Player development / real NFL prospects?

Submitted by Zoltanrules on

I am past the depressed and mad stage and just trying to rationally analyze what has gone on these past few years. Really it boils down to a collapse in player development which of course has a lot to do with coaching. Players are not getting significantly better and we are void of big play makers. I don't see anyone being picked on day 1 of the NFL draft for the next few years. After watching four games this season, does anyone see future NFL skills on display?

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FanNamedOzzy

September 20th, 2014 at 11:33 PM ^

He hasn't been showing it a whole lot, but neither has that whole offense thing. He's the only top 2 round NFL pick I can seriously consider just because of his size and speed. A cheaper version of Calvin Johnson.

Also, Jake Ryan had a great game. He was just everywhere, and I heard his name as much as someone would hear Kovacs. But, Ryan actually has good size and decent speed to make it to the next level. He would probably be closer to a 5th round pick, but someone will definitely take a chance on him and I think he'll find a home.

Besides those two...Idk man.

Joined: 08/22/2014

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massblue

September 20th, 2014 at 11:35 PM ^

I mean we seem to have experienced coaches, specially on defense.  Is this all on Hoke?  Perhaps the recuriting is screwed up and we do not evaluate the players correclty.  The team is broken, but it is hard to believe that it is all because of Hoke.

Joined: 08/15/2009

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MGolem

September 21st, 2014 at 9:34 AM ^

Clark, Henry, Funchess, Lewis, Taylor, Wilson, Ryan, R. Glasgow, G. Glasgow, and Butt are all excellent players who have made noticeable strides since setting foot on campus. We are losing because of coaching, head coaching to be more specific. Our schemes do not work. Kicking the ball to Kaelin Clay under any circumstances was/is moronic. Our offense insists on huddling and moving at what can only be described as a glacial pace. Our opponents have all the time in the world to set up their defense, check our personnel alignments and make the necessary adjustments.

When Hoke talks about execution I am convinced he means "we are going to let you know exactly what we are going to do but we are going to do it better than you so you can't stop it." There is no other explanation for his mention of "execution", repeated ad nauseum. This was a recurrent criticism under Carr and apparently that is how Hoke learned to coach however Carr had NFL players at every position and we don't. Running our schemes with a QB who clearly has PTSD is ridiculous.

 

Joined: 10/14/2010

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LordGrantham

September 20th, 2014 at 11:36 PM ^

I just don't understand WHY we're so bad and WHY we can't seem to develop players. What are we doing everyday in practice?  Seriously, what does an actual Michigan practice look like?

Joined: 01/01/2014

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lawlright

September 20th, 2014 at 11:37 PM ^

Guy is a true freshman and doesn't ever get talked about. Occasionally gets beat by strength or speed or just a good move all of those things can be negated with age at that position.

Joined: 11/08/2013

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Victor Valiant

September 20th, 2014 at 11:37 PM ^

Funchess is probably a 2nd rounder if he's healthy and puts up a decent 40 time. Butt could be a first rounder with continued development and is probably a 3rd round guy right now. Willie Henry is definitely getting drafted eventually. Probably a 6-7th rounder right now. Jake Ryan probably has a 2nd round grade right now. I could see Ray Taylor as a late round pick with a good 40. Frank Clark is definitely 2nd-3rd round right now.

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alum96

September 20th, 2014 at 11:54 PM ^

You have Clark and Ryan valued much higher than the scouts right now.  Clark is at a position of need so probably will go higher than "based on talent" due to his size but generally is 4th round ish.  Ryan if he had continued at that 2012 level I think would be a 2nd rounder ... but he needs to really pick it up and be back to being a demon the next 8 games.  he is also listed as an OLB not a MLB on draft boards.   A lot more competition out there.  But again 2012 Jake Ryan would be up there .... he is not back to that guy at this point.

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BlueinLansing

September 20th, 2014 at 11:38 PM ^

is a physical speciman.  Depending on how his combine goes he could go late round one.  Speed might be an issue in the NFL, not sure.

 

But its looking like he won't have the 'wow' numbers to get first round looks.

Joined: 09/01/2009

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alum96

September 20th, 2014 at 11:50 PM ^

Being a Lions fan I look at mock drafts all year (its our Super Bowl) and Funch is generally a late 1st round to mid 2nd rounder.  As you say he it will all depend on his 40 for him.  He is a productive physical specimen.  If he runs well he could move up to mid first IMO based on prior players and how people value big WRs in this game.  If he runs slow its probably mid 2nd round.  He is far and away the most highly thought of player on either side of the ball.  

Guys like Clark and Ryan are 4th round types.

Joined: 04/28/2012

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MFanWM

September 21st, 2014 at 9:24 AM ^

Funchess still needs more focus I think for the 1st round, but certainly has the talent and ability. It would be nice if his QB did not believe in going masterlock on him at the start of a play and basically put him in position for defensive play of the week hits on almost every single throw.

