Wisconsin DC Dave Doeren: With Denard Michigan brings "downhill attack"

Submitted by markusr2007 on

An interesting perspective below from a team that is well-known for it's own "downhill rushing offense".

From the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel:

Wisconsin DC Dave Doeren:

"You see a more true downhill running game when Denard is the quarterback," UW defensive coordinator Dave Doeren said. "They do the same zone read with both of them.

"But Denard will get the ball in the shotgun and they've got two lead blockers plus the O-line and he makes things go.

"Forcier is an accomplished passer. I'm not saying Denard can't throw. But I'm saying there are going to be more route concepts you're probably defending when Forcier comes in the game.

"There are just more drop-back throws. With Denard there are more play-action, sprint-outs and bootlegs. Not a lot of drop-back passes."

UW DL Coach Charlie Partridge:

He is so fast that if you lose him for a second he can make you pay dearly," UW defensive line coach Charlie Partridge said. "You've got to be aware of where he is at all times . . .

"He can make you miss well enough that if he does make a guy miss he can be gone. I've known who this kid is for a lot of years from recruiting down there in Florida. He is a little bit of a local legend. I'm very aware of how fast he really is."

UW HC Bret Bielema on Denard:

"Robinson, everybody wants to talk about him running the football," UW coach Bret Bielema said. "He looks very special doing that . . . I know he's had some picks, some bad decisions, but he's got a live arm. Because of what he can do in the running game, he really throws your secondary and linebackers in isolated coverages.

Tater

November 16th, 2010 at 11:36 AM ^

I'm glad to see that opposing coaches are now having to prepare for both QB's.  Anything that makes their job harder during game week benefits Michigan. 

Captain Obvious

November 16th, 2010 at 12:20 PM ^

Tate does not do a single thing that Denard doesn't do playbook-wise.  Sure, he runs pass plays more, but the plays are not different.  (note - not debating quality of passes).  Denard lines up in 4 and 5 wide to pass too.  they run the same fake ZR passes.  The routes are no different.  The team prepares for "Tate's plays" when they prepare for Denard.  There is 100% overlap.

If Tate came in and I'm Wisconsin's DC, here's what I tell my players:

  • remember those 4 and 5 wide sets we studied?  You will see a lot more of them.
  • Key on the RB in the zone read, he's more likely to hand off.
  • Don't worry about the QB iso, he doesn't run it much.  Don't bite if he tries the oh noes play action.
  • This guy likes to scramble, don't let him break contain.  If you can get to him, force the fumble.

That's it.  The new wrinkle that he brings is that he likes to scramble and is good at it.  Honestly, this "drive DCs crazy" meme only worked in reverse, as with last year when Denard was the change of pace.  Denard's style of play last year (read: limited) was so different from Tate's that DCs would be forced to learn to defend a new play - the QB iso and small possibility of a pass. This "advantage" was also overblown.  They knew what Denard was going to do last year, they just couldn't stop it.

Captain Obvious

November 16th, 2010 at 2:03 PM ^

Nowhere did I say that our offense is easy to figure out or stop.  I love our offense.  I also didn't say anything in your 1-4, at all.

Conventional wisdom: "Let's sprinkle in Tate, it will make DCs have to prepare for a whole lot more and freak them out."

My response: Tate doesn't have a different playbook than Denard.  The pass plays are the same, Tate just runs more of them.  If anything, it limits the playbook because Tate has less running options.  Therefore, in preparing for Denard, defenses have also adequately prepared for Tate.  Preparing for Tate does not require practice time devoted to his special plays - there aren't any.  You can prepare for him by, like you said, - "He runs less, passes more and likes to scramble."  This takes 15 seconds.

spicy tuna

November 16th, 2010 at 3:10 PM ^

I could be way off, but I think one of the biggest advantages stability at qb brings opposing defenses is that they can memorize general %'s based on formation. So if Tate and Denard run the same plays, the defense would be prepared for the general plays, but not have the advantage of knowing "hey they're in X formation with X personnel, which means that 65% of the time they're running play X."

deejohn

November 16th, 2010 at 4:02 PM ^

u answered ur own statement... you do know that when D-Rob is running toward the L.O.S. he has @ least 2 plays he's running. if safties dropp down then pass, if they pull back into coverage then run.  trust me its not that simple. Tate doesnt have the same homerun threat that D-Rob has. u know, scoring from anywhere on the field with his feet.

jmblue

November 16th, 2010 at 4:54 PM ^

Key on the RB in the zone read, he's more likely to hand off.

