What I learned today is that my head hurts following the "paralysis by analysis" of the team.
We won. Let's celebrate.
Analysis tomorrow. Please.
What I learned today is that my head hurts following the "paralysis by analysis" of the team.
We won. Let's celebrate.
Analysis tomorrow. Please.
If our D can hold a team under 30, I like our chances. Thats the mind set I have going forward.
I came away from the game thinking our D saved us by getting a handful of stops while the offense stagnated. Sure, Indiana helped by stupidly running on first down so often, but the D still got off the field four or five times in a row.
The Vincent Smith TD was nice and was a result of a HUGE hole on the right side of the line. Good effort to break a tackle at about the 10 yd line as well. I do agree that we need to find someone else other than Smith to at least split the carries as long as Shaw is out. There were several drives in the second half where he was stopped for a yard or 2 gain on 1st down which drastically stalled those drives and created three-and-outs.
The Vincent Smith bashing needs to end. The kid ran hard, made a long TD run, didn't have any fumbles, and picked up blocks in the backfield. He did everything that he was asked of. Cox isn't playing because of his mental errors and he isn't a good of a blocker compared to Shaw and Vinny Smith. Shaw should be good to go for MSU game, and you'll see combo of Smith and Shaw in backfield. Rod doesn't trust Cox, and Hopkins lost fumble in BGSU game, so yeah...
Agreed. Smith is one of my favorite players and a solid back. All-American? No. But he makes some plays.
I really do think the ACL has hampered him Hopefully he recovers.
He made a huge block on the winning TD, cutting Repfogle (sp?) as soon as he got into the backfield.
The Vincent Smith bashing needs to end. The kid ran hard,
I should hope that he ran hard. Putting forth a great effort isn't the same thing as being a quality runningback.
made a long TD run, didn't have any fumbles, and picked up blocks in the backfield. He did everything that he was asked of.
I don't think he did everything that he was asked of. He had nine touches, and only did anything on one of them. When Denard was dinged up and we needed someone else to step up he put us in a hole with 2 yard carries against one of the worst run defenses in the country on first and ten.
Dont know where to begin with this. I'll try to spell everything right.
Maybe there is an open thread at Touch The Banner or something for the Vincent Smith Sucks Club? But tonight at least, it aint here, bro.
Just try to enjoy things. The submit button is not your friend
I don't see why you feel the need to apply for the position of my life coach, but rest assured I'm enjoying the win.
I didn't think Vincent Smith played well today, with the tremendous exception of one huge play. I don't think he's played particularly well this season. I said as much in response to someone's post lauding his performance. I did not insult him as an individual or cross any lines.
Is it now unacceptable to critique a player's performance? If you disagree with my assessment, fine, but no need for you to jump all over my ass every time I'm not as optimistic as you about every facet of the team.
By the way, the correction of your spelling previously was a joke, written with an implied smile. Sorry you didn't seem to appreciate that.
Dude, you were the one jumping in West Texas Blue's grill for, GASP, daring to tell people to lay off one of our players who has had a major impact in the 5-0 start. I just have his back on this one as a poster. Dude deserves your respect tonight. Michigan does not win without him.
And, as for the spelling, of course it twas a joke which is why I kept up the gag. If everything in the above post was spelled orrectly it was on pure accicents. Those things are like Waldos and Goldbugs in my porsts.
What am I missing here? Smith looked decidely average. He had one, bordering on two good plays rushing the ball. He picked up blocks all the time and is probably our best option at RB, but I think it's fair to criticize his lack of pick up and inability to hit the lane.
This game showed that Shaw is in fact quite important to this team, at least until Smith gets his knee up to strength or Cox's brain gets in touch with his body.
Cox sure knows when to hit the hole. Its like he's programmed for it.
Is it your understanding that running back are only asked to run the ball? If so, you might want to go look at the other, equally important things they actually do (like blocking for Denard).
Your opinions on what "you" learned are vapid. I learned that every favorite on the road in the Big Ten struggled mightly. Yes, being on the road is death in the Big Ten...and we got a W against a team on the road.
but how will we hold up against a team that puts a heavy emphasis on the run, like Iowa or Wisky?
Leinenkugel Oktoberfest is pretty good. Better than I expected.
EDIT: Oh, and I also learned that Oregon is seriously f-cking good. Down 31-24 at the half, they hung 28 unanswered points on The Cardinal in the 2nd half, and didn't allow a single point by Stanford.
Yes they are. That Oregon offense is nearly as exciting as ours. I like the option pitch look that they mix in there. Maybe that's something Denard can add to his bag of tricks in the future as well.
Marecic were gassed in the 2nd half.
Truly, Leinenkugel's makes absolutely amazing beer.
I was also drinking Leinenkugel's yesterday. Agreed...on both points actually. Watching Oregon was kind of like watching Michigan. (With a much slower QB)
10. Taylor Lewan's mean-streak is indeed mean.
No one else earned any carries besides Vincent Smith.
He is the current best we have. Thinking that the backups are better is pure fantasy. The coaches play who have earned time and nothing more or less.
