But I think Miami self imposing last year is the best indicator they would have indeed banned themselves after say a 6-1 start vs 6-5. Their record last year was just as bad, but they still threw away a (very unlikely) potential BCS game appearance.
Miami got absolutely killed in recruiting because of the uncertainty regarding potential future sanctions. Not sure how you can say "most of the recruiting cycle was over" by late November, especially when Miami had to flip guys in January and February. Just my opinion.
BTW I remember your site, I used to have my own MIami one a few years ago, and you were one of the first to come around, so a belated thanks for that.
To ban yourself from a bowl game when you were bad enough to possibly not even qualify for one, don't ya think? Miami banned themselves once they became eligible at 6 wins.
No, I agree. Miami will get hit with scholarships at this point. I think before this came down it was going to be 5/year for 3 years, with the outside chance at another bowl ban. Now, I think 3-4/year for 2-3 years, I can't decide. But definitely no additional bowl ban.
Even if Miami somehow "skates," they wouldn't be getting off free. They banned themselves from two bowl games, and suspended a bunch of players last year. What worked in their favor was the fact they sucked already. Self sanctioning a Sun Bowl and a Russell Athletic Bowl doesn't make for the best trophy hunters when it comes to bloodlust for the rest of the country.
It was pretty clear from the start the ncaa was looking to make an example out of Miami for a future deterent, and most likely, rightfully so. The ridiculous letter stating "if you don't talk, we're assuming you're guilty" proved that point.
My guess is this will keep Miami from getting another bowl ban. They will probably still get scholarship hits, just maybe not as prolonged as previously thought.
And don't hate on Miami just because their illegal recruiting resources (hookers, rims, abortions, as you eloquently put) are better than what middle of nowhere state school towns can throw at recruits.
They only got that information by feeding the bankruptcy lawyer questions to ask. Does it prove Miami is innocent? Of course not. And yes, the NCAA could still use any info they got through any means, because they aren't a court of law. Problem is, if they punished Miami this way, their lawyers would (I'm guessing here) destroy the NCAA in the appeals process. [internet lawyer hat, removed]
The 10K and 17K was comparing apples to apples from the US News report, no grad school included. In that case it would USC with 38K and Miami with 16K. But your point is taken.
Although I could go a few more rounds discussing ND and the fact they've been around forever and are the defacto school rooting choice for an entire religion. But I'll leave it as Miami fans suck, through and through. Go Canes!
Many champion this idea, but the city of Coral Gables will never allow something of that nature built on their land. Think Grosse Point Shores x 5 in terms of highbrow mindedness.
And to be honest, I think anything more than 45K doesn't get filled up. Miami's best attendance year since 1980 was in 2002, coming off a national title but also continuing to win the following year. Miami fans treat the school like their 3rd favorite professional sports team in the city.
Combining responses here, but not sure how Miami's 10K and change is higher than USC's 17K, going off the recent US News report. And most corrupt of the 80s? SMU clearly takes that by a mile. We could probably throw a few SEC teams in here before Miami. Their big scandal was the early 90s Pell Grant fun.
But, as I said earlier, I agree Miami fans suck. I was just curious as to Brian's inherent hatred towards kicking the rolling dumpster fire that is Miami's program right now. In lieu of Brian responding, If that's the case as you say, I guess it'll have to suffice as my answer. Like my ghost tree stand hunting commerical.
which is very fitting for its lack of facts. Did you go to Miami? Because I did. I guess my eyes were deceiving me when 75K would pack in for Florida State and VT, and barely 40K would show up for Rutgers, WVU, or a top 20 ranked Syracuse and Washington.
The Orange Bowl was one of the most intimidating stadiums to play in, only surpassed by a rocking Silverdome in my opinion.
