I'm a member of a 12-step program. One of the things it promises us is that: "No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experiences benefit others."
The only way those experiences benefit others is if I share them--and I have to get past my own shame and judgement to do that. Looks like you are well on your way. Love and peace to you.
The rational decision would be to drop them. But I would rather risk losing a game once in a while than play a bunch of boring-game cupcakes. I'm really looking forward to next year's home slate. It is a solid improvement over some of the dreck I sat through this year.
Well, I would rather have seen M play FSU, which I suppose means that committee got it right if they were picking the four best teams and not the four most deserving. Not happy about that, but it is what it is. Onward!
I went to Lumen before moving to California back in the Class B days, and I'm a little surprised they don't play up a division or two. My kids swam for AA Skyline, which tended to be right on the border between D1 and D2 for both men's and women's swim/dive--the years they were D2, they opted up to D1 to keep their state cutoff times more consistent from year to year.
One problem with the Rose Bowl is that it is not anywhere near campus. The students have busses that take them to and fro, but that's just a completely different experience.
My son is a U-M grad, and in his second year as a grad student at UCLA. He never missed a U-M home game, but has yet to attend a Bruin game---and he might not until we all go in '27.
Having watched all four games in person, I was too. This probably says more about the other elite teams also being mortal than it does Michigan being exceptional. This week's game, in particular, did not feel at all comfortable until the pick-six, which could easily have worked out differently. I think even an incompletion there changes the tenor of the game significantly.
The good news is that we are going to play all of the teams you mention except (maybe) Iowa, so while this is fun to navel-gaze about, it will all work itself out.
I'm partial to Fubo, which with the optional sports add-on has pretty much everything you'd want if you are sports degenerate, including BeIn, Stadium, BTN/SEC/ACC networks, and the final year of the mighty Pac 12 network. (I went to Cal so I have an excuse.) They also often show the non-CONCACAF soccer tournaments so if you want to know what's going on in, say, the African Cup of Nations, they probably have you covered.
That leaves Peacock for most of the Premiere League and a handful of oddball college things. I was going to hold the line on this, but then got a promotion for 3 months at $2/month, so I caved.
I'm at a point on the time vs. money curve where I don't want to waste time trying to find a pirate stream that actually works, but I get that's not everyone.
Have been empty-nesting for a year. Kids are both in graduate school, but are townies who converted to Michigan students, so it wasn't 100% empty when they were at U-M.
The eldest is firmly rooted in her apartment in Madison starting year #3. No moves on the horizon. We saw the most recent M @ Wisc game with all four of us, which was a hoot. Definitely worth seeing a game at Camp Randall. (Proud Dad moment: She was part of the excavation team in the Netflix documentary Unknown: Cave of Bones. She's the one wearing a mask, b/c she was recovering from C19.)
The youngest moved out of his furnished campus apartment at UCLA to an off-campus house in Brentwood. It's a long enough trip that we did not go help and I have mixed feelings about that. He is happy about his return to the Big Ten, er Fourteen, or is it Eighteen. He has yet to see a game in the Rose Bowl; hopefully he'll still be there when Michigan comes calling so we can repeat our Wisconsin experience there.
I never got to see the Big Game Titration, except in video--I AP'd out of Chem. I did spend a couple summers as a CalSO counselor and Coordinator, though, where we made sure to show the newbies The Play.
Also on the subject: the Big Game Bonfire Roll On still gives me the chills.
I’m a Cal alum. This sucks, but there are worse things than following in U. Chicago’s footsteps.
And also as a Cal alum, our status as a Power 5 program has always been a bit laughable, minus a few years with Tedford. You practically have to go back to Pappy Waldorf for them to be relevant for more than a minute.
The idea that Folks Who Don’t Care About Sports would permanently subsidize the rest of us through cable bundles has been a slow-motion train wreck for a while now. And the sports leagues aren’t suddenly going to forgo that revenue without a fight. That will leave the rest of us holding the bag.
Unless we decide not to and just do something else with our time.
Logged in to upvote. Started using a version of this technique years ago, and it promoted brussells sprouts to the Top Tier in our household vegetable lineup, though I go 425.
There are very few things that don't get awesome after roasting at 425.
I left at the end of the third, and even then was questioning why I stuck around that long. The students had the right idea at half. It was a two touchdown lead against a clearly hapless opponent.
Now if you wanted to complain about the upper 1/4 being empty at kickoff, I’d be more likely to agree.
There are only a couple of these that come to mind. FL/GA is one, and TX/OK is another. Army/Navy is also neutral site, but I’m not sure it’s at the same place every time.