Joined: 09/19/2010

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alum96

September 20th, 2014 at 11:46 PM ^

I believe the stat is 31 players (of all classes) in the 97 team eventually played in the NFL.  That is partly why Carr drove some of us mad - we had so much talent yet found a way to lose that "dumb game to a nobody" every year and have 3 losses instead of 2.  But we had WAY more NFL talent 10-20 years ago.

So if we are looking at ALL rounds, not just 1-3 it is impossible to tell you if any OL will one day be a NFL player (maybe Cole) but if we look at the upperclassmen I mean I have Funchess as a WR, Gardner as a 6th/7th rounder as an ATH, Butt... and that's it.  Throw in Green if you wish - its a massive stretch today. 

On defense Peppers, Lewis (after tonight maybe - I am stretching and he is an underclassmen), Jake Ryan as a 4th rounder maybe, maybe Bolden (maybe), Henry, and Clark as a 4th round type.   Maybe Glasgow develops into one, I dont see it yet out of Pipkins - I just don't.  The defense is not that young outside of S and DT so easier to judge who can be drafted.  Guys ilke Countess Taylor or Wilson are not elite athletes who will succeed in the NFL in the secondary  going against AJ Greens or whomever.

So unless a bunch of freshman and RS freshman are phenoms we have maybe 10 NFL players on this entire squad.  That is me being a homer.  First 3 rounds?  Maybe 3.  It's a far cry from the old days and its no longer about system - i.e. RR offense didnt require NFL players. 

So do we develop players - of course.  At the level we used to?  No.  And before we get into the 2011 or 2010 class Oregon and UM have had the same recruiting ranking on average over the past 7-8 years... one is the 2nd most winning program in CFB.  The other is UM.  We should be doing a lot better.

MSU right now has a 1st/2nd round QB, DE, S, CB in the 2015 mock draft - 3 of those 4 guys are RS JRs (not seniors) and they were 3 stars and 2 stars.  They just sent a 1st round CB to the draft last year.  It is not luck why college teams are good - they h ave NFL talent.  OSU sent Roby and Shazier last year along with a few OL ( I think).  Hyde was drafted. Their entire DL will get drafted - I'd take Bosa today in the 1st round.   Etc. 

We are behind.  I dont understand why.  We cant just blame the 2010 class for it all.

 

 

Joined: 04/28/2012

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jackw8542

September 21st, 2014 at 11:49 AM ^

The biggest issue about Coach Carr, at least to me, was his extreme conservatism and the way it tended to cost us games.  Once his team got what he considered an adequate lead, it seemed as if he went into extreme conservative mode on offense and into a prevent defense.  I, for one, have always hated prevent defenses, as well as going conservative on offense.  If something is working and got you to where you are leading, you keep doing it until the other team shows you it isn't working.

Joined: 10/30/2010

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I Like Burgers

September 21st, 2014 at 8:57 AM ^

Gardner. There is now way Gardner is getting drafted. If successful QBs like Murray or McCarron are fifth rounders then Devin isn't getting drafted at all. Guy melts down on the road, turns it over way too often, and is inaccurate. He'll be the first QB in a while at Michigan that doesn't make it to the NFLz

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alum96

September 21st, 2014 at 10:24 AM ^

I wrote Gardner as an ATH not a QB.  He is not going to play in the NFL as a QB.  You need to be able to throw in tight windows with NFL CBs hanging on your WRs.  He is a turnover machine - thats what wins and loses games in 80% of NFL games. 

He might not get drafted at all - but I think some team is going to look at his height and see potential for a WR in the 6th or 7th.  His speed seems to have degraded from last year as well which is worrying.

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Marshall44

September 20th, 2014 at 11:39 PM ^

I do.  I think Funchess is a first round pick.  I think we have plenty of possible NFL caliber players (but we really are young, not an excuse just a fact.)  I don't think the recruiting rankings are off base necessarily.  I think there is a major player development issue.    

Joined: 09/20/2014

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UPMichigan

September 21st, 2014 at 12:00 AM ^

If any of these players think they can get drafted early, think again. See Donovan Warren for advice. These players will be lucky to get an opportunity on a team given their poor success on the field.

Joined: 01/09/2010

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Avon Barksdale

September 21st, 2014 at 1:11 AM ^

He'd be a top 10 pick if he could consistently catch the football.

My best guess for this year's seniors:
Jake Ryan - 3-4th round
Frank Clark - 5th round
Gardner - 6-7th round (receiver)

Joined: 04/27/2013

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Padog

September 21st, 2014 at 8:45 AM ^

Funchess 2016 top 20: he will stay so he can have a real QB throw to him
Gardner 7th round: I think he will be picked at QB, there are so many QBs in college that are super smart and are winners that don't pan out, AJ McCarron to name one, that someone will take the chance on DG. He has shown he can have a good arm and had really good games (Notre Dame last year, Ohio State). If he can increase the number of good games, and decease the number of bad, he can be an NFL backup.
Clark 5th round: get him some corners who can cover for more than 2 seconds and he can be a beast.


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