Don't disagree on Sun Life being a terrible place to play, in any capacity. But 45 mins from campus without traffic for a 20 mile all-freeway drive? I think not. But at this point we're just arguing semantics.
and grew up a Michigan fan, hence the frequenting of this fine blog. And I agree wholeheartedly, the stereotypical Miami fan is terrible. I was more curious as to why Brian is choosing now to harp on something that has always been the case. Miami fans never show up - I think they averaged 45K in 2001, for arguably the best cfb team ever. Miami will never have the infrastructure of a 50K enrollment rolling over each year into a ridiculously large alumni base. But to say or insinuate they specifically aren't what cfb "stands for" when in reality all they did was get caught and pick the wrong guy to be their booster, while cheating is as rampant as it ever was, all across the nation? Come on.
for Michigan is always beneficial in the fact they play them so early each season. So even in this recent lengthy period of ND medicrity, Michigan receives a polls jump they probably didn't deserve at the time, and definitely didn't deserve in hindsight.
You assume a playoff committee can differentiate between an early season win over a 2-0 ND vs looking at a whole 7-5 ND season resume. But the early jump in the polls and obviously sustaining it could make a big difference when choosing the top .
Miami was given tons of shit for not putting out a media guide this year, but their Asst AD's reason was the fact they are immediately obsolete. They literally just stapled a bunch of sheets together, not even in color. Of course, it just played into the whole Miami is Frugal meme. But I think it should be heading towards online media guides. The press should be able to live without those colorful thick covers to start at.
And someone please tell me the name of the tree stand hunting infomercial that was on every single Sunday before Michigan Replay in the Lloyd era. I've been searching for it for years.
My non-internet searched memory always remember the fake field goal as the 2nd year UM lost to a beatable PSU team, thus further exaborating the 3 loss seasons before playing OSU each year. Now I'll have to research the 96 game to store that memory as truth.
And WOW. That play was sooooo demoralizing. I've thought of that exact play at least once every year, especially with the recent Les Miles fake fg extravaganzas.
But said no to any other Texas schools. So no SMU (somewhat probable with Texas politics), Houston (farfetched), or even UTSA (ha Larry Coker). Anyways, what this means is the Big East is dead, dead, deader than dead. Fire sale coming on!
Michigan has both Nebraska and Ohio State home or away on the same year. Nebraska has only one other top tier intradivision team (UM) so the issue is moot, unless you want to count MSU or Iowa as the same tier as PSU/Wisc/OSU. Ohio State splits with Wisconsin and Penn State the same each year, against Michigan the opposite. Obviously the reason is UM/OSU is a locked in interdivisional game, whereas other teams aren't locked into that quality of an opponent. And having Michigan State opposite the NU/OSU years I guess sets up the same situation as OSU's.
Fair enough counterpoints. My point was the same as Brian's - why as a paying customer (not as a die hard fan) would you ever consider buying season tickets to even numbered years?
You'd think he wouldn't put Notre Dame, Nebraska, and Ohio State as home games all on the same year. Perhaps when the ND game takes a break this can be changed, but yes, I'd want an a la carte season ticket package. Pay up for odd years, skip the evens.
and always try to make it to AA once per trip. Hit up Jolly Pumpkin last night, no issues with a lack of what we were looking for. Oro de Calabaza was terrific as advertised. It was a weekday night however, so insert your own exceptions here.
Cafe habana around the corner was also fantastic, delicious cuban food and a terrific goat cheese app everyone should try if they choose to go.
But can anyone name the show that was on before or after Michigan Replay, that was basically an infomercial about this awesome hunting tree stand? I can't for the life of me remember the product name or the show. This was probably circa 96-98.
or Terry Foster for that matter is baseless and has zero merit. Brian has given 5+ years of fantastic opinion based on facts, while those two hacks have been freeloading since the Fab Five era.
Brian saw the issues with the Carr era, and spoke as much. At the same time he kept it relegated only to the on the field stuff, whereas I would have gone all in and condemned the entire program since around the time Tressel started dominating.
don't you want your AD to do that? I wouldn't want my AD as the new presser hire to spout on about how this guy wasn't the real choice, we'd rather have so and so. People can believe them or not, but public statements vs. private ones are differentiated by the fact one of them always counts more, even if the insiders know the truth.
Kirby Hocutt, Miami's AD, did the same thing after hiring Al Golden. Said he was the only guy he offered the job to, his first choice, etc. After the Gruden fiasco, rumors of Bo Pelini, I mean, come on. Yet it's easy to assume perhaps Golden was the only guy Hocutt officially offered the job to. This is all semantics to the public.
those teams were unbelievably stacked on defense. Perhaps the best collection of talent on one side of the ball in the new scholarship era.
