Without futher ado:
12pm EDT (ESPN)
Argentina vs. Iran
Without futher ado:
12pm EDT (ESPN)
Argentina vs. Iran
Hummels out with injury (he took studs to the quadruceps and has a bad bruise, but will likely be available against the US). Boateng takes his spot in central defense; Mustafi moves in at RB. Germany otherwise unchanged, to my surprise: I thought they'd rotate their lineup a bit to limit fatigue but they didn't really have to work all that hard against Portugal so I suppose it's OK.
Essien joins Mutari in midfield for Ghana replacing Rabiu; Afful in for Opare at RB, Prince Boateng gets the start up front in place of Jordan Ayew. Except for Afful, those were the first two substitutions made against the US, so I guess they're no surprise.
Jerome v. Kevin-Prince. Half-brothers on opposing teams--you don't see that a lot in international play.
Really straightforward today:
Argentina wins and they're in the Round of 16.
Bosnia loses and they're out.
That is all.
Switzerland CB Von Bergen has gone home with an orbital fracture.
I have to say, Ekoku's comment after the foul that "you have to be allowed to challenge for a ball like that" tops my list of bizarre annoucing moments so far. No, you don't have to be allowed to use your boot to challenge for a ball shoulder-high, and that's why.
I mean, how will that be managed? What about bicycle kicks, that's certainly part of the game, will those be allowed: Or are you suggesting any effort to use the foot to move the ball that is above the waist - not that you said wast but just to place a limit - should be disallowed? To limit the use of feet in a game where the foot is used as the primary mover of the ball is going to be difficult.
That's exactly what the laws of the game provide for.
"A scissors or bicycle kick is permissible provided that, in the opinion of the referee, it is not dangerous to an opponent."
Basically, the world is divided into a space where you can play with your feet and a space where you can play with your head. It's dangerous play to use your boot at head level when an opponent is within playing distance of the ball; it's dangerous play to duck your head down to chest or waist level when an opponent is within playing distance of the ball.
At least one of the refs on the bigsoccer forum thought it deserved straight red--it was universally acknowledged to need at least a yellow.
and it appeared the german player was looking for the ball when he kicked at it. I wouldn't make a determination based on just that view but it didn't seem like he was purposefully being dangerous; if he's allowed to kick like that and he wasn't seeing the other player going to head it, should it have been even been called a yellow? Would anything been called had he not made contact with Von Bergen? Tough call, but yeah, if players are kicking at the ball while others are trying to head the ball there's going to be trouble.
You can't kick a ball at head level if there's an opponent there, and it's your responsibility to know whether there's an opponent there. (Yes, I know most referees are lenient when it's a bicycle kick for goal, but out on the field this gets called all the time.)
If it had been deliberate it would have been a straight red with no questions asked. Because he was looking at the ball it's just a yellow. If he doesn't make contact it still probably gets called a foul.
This isn't an obscure rule. If you look at FIFA's published version of the laws the illustration for "dangerous play" is a picture of a play just like this one.
Auf geht's, Deutschland!
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I have the information saved on my computer so I knew what to do. But thanks anyways.
What does "sheet the door" mean?
This piece in the Guardian reads like something that could have appeared on this blog.
...watching every World Cup game and halftime show produced for an American audience this weekend, it was hard not to realize just how wedded ESPN remains to everything else about The Brand™ that so dumbs down its coverage of every other sport to which it owns the broadcast rights. Anchors holding a tenuous familiarity. Soft-focus features high on emotion and low on data. An aversion to analytics and a commitment to game breakdowns based on intangibles, delivered by the "authority" of ex-jocks. A pathological fear of politics or social context whatsoever.
And why do some Americans insist on thinking "The World" is a monolith that thinks all the same?
The Guardian is as representative of "The World" as ESPN is of the fans of US soccer.
just how well read IS 'The Guardian'? I don't believe the viewership (readership?) extends that deep world wide. UNLIKE THE WORLD WIDE LEADER IN SPORTS, HATERZ!!!
Where was I? This is just the opinion of one reporter, move along...
Chris Ber -uh, I mean - victors2000
to get away from news about social unrest and other distressing news. It's escapism. Yet, this guy wants it to be a vehicle for social change and that' s not what sports is intended to be.
