If that's how you want to live go for it! All I know is that if you have that attitude towards HR or other departments it shows more about your character than those departments. I was just trying to point out generalization are unfair and not warranted. Just like you stating your team should have got an award based on the work they did, they probably deserved it and it's unfair they didn't get it.
It amazes me how you can generalize an entire department. I have been in the "HR" space for 10 years and have not been around these type of situations. I know many times HR has saved many peoples jobs from being eliminated, or faught for your team to get more vacation, a bonus or even more head count because your team wsa stretched to thin. I have been in an HR department that faught with the exec team to get all prescriptions free for employees or helped many employees through personal problems that you never knew about. While I know there are people in HR that are not good, I could say the same for every deparment in an organization. I know sales people that will snake a sale from a teammate, I know engineers that do nothing and take credit for what their team accomplished and there is no recourse for those actions. I am sure your team bust their tails on a day to day and quite frankly deserve awards as well, but I think it's wrong to generalize HR to people that keep a bulletin board up to date.
I think it's reasonable as an employer to try and get as close as possible to an agreement on a salary early. This way no one is surprised or blind sided in the offer/negotiation process. I think even if a number/ range is established it's fair to still negotiate, but it is also wrong for a candidate to agree to a "range" and then think they can interview or hold out for a much larger salary. It goes both ways. Some companies negotiate with candidates very well and some are not ethical the same goes for candidates. I have had candidates accept offers wait until the Friday before they start and decline because they shopped our offer for more money.
I have been in sales and very successful, I just did not want to continue in sales. So plese get the facts traight before you make terrible generalized statements like this. Plus with the amount of sales people I have helped hire I have probably added more revenue to the bottom line that you could dream of not including the millions I have saved the company in agency placement fees!
I am not sure how to private message on here, but I know tons of great IT people in Atlanta and would be glad to help you out. Let me know how to get a hold of you in private and I will see what I can do.
I have been recruiting for 10 years and this is new to me. I have mutually decided with a candidate that a offer will not work based on salary negotiations. I try to be the most up front and honest recruiter out there. In fact I have told candidates to ask for more money, because of market and if a company was vastly underpaying them. A thought is that you mentioned that you heard there was an internal applicant as well. It could be possible that the HR person wanted that internal to get the job and saw your negotiation try as an out to make that happen. Unfortunately in the world of hiring people play favorites and don't look at the big picture of what it can do for a company. You should negotiate a job offer, unless they literally give you everything you want. One tip in negotations would be to have the market data for the role and city you are in, another tip is to have an idea on the willingness of the company to negotiate on the front end. You can do this by asking if there is a range for pay, or is it a set number.
It is rare that an HR person can trump a hiring manager, so if you want the job after the interviews you can go back to the hiring manager and see if he can push to hire you. Like most people said before, you may have dodged a bullet if this is how the HR team works. It sounds like this person is the reason HR Dept get bad names and people don't want to talk with us.
Besides Michigan (I just learned there were more stadiums outside of that one) Bryant Denny! Great tailgate area and awesome atmosphere in the stadium.
I am not comparing tradition, I am looking at coaches as you asked. So thanks for bringing up the point also that Mullen has never won an SEC title just like Hoke has never won a B1G title. So why is it ridiculous to compare?
So now you are saying his past records shouldn't matter because they could beat this team, come on that is ridiculous.
I don't think anyone should use the 11 wins first season as to what the trajectory for his career at Michigan. You are correct I will not be able to give you the person that has done the same thing. Please look at Dan Mullen's first 5 years at Miss St and how his record was up and down. Miss State stayed with him and now they are number one in the country. You put those records with him at Michigan and they would be calling for his head before this year.
So again my point is look beyond the record. I am not sure if they should keep Hoke or not. Many people say this and I agree if you let him go you better have a fail proof coach waiting.