It's the other way around. Denard rarely keeps it on the zone read, while Tate regularly does. There are other differences. Tate leaves the pocket much more quickly and is very comfortable throwing on the run; Denard is more likely to stay in the pocket and if he is flushed, usually stops before throwing.  Tate also goes through his reads more quickly and will find secondary receivers more often.

mgoblue720

November 16th, 2010 at 11:45 AM ^

Since the begginning Denard is only running between the tackles and the defense is going with a gang tackling strategy so that denard cannot break into the second level. They need to get him outside. Once the defense gets him in 3rd and long they play zone so their eyes are him and can contain him. Michigan needs to some how make the defenses to play more man-to-man

True Blue in CO

November 16th, 2010 at 11:49 AM ^

Watched the Purdue game last night for the first time fast forwarding between plays.  DRob looked slow but the field and conditions were not speed friendly.  Hoping a dry day will help Denard get his speed back.  Purdue played us well on defense and hopefully it was a good lesson for him and the coaches to make some adjustments that we are going to need against the bigger lines of Wisconsin and tOSU.

rcm

November 16th, 2010 at 12:14 PM ^

that seems to have been the trend over the past few games.  That's probably why we haven't seen the 70+ yard run in a while.  It would seem that opposing Ds are minding their assignments a bit better, preventing DR from getting the lanes he'd REALLY like

Don

November 16th, 2010 at 12:16 PM ^

is much more bruised than the staff has been letting on. I thought Denard looked step slower in the MSU game, and nothing has changed since.

jmblue

November 16th, 2010 at 4:57 PM ^

This goes back to the first time he hurt it on that sideline tackle.

I actually don't think it was the first time (against BGSU), but the second time (against IU).  He looked as fast as ever in the IU game until he reaggravated it.  That's when he started to seem a step slower.

switch26

November 16th, 2010 at 12:52 PM ^

I would love to see Denard in more Drop back passing situations just because of how many more run lanes will open up for him instead of him just taking and and running on a qb draw.

 

I noticed in the NW vs Iowa highlights when Persa dropped back and waited he had huge holes open up with an oline that is not nearly as talented as michigans.

Denard had a few good runs against Iowa, but not like some of the chunks Persa picked up.

 

Is there a reason we don't do more drop back passing with Denard?  Is it all because of the zone read  etc..?

BLUEFBFAN

November 16th, 2010 at 1:25 PM ^

Would like to see DR run on plays when he drops back and receivers are covered. Instead of forcing balls just run to the outside, get ten yards and then go down or out of bounds

Sac Fly

November 16th, 2010 at 1:58 PM ^

... about the badgers defense is they don't have anyone up the middle. They have two average defensive tackles but they're soft without borland. McGee will find plenty of ways to exploit them.

the_dude

November 16th, 2010 at 7:56 PM ^

The offense is so much more dynamic with Denard in there because of the home run threat with the running game.  That helps to open things up with the passing game.  With Tate the running game is never much of a threat other than some scrambling if no receivers are open.  The base offense is predicated on gashing an opponent on the ground and that's why Denard's having the greatest season in NCAA history for rushing yardage by a QB.

All first year starters struggle with throwing INTs in their first year of serious game action.  Tate threw 10 INTs last year and he was a very polished passer.  So it isn't much of a surprise that Denard has struggled at times with the passing game.  Hopefully we can get the running game going these next two games because that should really help to create some big plays through the air.