Contrary to what people think Jackie Robinson did not make Jim Crow or racism go away--even though we are told that. In my estimation, the desegregation of the military was much more important as the country finally was saying that a Black man had every much the right to die a "glorious death" for his country as the White man. In doing so the nation was finally saying that a Black man was indeed a Man for no profession defines "manliness" more than the military in these United States of America.
Sports is a adhesive. It binds together disparate peoples into a collective where social distinctions are temporarily forgotten or made irrelevant. Michigan fans are Michigan fans, not black or white Michigan fans. That is one reason why sports is a great and necessary aspect of modern society.
People who want sports to be movers of social agenda are much worse than the purveyors of schlock at ESPN. They are taking something that is a social glue and politicizing it. We have enough politics in this world. Please leave it out of sports Politics is like religion--an endless debate no one will win.We saw at the Munich Olympics what happens when politics is injected into sports. It doesn't end well. Oh and to risk a violation of Godwin's Law, Der Fuhrer sought to use Olympics as a political instrument. Does this Jeb Lund really want to follow Hitler's example?
Btw, we saw plenty of scenes of social disturbance up to and during the World Cup. I have no idea what this man was watching, but there was solid coverage of Brazilian unrest.
Within the context of the World Cup, sport is very politicized. You can't fully appreciate what Maradona did to England in 86 without the backdrop of the Falkland War. The same can be applied to some of the dogy decisions that have been made in the past, for example Argentina's World Cup in 78, I believe--the political situation adds an extra layer on what happened in that tournament. Of all the sporting events in the world, the World Cup is one that can't be removed from the politics of the countries involved. Too many examples of politics playing a role in World Cups--Ivory Coast civil war and the 2006 World Cup; Iran vs USA in 98; Holland vs Germany; even Germany vs Greece recently.
ESPN does dumbdown their coverage in this World Cup. The US-Ghana game was all about this revenge, nemesis, redemption narrative, when it should have been a time to demonstrate that the U.S. was a serious team that could make it out of the group. But the emotional "revenge" narrative plays well with American audiences. My buddy is one of the founders of the American Outlaw chapter in my college town--not once did he present the game as revenge or a rivalry. It was two teams who needed to win to set themselves to get out of this group. I'll end my ESPN rant.
...that the only thing that drew comment was the last sentence of the blockquote. I didn't expect that; that sentence wasn't at all representative of the piece as a whole, which was mostly about ESPN's aversion to tactical or data-driven analysis in favor of intangibles.
data-driven analysis. You make the assumption that most people are math or science geeks who look at sports like they do an a mathematical equation or the search for the God particle.
Most people don't care enought to have the depth of coverage that you desire. Part of the fun of sports is arguing about why this player did this or why the coach made that decision. Actually discovering the problem through the application of the scientific method is not what most people are looking for.
Because we hate picture pages, in depth play-by-play analysis, data...we just come here for the feelingsball.
I'm willing to bet that it isn't..
Sorry, I meant to emphasize more my dislike of narrative-only approaches taken by ESPN. The over-use of cliches such as "they wanted it more" or "they played with more desire" is one of my biggest soccer pet peeves. Different fans want different aspects of the game to be highlighted. But resorting to these cliches (and it isn't just ESPN--the Brits are also guilty at times) oversimplifies the technical and tactical aspects of soccer. It is dumbing down. ESPN doesn't even have to go in-depth like what happens at Zonal Marking--a few diagrams of tactical decisions and how positioning or a player's movement influenced a game would be a simple, yet highly beneficial. To be fair to them, Roberto Martinez's inclusion has helped with some of the tactical explanations; it also wouldn't be difficult to find foreign players who speak very good English and are tactically adept. Get Gary Neville from SKY if they need to--they have enough money.
I disagree, the U.S. went out at Ghanaian hands two world cups in a row, losing a third would have been devastating. Either your buddy was politely downplaying the consequences of the game or was willfully ignorant.
ESPN does dumbdown their coverage in this World Cup. The US-Ghana game was all about this revenge, nemesis, redemption narrative, when it should have been a time to demonstrate that the U.S. was a serious team that could make it out of the group. But the emotional "revenge" narrative plays well with American audiences.
Oh come now, Ghana has been a thorn in the side of the US since the dawning of the Republic. Right up there with the Soviet Union, the British Empire, and the Confederacy. Don't criticize the WWL for playing up the angle that Americans HATE GHANA SO MUCH!!!!
espn blows with their constant talk and analysis in everything they cover now.
