That was a pivotal moment in the game, and I'm not even sure that went off of Nik.
What's up with the no call on Stauskas getting hammered?
He got fouled but the worst part is calling it of Stauskas when it clearly was not. That basically handed Wisconsin the game since they then hit the winning three.
Despite Dakich saying it was well officiated any one with two eyes can tell you it was very poorly officiated. That being said if they foul at half court the lucky shot doesn't go in, at least not then they would have a second or so to try another play and Michigan still had at least one foul to give. Life on the road in the Big Ten is rough.
Dan Dakich is a complete tool
probally pissed me off more than the officiating itself.
Was that it came right after the refs missed the ball going off a Wiscy players head out of bounds in the first half. So there were two HORRIBLE calls involving Stauskus and the ball going out of bounds.
I know Brian likes Dakich a lot but he is just bad as most Espn analysts (Vitale excluded who is his own world of suck)
Absolutely incompetent officiating all game. Clear out of bounds calls right in front of them that they can't see. They wouldn't call fouls on anything. Those guys were a joke. They shouldn't be officiating a high school game.
The only thing worse than the officials was the announcer. What a tool. He was worse than Vitale.
Dakich is known for this. Loves trolling fanbases
Down three with 30 seconds left, I thought that foul call on Wisonsin's dunk was more frustrating. Gave them the tie. It seemed to work out when Hardaway knocked down the 3, but after all the no calls on Burke and McGary drives, that was ludicrous.
one of the few good calls in the game. Trey wasn't set on that play.
Actually if you go back and look at it he was set. He beat the guy to the spot. Not to mention that there is nothing in the rule book that says a player's feet can't be moving for it to be a charge.
I thought Burke set himself, butnot until after the Wiscy player was already airborne. What cost us the game was not fouling before their miracle three. Slap at him and get a two shot foul or maybe a no call. Either way, we win. It was also frustrating how many opportunities we had at point blank range and just couldn't put the ball in the basket. Some of it was probably bodies and slaps, but, man, you'd think we could make one or two of those!
Edit: I Differ With the thread - dang not refreshing!
like giving Wiscy a timeout.
IME, Wiscy made a big mistake by calling timeout under their own basket (and leaving themselves with none), forcing themselves to go the full length of the floor to get off a three in 2.4 seconds. What Wiscy should have done was inbound the ball like they did and then immediately call timeout. Then they would be inbounding the ball from ~half court with nearly 2 seconds left, and would have had a decent chance of getting off a normal three point shot.
Of course, the miracle shot trumps strategy.
Oh, and DockItch trying to fault Beilein for his strategy is just one more reason that DD is a moron.
Every time. They take some 1/4 turn rotating 3 from just last midcourt and it of course goes through the goddamn net. What the fuck. Ahhhhh!
I thought they called a fair game because literally nothing was called. But that was an obvious foul. You have to call that.
You can't be serious?
You are all like the annoying guy who sucks in the pick up games calling everything. We had many chances to win and the team didn't do it. Lets try actually making more than one bucket in ot or a different in bounds defensive strategy next time maybe? It sucks, but we didn't lose because they missed the call on Stauskas.
Now bitch on....I know it can't be stopped at this juncture.
So if you were in a pick up game and someone knocked the ball out of your hands and out of bounds and then yelled "our ball' you wouldn't say anything? Your dickish attitude tells me that is highly doubtful.
If not going with the herd of whining is "dickish", I am cool with that.
Your analogy is off and seems to indicate some paranoia that many are manifesting here...Dan Dakich and the ref are out to get us...seriously, the refs are intentionally making bad calls for his own benefit (your analogy)? Well if they were, well yeah, I would say something but their not...this is how all college basketball games go...there are some mistakes. We still had no business losing that game though and if you played organized sports at any competitive level, your coach would kick your ass if you started bitching about the refs after the game. Gimme a break.
