well that's just, like, your opinion, man
Harbaugh will flip him back Blue
On to the next one.
Triple Post. Derp
Triple Post. Super Derp.
Did the quashing of the JoePa health rumors turn the tide?
Those aren't rumors. People don't live forever, and that guy has one foot in the grave.
in the grave.
When AZ met with Joe Pa they talked for 2 hours. Not a word about football. Joe Pa did his little " Here is my personal phone number. Only use it when you want to play for Penn State".
I am shattered that a young man from my home town committed else where. AZ also told his HC that the RR rumors didn't play a factor. He just felt comfortable at PSU.
On to the next recruit.
No worries, it isn't like he grew up a huge michigan fan and visited for nearly every home game or anything.
Coaching limbo claims another.
there's no coaching uncertainty with an 84 year old head coach.......
...but the way the "Michigan Man" faction has behaved over the last few years, I could see those warm feelings towards us growing cool over time.
Or maybe he just didn't want to play for a coach who knows absolutely nothing about defense b
He clearly needs to hire you.
in a few years. Michigan can't say the same.
I think if Harbaugh is brought in, Zettel will return.
Or, he just saw/felt something at PSU that seemed to fit. Its not like he's picking Tuscaloosa State over UMich, PSU has a lot of good things to offer and another storied and competitive program. Happy trails.
He isn't going anywhere unless something happens to JoePa. Harbaugh coming would have zero impact, unfortunately.
Maybe the kid doesnt like RR..
how about 'continuing to breathe uncertainty'
Is it too late to charge him for coming to the games?
I like it. It is one of my favorites.
Oh Benke, whining about his artwork again.
Maybe three of the worst defenses in school history had something to do with this? If Zettel really cared about "coaching limbo," do you honestly think after taking over a year in the recruitment process that he would be unable to wait one more week?
Remind me again which others were claimed by coaching limbo?
If Walls wanted coaching certainty, he wouldn't be going to Cal.
Is Tedford for sure going to be there next year? Yes. By your logic probably half the coaches would be "uncertain". Anybody that has had a couple bad seasons. This is the kid that was recruiting for Michigan in the summer.
Hopefully these educated students are looking further than just if the coach will be there the next year.
That doesn't fit the blame-game/excuse machine that is the Army of Rich Rodriguez supporters.
Everybody is throwing blame and making excuses regardless of which side you're on. This M shaped firing squad has proven to be detrimental to our success on the recruiting trail.
So, if most kids are uncertain about who the coach will be for a team the following year and they still commit, doesn't that suggest that they are factoring in other things?
but that's not what I'm getting at. I said that Tedford is back for sure next year and that is a big difference from what we have here. Nobody knows if RR is back and that changes peoples minds, If he was a heavy Michigan lean and then nothing changed except for uncertainty of the coach, what else could it be? They are still located in AA at last check, they still led even when they weren't winning every week, and the depth chart looks even more inviting now than before. And if you say that it was al Cal making the difference, Tedford must be the ultimate recruiter because that is quite a lot of ground to make up.
And who knows how many other guys eliminated us weeks ago due to the coaching situation.
1. Dee Hart hasn't decommitted yet.
2. Your example shows what recruits do when they aren't sure who the coach is going to be. They wait.
3. Any other guys who have eliminated us that we don't know about weren't very serious about us to begin with.
Said he will still look even if RR returns. I don't think he's coming.
He hasn't decommitted yet, and the other place he was looking was Florida. Since Florida is picking up a new coach themselves, I think he IS coming.
Or, he's looking to see what it looks like Mucshamp will be doing with the program. If I was a recruit, I'd certainly be intrigued to see what that guy could do with a HC stop and a recruiting platform like Florida. Ideally a strong bowl performance and some outreach from a bunch of smart players at Michigan who look like they're having a heck of a good time will be enough to make that less appealing though.
The kid isn't stupid. He sees all this garbage out there, including on this board. He knows that a so-so season next year with RR could mean he gets stuck with another coach. Bama has no such coaching instability.
The guy asked about kids that we lost due to the coaching situation. So yes, this example shows what happens with the coaching situation is in the air and I will use it. I don't think Dee is gone, but he wouldn't be a question mark if DB came out after the Purdue or Illinois game and said RR is our coach.
And I don't know why people cannot read full posts before responding to said post. Guys that "we don't know about"? Where did I mention that? I said kids eliminated us weeks ago (ie. October, November and December) and who knows how many of them did that due to the coaching situation. Since these kids usually don't come out and say, "Yeah I will not go to that school because they're HC is up in the air" you're left to wonder.
Can you see him on January 4th announcing "This coach can't recruit".
is not helping matters.
Here is David Brandon's list of accomplishments since becoming the AD:
1. Scheduled a night game (Hooray! What an idea!)
2. Played hockey outdoors (Hooray! Only 10 years after MSU started the trend)
When Michigan fans reject the chance to play at Michigan (Zettel), it makes you wonder how easy it will be for an alum (Harbaugh) who is already critical of how Michigan athletics operate to reject a job offer.
with that whine...geez...
So what you're saying is, Harbuagh isn't coming here due to the coaching uncertainty.
Shouldn't his username be "1/3rd of B10 or Bust"?
How the hell are you not banned at -600? How can you post with negative points? Sigh.
What up Mike. Long time no see.
What about FuManBlue? He's at -5000 or so. Besides, how could you get back into positive territory without posting?
He knows that he earned virtually his entire negative score from his meltdown during the football season. A repenting sinner is welcome on MGoBlog; an assclown with no desire to change is not.