The only thing they did right in this World Cup is hire the best English (and mexican) announcers to do their thing.
Argentina looking very good. They'll eventually breakdown this defence.
Probably the biggest talent mismatch of the entire tournament. I'm impressed that Iran's been able to hold it together for almost a match and a half.
Yes, credit to them for their defensive resolve and concentration. Nigeria not the most creative, but Iran defended well. Higuain currently the weak link in Argentina's offense. Maybe they'll bring in Lavezzi on the left. Who knows, with the way this World Cup has gone, Iran might get a set piece goal.
Could they be the first team to advance from the group stage without scoring a goal? That really would be amazing.
Iran wrongly denied a penalty. Argentina escape there.
Argentina not looking at all like one of the tourney favourites.
Like I picked the right match to miss.
Depends on how you look at it. This would easily be the most surprising result of the tournament. And really Iran should be winning. Although the constant diving and stalling makes Iran painful to watch.
Credit to Iran--they've taken a battering, but have remained solid, and arguably should be winning. Argentina need to move a little quicker in offense--their movement and passing has been too slow.
And then Messi does THAT. Wow.
What a shot
Wow. What a shot.
WOW! That is why he is the best. The Messi-ah strikes against Iran.
Adam Jacobi under a pseudonym?
that messi goal was beyond ridiculous. goosebumps.
Time to either see a miracle from my Blackstars or a complete beatdown. I hope they don't get Mullered.
Overreact much? They barely beat Iran. That was a very unimpressive performance. Much worse than Brazil's against Mexico.
I was rooting for Iran in that one. Just like to see the underdogs beat the more highly-favored teams -- that holds true for all sports, unless, of course, I'm a fan of the favored team.
As a side note -- I actually watched most of a soccer game! That's big for me. Seriously. And, what's more, I didn't hate it. Can't say I love, or even like it, yet, but hey...that's also big for me. Baby steps, baby steps...
At least get the draw.
Which result in the Ghana/Germany game is best for the US? I need to now rooting interest.
soundly beating Ghana is best for the US
That way we beat Portugal and we're up 6-3 or 6-4. Draw with the Germans and we win the group.
Why do we need to WIN the group.
Because if we WIN the group and WIN the Round of 16 match...I'm watching the U.S. play in Maracana in the Quarterfinal match on the 4th of July.
How sweet would that be? U.S. on the 4th of July?
Anything but Ghana getting the win is good for the US. While there isn't too much difference, in my opinion Germany getting the win is the best for the US, rather than a draw.
I disagree. A tie for Ghana is much worse for us. If Ghana gets beat down by Germany and beats Portugal it means that we will probably get through even if we lose the next two games as long as we keep them close. Not that that would be the ideal way to do this, but it's worst case.
Ghana to lose. Ghana having points muddles the battle for second place. Germany wins the game and group and the U.S. just needs a point off Portugal probably.
Yes Mr Yost is wrong on this one. We want a Ghana loss - they are basically out with one.
I'd love a highly entertaining game where Ghana carries a good portion of the game in the midfield but Germany's finishing wins it 2-0 or so. It would make me feel better about how Ghana dominated our midfield. I think Ghana will do well and this is no gimme to Germany.
We are not beating Germany barring some miracle, sorry. We need to draw Portugal and have Ghana lose today. Win on goal differential vs Portual or have Ghana beat Portugal in the last game which I can think is a good chance esp if Portugal go in there with their heads hanging low.
Overall I am not that impressed with the 2 South American powers and impressed with Dutch, French, Germans. Costa Rica as well!
He has the best left foot on the planet. When you have two guys covering him at the top of the box do NOT allow him to dribble left to shoot left. Same applies to Robben and Bale. Spectacular shot by Messi that the Iranian keeper, who had a tremendous match, had no chance on.
Off the field issues continue with Hope and violence. Details seem sketchy. Hope she can get it together, even though I stopped being a fan when she pouted and called out Greg Ryan on the US national team. At least Michigan got a good coach out that mess.
First real chance of the game looks familiar; kick deep down the right side and let that fast guy get there before the defense.