That was one flippin call my man. Admit it, we got a charging call when my man McGary had his heel on the arch. Clearly it should have been a block. If we would of won, whiny lasses from Wisco would be complaining about how that lost the game for them. Just seems un-Michigan like to be bitching so much. We lose once in awhile, deal with the fact we had a major strategic gaffe at the end, are soft going to the rim, seem a little weak in the legs right now, and generally lose any sort of consistency on offense in crunch time in tight contests. Its okay, all is not lost (unless we lose to MSU on Tuesday...then bitch about the refs all you want).
Our inbounds was good, we forced a timeout and forced them to chuck it down to halfcourt where LeVert almost contested the shot. The inbounds defense was on of the best things we did down the strech.
hell game were watching? Wisconson was the only team getting the benefit of the call nothing side of things. Nothing new, the whole Big Ten has been dealing with that bullshit at Wisconson, since Bo Ryan has been there.
The advantage because we don't do it, too. We don't even get the advantage at home. And I'm not sure I want us to - at least to make it the cornerstone of our defense. I think our style can serve us in the tourney.
We should have gotten a make up call somewhere along the line like we did in the Ohio game.
i guess i won't be watching ESPN for the next 24 hours.. this game is the only thing they will talk about until another story over takes it
Lucky for you they just went crazy with the 5 OT ND game
ND's three "lucky" 3s in the last 50 seconds by a guy who hadn't made a bucket all day.
At least Louisville gets ND on their own court in a couple of weeks. Hope we get UW in the B1G tourney.
Agreed. You could hear the slap on McGary on TV- should have shot 2.
It was clearly a reach-in foul. Basketball is a stupid sport because the rules are irrelevant.
Well, we took 53 2 point baskets and 2 free throws. So, yeah.
It's not like we weren't aggressive here.
really pisses me off. Michigan was the far more agressive team, going to the basket the entire day. Wisconson shot 24 threes, six more than UM, but still took 10 free throws to 2 for UM.
its fuckin stupid, that's whats up. Now IM gonna go get hammered.
in OT without the officiating.
To be fair, it's not bad at Northwestern or PSU.
They're terrible anyway, so would we even notice?
Did he watch the OSU game for this year?
It was the loudest I ever heard. Definitely on par with @ OSU, while IU was probably a little bit louder.
I was there. It was very loud at times (specifically, the end of the game), but it was not that loud for long stretches. Our fans have trouble keeping their intensity for entire games.
The officiating was ugly, but our guys have to get comfortable in a rougher game. NCAAs are notorious for officials to let early games get rough especially if the favorite is the softer team.
are played on a neutral court. The home court aspect, like what we saw today, is eliminated.
Lower seeds are pumped to show they belong and officials struggle with the different styles of play. B1G officials should call more fouls on UW bc they know UW's ugly approach.
Heck, we needed OT to beat OSU at home so we would lose on a neutral court?
Tough teams adjust to officiating and find a way to win.
Just realized we had exactly ONE trip to the free throw line the entire game. WTF.
Welcome to life as a favorite in the B1G.....road teams have to be at least 10 pts better.
I didn't see Michigan getting a whole lot of homecooking against OSU. Your statement has some truth to it, however with Wisconson the homecooking is ratched up to 10.
Not to mention why is the home court bias ok? People just pass it off like it is perfectly acceptable. Just because it is norm doesn't make it right. Basketball officials seem to be the only ones not held accountable for calling a fair game.
Makes me wonder how much the coaching gets to the refs. Look at the toughest places to play: Ohio, MSU, Wisconsin and IU. Maybe Illinois to an extent. All have loud fans, but those coaches are aggressive in chewing out the refs.
Compare to Beilein, Tubby, Painter who are more laid back and don't seem to have as big of a home court advantage iMO.
The fans are definitely the biggest factor, and I don't necessarily want Beilein to start acting like Bo Ryan, but I just wonder if his calm nature doesn't help the refs give us calls at home.
I never thought I would want Dickey V to announce another game but whoever was announcing today was horrible. It was like he was trying to pick up the refs at a bar so he could make out with them
Officiating was fine actually...were so used to guys like Burr/Valentine calling everything in the world to get on tv that when a guy like Staratore lets you actually play the game it seems the game is officiated badly.