In addition, Shannon came to Miami in 2001, so he didn't recruit any of those players until later in his run as DC.
And not to be extra Debbie Downer, but his defense relies extremely on having a ball hawking safety able to shut down half the field and cover deep passes (Reed, Taylor, Meriweather, Phillips). The one year they weren't in the top 10 was the only year without a stud safety. With Michigan's Safety Hating God or whatever the running joke is with Brian that is definitely a position that would need to be address wholeheartedly.
when left alone behind the shadows. He is notoriously bad with the media. I do not know his intentions, as he has been AWOL since his firing. But Michigan could definitely do a lot worse than hiring Shannon.
As for him creating a pipeline from Liberty City to Ann Arbor? I'm not so sure about that. What I would be more excited about as a Michigan fan would be his potential ability to lock down the DPL that Michigan State has capitalized upon lately. His background really resonates with the inner city kids.
Ed Reed, Sean Taylor, Vince Wilfork, Jon Vilma, Antrel Rolle, D.J. Williams, Kenny Phillips, etc., etc., etc. His base 4-3 only works with top tier talent. Short of that, and you'll love their inability to get teams off the field late in games.
Not that it's anything close to being worse than the past three years.
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But I think Miami self imposing last year is the best indicator they would have indeed banned themselves after say a 6-1 start vs 6-5. Their record last year was just as bad, but they still threw away a (very unlikely) potential BCS game appearance.
Miami got absolutely killed in recruiting because of the uncertainty regarding potential future sanctions. Not sure how you can say "most of the recruiting cycle was over" by late November, especially when Miami had to flip guys in January and February. Just my opinion.
BTW I remember your site, I used to have my own MIami one a few years ago, and you were one of the first to come around, so a belated thanks for that.
To ban yourself from a bowl game when you were bad enough to possibly not even qualify for one, don't ya think? Miami banned themselves once they became eligible at 6 wins.
*rimshot*
I'll let myself out.
Whether you agree or not. And those away jerseys with actual sleeves are beautiful.
No, I agree. Miami will get hit with scholarships at this point. I think before this came down it was going to be 5/year for 3 years, with the outside chance at another bowl ban. Now, I think 3-4/year for 2-3 years, I can't decide. But definitely no additional bowl ban.
Even if Miami somehow "skates," they wouldn't be getting off free. They banned themselves from two bowl games, and suspended a bunch of players last year. What worked in their favor was the fact they sucked already. Self sanctioning a Sun Bowl and a Russell Athletic Bowl doesn't make for the best trophy hunters when it comes to bloodlust for the rest of the country.
It was pretty clear from the start the ncaa was looking to make an example out of Miami for a future deterent, and most likely, rightfully so. The ridiculous letter stating "if you don't talk, we're assuming you're guilty" proved that point.
My guess is this will keep Miami from getting another bowl ban. They will probably still get scholarship hits, just maybe not as prolonged as previously thought.
And don't hate on Miami just because their illegal recruiting resources (hookers, rims, abortions, as you eloquently put) are better than what middle of nowhere state school towns can throw at recruits.
They only got that information by feeding the bankruptcy lawyer questions to ask. Does it prove Miami is innocent? Of course not. And yes, the NCAA could still use any info they got through any means, because they aren't a court of law. Problem is, if they punished Miami this way, their lawyers would (I'm guessing here) destroy the NCAA in the appeals process. [internet lawyer hat, removed]
on my Grandma's Xmas tree back in '92
Love the reference. Brian you're at your absolute best talking about the Carr era. It's why I started coming here in the first place.
The 10K and 17K was comparing apples to apples from the US News report, no grad school included. In that case it would USC with 38K and Miami with 16K. But your point is taken.
Although I could go a few more rounds discussing ND and the fact they've been around forever and are the defacto school rooting choice for an entire religion. But I'll leave it as Miami fans suck, through and through. Go Canes!
Many champion this idea, but the city of Coral Gables will never allow something of that nature built on their land. Think Grosse Point Shores x 5 in terms of highbrow mindedness.