Relax. He's one player. A Michigan fan? Sure, but he was thought to be on the verge of committing here for a long time and didn't pull the trigger. Perhaps he doesn't like the defensive system we run. Penn State has been churning out good DL to the NFL for a while.
I can assure you David Brandon is not a clown. Why bring in a recruit that is hesitant only to transfer in a couple years...to OSU (Boren)! We want players that are committed to Michigan. I understand why people are upset and why it is frustrating...such is life. Trust in DB and he will put things on track.
Have you ever even read his Bio? DB is not a clown.
I think other than a small handful of die-hards, few people come into Michigan w/ that level of commitment in years we aren't in the elite pantheon. That devotion comes from your experience there.
Before we start hailing Dave Brandon as either messiah or clown, how about we wait to see how the outcome plays out. While I understand the frustration of both factions, it's rare to have this much success in life (turnaround Dominos as CEO, very aggressive already as UM AD) by being a complete idiot. Besides, he is a Michigan Man.
But if not Blue, glad he didn't choose Sparty
But I wish he went to another conference...
I'm not gonna blame Brandon for this one because its obvious with his choice he's not too concerned with the coaching situation. This decision seems to be more about style of play. Maybe he saw how bad our defense has been under GERG and would rather not play in a 3-3-5 scheme. If we make a CC or bring in a top notch d-coordinator we might have a shot at getting him back.
At least we are just rolling in the the dline recruits.
This feels like anti-Chad Henne karma
Just when I thought the possible coaching change was not causing a problem with recruiting (i.e. the commits last week) I get dragged back in.
Best of luck, Anthony.
Yeah, because PSU won't have any coaching uncertainty over the next four years.
Maybe defensive statistics and performance, rather than coaching uncertainty, is what Zettel made his final decision on. GIven what we've seen from 2008 - 10 at Michigan, can you blame Zettel one bit for not committing to Michigan?
You honestly think the coaching situation had nothing to do with this? I don't care if JoePa was 100....Penn State's coaching situation is rock solid relative to ours. Rich Rod must feel like a lame duck right now trying to tell kids he'll certainly be there. He has my sympathy. Blaming defensive performance when we are putting out all-american level lineman is really reaching.
The fallacy of your argument:
Is National Signing Day today? Tomorrow? Next week?
Michigan's coaching "uncertainty" will be cleared up by NSD. If this was truly an issue for Zettel, he'd wait it out. I"m beyond certain the coaches told him there was a spot for him whenever he wanted to commit.
No - the issue wasn't the coaching uncertainty, because that will be cleared up in 7 days. Like i said before, his recruitment lasted at least 13 months. Why would he decide 7 days before we all know what's going on with RR if it were solely about RR? That makes no sense.
Yeah.....but after coming to every game this season, he realized that we've played bad defense for three years. The fact that you won't even consider the coaching situation is silly. Some kids don't want to wait until NSD to make their decisions. Others like Walls have already committed elsewhere because of the situation. Crawford (and Holloway) have said they will look elsewhere if Rodriguez is not brought back.
Are you suggesting DB should retain Rodriguez so that some recruits MIGHT not decommit?
And Walls was never a commit, so I don't know how you can say he committed elsewhere "because of the situation." You don't know that.
I agree. I would say it is probably less likely something changed with out situation and something he liked about PSU. Getting the chance to play at least one year nominally still under JoPa probably didn't hurt either.
By announcing now that he's made up his mind, and not waiting even though he has, he allows Michigan to pursue Barnes with more clarity of purpose when the dead period ends (and probably Greg Robinson is let go -- pray what Brandon is really spending his time on these past weeks is lining up a new defensive coaching staff). Also, maybe Zettel's choice reduces the chances Barnes will chose Penn State, thereby helping Michigan.
dude, many of these guys don't want to believe the fact we aren't a good team was probably the major factor. lmao
+1 for courage
I'm guessing Zettel was on JoePa's bucket list.
Outstanding. Comment ftw.
Also good luck catching Shoelace and Gardner AZ.
Come on DB
losing these recruits hurts big time.....hopefully with guys like Zettel we get the coaching situation set in stone and then throw some snake oil around to reel them back in
a in state defensive tackle, but seriously why would you want him if he does not want us? Like everyone has said it is not like Joe Pa will be coaching for the next 4 years, and if he is then take 100 m go points from me when that time comes. I figure by then I should at least have that much lol.
he is a defensive end/offensive line prospect.....not DT and he's ranked top ten in the country in both. Last time I checked it would be nice to have a beast DE(remember BG?) or some offensive line depth. Hes one of the top 70 players in the country. Remind me how it wouldn't be nice to pick up a guy like that?
It would be nice to have someone of his caliber. I remember we lost out on CJ Olaniyan to psu as well. He would have provided some nice depth for us.
I was thinking the same thing. They are LINEBACKUH YOOO
.....constipated and senile. Thats how he comes across right there, no disrespect.
I am hoping he is not. I am holding out hope that when the dust settles from the coaching evaluation, he could be persuaded to change his mind.
I talked to his sis, Jenna Z, he's finishing his senior year and enrolling in Fall. So until he signs, we still have a chance.
Seriously?? They have like 8 commits
AZ - still time to change your decision. Here's hoping to a signing day reversal.
If uncertainty is an issue, I'd think only near term uncertainty was really a consideration. Is there any chance that the current coaching regime at Penn State will even be there through Zettel's career?
