So i am really drunk....bad start, but really want to know what mgoblogger think do you want shaw or v. smith at rb??? too many nights pondering, or who else?
this may be of some local interest
You must be drunk, If you're not even considering Toussaint
What about Denard at rb!!11!one
Still my fav of all time. and I seen Jamie Morris in person several times.
Leroy Hoard followed closely by Tyrone Wheatley.
I think it will be a Committee pending on whos hot and who they are playing.
Vincent Smith, he is as close to a Noel Devine as Rodriguez has(with playing time) on the team, wouldnt be suprised to see a side of Stephen Hopkins(the role Minor was in when healthy)....
Sorry to burst your bubble, but VS isn't anything like Devine.
The only thing similar is that they are both smaller guys. Devine might be the most explosive back in NCAAF. He has all kinds of speed to burn and can stop on a dime. Devine is lightning in a bottle.
Smith is quick, but not that fast. Smith runs behind his pads pretty well and is pretty slippery. Smith is also a little stronger and a better inside runner than Devine IMO.
Shaw will be our RB this fall IMO.
"Vincent Smith, he is as close to a Noel Devine as Rodriguez has(with playing time) on the team"
It says as close to Noel, not an equal. I agree, Devine had. 5* talent....Vincent was a 3* talent but in the system being run. Smith is as close as he has right now.
and still disagree. If your looking for a RB as close to Devine on Michigans roster, it would be Shaw. Devine and Smith aren't anywhere close when you compare what kind of runners they are.
you provide a link with some highlights. All i can seem to find on youtube is a very elusive and fast smith in pahokee highlights and a shaw that looked alot slower...maybe i am wrong...thats why im asking for your source.
Shaw ran a 10.39 100 and 21.19 200 in HS. He was the 200M NATIONAL champion. Yeah, he's a "lot slower."
and thats straight line speed, im talking about game speed. big difference IMO
What about skating speed? As in, speed roller skatering - who would be faster then? What about in-line skating? Have you thought about that?!!! WELL HAVE YOU!!!!
V.Smith is maybe slower than Mike Hart. They seem to be more a like. Not the fastest guys but they both make up for it with good vision. Noel Devine and Smith aren't even close other than size.
Shaw is one of the fastest on the team. Maybe in the top three or five.
vince smith is not slower than mike hart. by the same token, noel devine isn't as fast as people here are making him out to be. he's been caught from behind several times in his career at WVU, he looks a lot faster than he actually is.
Devine has been caught from behind, but usually by very fast dudes. One was Patrick Robinson, a cornerback from FSU - who ran a 4.38 in the run-up to the draft.
I did use the word "maybe" as in IMO or they are at about the same kind of speed. Also how does one look a lot faster? Just curious.
my response and conversation was about Shaw and Smith.....not Smith and Devine....lets not get sidetracked...hands down devine was lighting in a bottle. way faster then smith...my contention is that with ability and vision...(in comparison to shaw) smith is faster in game speeds.IMHO
who will be the better RB. But to say Smith is faster in "game speeds" is crazy.
Smiths vision/feel for the game might make it so he ends up being a better RB, but it has nothing to do with speed.
Maybe you can try explaining what you mean by game speeds.
i watched devine all through high school, he had a game once with 9 carries, 300+yds and 6 touchdowns... untouchable.
closest skill set to Noel Devine that we have. I like all of our running backs but we don't have a feature back that will carry the ball 20+ times a game. Don't sleep on Michael Cox though. He looked good in the spring game and should know the system now. I hope our RB by committee is a force come August.
Well, I thought Cherundolo really outplayed Spector today, but I think Spector has the higher ceiling. Plus, if Onyewu can't go, then you can move Spec...
Oh, right, that kind of RB.
Smith if he's healthy.
But I'm a Shaw and Toussaint fan...it's the breakaway speed that does it. Smith's extremely versatile and shifty, but Rod's offense is made to capitalize on the ability to outrun opposing defenses. GoBlue1065 is right; Devine is a Darren Sproles-type back and Smith isn't. Current speculation suggests mixing them all in and seeing who blows up first.
The thing that has yet to be addressed is blocking...I don't think we have a clear idea of which back is the best blocker. I remember Minor being in the backfield on nearly every passing down last year when he was healthy just because he could match up with and overpower DEs.
on the pass blocking. It could get a little scary.
Physically, Cox and Hopkins would be the best to do this. Problem is, one reportedly has a problem remembering plays from time to time and the other is a freshman.
One of the knocks on Shaw is he isn't a very good pass blocker. Hopefully he can improve.
We haven't seen what Fitz can do running or pass blocking.
Our best pass blocking back is probably Smith, which sucks because he's hurt and won't get a ton of reps.
My guess is in obvious passing downs, we use on of our TEs as a H back or we go empty and spread everything out and try to get rid of the ball quick.
we'll know until at least a few games into the season--prolly after a few big ten games. until then, it will be running back by committee--which, is what it is i guess.
a question i have is, will the starting qb have any effect on which running back gets the most reps?
I mean, would tate require a better blocking back while nardawg would be provided a more speedy and elusive running back? inquiring minds want to know.