Ghana very up to task as I imagined - they are a bit of a matchup nightmare for many teams. If they had any finishing they'd probably be a top 5-7 team in the world. The final 3rd seems to be their main weakness. That said they are getting some decent shots off but generally from distance. Amazing the gulf between Ghana and Nigeria watching the last 2 games of each. I guess Ivory Coast would be 2nd on that continent, a step behind Ghana.
Ghana could take this if they find a finish.
Germany is getting some quality shots on Ghana in the box.
It's Germany. There is not a defense in the world they won't get chances against.
It's been quite limited overall, they shut down on players very quickly. But a team of Germany quality is going to get some chances every game- you just try to limit them which Ghana has does. Ghana midfield has impressed me in both games - hold the ball, not afraid, speed, skill.
Alright Germany, time to stop fucking around
Allemand is "German" in French. Allemagne is Germany.
Son of a bitch
My head is fighting my heart.
My head says Germany because it helps the US.
My heart pulls for Ghana because of the spirit they are showing against the machine.
Is there a more athletic team in the WC than Ghana?
I was talking about players that get paid.
Oh yeah, so were you.
I haven't seen all the games but Ivory Coast is pretty athletic and the Netherlands has a lot of speed at forward.
They have the youngest team in the WC
Boom 2-1 Ghana
IMO Ghana has deserved to win both their games - they have been very unlucky and they are punching Germans in the mouth today.
Holy shit son of a fucking bitch
Shit just got real.
Ghana and the US to go through . . . right?
More like Germany plays for its life against the US, thus knocking us out
No one is guaranteed anything at this point in this group.
Not if the US beats Portugal. Then Ghana needs a win to stay in and Portugal would be out. If Ghana wins, the US could get 6 points and still not make it out while a team they beat makes it in.
Ghana will beat Portugal IMO - of all the teams I've watched I'd put Ghana as top 5 over the first 2 games in terms of run of play. I think only Chile France and Costa Rica have played 2 quality games along with Ghana.
That would put Germany and Ghana through. We need a German tie at least
One man can make a big difference.
Ghana is playing like a team - Portgual plays lke an individual. Watch the teams that play with unity this tournament - they are winning or playing well and unlucky. Chile, Costa Rica, Australia, France. Portugal is a mental case most of the time and if they go down 1-0 to Ghana they will all begin infighting - that is what they do.
I think Ghana could beat Portugal 3-0 if they get a goal in the first 15 minutes because watching Portugal in South Africa and this tournament they are just mentally easy to implode.
Whoa there - Ghana hasn't won a game yet. (And at any rate, I think you have to add the Netherlands to the group of impressive teams.)
The World Cup.
The Germans will be pissed and needing a win.
If we can beat Portugal, we'll still probably be OK. It's not often you see a three-team tie with six points.
If there was a 3-team tie at 6 points, we'd be screwed. Germany would still have a big goal differential, Ghana's would be +1 or +2, so we'd have to lose to Germany by just 1.
Yes - but there probably won't be a three-team tie at 6 points. That rarely happens, and probably won't now either.
Why should we be afraid?
Go out and WIN, screw backing your way into everything. Take it. That's what Ghana is trying to do...that's what we should try to do.
First off, we need to beat Portugal. Period. They're wounded and I don't even think they're very good.
Go up 6-3-3-0 and all you need is a draw to win the Group. Go get your point.
If we don't win tomorrow, we might be boned.
Sickening to think the US could start 2-0 and still not go through...c'mon Germany!!
Wow, Germany reeling right now
probably the wrong team ahead, but don't you all just love the action in this game!?!
Wow Ghana could have headed that in! Just missed. Germans reeling - something you almost never see!
Germany is not doing a whole lot better at keeping midfield possession than the US. Ghana is for real.
Excited with every successful pass.
Reminds me of an NCAA Tournament game that's close under 8 in the 2nd half with a big upset on the line. Only this is the entire world and not a 20,000 seat arena.
This game can easily end 2-2 and then everyone can relax
Can't relax, Germany needs another
Thank you baby jesus
KLOSE! WHO ELSE! GOOD GO GERMANY. ONE MORE
Ghana doesn't deserve to lose this game.
2-2 final or 3-3 final just because I'd love to see a couple more goals.
Make it 4-3-1-0 with Germany at the top. Then US go win tomorrow and we're in and everyone can relax.
Ghana doesn't deserve to lose this game.
2-2 final or 3-3 final just because I'd love to see a couple more goals.