Best of luck to Anthony except when he plays us. Just win the bowl game and maybe Zettel changes his mind. Snake oil, it's good.
Dave Brandon told me coaching uncertainty doesn't hurt recruiting, and he's always right.
what the hell is going on here.?????????
I think he was quoted saying "Michigan has too many question marks".
and a miss...
Another top in-state kid goes out of state??????
what the hell is going on here.?????????
Look closely and you will find your answer.
Could of finished with grasshopper.......profound...".look closely and you will find your answer grasshopper"....classic
Man, this one stings. While it doesn't erase all of the good feelings from the three recent commitments... Actually, it sort of does. :( Oh well, let's move on.
Well that Zettels that. Sorry, had to.
Hanging is too good for punsters. They should be drawn and quoted.
Welp, move along I suppose.
Deion Barnes please come on down
hooray for D-line depth!
BKFinest: Hello: Anthony Zettel. Book it. Neg bomb me away if it doesn't happen, but I've got a credible source that affirms Zettel is 95% Blue. Anthony Zettel will be blue at 7:30 tonight. BKFinest it.
Burger King, where are you?
Technically Zettel is blue, just the wrong shade
What's it about 95% today? We have the above from BKFinest and Bigelow and his "95 percent of them were stunned -- yes, stunned -- by what took place there."
Yes, where is he...I have an unfulfilled promise...
and we never even found out if Zettel is a good kisser!
He wasn't that good anyway. M never really wanted him. Coach Jackson called him "meh."
about kids that come to Michigan.
I love how people say this every time thinking it sounds all stoic and badass when it really just sounds bitter and petty.
and it's not petty. Really I don't care to talk about kids that gon't want to be blue.
Cam Newton, LaMichael James, Justin Blackmon. You never want to talk about them? That seems to take a lot of the fun out of college football.
Well this sucks
At least there are 2 silent commits hanging out somewhere. best of luck Anthony
I'm hoping one of those is Frost.
seriously, did he switch the hats for the Michigan one yet?
at his childhood favorite school. Sorry but don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya. Next?!
Stay classy buddy.
It does seem that we have a good shot at Deion Barnes who's visiting on the 7th. It'd be nice to do it the easy way once in a while, though.
p.s. Barnes is from Pennsylvania. Might as well trade with PSU.
good luck to him...hope he enjoys meeting Taylor Lewan over the next few years....
Woulda liked to have him, but can't can't blame him. What in the world is Brandon possibly waiting on??
The bowl game.
Take a second and think about it. Maybe it'll be clearer around midnight when January 3rd becomes January 4th, at the end of the Orange Bowl.
If there's one thing I can't stand it's a former player and alumnus that badmouths his former team and school. If only Bo had been alive when Jimmy Jacka** made his comment.....
bowl game to finish.
So you guys really think that Brandon has examined 3 years of wins and losses, off the field issues, academic performance, maturity/development of talent, recruiting, and countless other issues (both positive and negative) and has concluded that he will base his decision on what happens against Mississippi State??
I have to admit with this loss I've jumped ship. Brandon's timetable is hurting recruiting. Its not KILLING recruiting per say (i.e. D.Hart and Countess), but it certainly is hurting it. Its not everyday a lifelong Michigan fan, 4* DT, in state, player on team that desperately needs DT's goes anywhere else...
edit..UM FAN, I meant to post this as a reply to the above post not yours, sorry
as we just haven't fielded good football teams the past 3 years
Agreed. I have thought that everything Brandon has said and done so far is right on but this decision to wait until after the bowl game is just BAD. It is hurting us no matter how you look at it. I have thought a lot about why he is doing this and I keep coming back to the same conclusion that Brandon and Harbaugh already have an agreement and they are just waiting until after the Stanford/Michigan bowl games to announce it. If it doesn't end up being the case than Brandon made his first really stupid decision.
but I get your point.
Hm youre right, didn't realize he was actually listed a DE. Nonetheless, this one hurts.
that someone has a gun to Zettel's head forcing him to make his decision now and not a week from now.............
He made it clear to anyone close to the Stanford situation he will not entertain any discussions for coaching jobs because he is preparing a team (which he built from nothing) for a once in a generation major bowl appearence.
He is Brandon's first choice. Brandon is taking the mess of early December 2007 into account, and politely honoring Harbaugh's wishes. Killing two birds with one stone: restoring Michigan's stature from a poorly handled search in 2007, and staying in good with Harbaugh.
No idea if this is fact, but it makes way more sense then the idea that Brandon is waiting on any second tier bowl result.
What about the dump JH took on Michigan football and the university. If that's the kind of man that DB wants running the program maybe he should hire himself. Dominos pizza tasted liked sh*t while he was CEO. I hope he doesn't do the same for our athletics as he did for the pizza.
Given today's Bball performance against a Big 10 team, I still don't get how DB gave JB a vote of confidence. JBs been here longer, doesn't recruit the state well despite a very deep and talented pool (unlike the generally weak FB pool), and we haven't done well in conference since JBs been here. That's right JB has a young team- didn't Kentucky have a young team last year?
Possibly the worst comparison in the history of comparisons. Why didn't you just reference the Fab Five and wonder why JB couldn't pull in a class like that again. I seriously laughed out loud at the thought of you comparing Kentucky basketball last year, which had 5 players drafted in the first round (4 of which were freshmen), and Michigan basketball. Possibly, no, not possibly, positively the dumbest thing I have ever read on these boards.
And I didn't even mention how dumb your overall point was of JB doing horribly because we got beat by the 11th best team in the nation with a bunch of true freshmen and sophomores.
