing you knew that, but since you probably thought I knew what Howard did in the NFL, I decided to drop a more pertinent factoid.) Welker is a #1 target, regardless of short or long routes. Ward made numerous probowls and was 2nd team all NFL several times. Elite enough for me.
The LB is loaded with quality because Michigna has (over) recruited the position. They had Furman but still offered 43 scholarships to linebackers over the last four years. Give or take 30.
Furman was not a good safety. He looks like a good LB. You can make all the excuses you want but this is not putting athleticism and talent where it is best suited. Michigan could have looked at Furman and said "we've got a hell of LB here, maybe we should back off on trying to find so many more LBs"....like, oh, I don't know, the OL that needs 3 or 4 starters to be ready to go 2 seasons from now, which is really hard to do. Or a backup QB.
They also don't HAVE to put more weight on Furman. OK State hasn't.
|6 days 15 hours ago||"A difference in philosophy"||
"A difference in philosophy" -- exactly! One philosophy is old, one is new. One looks back, one looks forward. [Or at least towards what current trends tell us forward looks like.]
This NFL season is 4 games in. Last season is complete. You are now dropping your criteria to 215 or 210, which is less than what Green, Smith, Issac weigh. Hayes and Johnson (211) fit though - but they are not even being considered for 1st or 2nd down duty. They are viewed as specialists.
You are seriously going to mention Jerome Bettis with a straight face? He played college football in the 80s (1990 technically counts). He is exaclty the kind of backward looking profile I am talking about.
I never said "having bigger backs on the roster is outdated". I said recruiting big backs almost exclusively is antiquated. The prototypical RB is now 200-220 lbs. In the 80s it was far more common to have 230+ pound backs. It was very rare to have backs who weight less than 200 pounds. Now it is common.
Michigan does not go after guys like Emmit Smith very often. They don't seek short and stout, they seek tall and lean.
I don't have the data to support it at my fingertips, but if you look at who they offer I am confident in asserting that they will be taller, leaner, and generally larger than most elite college football programs.
Yes, OSU does like big backs, but they recruit Dontrel Wilson and Jalin Marshall too.
My concerns on this front have been mitigated to an extent by Harris (who is a 5-star elite player, so the coaches probably don't care about his size) and Weber (who the coaches backed off of for a while, much to my chagrin). But the guys they tend to prefer fit an outdated mold.
I don't think these guys are idiots - they will take great prospects who do not fit their desired profile, but they are more size-oriented than most other staffs, including Wisconsin.
I don't think Hoke should be fired. I think we can win with him. I hope this gets turned around. I think we will kill Minnesota. etc. But if you don't think this program is looking back, trying to build the 1997 team all over agian, I think you are flat out not paying attention.