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- 11 years without a tournament bid
- 26 years without a Big Ten Championship
- 20 years without a Final Four appearance
- 19 years without a Sweet Sixteen appearance
- 15 years without an All-American
- Michigan won it's first Big Ten championship in 26 years, and won a second two years later
- Michigan ended an eleven-year NCAA tournament drought
- Michigan had one national player of the year and another Big Ten player of the year
- Michigan went to the National Championship game where it lost by 6 points, with much of the final moments hanging on a clean Trey Burke block that was called a foul
- Michigan has sent 6 players to the NBA draft, and is likely to send a 7th player this year
- Michigan has had the best Big Ten record over the last 4 years
- Michigan has done all this despite playing in the nation's best conference the last two years and competing with elite coaches like Tom Izzo, Thad Matta, and Bo Ryan
|1 year 1 week ago||What timeline would you prefer? Should Arizona,||
What timeline would you prefer? Should Arizona, Indiana, and Maryland get credit for success 15 years ago? And MSU and UConn are top 5 programs regardless of timeline.
|1 year 1 week ago||Arizona hasn't been to the||
Arizona hasn't been to the Final Four since 2001. Indiana and Maryland haven't been to the Elite 8 since 2002. Florida has been to one final four since 2007.
MSU has been to 7 Final Fours since 1999 - more than any other school (Duke and UNC have been to 5 each). And UConn has won 4 titles since 1999 - more than any other school (Duke has won 3). Both of these schools are top 5 programs nationally.
That is an extraordinarily diverse group of programs that you've decided to compare us to, and Michigan has been equal to or better than just about all of them under Beilein.
|1 year 3 weeks ago||Stop upvoting yourself, it's||
Stop upvoting yourself, it's embarrassing
|1 year 3 weeks ago||Icarus. You all need to read||
Icarus. You all need to read about Icarus.
|1 year 3 weeks ago||I could go at this with you||
I could go at this with you all day. You are an absolute character
|1 year 3 weeks ago||You have literally no facts||
You have literally no facts to back this nonsense up. I and others like me have spent plenty on the basketball program over the years. The fact that your arguments always devolve into this plutocratic bullshit shows how delusional you are. If you truly do pay for season tickets (not like their is any evidence of that, either), please just stop. It doesn't seem to bring you any pleasure
|1 year 3 weeks ago||Beilein wanted Draymond badly||
A great quote from Dylan Burkhardt from 2009:
"The first head-to-head recruiting battle between John Beilein and Tom Izzo was over Draymond Green. Green turned down the opportunity for ample playing time in Michigan's sparse front court, and is now playing only 9.3 minutes per game for the Spartans. Many recruiting analysts thought Draymond was headed to Ann Arbor before a late Michigan State offer swayed Day-Day to the green and white. It's hard to interpret that as anything more than a statement from Tom Izzo – stay out of my backyard."
|1 year 3 weeks ago||Most of those guys flamed out||
Most of those guys flamed out for one reason or another. See AC1997's post earlier in this thread
|1 year 3 weeks ago||The fact that you have||
The fact that you have repeatedly compared Beilein to Hoke and Rodriguez shows how incapable you are of looking at this situation objectively
|1 year 3 weeks ago||Except Beilien has vastly,||
Except Beilien has vastly, vastly outperformed the program's accomplishments from the two decades prior to his hire. Michigan basketball has literally not been this successful since Bo Schembechler was the football coach. You do realize that firing Beilein is just as likely to lead to the program getting worse as it is to getting better, right?
|1 year 3 weeks ago||How Michigan basketball was before Beilein||
|1 year 5 weeks ago||It's been clear all season||
It's been clear all season that 93Grad has a crystal ball, and the outlook is bleak
|1 year 5 weeks ago||If Michigan fails to make the||
If Michigan fails to make the playoff, the negative Harbaugh talk will start this season.
|1 year 5 weeks ago||I've seen people suggest that||
I've seen people suggest that Michigan needs to get to the Sweet 16 every single year to meet their baseline expectations, so even beating ND and losing to Kenpom's #6 team, WVU, would be considered disappointing. A portion of this fanbase just loves to be unhappy
|1 year 5 weeks ago||It's totally legitimate to||
It's totally legitimate to knock Michigan's recruitment at the 5 position, and I think that has been Beilein's biggest flaw as our coach. I will say that Jordan Morgan and Jon Horford both developed throughout their careers, and I think that the current grouping of centers (plus Teske and Davis) will develop. I think Wagner has a ton of upside and is an exciting prospect.
The problem with low ceiling bigs is that the guard play has to be elite, and Michigan's guard play has been good-not-great the last two years; injuries and attrition have played a factor. But Beilein has developed a bunch of talented guards while at Michigan, so this is something that will absolutely get better. Additional depth is going to make the guards a lot better next year.
And the defense has been bad, but that is because Michigan's currently got some bad defensive players. This is correctable and is not a reason to fire a head coach. The defense 3 years ago was bad, but the offense was elite to the point that it didn't matter much. I don't think that we have nearly enough data to say that Michigan's recruits will perpetually be soft and bad at defense (they only need to be average defenders to win with this offensive system).
|1 year 5 weeks ago||And people use the||
And people use the disasterous half-decade (at least) in which Michigan's players were getting paid as some sort of bar. Like we should be disappointed about 2 Big Ten titles, an Elite 8 appearance, a national championship appearance, a Big Ten player of the year, and a national player of the year. Now that is beyond pathetic.