John Beilein got a vote of confidence because the basketball facilities at Michigan are very bad. It wouldn't be fair to fire JB when Dave Brandon knows that Michigan hasn't provided the basketball team with the resources to compete with other top schools. Brandon has stated so publicly. It's a completely different situation than the football program.
Everyone assumes that not giving RR a vote of confidence means Jim Harbaugh is definitely going to be the coach. This is not true, there is an evaluation process that Dave Brandon will stick to for every sport that has been given the proper resources to compete with other schools. Football has not concluded it's season and thus there will still need to be an evaluation period that will involve reflection of all games and feedback from the entire coaching staff, especially RR, to decide where the future of Michigan football is headed.
You're pretty naive if you believe Dave Brandon is simply "following his evaluation process."
You must not have worked for a major company if you believe CEO types are always completely straighforward.
But "following process" gains credibility when it was announced in March. I hope he retains RR and think he will but even if he doesn't, he has followed his process.
I was hoping he committed to um. That would have gave some hope that he heard RR was returning. At least DB is right by saying that his eval time doesn't affect recruiting...What a stubborn man.....
When I saw him this fall, he seemed like he was a way better offensive lineman than defensive lineman. He was a very good defensive lineman, don't get me wrong. But I'll bet you he plays offense there. I'll spare you the details of his overall greatness.
I'd just say to resist the temptation to blame anyone or any situation in this case. My buddy from Philly went to Penn State and said it is an amazing place. Plus they are a young team on the rise.
Michigan is a young team on the rise, remember?
Most people said that he developed his speed and has a great first step, which is why he might project better as a DE.
Hey DB this isn't Domino's. The kids want to know who the coach is. They are making their decisions now and so do we.
... let's not put this on Brandon? It's a convenient excuse, but it fell flat with the last 3 recruits. Unless Zettel said it was exactly that then we shouldn't think it was. Afterall, he could have waited until after January 4th to make his decision.
This is just a kid going where he thinks he'll be happiest over the next four years.
I find it weird that he couldn't wait a week or more for DB's decision. It's not like PSU was running out of spots.
You bring up a very point. From what we knew before, Zettel's coach strongly believed that Zettel would not fit in well in Michigan's system. If it truly was our CC situation, he would've probaly waited until after the first week of January. I think this was a decision based on where he (or his coach) felt comfortable.
What was he looking for during recruiting?? He visited UM 100 times and obviously didn't find it at UM. Just very curious.
sadly she never showed.
This choice by Zettel makes absolutely no sense to me
Now make sense?
Still sense no make.
Is that you?
In a metal Bikini?!?!
If they play the 3-3-5, many top defensive recruits are going to be scared off. I don't care if we get 4's and 5's, as long as Casteel comes and makes this a top-10 defense. WVa. is the only major school not to allow 21 points in any game this season.
If we get Harbaugh, fine, great, a Michigan man.
If we keep RR, great. Now let's go get the guy who knows how to execute the 3-3-5. He's worth five AZs (although it sucks that we lose an instater)
I think someone might have posted this a little too early in the night.
If it were that easy to just go out and get Casteel, I'm sure he'd already be coaching here.
he wanted to stay in WVa. and had the choice to do so. With a head coach waiting in the wings, and considering the small number of teams running the 3-3-5, I think Michigan is in a significantly better spot to land him.
Ya know, I remember hearing that Woody Hayes called himself Notre Dame's best recruiter because if any kid seemed like he was headed for Michigan he would start to talk up ND. Now, this Dantonio character...
With Charles Rogers. Tried to get him to go to FSU. We weren't as good at it as Woody.
Of all the places why PSU? When we lose kids out of state it is to a big time program out of the Big 10. Penn State-comparatively mediocre academics, coaching uncertainty, cold weather, no family connection, and on and on. Will be interesting to hear the rationale.
Seems like he has a big, close family so I don't understand the decision to pick a school that's a 10 hour drive from his hometown.
Colasanti, Tim Shaw, Anthony Adams, Bolden. It is a good school with a great fan base and tradition. The weather is no worse then instate. Plus, PSU's defense looks competently coached. UM's not so much.
PSU's defense looks competently coached. UM's not so much.
Defensive line is the bright spot of our defense. They definitely look competently coached...I seriously doubt anyone could transform Greg Banks into Brandon Graham.
Saying next in November is one thing, saying it in late Decemeber is another..Any good 2* DT's left???
break out the snake oil
Seems like a good kid, and I wish him the best.
As for everyone speculating about if it was coaching limbo or defensive performance over the past 3 years maybe it is this, he just liked Penn State as a whole. Recruiting is never one thing that sways a kid. For every pro or con there are the same thing the other direction, so it most likely his decision came down to 50 different things.
This is the one kid I wanted in this class more than anyone. I forging pissed off. Shitty news. The 2 best D line recruits in Michigan and two of the best national prospects aren't coming to Michigan to play football. PSU? And MSU. Wow. Fudge that, im beyond pissed.
At least he didn't go to MSU, it could be worse folks! This loss stings, we couldn't close Zettle & Walls when they were both huge UM leans until the very end. "Doesn't affect recruiting" my @$$!! There's always a chance of a reversal but I certainly wouldn't bet on it. Good luck AZ!! Off to make a drink, in fact a double!!
I agree Fhshockey, but 3 years of terrible defense and coaching uncertainty had to play a role in the decision for a kid whose whole family were Michigan fans.
In times like these, I just like to lawl.