Hoke inherited a better starting line up I agree, but the depth was atrocious at every position. The players that were here were built for an entirely different system. I am not trying to compare him to Harbaugh. My statement revolves around the fact people want to use a win-loss record as the only deciding factor. It should not be, they should look at everything and I think it's fair people are defending him. Your statement about Harbaugh's record improving only proves that more. His record was improving when given a chance at Ball State and his record improved at SDSU. So because he is not improving W-L at the rate the fans want does not mean it's not getting better. Do I think he has been perfect by no means, has he made great decisions every time absolutely not, but to say he is terrible and anything else people are saying is just ignorant. I am fine if they replace him, but the person better be the actual answer to the problems and I hope everyone agrees the problems with Michigan football goes beyond just coaching
Because they still feel he is the right coach! They played the game, probably have access to things we have no idea about and feel that he is close to making this program what it should be. Why is it wrong to defend him if they feel he is the right coach? Just like it's not wrong for you to think he is the wrong coach. I am not saying he is the right or wrong coach, but he has recruited at a high level(only losing recruits as his job is being questioned). Many losses are not because he was "out coached." Injuries, he has had to deal with many injuries, he came into a program with talent (first year 11-2), but terrible depth at almost every position and as he was building depth injuries took over. I am tired of the he is developing players, go to every program and look how many high recruits washed out! The fact that some recruits aren't panning out is being focused on is because he is still trying to get depth. The last two recruiting classes have been small not his fault. So I think there is more evidence than people want to admit for him keeping his job. If keeping a job was dependent on wins and losses many GREAT coaches would be with out a job, first one that comes to mind is John Beilein. There are many more to add to that list as well. Jim Harbaugh went 17-20 in his first 3 years at Stanford! If it was pure wins and losses he should have been fired. So please understand there are reasons to keep Hoke and reasons against him, but we should not criticize someone's stance on it
While Devin is not playing up to his potenial, I am not going to say he is totally awful. He has always been "questionable" at times, but also shows magic at times. The offense stalling is not on him I feel this time. Go back to the tape and look at the drops! Unreal how many times the receivers have dropped balls that are delivered on time and on target. It happened agains ND, State and this past week. I am not saying they would have beat ND or State, but the game would have been completely different. Against ND in the first half he drove them to FG range and they missed, the game changed completely after those misses. Against state the WRs dropped everything especially at crucial times. Same last week, they were just lucky the defense was out of it's mind.
The WRs have talent, but drop too many balls! Funchess is a beast, but drops too many easy catches, Darboh is just getting use to college ball after the injury (starting to come around), Chesson is still a year a way from being a big threat.
Let's not forget the line is beat up and extremely young. One of the players expected to contribute significantly took a leave of absence (I hope he got his stuff figured out whatever it is). The line is not as strong as it should be which causes an inconsistent run game; which leads to long 3rd downs which causes more pressure on Garnder to be perfect!
Gardner is on his 3rd OC of his careeer, a position change and then back to his original position. He has battled injury every year as a full-time starter.
We as fans have to take all of this into consideration and realize with those factors everything had to go perfect for the special season to happen. Michigan has been on the wrong side of it this year.
So to the fans that want to blame Gardner or any one else, need to undestand this team was flawed from the beginning and the injuries, drops, inconsistent run game and Garnder being who he is has showed all of this even more.
So let's sit back support the team we love and wait for what's next! At one point this place wanted change because 9-3 and 10-2 was not good enough. We have change and now we have to deal with what is left.
He is 5 now and has been singing "Hail to the Victors" since he was 2. He is a die hard Michigan fan at 5 and when asked things he like he says Michigan and when asked things he hates with out missing a beat he state Ohio and Michigan State!!!! Also he has been asking me to take him to the big house everytime a game is on.
His rec soccer coached asked the kids for names of the team and he insisted on the name being Michigan and when we named our dog he named her Maize. (I sware, I didn't even suggest either of those) Proud dad moments!!!!
I disagree that he is a race baiter. He brings up race when it is needed. He has written many articles criticizing people for claiming racism when it is not (Vince Young and Cam Newton). He dislikes how Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson try to infuse racism to any criticism of a minority. I think it is hard to claim he is RACIST as one post claims. He claims the best football player of all time is John Elway, last time I checked he is white and if he was racist he would not be picking a white QB as the best of all time. If anything people do not like him because he challenges many people in their own thoughts.
Anyways that is off topic of the original thread. GO BLUE!!!!
I think Whitlock is great. Does he put race into some columns yes, but if you read them he also calls out a lof of others for using race. Such as his latest with Cam Newton. He is a huge Hoke fan since his time a Ball State. Whitlock probably is one of the few sports writers that calls it like it is.