And to be honest, I think anything more than 45K doesn't get filled up. Miami's best attendance year since 1980 was in 2002, coming off a national title but also continuing to win the following year. Miami fans treat the school like their 3rd favorite professional sports team in the city.
but just full of these guys
If that was the case, I envy your attendance years in the independent scheduling bonanza.
Combining responses here, but not sure how Miami's 10K and change is higher than USC's 17K, going off the recent US News report. And most corrupt of the 80s? SMU clearly takes that by a mile. We could probably throw a few SEC teams in here before Miami. Their big scandal was the early 90s Pell Grant fun.
But, as I said earlier, I agree Miami fans suck. I was just curious as to Brian's inherent hatred towards kicking the rolling dumpster fire that is Miami's program right now. In lieu of Brian responding, If that's the case as you say, I guess it'll have to suffice as my answer. Like my ghost tree stand hunting commerical.
which is very fitting for its lack of facts. Did you go to Miami? Because I did. I guess my eyes were deceiving me when 75K would pack in for Florida State and VT, and barely 40K would show up for Rutgers, WVU, or a top 20 ranked Syracuse and Washington.
The Orange Bowl was one of the most intimidating stadiums to play in, only surpassed by a rocking Silverdome in my opinion.
Don't disagree on Sun Life being a terrible place to play, in any capacity. But 45 mins from campus without traffic for a 20 mile all-freeway drive? I think not. But at this point we're just arguing semantics.
and grew up a Michigan fan, hence the frequenting of this fine blog. And I agree wholeheartedly, the stereotypical Miami fan is terrible. I was more curious as to why Brian is choosing now to harp on something that has always been the case. Miami fans never show up - I think they averaged 45K in 2001, for arguably the best cfb team ever. Miami will never have the infrastructure of a 50K enrollment rolling over each year into a ridiculously large alumni base. But to say or insinuate they specifically aren't what cfb "stands for" when in reality all they did was get caught and pick the wrong guy to be their booster, while cheating is as rampant as it ever was, all across the nation? Come on.
why such intense and constant Miami hate?
for Michigan is always beneficial in the fact they play them so early each season. So even in this recent lengthy period of ND medicrity, Michigan receives a polls jump they probably didn't deserve at the time, and definitely didn't deserve in hindsight.
You assume a playoff committee can differentiate between an early season win over a 2-0 ND vs looking at a whole 7-5 ND season resume. But the early jump in the polls and obviously sustaining it could make a big difference when choosing the top .
Miami was given tons of shit for not putting out a media guide this year, but their Asst AD's reason was the fact they are immediately obsolete. They literally just stapled a bunch of sheets together, not even in color. Of course, it just played into the whole Miami is Frugal meme. But I think it should be heading towards online media guides. The press should be able to live without those colorful thick covers to start at.
Well, that saves me the trouble. Thanks.
Lloyd had a pretty nice seat there on the bench next to Beilen.
My non-internet searched memory always remember the fake field goal as the 2nd year UM lost to a beatable PSU team, thus further exaborating the 3 loss seasons before playing OSU each year. Now I'll have to research the 96 game to store that memory as truth.
And WOW. That play was sooooo demoralizing. I've thought of that exact play at least once every year, especially with the recent Les Miles fake fg extravaganzas.
Wasn't it the '96 PSU game they ran a fake field goal at the end up one score to effectively end the game?
If true, that's a horrendous trade for Shafer. Destroy your building reputation as a DC for some private personal vengeance?
But said no to any other Texas schools. So no SMU (somewhat probable with Texas politics), Houston (farfetched), or even UTSA (ha Larry Coker). Anyways, what this means is the Big East is dead, dead, deader than dead. Fire sale coming on!
Michigan has both Nebraska and Ohio State home or away on the same year. Nebraska has only one other top tier intradivision team (UM) so the issue is moot, unless you want to count MSU or Iowa as the same tier as PSU/Wisc/OSU. Ohio State splits with Wisconsin and Penn State the same each year, against Michigan the opposite. Obviously the reason is UM/OSU is a locked in interdivisional game, whereas other teams aren't locked into that quality of an opponent. And having Michigan State opposite the NU/OSU years I guess sets up the same situation as OSU's.