Good thing he's just a 17 year old kid, otherwise I'd be super bummed right now.
He went to ND - found he was still Blue at heart - came back.
Hope AZ figures this out - sooner than later.
not quite but that does make a nice hallmark card
I just don't see how this one can fall on DB. Zettel knew that by Jan 4th, we would know whether RR was the coach, or JH. He could have waited one week longer to find out, but only if he wanted to play for one of those guys. If AZ wanted to play for UM under RR or UM under JH, wouldn't he have waited to find out if that was possible? I don't see how DB announcing the coach three weeks ago changes anything here.
Why would AZ say "I wanted to play for RR at UM, but DB waited too long so I'm out."? That doesn't make any sense at all. He waited this long. He just must have ruled out UM no matter the coach, and picked PSU.
I know blaming DB is the new black and all, but I can't make an argument for it here.
for DL or OL Michigan anyway. So we get D. Barnes now and get the better end of the deal in the long run. No worries.
Isn't that the woman that Dr. Dre beat up? Do we want that?
As much as I am frustrated with DB about the CC(either JH, RR, or someone else, I just want to move forward with the future), AZ decision is not on DB. As I said earlier, AZ has another week or 2 and PSU spots are not filling up. He had time. It has to be something else.
Sorry for the abbreviations.
Maybe he wanted out of Michigan, the state. Penn State has a great football tradition. I can't imagine he wouldn't have waited a week if it was all about the CC.
You sure? Looks like we changed places. I remember you after the MSU lost and I said it would be ok, let's wait till after PSU or Wisky before we go overboard.
Good point, but think long term..Let's say Michigan is 7-5 next year, and its another year of CC rumors, and likely a new coach this time around.
I thought AZ's big thing was he wanted to see a program on the rise - make sure M was headed in the right direction. He decided M wasn't going in the right direction and then picked PSU? Really?
It hurts when lifelong U-M fans like Arnett, Thomas and Zettel do not come here. Michigan has become a sad shell of its former self. I was pissed about Ronald Johnson, Nick Perry, Gholston and Thomas (i know the sparty connection) but this really hurts. LaLota, Campbell and so far no DT recruits, looks like another decimated defense topic in the making.
In all fairness, Zettel is a DE, not a DT. We aren't looking that bad at DE. Next fall, Roh will be a junior, Black a soph, Wilkins a RS frosh, Beyer a frosh or redshirting, and we might get another DE in this class (Barnes). All of those guys will be around for 2012 as well.
You just named TWO kids that have ever played a down at the position. DL was a huge need for us this was a big miss. You're siting a current recruit in our two-deep at DE and calling that adequate depth?
Notice I didn't mention RVB. I'm sitting a current recruit on our 2 deep for 2012. I'm assuming our 2011 2-deep will be RVB, Roh, Black and Wilkins. Yes, in 2012 we might need a guy who is not currently on the roster for our 2 deep, but that's not that crazy. It might be Beyer, it might be Barnes, it might be Paskorz who is already here, or it might be a stand-out 2012 recruit like Chris Wormley.
We have 4 highly rated and proven DE's on our roster for next fall, and three of those four will be back in 2012. Kenny Wilkins has looked good (and big) and Chris Rock might be a DE as well. Let's not forget that Beyer is a pretty solid recruit in his own right. Sky not falling.
Mike Martin is back next year. Q will have made major strides by the time next season comes around. From all reports Ash is looking real good and is RSing. Talbott is looking good but isn't strong enough and he is also RSing.
We are still in it with Cooper and should find out more about Jernigan as he is suppose to make it to one of the Gator Bowl practices that is open to the public.
Put Zettel on the list of recruits we have a better chance with if JH comes.
Wow man, JH must be like Jesus to you. More like, put Zettel on the list of would've been in AA if half our fan base didn't run our coach out of town before he unpacked his bags. JH was a great player, and is a hell of a coach but, he's NOT GOD. It would've taken JH 3-4 years to rebuild UM too. JH hasn't accomplished anything more than RR has done in his coaching career.
FYI I'm a huge JH fan but we have a great coach that has our team ready to break out & dominate (with a bit of growth & a few new players). Why do you want to start this over again? It's just bad timing...
Not at all, I actually want RR to stay. I don't really blame our fanbase for running RR out, mainly because that hasn't happened yet. And if RR would have won more games, or taken the tough teams down to the wire this year, this wouldn't be an issue. I understand why it took us a while, but most don't, and that's the reality.
The reason I say JH would help for Zettel is becayuse as it stands now, he's a PSU commit, so I don't see how a change could hurt. Maybe Zettel didn't come to UM because we have a shitty defense under RR and JH has the DC of the year on his staff. It shouldn't me a major shock when top level defensive recruits don't want to play in this system.
If he was interested in who comes next he would have waited. Its not like he was going to lose his spot at PSU, he went through nearly an entire year of recruiting. If he had made some rash decision, maybe he could be swayed, but there was no pressure for him to make is decision when he did, he said he was waiting to feel comfortable. Highly unlikely he comes back into play for anyone who has offered him
JH might not be Jesus but there is no way in hell we continue to play the 3-3-5 if he's coaching at Michigan. This decision is clearly about scheme and defensive coaching. Maybe Zettel wants to play for a team that prides itself on having a great defense. It also helps that PSU has a d-coordinator with a proven track record.
We don't need to start over. We do need someone who is up to the job. I just don't think we have that currently. That guy will come in and win what we should AND pull off an upset or two right away.