These games are on my bucket list, because they are tradition-laden neutral site games. Half the stadium is one side. Half is the other. Folks who’ve been write about it as a different experience in that the stadium is always loud—because half the stadium is always trying to interrupt the offense’s communication.
Yes, it costs a few bucks. And yes it’s one game you can’t recruit. And, it’s also true that my opinion doesn’t really matter because I’m not a fan of any of these teams. But this is one of those things that Makes College Different, and I like those things.
I'm not sure how this is a stand-off. I had one particular moment in my own career when I thought X was the right thing to do, but my boss wanted me to do Y. I made my case, didn't prevail and then asked: "Are you telling me to do Y?" The answer was: Yes, do Y. So I did. I disagreed with the decision then, and if I'm honest I still do. Doesn't matter--it was my job to carry out the decision.
If this case were in isolation, maybe there's a contract renewal, but it's not an obvious yes. But given the current climate, where the President and the Provost have both been fired for inappropriate conductwhile in the midst of dealing with a decades-long abuse scandal in the athletic department, all in the last three years? There's no way you can renew his contract without telling the student-athletes in every program: We don't care about you. You may not mean to say that, but that's what will be heard.
There are lots of hockey coaches in the world. Some of them are good hockey coaches. A few are very very good hockey coaches. Try to hire one. The alternative is losing whatever good faith still exists with the students.
I was at that game in Berkeley for a mini-reunion (I was an undergrad there) and yikes was there a lot of red. Cal got *waxed* which was a bummer after giving them a good game in Columbus the year before. As I remember it, we were down three scores before I had time to get settled. On the bright side my Worst State Ever shirt got plenty of commentary.
Seeing as he's a Bruin I bet it could go either way. Plus if UCLA and USC bring all their NCAA championships with them, that might move the title to B1G. So maybe he'll still be a part of "the conference of champions" with a new name.
She's on N. Segoe right across the street. I'd *love* the walk, but I'm not sure the rest of the family agrees with me. Of course, I suppose they could take the bus and I'd meet 'em there...
It might also depend on when/whether the rain starts.
My daughter is a U-M alumna and now a graduate student in Mad-town. My bride, my son (a senior at U-M) and I are all going to spend the weekend and take in the Fifth Quarter in its natural habitat.
We are thinking about visiting the Badger Bash at Union South before the game, but are not 100% sure yet. She lives over near the Hilldale mall, and we're staying right there too. Debating driving or taking the bus--sounds like the bus might be the way to go?
I've been sober for 3+ years after several decades of escalating alcohol use, abuse, and addiction. There were a lot of moments in there where I wondered if maybe I had a problem, but I was always able to convince myself I didn't because I hadn't done some other thing...yet. Until I did. Then I was able to find Some Other Thing.
If you've ever wondered like I used to---whether it's alcohol or something else--it is worth talking to someone who's been there. You'll probably know pretty quickly one way or the other. You can often find folks willing to talk at the Washtenaw Alano Club if you are in or around A2. They won't judge you. In fact, chances are very very good that they've been where you are and worse.
I know when I finally talked to someone, it made a world of difference. But not everyone makes it, and it's easy to go back out. Someone from my group very recently drank himself to death after also having about 3+ years sober. This shit kills, and it's not shy about it.
On some level it is shitty news. But from where I sit it is absolutely the right thing. The only reason we'd be playing a college season this Fall is as a money grab, while not paying the students who are doing most of the earning of that money and doing most of the risking anywhere near what I think they deserve.
For that matter, I'll be pretty angry if there ends up being (an attempt at) a season given how the disease is progressing around the country. Sean Doolittle put it best: "Sports are like the reward for a functioning society." We aren't there yet.
My son is also a rising junior at U-M, and we had this conversation in April. At first he was dead-set against a full online-only term, at any price. I think he was reacting more to "living at home with my parents and not being able to go anywhere is not college" than to online vs. in-person learning.
We talked about options: if he took time off, we'd want him to be doing *something* with that time, but the something could be pretty flexible. Could be a job, could be volunteer work, either in-person (provided the environment was safe) or remote, but that it wouldn't be playing call of duty all day. He was good with that, and even ended up picking up a job for the summer to give himself some spending money and something to do---and that was his idea, we didn't push him. If anything, we were both a bit hesitant to have him working an in-person job.
I think as we all got used to the idea that this was going to be with us for at least a year and possibly much longer, it didn't seem worth it to put it off. If he were an entering first-year student, and on a completely remote campus, I might re-think that. But even then I think it's reasonable to ask when "normal" (as in, "like the before times") will return, because if that doesn't happen soonish, at some point you have to move on.