Make it 4-3-1-0 with Germany at the top. Then US go win tomorrow and we're in and everyone can relax.
Ridiculous game!! I know a Ghana loss is best for US(A), but damn I still want to see this upset. (due to Family ties and the one dude with the crazy Mohawk)
Someone else said it best - heart with Ghana, brain with Germany. If Germany wins it would be gutting to see Ghana 0-2 when you could argue they've been one of the top 5-6 teams thus far.
Living up to the Group of Death moniker.... No doubt that 3 of these teams deserve to move on, and I'm guessing Portugal will show some quality play before long.
Both of Germany's two goals were the result of headers.
Well they're not the biggest team...
They mean nothing...
Ghana doesn't deserve to lose this match. And a tie means US just needs to win ONE of it's final two matches.
I'm rooting for the draw.
Ghana is really, really impressive. Surprisingly good possession. Relentless pressure in the midfield. Makes me feel a little better about our showing against them. They deserve to be in the final 16 from what I've seen of them.
Considering it is 84 and humid their relentless pressure is fantastic to watch. Esp since most of these guys play in Europe 10 months a year now. Their midfield is very very good. Truth be told US is probably 4th in skill in this group but could advance still.
The heat and humidity may work to their advantage. Ghana itself has a tropical climate.
On the flipside, I'm leery about us having to play in Manaus. Having World Cup games in that location is absurd.
But both teams have to play in it.
And LeBron plays basketball.
I disagree on this theory because most of their players are based in Europe now. If you are in Europe 10 months a year your body adjusts to that no matter where you grow up. If you move to Forida for 6 months and come back to Michigan when its 40 degrees you feel like its Antartica.
If the Black Stars were all based in African leagues - I'd buy the advantage.
They may be based in Europe but they grew up in the heat and humidity. In any event, they have more familiarity with it than Europeans would.
You want absurd? Could I interest you in a World Cup in Qatar? aka Las Vegas... in July.
If Qatar still hosts the WC, it'll be in the winter. But that too is pretty crazy.
But yes, if it's in Qatar, the final match is supposed to end like the week before Christmas.
So what happens to club play during that year?
Do they continue without WC players? I guess it would be like the MLS where they continue playing without the players who play internationally.
Anyone know if this is an international feed? i.e. one feed for the world via FIFA? Not an ESPN feed for example?
Not sure if International but it's the same feed that CBC is using.
He is such an interesting character - he plays at a different level for county than for club.
It's one thing to watch a tie game, but another to watch one played at a REALLY high level.
Very excited that this game is tied
US can take command of the group assuming they beat Portugal
Go take it. Let this hold and then win and we're in. Jozy can definitely sit another game (even if he would be 50/50, which who knows). Hell you could sit Dempsey and Besler too and let them heel up and bring them on as subs if you want.
In the end, we'd be in and that's what matters. Tie Germany and we win the group.
I know you are being rah rah but the chances of US beating Germany or even tie-ing is about 5%. it would require a Ghana like level of misses (like game 1) and 2 set plays to work out for the U.S. Versus a German team that is tall and discplined...hence set plays don't work well versus them.
Other than Tim Howard there is not a single player that would play on Germany's 1st... and maybe 2nd team lol. And now Germany has something to play for. I think we need to beat Portugal now....which I find plausible. Unlike beating Germany.
...then win tomorrow and get 2nd. Either way a tie isn't and wasn't a killer for the US.
At some point you have to WIN. I mean, yea, sure you can advance on 4 points, and that's cool.
But "you play. to win. the game."
That's all I was saying it has nothing to do with the Germany match and that 5%. That is a luxury game if you win tomorrow.
My response was to those going crazy like Ghana HAAAAD to win and the US was out if they didn't.
No, a tie is just fine and likely forces us to win 1 of 2. That's reasonable. I'll take that. Just go do it.
I agree, go win tomorrow. But scenarios that include "do this vs Portugal than go beat Germany" in off handed way are a bit ridiculous. Yes it could happen - anything can happen, see 1980 hockey. But U.S. path runs through Portugal.
Anyhow its a bit for sh** and giggles, watching some of these teams the U.S. feels farther behind them then they were two world cups ago which is sort of sucky.