I think the idea is great it is orginal and is a new way to honor people. I think it also will make a player think before asking for a number. I think it will help the history of the program stay with all players regardless of the generation!!
I think Cowherd says crap like this just to get people talking. He knows nothing about sports is only on T.V. because he pisses people off and then we watch to see what idiotic thing he says next. He rips off tons of peoples radio bits and articles and give no credit. I can't wait for the day when he is cancelled.
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Love the new designs! I am sure they will get plenty of money from me
Does anyone have tickets they are selling for the Michigan at Northwestern Game? Looking for 2
If that's how you want to live go for it! All I know is that if you have that attitude towards HR or other departments it shows more about your character than those departments. I was just trying to point out generalization are unfair and not warranted. Just like you stating your team should have got an award based on the work they did, they probably deserved it and it's unfair they didn't get it.
It amazes me how you can generalize an entire department. I have been in the "HR" space for 10 years and have not been around these type of situations. I know many times HR has saved many peoples jobs from being eliminated, or faught for your team to get more vacation, a bonus or even more head count because your team wsa stretched to thin. I have been in an HR department that faught with the exec team to get all prescriptions free for employees or helped many employees through personal problems that you never knew about. While I know there are people in HR that are not good, I could say the same for every deparment in an organization. I know sales people that will snake a sale from a teammate, I know engineers that do nothing and take credit for what their team accomplished and there is no recourse for those actions. I am sure your team bust their tails on a day to day and quite frankly deserve awards as well, but I think it's wrong to generalize HR to people that keep a bulletin board up to date.
I think it's reasonable as an employer to try and get as close as possible to an agreement on a salary early. This way no one is surprised or blind sided in the offer/negotiation process. I think even if a number/ range is established it's fair to still negotiate, but it is also wrong for a candidate to agree to a "range" and then think they can interview or hold out for a much larger salary. It goes both ways. Some companies negotiate with candidates very well and some are not ethical the same goes for candidates. I have had candidates accept offers wait until the Friday before they start and decline because they shopped our offer for more money.
I have been in sales and very successful, I just did not want to continue in sales. So plese get the facts traight before you make terrible generalized statements like this. Plus with the amount of sales people I have helped hire I have probably added more revenue to the bottom line that you could dream of not including the millions I have saved the company in agency placement fees!
Hi Poseidon,
I am not sure how to private message on here, but I know tons of great IT people in Atlanta and would be glad to help you out. Let me know how to get a hold of you in private and I will see what I can do.
I have been recruiting for 10 years and this is new to me. I have mutually decided with a candidate that a offer will not work based on salary negotiations. I try to be the most up front and honest recruiter out there. In fact I have told candidates to ask for more money, because of market and if a company was vastly underpaying them. A thought is that you mentioned that you heard there was an internal applicant as well. It could be possible that the HR person wanted that internal to get the job and saw your negotiation try as an out to make that happen. Unfortunately in the world of hiring people play favorites and don't look at the big picture of what it can do for a company. You should negotiate a job offer, unless they literally give you everything you want. One tip in negotations would be to have the market data for the role and city you are in, another tip is to have an idea on the willingness of the company to negotiate on the front end. You can do this by asking if there is a range for pay, or is it a set number.
It is rare that an HR person can trump a hiring manager, so if you want the job after the interviews you can go back to the hiring manager and see if he can push to hire you. Like most people said before, you may have dodged a bullet if this is how the HR team works. It sounds like this person is the reason HR Dept get bad names and people don't want to talk with us.
It is wrong to dis anything Zubaz pants related!
Besides Michigan (I just learned there were more stadiums outside of that one) Bryant Denny! Great tailgate area and awesome atmosphere in the stadium.
So that interview was pointless!
If you can come to the one in Atlanta my family and I will be there!
Glad we are basing why we should fire him based on how he is not winning how you like right now.
I am not comparing tradition, I am looking at coaches as you asked. So thanks for bringing up the point also that Mullen has never won an SEC title just like Hoke has never won a B1G title. So why is it ridiculous to compare?
So now you are saying his past records shouldn't matter because they could beat this team, come on that is ridiculous.