A friend of mine is on the faculty there, and took my son and I out to dinner on a college visit. At first, I wondered why we were there. Then the cheese curds came. Wow.
I am so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine what that must be like. It really does put the truth that college football is just a meaningless game in sharp focus.
We arrived at about 6:15 or so, and parked pretty far out. I ended up getting a ride to the stadium by a friend of mine who is an officer with AAPD on her way to the end of her shift. She said that it was surprisingly quiet, and much calmer than they expected. Few if any fights, and everyone was pretty well-behaved.
As a bonus, my son got his first ride in the back of a squad car.
Despite the U-Verse complaint upthread, my cable experience for UM-FSU was fine. And granted I was watching a game no one cared about, but the ESPN3 stream of Cal-UNC was fine too.
The drum line did take a request once to play at my brother's wedding reception in the League. They didn't even take the beer we offered (they were on their way to another gig.) This was 20-25 years ago, though.
Any of the three (Pioneer, Huron, Skyline) will provide great educations for most kids. Each has particular strengths and weaknesses. My kids happen to go to Skyline, and both had great experiences there, but we probably would have been happy with any one of them.
There are few enough houses in the district that I would not limit by high school. Just find a place in town you like.
Saline vs. Ann Arbor: Saline has a much narrower socioeconomic band, and is correspondingly less diverse. That's not the place for us, but it might be for you. It depends on what is important to you.
Finally, if you're really that concerned, send your kids to Greenhills. I'm an engineering faculty member and a number of my colleagues' kids go there. My wife and I are fans of public education so we never really considered it.
With my son on a college visit at Wisconsin. Sitting on the Terrace over Lake Mendota, people watching, and sipping Lake Louie Warped Speed Scotch Ale. For Not Michigan, this isn't half bad.
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I'm a member of a 12-step program. One of the things it promises us is that: "No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experiences benefit others."
The only way those experiences benefit others is if I share them--and I have to get past my own shame and judgement to do that. Looks like you are well on your way. Love and peace to you.
I have to believe they feel a lot like some of M's players did this year: Unfinished business. I respect that.
I'm not happy about it, but I respect it.
Yes.
There's a reason we called it "white gold" in the fraternity when I was an undergrad--when you don't have it, it's worth its weight in gold.
The rational decision would be to drop them. But I would rather risk losing a game once in a while than play a bunch of boring-game cupcakes. I'm really looking forward to next year's home slate. It is a solid improvement over some of the dreck I sat through this year.
Well, I would rather have seen M play FSU, which I suppose means that committee got it right if they were picking the four best teams and not the four most deserving. Not happy about that, but it is what it is. Onward!
I went to Lumen before moving to California back in the Class B days, and I'm a little surprised they don't play up a division or two. My kids swam for AA Skyline, which tended to be right on the border between D1 and D2 for both men's and women's swim/dive--the years they were D2, they opted up to D1 to keep their state cutoff times more consistent from year to year.
I don't know. It sounds like a pretty good rendition of "Say absolutely nothing while making it sound like you are saying something."
One problem with the Rose Bowl is that it is not anywhere near campus. The students have busses that take them to and fro, but that's just a completely different experience.
My son is a U-M grad, and in his second year as a grad student at UCLA. He never missed a U-M home game, but has yet to attend a Bruin game---and he might not until we all go in '27.
I looked at a job at Oregon for a minute. (Well, it would be more accurate to say they looked at me for a minute before looking elsewhere, but...)
One of the more interesting tidbits I learned was: "It Never Rains in Autzen Stadium." I thought this was a pretty cool bit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LE6mDUqxZuI
I recall them getting well past midfield, but your point still stands.
> I was a bit surprised by this
Having watched all four games in person, I was too. This probably says more about the other elite teams also being mortal than it does Michigan being exceptional. This week's game, in particular, did not feel at all comfortable until the pick-six, which could easily have worked out differently. I think even an incompletion there changes the tenor of the game significantly.
The good news is that we are going to play all of the teams you mention except (maybe) Iowa, so while this is fun to navel-gaze about, it will all work itself out.
We had three games going at once last night: FLA @ Utah, NCSU @ UConn, and Neb@Minn. There were often three commercials going at once. Gah.
I didn't want to like this, but I did anyway.
As a Cal alum, I am disgusted. And also grateful. Very very grateful.
This sucks.
We caught some of this on BTN last night. It looked like a great time for everyone (except maybe Omaha.)
I'm partial to Fubo, which with the optional sports add-on has pretty much everything you'd want if you are sports degenerate, including BeIn, Stadium, BTN/SEC/ACC networks, and the final year of the mighty Pac 12 network. (I went to Cal so I have an excuse.) They also often show the non-CONCACAF soccer tournaments so if you want to know what's going on in, say, the African Cup of Nations, they probably have you covered.