And that's great and yes winning takes care of things but you also have to be realistic. A German win was better for us. A tie tomorrow still most likely gets us through barring a blowout in the third game so this isn't the worst thing ever. But I don't agree that we should have to beat everyone to move on. I'll take any way we can get it
My exact thoughts. We have a lot on the line Sunday, if we lose or tie Portugal that game becomes critical. And it's unlikely that the US would beat Germany. It would really show you what it is like to be in the Group of Death...
Or the US could just win Sunday and relax instead of having to be drawn into a pressure-filled situation I'm not sure they could win.
Sunday's result is very important and the US must win it, no excuses
Portugal - RED CIRCLE GAME!
US beating Germany or even tie-ing is about 5%
You mean "tying"?
No I meant tie-ing :D
I don't do grammar on weekends.
what a defensive play - miss the tackle and its a PK
RT @JoshElliott32 Can't argue. RT @GrantWahl Klinsmann doing the smart thing, leaves press conference to watch Germany-Ghana finish.
This second half has been fantastic.
It may be the best half we've had in the World Cup.
I can't say for sure because there has been some AMAZING soccer played, but it's definitely up there.
Watching Ghana is like watching VCU basketball.
Win or lose these guys are going to press you and pressure you ALL GAME.
Chile v Ghana would be fascinating in that respect.
I'd propose that each team is allowed a 4th sub.
This could very easily be 3-2 Germany.
Overshot on that header and just fucked up a 3v2 as well...both side have had their chances to win this. Everyone looks GASSED. And rightfully so.
I love how these commentators are kissing the a$$ of the U.S. team. "puts in perspective how impressive US win over Ghana is ".
Dear commentator - Ghana dominated for 83 minutes of the game!
which has been replicated in this game is why Ghana is not yet an elite team. The US ought to have lost that game 3-2 or 4-2, but Ghana just could not bury their chances.
Since when does dominating time of possession mean they are the better team? Oregon football disagrees.
Its not just possession. It is chances. It is corners. It is eye test. Cmon now - if you think U.S. was better than Ghana in that game you are a serious homer. The U.S. played far better the last 2 times and I thought Ghana and U.S. were a lot more even in previous world cup matchups. This time around Ghana is better. Ghana missed all sorts of chances and thankfully we have a world class goalie.
One last free kick for the game...
Well great 2nd half and a fair result to both teams. Not so good for U.S.
No such thing as a fair result if it doesn't benefit the US
We win tomorrow against a wounded Portugal and we're in the knockout stage before we even face a Germany team fighting for their lives.
Wow, Muller... :O
They all look exhausted
Well, win and advance. Simple as that.
Less than ideal finish if you're a US fan but better then a Ghana win.
WIN THE GAME!!!
I believe that we will win Sunday. We know what is on the line. Plus eliminating that smug jerk Cristiano Ronaldo would be sweet. Yes, I know he is great towards underpriviledged, but I don't like the diving, flopping, and something about him just screams douche
I love Ronaldo the soccer player. The diving I don't care for but it is pretty prevalent in most countries now outside maybe the Asians and the U.S. players.
What I don't like about Ronaldo is when things go against him, he does not turn into a leader but a yeller. Which is why I don't believe in Portugal - did not in 2010 and do not in 2014. Even if they beat U.S. I see a team unity and spirit in Ghana that you don't see in a side like Portugal. Using a popular meme around here "they lack leadership". Like it or not your best players are looked on as leaders and Ronaldo is not one IMO. On club he has other guys to take that role, when with country he is looked upon and whenever things go south for Portual they go south fast.
I'd love an early goal vs them to see how they react emotionally!
I remember his reaction in the Spain game
Geez, actually getting a win against Portugal just became very, very important. I don't think facing a Germany team with their tourney on the line is going to end well for the US.
It doesn't require any collusion--it's just that when a team is through with the result on the board but would go out if they give up a goal, they have an enormous motivation not to take chances. Once both teams are in that situation it tends to be the end of the goals.
It's true that Germany would be playing for their lives but they would have nothing to gain from a win, they would just need to not lose.
Both teams would be content with a point and Germany would win the group on GD.
But if first place in the group (and thus the chance to avoid a strong Belgian team) is out there, I don't want us conceding it.
So much for the talk about how the US could lose to Portugal and Germany and still go through on points.
If we want to go through, we need to win our way through. As it should be.
Maybe it's just me, but I would more than happy to lose to both Portugal and Germany and still have the chance to go through.