Need more guys like Staratore doing hoops games instead of Valentine/Burr
they wanted, the other was not. It's one thing to let both teams play, only letting one side do it is completely different.
Yep, I'll take that game over any Eddie Hightower game, that's for sure.
EDIT: Just because you disagree with me doesn't mean I'm trolling. I would rather have that game than a game where 40 fouls are called and 4 players have fouled out. Is that such a terrible opinion to have?
a game where one team is called for fouls and the other team is allowed a free pass to do anything they want? Sorry I'll take a fairly called game, where both teams are on somewhat equal footing any day, even if it means both teams are being called for ticky tack stuff.
Letting both teams play is a different story, however.
Let's just say that I'm sure we can find plenty of calls from this game that Wisconsin fans thought were terrible.
I'm done arguing officiating with people who are too emotionally invested to look at something objectively.
I'm not talking about you personally, but seriously, it's exhausting. Every game we get the "Worst Officials Ever" and somehow the other team's fans is not all "wow these refs sure are nice to us today."
I'm with you all the way. I'm not about to try and argue it though.
I would rather have a 40 foul fairly called game than biased and no fouls.
Ideally, you'd get equal treatment and no fouls. But fairness is priority #1, then style of play. And for what it's worth, a tightly called game helps us more, because we're all about driving by people. If you can't hand check us, we're very very hard to stop.
I like letting guys play but I don't like the team with the fewest fouls all year getting called contstantly while the bigger, rougher team gets off free. I like no-calls, I just like them called fairly.
It's not about being too soft. What can you do when you're not allowed to shoot layups because your being hacked?
This is basically like pick-up hoops when you drive in the lane and get hacked...especially on game point. Except you don't shoot free throws in pick-up hoops. The beauty of officials is that you get rewarded for getting fouled by attempting what are called "free throws". It's part of the game, and it's frustrating when you don't get to shoot any when you get fouled. I'm all for "letting them play" on loose balls, even the occasional rebound. But getting hacked while shooting layups - and no fouls called - is just plain unfair.
The worst part was how enthusiastically the ref motioned it went off Stauskas leg when it never touched him.
That is what you get when you have officials that clearly have vision problems.
We arent the same team on the road against good teams. Bottomline. I can't help but compare the struggles to football. Great at home, great on road against bad teams, struggle on the road against good teams.
I think Biefeldt plays GREAT defense and has passed Horford. Until Morgan comes back, I think we play Bielfeldt and McGary, with Horford getting a few minutes here and there. Horford is all finesse and gets punked by physical bigs and cannot get the boards that Biefeldt can. Stauskas and Robinson are on severe cold streaks, as is Levert. Anyone think Vogrich can still knock em down?
Coach Beilein shows he never learned from the Evan Turner buzzer beater. If you have fouls to give, use em. Even if he gets the call in the act of shooting and hits all three, the clock stops and you get a shot. Even if you only have 2 seconds left and have to heave a half court prayer (those never go in right? loll) it's a shot.
Got to beat MSU with Harris and Appling banged up. No excuses.
According to Dakich, Beilein was calling for a foul. For some reason, not everyone got the message.
Hasnt knocked em down in 4 years!
I thought Max looked good as well, but he's gotta kick it out to the guards after he grabs an offensive rebound. He's not big enough to just go back and put it in the hoop.
because JB has forgotten more about basketball than you'll ever know.
Definitely a terrible call. The referees allowed them to slap at our guys' arms all game whenever we grabbed a rebound, which was irritating enough, but there you absolutely have to call it a foul. One minute to go in the game and a guy loses the ball after getting raked on the arm? You can't "let 'em play" there.
Going to point out that "no calls" actually *do* impact the outcome of the game!?!?!?!?! You are impacting it by what you are not doing. 35+ years of playing and watching basketball and I've heard that crap the whole time. It's frustrating and it's only something an announcer who doesn't like to to have stoppages for free-throws and in-bounds palys - or the team who regularly benefits from them - ever says. Rant rant rant rant rant rant rant rant.