That leaves Peacock for most of the Premiere League and a handful of oddball college things. I was going to hold the line on this, but then got a promotion for 3 months at $2/month, so I caved.
I'm at a point on the time vs. money curve where I don't want to waste time trying to find a pirate stream that actually works, but I get that's not everyone.
Ours both seem to have launched successfully. Looking around at the other families in their cohort, we are in the minority.
Judging from the crowd at the A2 Trader Joe's today, move-in is definitely in progress here.
Have been empty-nesting for a year. Kids are both in graduate school, but are townies who converted to Michigan students, so it wasn't 100% empty when they were at U-M.
The eldest is firmly rooted in her apartment in Madison starting year #3. No moves on the horizon. We saw the most recent M @ Wisc game with all four of us, which was a hoot. Definitely worth seeing a game at Camp Randall. (Proud Dad moment: She was part of the excavation team in the Netflix documentary Unknown: Cave of Bones. She's the one wearing a mask, b/c she was recovering from C19.)
The youngest moved out of his furnished campus apartment at UCLA to an off-campus house in Brentwood. It's a long enough trip that we did not go help and I have mixed feelings about that. He is happy about his return to the Big Ten, er Fourteen, or is it Eighteen. He has yet to see a game in the Rose Bowl; hopefully he'll still be there when Michigan comes calling so we can repeat our Wisconsin experience there.
I never got to see the Big Game Titration, except in video--I AP'd out of Chem. I did spend a couple summers as a CalSO counselor and Coordinator, though, where we made sure to show the newbies The Play.
Also on the subject: the Big Game Bonfire Roll On still gives me the chills.
I sat next to some Washington fans for the Brabbs kick game. They seemed like very nice folks. I’d be happy to have them make the trip.
I’m a Cal alum. This sucks, but there are worse things than following in U. Chicago’s footsteps.
And also as a Cal alum, our status as a Power 5 program has always been a bit laughable, minus a few years with Tedford. You practically have to go back to Pappy Waldorf for them to be relevant for more than a minute.
The idea that Folks Who Don’t Care About Sports would permanently subsidize the rest of us through cable bundles has been a slow-motion train wreck for a while now. And the sports leagues aren’t suddenly going to forgo that revenue without a fight. That will leave the rest of us holding the bag.
Unless we decide not to and just do something else with our time.
Logged in to upvote. Started using a version of this technique years ago, and it promoted brussells sprouts to the Top Tier in our household vegetable lineup, though I go 425.
There are very few things that don't get awesome after roasting at 425.
I left at the end of the third, and even then was questioning why I stuck around that long. The students had the right idea at half. It was a two touchdown lead against a clearly hapless opponent.
Now if you wanted to complain about the upper 1/4 being empty at kickoff, I’d be more likely to agree.
There are only a couple of these that come to mind. FL/GA is one, and TX/OK is another. Army/Navy is also neutral site, but I’m not sure it’s at the same place every time.
These games are on my bucket list, because they are tradition-laden neutral site games. Half the stadium is one side. Half is the other. Folks who’ve been write about it as a different experience in that the stadium is always loud—because half the stadium is always trying to interrupt the offense’s communication.
Yes, it costs a few bucks. And yes it’s one game you can’t recruit. And, it’s also true that my opinion doesn’t really matter because I’m not a fan of any of these teams. But this is one of those things that Makes College Different, and I like those things.
God help me, I might care about the Lions again. I mean I know better, but...it was certainly a fun watch. Looking forward to the rest of the series.
I'm not sure how this is a stand-off. I had one particular moment in my own career when I thought X was the right thing to do, but my boss wanted me to do Y. I made my case, didn't prevail and then asked: "Are you telling me to do Y?" The answer was: Yes, do Y. So I did. I disagreed with the decision then, and if I'm honest I still do. Doesn't matter--it was my job to carry out the decision.
If this case were in isolation, maybe there's a contract renewal, but it's not an obvious yes. But given the current climate, where the President and the Provost have both been fired for inappropriate conduct while in the midst of dealing with a decades-long abuse scandal in the athletic department, all in the last three years? There's no way you can renew his contract without telling the student-athletes in every program: We don't care about you. You may not mean to say that, but that's what will be heard.
There are lots of hockey coaches in the world. Some of them are good hockey coaches. A few are very very good hockey coaches. Try to hire one. The alternative is losing whatever good faith still exists with the students.