Assuming Germany win v U.S. and wins the group here are scenarios
JUST WIN BABY
...or if we tie Portugal, JUST LOSE SMALL TO GERMANY...and go kiss your sisters Ghana and Portugal.
...I mean really, isn't that why we have Jurgen?
Joking (about the reasoning we have Jurgen, not about the assumption. In one match, if we've got to play for our lives, I'm not going to be confident --- but I'm not counting us out.)
So I don't know much about how this all works, but because Germany tied today, if we beat Portugal tomorrow do we automatically advance? Can someone explain our scenarios?
If we beat Portugal we will be one of the top two teams. Portugal would only be able to get three points with a Ghana win. Ghana would only be able to get 4 points. We would, at worst, have 6 points. The only thing not determined is if we would win the group or place second behind Germany.
It is highly unlikely we win that game but I could see a tie. Great goalies can keep you in the game.
End if day we need to beat Portugal and we will be through.
If we win tomorrow, we are in. If we draw tomorrow, we are like 99% in, right? Because even if we lose vs Germany, we hold tiebreaker on Ghana, and Portugal would need to make up a 5 goal differential for their tiebreaker. So a draw or better tomorrow and we are a lock.
Or am I missing something?
If the U.S. finishes on 4 points and Ghana beats Portugal then Ghana will likely hold the tiebreaker.
Need to beat Portugal to be a lock.
So H2H doesn't matter there as the first tiebreaker?
Nope. Goal differential and goals for are the first tiebreakers.
In Europe it's the first tiebreaker but things are different with FIFA. The tiebreak order:
I find it dumb that H2H is not first tiebreaker when it is applicable. But that is FIFA for you.
UEFA does it and the result is more meaningless third games, and more games where there's a particular result that puts both teams through and that they therefore play for.
Doing it this way means that as the result in the other game changes, so does the result you need in your own game. Day 3 is a lot more interesting.
First tiebreaker is goal differential. If we draw vs Portugal, lose vs Germany, and Ghana beats Portugal, we'd better hope we lose to Germany by only 1 and Ghana doesn't win by more than 1 so we'd both be at 0.
Then if we tie goal differential, it comes down to goals scored. Right now we have 2, Ghana has 3, so if we draw vs Portugal, a high scoring draw is best.
If still tied with goals scored, then it finally comes down to head to head, and we'd take that tiebreaker.
I just listed all 5 scenarios (assuming a German win vs USA) above about 5 posts earlier.
If US wins vs Portugal they are in, no one else can get 2 wins aside from Germany.
I don't think anyone ratioanlly thought this possible, but it is now.
First off, if we beat Portugal we are through. If we draw with Portugal, we'd need a draw with Germany to go through (or for Portugal to beat Ghana and then us to go through on GD, etc.).
But if we beat Portugal and tie or beat Germany, we win the group. That would set us up in the Round of 16, most likely, against mediocre South Korean or Russian teams--rather than very talented and dangerous Belgium. This is obviously the draw we want.
Obviously a lot has to happen for that to come to pass, and I imagine both Portugal and Germany will play with a lot of desperation at this point. But it's no longer a pipe dream.
Belgium wasnt that impressive in first game. No Lukaku makes a huge diff. We couldnt contain him when we played them last year.
1. US advances with win tomorrow.
2. US advances with draw tomorrow and draw or win against Germany.
3. US advances with draw tomorrow and loss to Germany if...
a. Ghana and Portugal draw, or
b. The US loses by only one goal, Ghana wins by only one goal, and the US scores one more goal against Portugal and Germany combined than Ghana does against Portugal, or
c. Portugal defeats Ghana by a margin no more than two goals greater than the US's losing margin against Germany.
4. US advances with loss tomorrow and win against Germany..
5. US advances with loss by one or two goals tomorrow and draw against Germany if Ghana and Portugal draw.
Hope I got these right--I welcome corrections.
If they lose (or tie tomorrow) and beat Germany are two more scenarios.
Bosnia robbed of goal due to dumb linesman...it wasnt even CLOSE to offsides.
Terrible call. Entire body was at least a yard onside.
Entertaining match other then that.
Poor Bosnia - down 1-0.