I am gonna call BS on the widespread myth that we had nothing on that 08 team. We had enough veteran defense to beat teams like MSU, Toledo, Northwestern and Purdue.
It boggles my mind that Rodriguez could think he could come in and lollygag around missing bowls for two years. This isn't Rice or Tulane. We needed to see more progress this year and likely didn't.
How everyone sees this automatic year of dominance in 2011 is a mystery. The schedule is just as hard the way Notre Dame and Nebraska look. Other teams improve too. We aren't the only ones. I trust that if this big year is so obvious, Brandon will keep Rich.
It boggles my mind that you think the problem is Rodriguez thought it would be OK to be bad.
I think he was trying to say that RR can be faulted for his decision not to adapt his offense at all to the players on the 08 roster - even though they were not at all qualified to execute the spread.
(Disclosure: I hope RR is extended for several more years, but I do understand this position)
A mild fisking is in order on this gloomy Tuesday:'
It boggles my mind that Rodriguez could think he could come in and lollygag around missing bowls for two years.
Yes, you're right. There are numerous reports that RR said, and I quote: "I'm sure glad I can lollygag around and miss bowls for two years!" If there's one thing I've always gotten from Rodriguez it's that he likes to lose and also doesn't like to win.
This isn't Rice or Tulane.
We needed to see more progress this year and likely didn't.
I honestly don't know what this means. If I knew I would fisk it.
Zettel won't decommit.
Just an open scollie for someone that is Michigan at heart.
....defensive ends, we got no secondary, our pet's HEADS ARE FALLIN' OFF!
Well, at least it's B10 basketball season.
Today. Yup. Mmm hmm. Sigh.
Good, the numbers are tight and it was looking like we might have to turn away a receiver.
I like your attitude. May your glass always be half-full!
We better win that damn bowl game or this may not end as well as we thought
The remaining 5% must have been a real turd in the punchbowl.
Pack his bags for Bolivian yet?
I am currently in Bolivia. Let me tell you it is not a place you want to be. Hopefully I will be able to liberate myself soon, but it looks like it will be later rather than sooner.
You're a lot closer than Fuman Blue
...but maybe he got a cookie for being the ninth member of their class.....and while we're at it, that's pretty darn weird too....
Chaos will reign if this CC comes to fruition.....AZ obiviously picked a dark horse and childhood fav....more dashed hopes and dreams on tap no matter what happens im sure!! Wish we could flash forward to next week and see the carnage on this board....GO BLUE!!
I would hope that a big Michigan fan would want to play for the team he admired all these years. May be he just felt his development at DE, TE or OL would be better at PSU and thus his chances to play in the NFL.
Good luck to him. But I always wondered why he did not commit earlier and was worried about this happening. Oh well, may be we can still get a few more good DT's, something we are really in need of!
can't really blame him though. no question that psu's defensive coaches > UM's.
After the bowl game, Greg Robinson and co. they gone
Correction: After the bowl game Greg Robinson, and Greg Robinson alone, is gone. If you really believe RR will fire his WV "crew", you haven't been paying attention.
This is what I've been thinking for a good long while—the most common scenario in which RR returns is one in which DB basically requires RR to dump his entire defensive coaching staff, hire a red-hot DC, and let him choose his own assistants. I have seen nothing that persuades me that RR will voluntarily axe Gibson and Tall, even if refusing to do so means that everybody goes. My hunch is that RR is so loyal to his WVU buddies that he would refuse to fire any of them, regardless of the consequences.
Which is exactly why the most likely scenario is that they are all fired. it is the only way to get a new defensive staff.
Michigan has five full-time offensive coaches and only three full-time defensive coaches.
I have seen nothing that persuades me that RR will voluntarily axe Gibson and Tall, even if refusing to do so means that everybody goes.
This seems right, but it may be possible to work around it. Rodriguez's closest friend seems to be Gibson, so move him to special teams coach full time (plus his "assistant head coach" position). Problem 1 solved.
LOL I called this over a month ago.
LOL awesome dude
Coaching change doesn't matter!!1!!
Considering how much it hurts the coach.
Shouldn't you be more concerned about it hurting the program instead of the coach?
Last time I checked RR is still coach of the program. Aren't the coach and the program the same until the coach is not employed under the program. So losing a good recruit hurts both.
So I find the lighthearted response out of character. And I thought to say "your coach", but he's still coach of the program, as you say, so he's my coach too. And if you hurt the head coach of your program, you hurt the program.
Yes and no. In this context, "it hurts the coach" means it hurts Rodriguez's chances of keeping the job. I'm more concerned that we don't have many D-linemen for future years, regardless of who the coach is.
When he made his first visit to PSU in the summer I didn't think UM was going to land him, always seemed to be looking for a reason not to go to UM. Didn't think UM would bring him in without a huge year.
Michigan lost a clone of RVB not the next BG. UM will move on.
Yeah, if we moved on from losing Turner, Witty, and Dorsey, we can weather this one too.
Uh, our defense is weathering the loss of those players? That's news to me. Are we weathering the placekicking situation too?
I read a chunk of these comments and had to check my URL again to make sure I wasn't on MLive. Losing Zettel to Penn State sucks but none of you know why he chose Penn over Michigan so quit your fucking bitching.
Please relax. People are bummed out since he would have been a nice pickup.
1. Only read a chunk of comments.
2. Makes a blanket stament. Apparently a response to everyone in this thread.
3. Telling other people to quit bitching in almost the bitchiest way possible.
Yep, it sounds like MLive.