I was at that game in Berkeley for a mini-reunion (I was an undergrad there) and yikes was there a lot of red. Cal got *waxed* which was a bummer after giving them a good game in Columbus the year before. As I remember it, we were down three scores before I had time to get settled. On the bright side my Worst State Ever shirt got plenty of commentary.
Seeing as he's a Bruin I bet it could go either way. Plus if UCLA and USC bring all their NCAA championships with them, that might move the title to B1G. So maybe he'll still be a part of "the conference of champions" with a new name.
I'm a Cal grad from the early 90s. They will always be U$C, no matter how much better they've gotten in the intervening 30 years.
We were at the game, in the upper deck. We liked the look, and i didn't expect I would. Thumbs up.
She's on N. Segoe right across the street. I'd *love* the walk, but I'm not sure the rest of the family agrees with me. Of course, I suppose they could take the bus and I'd meet 'em there...
It might also depend on when/whether the rain starts.
My daughter is a U-M alumna and now a graduate student in Mad-town. My bride, my son (a senior at U-M) and I are all going to spend the weekend and take in the Fifth Quarter in its natural habitat.
We are thinking about visiting the Badger Bash at Union South before the game, but are not 100% sure yet. She lives over near the Hilldale mall, and we're staying right there too. Debating driving or taking the bus--sounds like the bus might be the way to go?
https://union.wisc.edu/events-and-activities/special-events/badgerbash/
I'm really sorry for your loss.
I've been sober for 3+ years after several decades of escalating alcohol use, abuse, and addiction. There were a lot of moments in there where I wondered if maybe I had a problem, but I was always able to convince myself I didn't because I hadn't done some other thing...yet. Until I did. Then I was able to find Some Other Thing.
If you've ever wondered like I used to---whether it's alcohol or something else--it is worth talking to someone who's been there. You'll probably know pretty quickly one way or the other. You can often find folks willing to talk at the Washtenaw Alano Club if you are in or around A2. They won't judge you. In fact, chances are very very good that they've been where you are and worse.
I know when I finally talked to someone, it made a world of difference. But not everyone makes it, and it's easy to go back out. Someone from my group very recently drank himself to death after also having about 3+ years sober. This shit kills, and it's not shy about it.
On some level it is shitty news. But from where I sit it is absolutely the right thing. The only reason we'd be playing a college season this Fall is as a money grab, while not paying the students who are doing most of the earning of that money and doing most of the risking anywhere near what I think they deserve.
For that matter, I'll be pretty angry if there ends up being (an attempt at) a season given how the disease is progressing around the country. Sean Doolittle put it best: "Sports are like the reward for a functioning society." We aren't there yet.
My son is also a rising junior at U-M, and we had this conversation in April. At first he was dead-set against a full online-only term, at any price. I think he was reacting more to "living at home with my parents and not being able to go anywhere is not college" than to online vs. in-person learning.
We talked about options: if he took time off, we'd want him to be doing *something* with that time, but the something could be pretty flexible. Could be a job, could be volunteer work, either in-person (provided the environment was safe) or remote, but that it wouldn't be playing call of duty all day. He was good with that, and even ended up picking up a job for the summer to give himself some spending money and something to do---and that was his idea, we didn't push him. If anything, we were both a bit hesitant to have him working an in-person job.
I think as we all got used to the idea that this was going to be with us for at least a year and possibly much longer, it didn't seem worth it to put it off. If he were an entering first-year student, and on a completely remote campus, I might re-think that. But even then I think it's reasonable to ask when "normal" (as in, "like the before times") will return, because if that doesn't happen soonish, at some point you have to move on.
That seems to be true at least for EPL. NBC Gold replays allow you to watch with "enhanced sound" or "natural" (i.e. no "crowd" noise).
At least, they did today for the TOT v. ManU replay.
A friend of mine is on the faculty there, and took my son and I out to dinner on a college visit. At first, I wondered why we were there. Then the cheese curds came. Wow.
I am so sorry for your loss. I can't even imagine what that must be like. It really does put the truth that college football is just a meaningless game in sharp focus.
We arrived at about 6:15 or so, and parked pretty far out. I ended up getting a ride to the stadium by a friend of mine who is an officer with AAPD on her way to the end of her shift. She said that it was surprisingly quiet, and much calmer than they expected. Few if any fights, and everyone was pretty well-behaved.
As a bonus, my son got his first ride in the back of a squad car.
Despite the U-Verse complaint upthread, my cable experience for UM-FSU was fine. And granted I was watching a game no one cared about, but the ESPN3 stream of Cal-UNC was fine too.
MMB Posted the video of their surprise visit to John's birthday party. Worth a watch.
https://www.facebook.com/Michigan.Marching.Band/videos/10154963436316136/?hc_ref=SEARCH