Just watched it again. All ball on the knock out - can't see where/if it hit Stauskas on the way out.
Stauskas should have chinned the ball like he's supposed to. He let it get slapped out. There was slight contact but not much.
Quit looking for excuses.
Love the snappy down voting a reasonable statement
Our whining reflects our team's softness. I don't think we get partial credit for being close or stylish - play tough and grind out a win.
Find me a teams fans that don't whine after a loss. It has nothing to do with toughness. It just sucks to lose
Michigan fergodsakes. We shouldn't whine like the lesser sorts.
If this team is going to push deep into March, we need to adjust to poorly officiated games.
I hope the guys learn and grow from this game because we're the better team.
like the one in the first half.
Feels good to bitch about the officials. So cathartic
No point in dwelling on it. That's what happens in Madison. It's just bullshit, move on and forget about it.
held accountable it will remain the norm.
Yes, the officiating sucked. Let's move on and beat State!
The ball to your chin and man up.
Also, thing I'm curious about and hope someone asks Beilein: did the miscommunication with regards to Tim's foul status (apparently one of his early fouls was changed to GRIII) result in Caris being in the game with the order to foul? So just in case something went horribly wrong Tim wouldn't be fouled out for overtime.
Because... yeah. That would be a concrete example of the officiating screwing us.
Dont blame the refs, its a road game in the big ten, you are NOT going to get calls. Period.
If we put one shot in the basket in the last 6 mins of regulation (other than the hardaway desperation 3) we win. If we dont miss 2 fast break layups in overtime, we win. It was a very ugly performance and the only people to blame is the kids for lack of execution.
Tough loss on the road in the big ten. Lets just go win at breslin and make up for it.
doesn't make it right. Why do people hold basketball officials to a lower standard than refs in other sports? It's not ok, and I am not justing talking about this game, I am talking about basketball in general. As long as people write it off as the norm and make excuses for these guys, basketball officiating will continue to be piss poor.
while i agree with your overall point, the officials have a tough job to do. I dont know if you have ever tried it, I have and it's not easy.
On top of that, the rules are ancient and not followed by the game today. If they were to call basketball by the rules in the books, every posession there would be multiple fouls.
The game has evolved but the rules have not (with the exception of continuation and some of the different fouls and whatnot) thus making the officials jobs that much harder to do. There is so much room for discretion that it is nearly impossible to have 2 sets of officials call the game the same way. You just have to adapt and play how they let you play.
If you want to put the officials under the microscope and maybe expand instant replay in basketball, by all means go that route. I understand the frustration. I just see it a different way.
We aren't as good as everyone says. Hell, there are those, mostly announcers and national media, that say we have a good/ok defense. This is similar to those saying we had a good secondary this past year on the gridiron.
The officials hosed us. There was another play in the first half too where the ball bounced off of a Wisky player's head laying on the ground and the ref said it was off Stauskas. Just atrocious. LeVert was hammered on one play. A lot of poor calls. I thought the one WI block was a goaltend. McGary also goaltended on a play and they missed that although WI immediately got a putback.
We need to finish better and be more physical in finishing. Guys got fouled on a lot of shots close to the rim and those fouls were not called and became misses. That's on the refs but if they take some of those shots up stronger then they will get calls.
In the big picture, B1G officials let way too much physical stuff with the hands go on and now the body bumping is out of hand too. That's always going to be a disadvantage for us as that is not our style of play and favors certain teams like WI and MSU that tend to be overly physical.
That no call was complete bullshit. We got screwed over twice. The guy slaps the shit out of him, and then they add insult to injury saying it was OoB on Stausaks. Even if it did go off Nik's leg, he was fouled.
I feel almost like the ref needed to go with a soccer call there. If you're not going to give him the foul, when the slap causes the ball to go off Stauskas then you have to blow the whistle and give a late foul call on the Wisconsin player.
To let him get away with a foul and then reward him for it is ridiculous.