This is not good, everyone saying next needs to realize we just lost the 2nd best player in our own state who was also a lifelong michigan fan. What's next is Raymon Taylor going to look elsewhere? or for 2012 is James Ross, Richardson, Jenkins-Stone, O'Brien, and Godin all going to look elsewhere too because they were childhood Wolverine fans also. Losing Zettel is just another lost to coaching uncertainty. This hurts a lot.
It's one recruit...there will be more. Coaching certainty will occur before signing day.
Be cool like Fonzie.
No, but there is consolation to be taken here. It looks like he is afraid to come to Michigan because he doesn't know who his coach will be. The good news is that he apparently chose not to go to MSU based on its own lack of merit as opposed to any coaching uncertainty. That is good for Michigan.
It would have been nice if he signed with Michigan, but his signing with PSU is much more palatable than if he had signed with Sparty or Brutus. Besides, Michigan gets plenty of recruits from PA; it's not like they wont get another to compensate for this "loss" somewhere down the line.
I still say these lifelong "Michigan fan" recruits are 90% bullshit.
M lately has had plenty of kids with great offer sheets who have committed because they were Michigan fans growing up especially with our recent growing pains.
It doesnt matter what state/school you've root for, if a kids dream is to play for a certain school then they will play for that school. Even Rudy did for gosh sakes.
I am not criticizing his decision, hopefully he enjoy's being Taylors Donkey but I am just annoyed with people who pledge allegiance to a school just to spurn them. rant over.
UGH!! If we lose the bowl...or even worse get blown out there will be blood flowing in the streets of Ann Arbor!! Good news is the way this MEGA CRAPPY bowl season is going all ranked teams will lose...and those higher ranked lose as well....
On another note...wonder if JoePa crapped his pants in excitement bout AZ? Or if he had to call someone and ask WHO??
It's gonna painful when Dee Hart decommits. Welcome Justice Hayes
but he's not a RB.
From 360 different angles.
But the bottom line is that losing Zettel is an enormous loss. No way this should have happened.
Dave Brandon has said he will evaluate RR "after the bowl game". He didn't say one minute after the bowl game. It's a very open-ended statement - "after the bowl game" could mean he will finish his evaluation on January 31. You guys all seem to think the evaluation and CC decision will be finalized by Sunday January 02. Study DB's comments carefully because this is a false assumption methinks. He never promised a specific date guys.
Bummed about AZ, we really really need him.
what would happen if DB waits until January 31. I doubt this will happen. An announcement one way or the other will come after the Orange bow!
If he waited any longer than the day after the Orange Bowl then the alumni and trustees would gather their torches and pitchforks and have his job. It's not like he's Supreme Dictator of Michiganland.
He will take as long as he needs to make a good decision. There are plenty of alumni and trustees that are behind Dave Brandon taking his time. Some people still value integrity. Wow, a person who sticks to their values and plans, lets get rid of him! One can only hope that the win at all cost alumni will go enroll at an SEC school to join other athletic programs with no adherence to ethical standards.
least he didn't pick msu.Maybe after we win our bowl game and coach is retained we can lure him back into the fold.GO BLUE!!!
Regardless of how you feel about the cc, take comfort in the fact that Harbaugh will almost certainly attract some great D recruits. He's a killer recruiter. And he'll attract recruits who shunned RR. Count on it.
I am glad you have such confidence in JH. Bold statement. I just hope if he comes here, parents will forget what he said 4 years ago about our academics.
SportsByBrooks sure hasn't:
I have no problem with what he said about academics. Michigan should embrace high standards. This ain't East Lansing.
Well, I hope you have a kid that is college bound in a couple of years. Not sure all parents will think as you do. And it's not just about higher standards.
Yes, I'm sure all the parents of recruits will say to their little Jimmy Linebacker, "You know, I don't think I can let you go to Michigan to play football for Jim Harbaugh. Remember three years ago when he said Michigan has a general studies program that many athletes are in? I'd much rather you go play for Ohio State, where those esteemed Rhodes scholars Greg Oden and Andy Katzenmoyer learned their craft."
Right. I guess I said all parents will have that problem for sure. I hope you are right and it never comes up. Just because you don;t care doesn't mean others won't. Thanks, I am glad you speak for all the parents out there.
No, you're right. College isn't all about high academic standards. It's about high tackling standards.
Right, I said higher standards don't count. They are part of it for sure, but there is more to it for certain people. You read my statement so well. I said I want us to be the SEC and we should have lower standards and that's what counts.
Right because Stanford never steers many of their student athletes to certain fields of study. Give me a break if you believe that Stanford is some "holier than thou" school that only allows their players to pursue the toughest of college classes.
Jim Harbaugh is so enthralled with the Stanford academic standards that he is willing to run to the NFL or entertain other college jobs with lower academic standards. If Stanford is so amazing and he believes so strongly in the type of student athlete that Stanford brings in, stick to your guns and stay in Stanford Mr. Harbaugh.
Mackbru is funny...He loves him some harbaugh he's the greatest coach to ever coach football. He will get all the great recruits count on it... harbaugh will never lose a game at michigan count on it.. Harbaugh turned stanford around and nobody has ever had a good season at stanford before harbaugh not even bill walsh or ty willingham... Harbaugh will get recruits he's a killer recruiter count on it.. All the shunned recruits that turned rrod down will be lining up at the door count on it.. who would ever trust rrod he's the devil harbaugh is a saint he played for bo count on it... C'mon crapbru your shit is getting old count on it!!!!