Nigeria style is old English football, go kick and chase it ... Bosnia hopefully pulls this one out.
and Nigeria has an undeserved lead, should be tied now, but Bosnia has still looked the better team so far
I guess Nigeria's tie v Iran looks better now in light of the Argentina Iran game but they are just not that inspiring to watch. Iran Nigeria I could not even watch it.
I am biased due to the US friendly a few weeks ago as well. Watching Ghana or even Ivory Coast is much more fun... as is Bosnia.
The football analogy (to my un-trained eyes) to Nigeria, would be a team that just threw a hail mary on every play... I have a feeling Bosnia is going to put 1 or 2 more goals in though. too much attacking talent
Hail Mary every down and then just hot route off of it with slants and outs.
Worked every time.
...and they played a solid game vs. Argentina until the best player in the world decided to be the best player in the world.
IMO they'll get 1 in this 2nd half and wouldn't shock me if they get two.
Whether win or draw, I see them beating Iran and advancing to the Round of 16.
Is there a particular reason why GD is the tiebreaker over head-to-head when it's a two way tie?
If Japan beats Colombia 2-1 and Ivory Coast and Greece tie 0-0...Ivory Coast and Japan will tie with 4 points, they'll have the same GD as they will have scored 3 goals and allowed 3 goals.
However Ivory Coast beat Japan 2-1...shouldn't that matter more than anything else?
Apparently per an earlier comment on thread to provide more excitment in the 3rd games of the group. Since goal differential matters both games will tend to affect things more with this as the first tiebreaker as opposed to head to head which would make some 3rd games irrelevent in every way.
But again, that's garbage (to FIFA)...
Right now in Group E Ecuador has the tie breaker over Switzerland even though Switzerland beat them head to head.
But because Switzerland got their doors blown off to France, they're down in GD.
Now Ecuador plays France and they're already through, it could happen, but I doubt they're going to worry about putting 5 goals up on anyone.
...as much as it's limiting situations where both teams lie down. When both teams go into a game knowing that a certain score gets them both through, the scoreline magically gravitates to that score. This way it's a moving target.
They don't ever want Germany/Austria to happen again. UEFA's had quite a few of those, doing it the other way.
The one that really sticks out in my mind is 2002. Denmark beat Bulgaria and tied Italy 0:0; Sweden beat Bulgaria and tied Italy 1:1.
In the last round Italy had Bulgaria and Denmark played Sweden. If Italy won they'd have five points; if Denmark and Sweden tied they'd also have five points. And since the first tiebreaker was head-to-head, all that would matter was the number of goals scored in the matches among the three teams. Italy's result against Bulgaria didn't matter; they'd already posted their number and all Sweden and Denmark needed to do was to beat it. If they had a draw of at least 2:2, they'd both go through no matter what Italy did.
Sure enough, the game finished 2:2.
My only guess is that FIFA enforces it to force teams to treat each match as important, instead of just relying on a previous win? I don't know really, head-to-head seems so much more plausible.
6/23: Mexico vs. Croatia (3:30p)
6/24: Italy vs. Uruguay (11:30a)
Bosnia seems to have tired out.
Goals in the last four World Cups:
Miroslav Klose: 15
The games being played on the Nigerian end, but they can't break through all the green shirts.
And they don't have Messi.
On 18 June, around 100 Chilean supporters who had gathered outside Maracana Stadium forced their way into the stadium. During the breach Chileans broke through security, after one fan pretended to be sick to distract the guard. They proceeded into the media centre, smashed the glass door, knocked over two partition walls and entered the stadium. Military police reported that 85 Chileans were detained during the events, while others reached the stands. Earlier on 15 June, about 20 Argentinians made a similar breach during the Argentina–Bosnia match.
not bosnia's night
damn nigeria goes through with a tie. Actually if Bosnia beats Iran, Nigeria goes through no matter what.
Germany probably should have won that game; they were very un-German, meaning they weren't clinical when it mattered. But I'm very happy with the response by the Blackstars. You see, this what happens when you start KPB and Afful, who can actually defend. This is actually how I expected the U.S. game to play out, a press and bend-but-don't-break defense followed by swift counterattacks. Of course Dempsey's early goal wasn't expected. It's a shame that Kwado Asamoah has to play defense instead flying down the left wing, but my goodness what a tackle to stop Muller from a certain goal. Still hope to get through with the Germans.
I hope you get through too . . . with the USA.
Heads would explode.