I agree with the above statements. We haven't gotten the same home court advantage in our games. Craft was allowed a three with the shot clock expiring, Burke was called for a foul where he didn't even touch Deshaun Thomas, and Amir Williams was allowed to touch a ball on the cylinder.
No one to blame but ourselves
The refs were awful. The slaps, the shoves, the contact, etc. I like calling an open game where few fouls were called, but if you don't call ANYTHING around the rim then it totally favors the unathletic team like WIsconsin who shoots jump shots and cripples an athletic team like MIchigan.
The killer for me was the ball that hit the Wisconsin player in the head who was lying on the ground and they gave them the ball. That is pure incompetence. Fouls are tough to call....and thus prone to wild swings in performance by the ref. Missing blatantly obvious things is just incompetence. Much like the Craft three and the OSU goal-tend.
All of that bitching (and more) aside, our fricking big men need to learn to finish. I am so sick of them missing bunnies at the rim. Heck, the shortest and least athletic big we have (Bielfeldt) did better making a tough layup at the rim than the others. Between that, lousy defense late, and the lack of fouling we lost the game.
Stauskas and GR3 look like they've hit a wall. Both playing pretty poorly even if it is against tough competition. GR3 has been no where near the rim the last three games on either end.
to be one of those reasons. I will agree however, that Stauskas and GR3 need to start playing like were earlier in the season. GR 3 in particular has looked lost the last three games.
Both seem to dissapear in tough environments. They are playing like freshmen so it is what it is. The youth of this team is starting to show now.
...like everyone else. This team is very talented overall but I sense a physical weakness that teams are going to key on. We aren't a physically strong team and I think this will haunt us in the end. We should not lose to Wisconsin. They are not elite or even ranked. Bad loss. This makes EL trip a must win. Can't go 1-3 in your tough stretch of the season. This loss puts Michigan's back against the wall for the #1 seed....let's see how they react.
at Wisconson isn't exactly something new. The Zebras have definatly been part of that trend for teams trying to win there. I seriously hate everything about Wisconson basketball.
Yeah, Wisconsin is no good, they only won in Assembly. And will be ranked in two days, but they're not right now, so DOOOOOOOOM
Come the fuck on, people.
When hes not shooting. The kid cant hang on to the ball in big moments for some reason.
He's just a shooter?
than the one in OT. I can not see anyway that the ref didn't see that clearly. Which only leaves possibility if he saw the play properly.
I couldn't believe this call. Through the power of DVR technology, I replayed this over and over. I first assumed the Nik dribbled off his foot, thus causing the ball to carom quickly out of bounds. But it seriously went off Wiscy's head. Right in front of the ref. Un-freakin-believable.
But the execution down the stretch was worse...offensively and defensively.
So disappointed in this game.
Is RCMB, if we had won and not executed poorly down the stretch, we wouldn't bitch. If the refs are horrible Tuesday but we win, nobody will say anything. We laugh at izzo all the time for all the whining he does, yet most of you are doing the same thing. This team needs to get tougher and learn to execute down the stretch on the road. We haven't beaten a quality opponent on the road yet, luckily, most other teams haven't either. Quit the damn whining.
One thing I want to say in regards to execution and its hard to pile on THJR, but how many times today could he have moved one of his feet about 5 inches further back and attempted a 3 pointer instead of a long two. He's getting a bad habit of not knowing where his feet are, we could have had at least two additional points in regulation if Timmy keeps his feet behind the line, I think Burke did it once too. Probably the worst shot in basketball.
is not matter how bad the officiating is in a particular game you can never call out the officials. That is good to know. Refs are paid to a job like everybody else, and just like everybody else they should be accountable if they do a piss poor job. The fact of the matter is basketball officials have a larger impact on the game than in any other sport, but yet for some reason they seem to be held to the lowest standards in terms of being impartial and calling a fair game. That is a bad combination.