If DB said Rich Rod was "our guy" right after the regular season ended we would have Zettel and Avery Walls committed right now. With us in great place with Jernigan and Curtis Grant. Also we would have Dee Hart secured up. I'm worried about Kris Frost next going to Auburn because that's another" lifelong fan."
Are 100% correct
Actually, I think that would be better termed 100% conjecture.
I don't know how you know this, but you must be correct. Are you a. Walls or zettel?
I think we should let the kids know who the coach is gonna be right now. With that being said perhaps we shouldn't crucify DB and take RR off the hook. The real problem is Greg Robinson. Let's get a new DC and keep RR. If that doesn't work then back to the head coaching drawing board.
Letting the kids know == letting the world know. You know, the internets and all.
Robinson, you might remember, got the gig because RR was also wrong about the first guy he hired for it. Three DCs in four years might have something to do with AZ's decision.
This whole thing points to a coaching change. Do you know how stupid DB would look if he keeps RR and loses all of these recruits in the process? One game is not gonna make or break RR, DB has made up his mind.
DB has really painted himself into a corner. If we lose the bowl, it will be hard for him to stand by RR considering the very vocal anti-RR contingent already asking for his head. But if we win, he'll look sort of silly if he gets rid of him. In the case of us losing, he better have a good coach ready and willing to come. But what good coach that he might already have lined up is going to want to back off should RR win big. Additionally, I think DB will take some heat if he ends up keeping RR and losing some recruits because he waited so long to make the decision. He's obviously a betting man.
Dave Brandon does not look stupid at all. He has a plan that he has continued to follow. It would make him look stupid to change his leadership values for the needs of kids who aren't even sure of the school they want to attend in the first place. Brandon looks like the genius in the room amongst a group of AD's who have zero patience and will sell their soul to win.
Why would any blue-chip D player feel fully confident in Rich Rodriguez? Gimme a break.
Why now, all of a sudden? The timing of the kid's decision makes this feel like a little F-you to Richrod.
If you think that the coaching uncertainty isn't affecting recruiting now, then not only have you lost your mind, but you have permanently lost all sense of reality!!
Holy Hell Jumpin Jesus tap dancing Christ!
Well, it's not like RR has recruited the state of Michigan hard.
It's not pleasant to hear this news on AZ today but there's a lot of scenarios to play out before the official signing day. In the end I believe we'll be surprised at how well things end up for us in this year's class.
If he's not feeling it we wish him the best. But officially, it's not over yet!
This entire situation and program is a complete mess. UM used to be a football factory and now we get excited about a 3 star recruit (I know stars mean little). However, this is the type of athlete that RR and staff recruit and we better get used to it.
I don't know, it might be time to move on. I think it is a no win situation for Michigan. Fire RR and have the worst recruiting class in the history of the program or keep RR and lose out on a few elite players and add more fuel to the fire. Either way and people will bitch.
People should stop and consider that perhaps a coaching change might be good for recruiting for this class. Especially for defense. Who really knows what the effect would be?
After all, isn't it Rodriguez' recruiting and development program to date at least partially to blame for the state of the defense? Assuming that more of him recruiting will improve things is little more than a hope.
Whether or not we'll ever all agree on here that it is time bring in a new coach, the situation points to it happening. Folks should just cool it if there is a change and remember that whoever is brought in is no amateur. He'll have his own list of players and he might be able to turn guys that had previously not wanted to come to Michigan.
Are you ever going to change that signature? Or are you just going to keep looking stupid?
The perception that we're getting poorer recruting classes under RR than we got under Carr is delusional. It just isn't true. Our classes were always made up of mostly three star guys, just like nearly every other schools class every year. What will people say if RR is retained and Kris Frost and Dee Hart both sign LOI and have received fifth stars from Rivals, because Rivals already have Hart as the highest rated four star and they write half of their articles about Frost?
And you've already stated that it doesn't matter, so I don't understand why you made the post. But, just to emphasize the irrelevance of the star system, I would sure hate having three star prospects Ryan Kerrigan, and JJ Watt, and Mike Hart, and Sam Bradford on my team. They surely aren't good enough.
Do you actually believe what you just wrote or are you just in serious denial?
"mostly three stars"? No. From rivals:
2002: 1 5*, 10 4*, 8 3*
2003: 2 5*, 11 4*, 3 3*, 1 2*
2004 : I could go on, but you should get the point: you are delusional.
2005: 1 5*, 10 4*, 11 3*, 1 2*
2006: 2 5*, 9 4*, 7 3*, 1 2*
2007: 2 5*, 5 4*, 12 3*, 1 2*
2008: 17 4*, 6 3*, 1 2*
2009: 1 5*, 13 4*, 6 3*, 2 2*,
2010: 6 4*, 20 3*, 1 2*
2011:4 4*, 9 3*, 1 2* (so far)
Lloyd to RichRod doesn't look much different to me.
Just to throw more fuel on the fire, Stanford:
2005: 5 4*, 5 3*, 7 2*
2006: 10 3*, 7 2*
2007: 1 4*, 10 3*, 8 2*
2008: 2 4*, 8 3*, 7 2*
2009: 8 4*, 12 3*, 2 2*
2010: 5 4*, 15 3*, 2 2*
2011: 8 4*, 12 3*, 2 2*
like coal in my Christmas stocking. Damn...
Nothing is official until signing day. Never under estimate the power of RR snake oil. If RR returns for 2011, I can see AZ making the switch.
he's not in our division i guess.
When Brady Hoke is named the new coach AZ will decommit to us from PSU in a heartbeat.