I don't think anyone should use the 11 wins first season as to what the trajectory for his career at Michigan. You are correct I will not be able to give you the person that has done the same thing. Please look at Dan Mullen's first 5 years at Miss St and how his record was up and down. Miss State stayed with him and now they are number one in the country. You put those records with him at Michigan and they would be calling for his head before this year.
So again my point is look beyond the record. I am not sure if they should keep Hoke or not. Many people say this and I agree if you let him go you better have a fail proof coach waiting.
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While Devin is not playing up to his potenial, I am not going to say he is totally awful. He has always been "questionable" at times, but also shows magic at times. The offense stalling is not on him I feel this time. Go back to the tape and look at the drops! Unreal how many times the receivers have dropped balls that are delivered on time and on target. It happened agains ND, State and this past week. I am not saying they would have beat ND or State, but the game would have been completely different. Against ND in the first half he drove them to FG range and they missed, the game changed completely after those misses. Against state the WRs dropped everything especially at crucial times. Same last week, they were just lucky the defense was out of it's mind.
The WRs have talent, but drop too many balls! Funchess is a beast, but drops too many easy catches, Darboh is just getting use to college ball after the injury (starting to come around), Chesson is still a year a way from being a big threat.
Let's not forget the line is beat up and extremely young. One of the players expected to contribute significantly took a leave of absence (I hope he got his stuff figured out whatever it is). The line is not as strong as it should be which causes an inconsistent run game; which leads to long 3rd downs which causes more pressure on Garnder to be perfect!
Gardner is on his 3rd OC of his careeer, a position change and then back to his original position. He has battled injury every year as a full-time starter.
We as fans have to take all of this into consideration and realize with those factors everything had to go perfect for the special season to happen. Michigan has been on the wrong side of it this year.
So to the fans that want to blame Gardner or any one else, need to undestand this team was flawed from the beginning and the injuries, drops, inconsistent run game and Garnder being who he is has showed all of this even more.
So let's sit back support the team we love and wait for what's next! At one point this place wanted change because 9-3 and 10-2 was not good enough. We have change and now we have to deal with what is left.
My Son,
He is 5 now and has been singing "Hail to the Victors" since he was 2. He is a die hard Michigan fan at 5 and when asked things he like he says Michigan and when asked things he hates with out missing a beat he state Ohio and Michigan State!!!! Also he has been asking me to take him to the big house everytime a game is on.
His rec soccer coached asked the kids for names of the team and he insisted on the name being Michigan and when we named our dog he named her Maize. (I sware, I didn't even suggest either of those) Proud dad moments!!!!
I disagree that he is a race baiter. He brings up race when it is needed. He has written many articles criticizing people for claiming racism when it is not (Vince Young and Cam Newton). He dislikes how Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson try to infuse racism to any criticism of a minority. I think it is hard to claim he is RACIST as one post claims. He claims the best football player of all time is John Elway, last time I checked he is white and if he was racist he would not be picking a white QB as the best of all time. If anything people do not like him because he challenges many people in their own thoughts.
Anyways that is off topic of the original thread. GO BLUE!!!!
I think Whitlock is great. Does he put race into some columns yes, but if you read them he also calls out a lof of others for using race. Such as his latest with Cam Newton. He is a huge Hoke fan since his time a Ball State. Whitlock probably is one of the few sports writers that calls it like it is.
Michigan 49- Illinois17
I have signed and hope that they will release him. My thoughts and prayers are with him, his family and friends
Here is the article from the local paper in Atlanta and he states Michigan is his dream school. Looks like Bama is trying to get him too!
Hope the visit goes well this weekend and he gets that offer!
http://blogs.ajc.com/recruiting/2011/09/22/rb-kamani-thomas-gets-comparisions-to-alabamas-trent-richardson/
God Bless you and your family. I can tell your father raised a great man.
I think the idea is great it is orginal and is a new way to honor people. I think it also will make a player think before asking for a number. I think it will help the history of the program stay with all players regardless of the generation!!
I think Cowherd says crap like this just to get people talking. He knows nothing about sports is only on T.V. because he pisses people off and then we watch to see what idiotic thing he says next. He rips off tons of peoples radio bits and articles and give no credit. I can't wait for the day when he is cancelled.