Weren't good, we didnt execute worth a shit, if we had, this discussion wouldn't happen. We didnt lose this ame because of officials. We lost this game due to poor defense and inconsistent half court offense, Wisconsin, Wisconsin scored 65 points on us! Not good...
that we could have won with more execution, but it's also possible that balanced refereeing would have won the game as well. I don't know why it's so terrible to want decent refs....we aren't the coaches....
Be, but again, one thing we can control is our execution. There is no way Wisconsin should score 65 points on us.
It's pretty absurd that a desperation half-court heave is most likely going to cost us a Big Ten title. Belein really needs to reevaluate his strategy on these late possessions. There is smply no excuse for allowing a guy to catch the ball in stride at half-court. PUT SOMEONE ON THE INBOUNDER.
By having McGary sit under the basket, all you've done is negate your numerical advantage, which is the ONLY legitimate reason not to guard the inbounder anyways. I love Belein, but he needs to stop doing this.
Finally, I know our competition has been tough lately, but does anyone else feel like the team is getting worse?
it's mindboggling not having a horford or mcgary or GRIII on the inbounds passer. there's no way he can make that pass with a guy in his face. that coupled with levert's stupidity allowed the miracle to happen.
doesn't even enter the equation when you have fouls to give and a 3 ties the game. Hammer the guy who gets the ball and block out on the second foul shot. Game over. Michigan wins.
He got his shot off with a full second left. So fouling would have served as a timeout for Wiscy. They would have gotten the ball at half-court with ~1.5-2.0 seconds left, and would have had an inbound chance for a normal three point shot.
Of course, miracle shots trump strategy.
Finally, I know our competition has been tough lately, but does anyone else feel like the team is getting worse?
Well, we're in by far the toughest stretch of the season, and our starting center is out. That's a double-whammy right there. Anyhow, right now it seems like ALL of the top 5 teams are struggling at the moment.
No doubt GR3 and Stauskas are playing worse - tentative, freshmanitis. Burke is steady strong as always, Timmy and Mitch are actually playing better and better. With Morgan out, that hurts a decent amount too, certainly enough for the difference yesterday.
the refs allowed a few common home-cooking calls for wisky. but to put the blame on the refs is dumb. i can think of at least 20 horrible shots/decisions/defensive lapses that cost us this game. those far outweigh the officiating.
The refs weren't good but we shot ourself in the foot more than the refs did. We gave up 65 to Wisconsin.
Where in the fuck has Robinson been? 2 points today, 2 points at Indiana. This is a different team. A lot less driving to the hole and a lot more poor shot selection.
That the kid has hit a wall. Grind of B1G schedule, etc. It's not good. We need him.
We lost this game because we couldn't hit uncontested layups. Everything else would have been irrelevant if we hit half the 7 or 8 layups that we blew.
yep, yep, yep!
Bruesewitz - 1 foul called against him today. Ha! What a joke.
After hearing over and over how 5 or so of the last top 10 teams that played at Madison all lost, there's your explanation right there. There were so many horrible calls in that game all going Wisconsin's way, but let's face it man, this is standard Big Ten officiating. I would guess that home cooking accounts for about a 6-10 point advantage for the home team almost every game. But holy shit man, how many chances did we have... If the refs call it right, we win. If Stauskas hits that uncontested 3 from the top of the key with like 2 min left, we are up 6 and will win. In that kid doesn't hit the miracle half courter, we win...
This is the one that got away, and will probably cause us to lose the BiG by one game to Indiana.
Thankfully, the officiating in the NCAA tournament is far more equitable. Why else does a mediocre team like Wisconsin never make a Final 4, yet they crush the world at home?
P.S. - CBA home cooked reffing is the single reason basketball will always be my #2 sport behind football. Just too much poetic license for those stooges in stripes.
I think it was the same ref that watched Craft get mugged on the non-call a week ago when he drove the lane to attempt a tie againt the Blue. Just my opinion
So the same one that decided not call an obvious flagrant because it would have sealed the game? And the same one that decided to count a buzzer-beater that never actually beat the buzzer?
As soon as Morgan is back (does anyone know when?), he and McGary will be playing alot together and GR3 will be sitting alot.