EDIT: And before you tell me that Michigan's now headed in the wrong direction, who thought in 2010 or 2011 that we were on the cusp of achieving all of the above? People act like Beilein and staff identifying six draft picks plus Spike Albrecht was a fluke. If Xavier Simpson or Ibi Watson or Mo Wagner blows up, Michigan's future may be as bright as ever.
|1 year 6 weeks ago||What exactly is the decision||
What exactly is the decision that Manuel is going to have to make regarding Beilein?
|1 year 8 weeks ago||Alternatively, if Gentry is||
Alternatively, if Gentry is really that good, he can transfer and still find success. Aaron Rodgers and Cam Newton both played in junior college. Joe Flacco transferred to FCS. Nick Foles played at MSU and Arizona. Russell Wilson played at NC State and Wisconsin. As much as it pains Uncle Rico, the best quarterbacks are not sitting on the coach because the coach didn't give them a chance. They are starting in the NFL.
|1 year 14 weeks ago||It sounds like you want||
It sounds like you want Michigan to recruit guys like DJ Wilson, Mo Wagner, and Jon Teske.
|1 year 14 weeks ago||Ekpe Udoh was a lottery pick.||
Ekpe Udoh was a lottery pick. Tyson Chandler was a lottery pick. Pretty much all guys 6'10" and above who can rebound, block shots, and run an effective pick-and-roll are lottery picks. Expecting Beilein to outrecruit Kansas, Kentucky, Duke, Indiana, MSU, OSU, UCLA, Arizona, etc. for the one or two guys a year who have that skillset is asinine.
|1 year 14 weeks ago||I think this is pretty spot||
I think this is pretty spot on, except I would swap the Purdue and Maryland games. Purdue shot really well from 3 against us at Mackey, and we shot really well from 3 yesterday. Bring both of those numbers back to Earth a bit and Michigan almost certainly loses at Maryland, but keeps the Purdue game a lot closer. Plus a hopefully healthy LaVert should help against Purdue
|1 year 14 weeks ago||I thought the ball had left||
I thought the ball had left his hand, but I was watching on a 12" black and white Magnavox with antenna
|1 year 18 weeks ago||A good way to think about||
A good way to think about this is that there is a difference between compromise and accomodation. With the first, both parties sacrifice something in order to come to an amicable understanding. This is an important part of all relationships and is essential to resource management in general. You prioritize the important things, and in exchange, give up some of the things that are less important to you.
Accommodation means that you give up what is most important to you in exchange for things that are less important. This seems like compromise, but eventually, a person's inability to access the things that they deem most important will wear on them, so instead of an amicable understanding, you just push off the initial conflict (aka, the negotiation about each party's values) until later. And when things build up, people eventually blow up.
|1 year 20 weeks ago||But has a top, uncommitted||
But has a top, uncommitted recruit ever both committed and enrolled early at a school that had no head coach? We've seen just about everything else in recruiting, so it wouldn't be a total shock, but that sounds pretty unlikely.
What if Georgia then settles for Schiano as their coach? Would Nauta really take that risk just to stay close to home? Could anyone face such dire consequences as accidentally committing to Greg Schiano???
|1 year 27 weeks ago||Truly, the team should feel||
Truly, the team should feel comfortable hanging its hat on this special teams unit. It was a major advantage against both Northwestern and Michigan State (until the final play). Michigan can expect to neutralize some of its weaknesses thanks to its special teams, and that's valuable.
|1 year 27 weeks ago||You are using bad data||
You have vastly underestimated the special teams advantage that Michigan had in this game. As Brian alluded to, Bill Connelly's win expectancy against Michigan State was 68%, meaning that a team that performed as Michigan did against Michigan State would be expected to win 68% of the time. State had 3 scoring drives all game and missed no field goals; Michigan had 5 scoring drives. State was able to accumulate more yards from scrimmage because they were faced with a major field position disadvantage the entire game. That was due to special teams.
EDIT: Michigan State also ran 14 more plays than Michigan did, which at State's rate of 5.15 yards per play, would result in 72 additional yards from scrimmage.
|2 years 12 weeks ago||What Michigan has done for||
What Michigan has done for you lately is go to the National Championship, go to the Elite Eight, have a NPOY, have a Big Ten POY, won two B1G titles, and sent five guys to the draft. All of that has happened in the last 3 seasons.
I don't live in your hypothetical future world where Michigan is a disappointment. In the real world, less than a decade ago, Michigan was an AWFUL basketball program that hadn't hung a banner since George H.W. Bush was president. Beilein has changed all of that. You are suggesting that we hold him accountable for seasons that haven't happened yet, which is asinine.
|2 years 12 weeks ago||I feel like I'm taking crazy pills||
Under Joh Beilein:
Despite all that, the brats in the Michigan fanbase want more, more, more!
And people wonder why our football program has been toxic for almost a decade...
|5 years 15 weeks ago||Is he still allowed? Like the No Homers Club?||
|5 years 21 weeks ago||Michigan would like to give||
Michigan would like to give thanks to Fitz's mom for his fantastic name.