Tyrone Anthony Wheatley....he's a good one.
I don't know if we'll have a true #1 RB this year. I expect Shaw and Smith to get the most carries, with Toussaint, Cox, and Hopkins getting some too.
willie heston. no wait, tom harmon.
yes. no, ye-no NO Yes.
Smith is extremely intelligent on the field, takes his time, and uses his blocking really well; he is quick and shifty, but his speed could only be described as "sneaky fast." Devine is a guy who grabs the ball, starts running, and allows world-class speed and reflexes to do his work for him.
I fail to see how they are remotely alike, other than being a bit small.
this thread quickly turned into 'my dad could beat up your dad'.
Longest offseason ever........
but I won't.
I'll put my guess in that Cox will be the somewhat surprise yardage leader this year.
I talked with Rich Rod this morning. He told me I could play running back. He has no regard for the NCAA or their rules. Nor does he have any desire to treat his players... ie me... with any sympathy for their bodily safety.
We're all counting on you, FA.
Rich Rod told me that as a slow, kinda chubby guy in his 30's, I'd be perfect.
I would like to see Shaw start, but Smith and Cox coming in and getting some carries. Shaw has terrific speed and if Shoelace is making the right reads on the zone read play, it could be a scary combination.
I'm absolutely bewildered that, after its beginnings, this thread actually turned into a discussion about our running backs for next year
I like Toussaint.
I see Shaw was being a Carlos Brown clone.
Hopkins looks like a good RB, if he works hard I think he is going to see a good bit of time this year.
I'd love to see some screens to Cox or Hopkins. Different kind of offense but screen passes to AT were a thing of beauty and they worked quite often.
Wasn't he the surprise of the spring? I think he's got to be mentioned in the top 3.
I like whichever back can block and make the most Yards after contact, break some tackles, keep running, juke here and there, and score a touchdown
i would prefer whomever cannot do any of the things you've mentioned.
I think some of you are expecting too much out of Vincent Smith. He suffered an ACL tear at the END of the season. He's probably not going to be recovered in time to win the starting job right off the bat.
It will probably be Cox or Shaw to start the season.
I also agree with Magnus about the hype surrounding Vincent Smith. He's a good all-around player and he's a cerebral player, but he doesn't really have any world-beating ability in any area besides change of direction. I think Cox might even have better straight-line speed than Smith.
The spring game answered no questions about Toussaint...he looks sizeable now, but he's reputed to have major jump-cut ability and burning track speed, neither of which had the opportunity to show themselves in April. I guess we'll find out.
i see Shaw as another Carlos Brown, basically. He might have a monster day against the Indianas and Eastern Michigans of the world, but he lacks vision and strength to average 9 and 10 yard gains. It's boom or bust with him. Against Ohio State he was god awful (well the whole run game was, but him especially....)
I say, keep motioning him out of the backfield and throw darts to him. Hopefully he'll be healthy enough to showcase the speed to juke linebackers in the slot and develop the strength to plow over cornerbacks as he jets to turn the corner.
Either Cox, Toussaint, or Smith will be our bet bet to gain traditional yards, but I'd be really suprised if we had a 1,000 yard rusher this season.
he lacks vision and strength to average 9 and 10 yard gains.
Just about every running back ever lacks that vision and strength. I'm guessing you meant something other than what you typed.
Barry Sanders was a bust.
Magnus, your statement got me wondering about average yards per carry, because I thought Reggie Bush averaged somewhere around 9 per carry, so I checked into it. Percy Harvin averaged over 9 a couple years ago and Reggie Bush averaged just under 9. But the real interesting thing (and unless I saw it with my own eyes, I wouldn't have believed it): In 2004, the top 2 rushing-yards-per-attempt guys in the nation both played for MSU. Drew Stanton and DeAndre Cobb both averaged over 7.2 yards per carry and were #1 and #2 in the nation in that respect. These were other RBs who averaged less than them (although they had many, many more carries): Adrian Peterson, Deangelo Williams, Mike Hart, JJ Arrington, Leon Washington, Lawrence Maroney, Cedric Benson). MSU also went 5-7 that year. Just thought it was interesting.
Sorry that was actually a dumb statement. I meant that he'd either gain 2 yards or 20....mostly two.
Running backs that are good normally are the beneficiaries of a good offensive line. When they encounter awesome defensive lines they normally have troubles. Hence, Shaw's problems last year versus Ohio State.
Michigan will have a 1,000 yard rusher this year. His name is Denard Robinson.
As a redshirt freshman Pat White averaged over 7 ypc and had 983 rushing yards. Denard can exceed those totals with a season of actual playing experience, as well as running plays where it's not pre-ordained that he is the rushing threat (despite everyone knowing what play Denard was in to run, he still averaged 5.1 ypc last year).
Word is Fred Jackson thinks one of our RBs is fast, powerful, elusive, shifty, and has great vision. But he's not telling anyone who it is.
that RB must be awesome. We haven't heard Jackson put that much praise on something since forever.
OK, since last year.
Gordie Bell and Rob Lytle, bring back the 70's!!!
at last, we figure out where you got your handle from