Fair enough counterpoints. My point was the same as Brian's - why as a paying customer (not as a die hard fan) would you ever consider buying season tickets to even numbered years?
You'd think he wouldn't put Notre Dame, Nebraska, and Ohio State as home games all on the same year. Perhaps when the ND game takes a break this can be changed, but yes, I'd want an a la carte season ticket package. Pay up for odd years, skip the evens.
Just saw Terrell throw Mattison's headset onto the ground after a late hit on the ND sideline.
Remy Hamilton, anyone?
and always try to make it to AA once per trip. Hit up Jolly Pumpkin last night, no issues with a lack of what we were looking for. Oro de Calabaza was terrific as advertised. It was a weekday night however, so insert your own exceptions here.
Cafe habana around the corner was also fantastic, delicious cuban food and a terrific goat cheese app everyone should try if they choose to go.
to Lake State? That one seems just out of range for the big time D1 school, even for hockey.
Perhaps an old school Dreisbach era version he kept after leaving to ND?
Well if they play Miami (YTM) it will be in their generic "Enter Your Name Here" corporate stadium anyways. Sign them up for a Home and "Home."
Just leads to Urban Meyer being the coach for the next 10 years?
The game for the following year? They signed a home and home for 2018-19.
Rutgers doesn't have him on their Spring 2011 roster, so they are definitely moving in another direction. Odd to lock him down on locations.
But can anyone name the show that was on before or after Michigan Replay, that was basically an infomercial about this awesome hunting tree stand? I can't for the life of me remember the product name or the show. This was probably circa 96-98.
Can we be part of two factions? I'd say I was 90% In Rod We Trusted, 10% Fierce Pragmatist. Not allowed?
or Terry Foster for that matter is baseless and has zero merit. Brian has given 5+ years of fantastic opinion based on facts, while those two hacks have been freeloading since the Fab Five era.
Brian saw the issues with the Carr era, and spoke as much. At the same time he kept it relegated only to the on the field stuff, whereas I would have gone all in and condemned the entire program since around the time Tressel started dominating.
Sounds juvenile, but "his blog, his rules."
Not the best season, but definitely my favorite of the 5.
don't you want your AD to do that? I wouldn't want my AD as the new presser hire to spout on about how this guy wasn't the real choice, we'd rather have so and so. People can believe them or not, but public statements vs. private ones are differentiated by the fact one of them always counts more, even if the insiders know the truth.
Kirby Hocutt, Miami's AD, did the same thing after hiring Al Golden. Said he was the only guy he offered the job to, his first choice, etc. After the Gruden fiasco, rumors of Bo Pelini, I mean, come on. Yet it's easy to assume perhaps Golden was the only guy Hocutt officially offered the job to. This is all semantics to the public.
those teams were unbelievably stacked on defense. Perhaps the best collection of talent on one side of the ball in the new scholarship era.
In addition, Shannon came to Miami in 2001, so he didn't recruit any of those players until later in his run as DC.
And not to be extra Debbie Downer, but his defense relies extremely on having a ball hawking safety able to shut down half the field and cover deep passes (Reed, Taylor, Meriweather, Phillips). The one year they weren't in the top 10 was the only year without a stud safety. With Michigan's Safety Hating God or whatever the running joke is with Brian that is definitely a position that would need to be address wholeheartedly.
when left alone behind the shadows. He is notoriously bad with the media. I do not know his intentions, as he has been AWOL since his firing. But Michigan could definitely do a lot worse than hiring Shannon.
As for him creating a pipeline from Liberty City to Ann Arbor? I'm not so sure about that. What I would be more excited about as a Michigan fan would be his potential ability to lock down the DPL that Michigan State has capitalized upon lately. His background really resonates with the inner city kids.
Ed Reed, Sean Taylor, Vince Wilfork, Jon Vilma, Antrel Rolle, D.J. Williams, Kenny Phillips, etc., etc., etc. His base 4-3 only works with top tier talent. Short of that, and you'll love their inability to get teams off the field late in games.
Not that it's anything close to being worse than the past three years.