I'm not sure how telling that is given that we only ran 45 offensive plays. Smith had nine carries. Hopkins did play, although he did not carry the ball. But yeah, Shaw/Smith have earned more trust from the staff than the others.
I wouldn't get too down on Vincent Smith. IU was selling out against the run and setting themselves up to get burned by big plays over and over.
I would like a big power back to mix it up with Robinson though. I think they could complement each other well.
This post should be entitled, "What I learned today," because, quite frankly, I learned nothing. Some I already knew, and some I disagree with, especially the Vincent Smith premise.
You can play in the first four games. After that, you can't get a medical redshirt no matter what your injury is.
We do, of course, have to furnish actual medical documention to the NCAA to get one for him.
That counts, yes? It's not like he has to get hurt on national TV for it to count.
That Tony Gibson needs the boot.
The offense is fantastic. If UM had just an AVERAGE defense, they'd be easily a top 15 team.
If enough people lose this week, we'll be a top 15 team
I love you're optimism on this matter. Some might disagree with me, but with the close game, we will need a lot to lose and other games to be close to move up.
In saying this, i too am hopeful we do move up the rankings.
I think the pollsters understand that this is now conference season and the game are going to be tighter than usual. Just look around the league no one had an easy time with their opponent besides Iowa over Penn St.
If enough people lose this week, we'll be a top 15 team
Dude, our best player in our secondary is a walk-on.
That's like trying to boot Rod Smith after '08.
when we play a ultra power running team (ie. UMass), they can expose our LB's weakness to accurately read the running play and step up into the hole to stuff the play. When we play a passing team (ie. Indiana) they expose our DB's inability to cover guys on a consitent basis.
I think we have a good chance to beat any team in the B10 that is mostly one dimensional in one of these offensive areas (Power running: Iowa, Penn St., Wisconsin - Passing (Purdue and Illinois).
I think the two teams that can do both of these offensive things well (MSU and OSU) are going to be the games that will really test GERG, the defense and my blood pressure, to the limits.
And until we play an elite defense (Iowa, OSU) I am under the impression that our offense is going to put up some big points on just about everyone (minus if we shoot ourselves in the foot with turnovers, DA penalties and any significant injuries to key offensive folks).....
Celebrate our 3rd road victory in as many years.
The numbers predicted this one exactly, therefore we shouldn't be surprised, nor feeling bad about anything in this game.
Bask in the dilithium and turn your vitriol to where it belongs --- little bro'.
will stop in the middle of the street and start performing tai chi, and they don't care whether the light is green or read.
Were you over in Southeast today? I was picking up Thai and had the same thing happen on Hawthorne. Small world.
My parents found it strange when they saw a man in a business suit holding on the a street pole and spinning around in several times, then picked up his walk as if nothing happened. The tai chi walkers were icing on the cake. "Wow, this place is weirder than San Franscisco," was my father's comment.
what I learned today is that if the opposing defense can not stop HE16MAN, our chances of winning are really good. if a defense comes along that can contain HE16MAN, our chances of winning are not good.
but in all seriousness, Indiana today looked like Texas Tech under Mike Leach. A total overload of short passes in front of our prevent D. We certainly didn't play well, but hopefully people now, even the most homerlicious of us, understand that we lack defensive talent outside of the front 3 or 4. In a situation like today's game, at least we didn't give up a series of quick strikes. to force the offense to earn their points on extended drives may be the best we can hope for. Greg Robinson's working with shit-for-talent right now, even if he's not the best D-coordinator out there.
And failed on two. The fact that they got their key conversions on the last drive shouldn't take anything from the defense. Also note that they completely stoned Indiana in the fourth quarter until the last drive.
The offense let down the defense in the fourth quarter, which was why it was so close. Robinson missed on three deep balls on three different drives; in previous games he has made those throws. Indiana was clearly selling out on the run and Michigan though they could wrap up the game with a deep pass, which is why those drives stalled. Personally I wish they had chosen shorter routes, but again, remember he is still a sophomore quarterback and those throws throughout the season have been his weakest.
The defense played very well in the fourth quarter. Michigan had three drives in a row with fewer than five plays, so can we stop freaking out about the defense and agree that the offense didn't put it away even after given three separate chances in the fourth?
No one is going to contain him. Oh these posts are killing me. He takes what the defense gives him. The offense is like the triple option.
1) we scored 42 points
2) indiana scored 35 (apparently this means that we won)
3) denard robinson doesn't tie his shoes. weird!
4) a sellout at indiana means filling 75% of your stadium
I struggle to understand how a kid can come back ahead of schedule from ACL surgery, be expected to be a step slow, and also be labelled NOT GOOD.
Instead of not appreciating the 50 yard TD run, you should appreciate the fact that he did not get tackled from behind. If Roundtree doesn't get caught from behind and we go up 21-7 in the 1st qtr, this game may take a whole new complexion.
Plus, he's still just a true sophomore. Give the kid a break.
We can be Big 10 champs this year. As bad as D has played , we are 5-0. There is no great team in the conference this year, with a potent offense AND a defense capable of slowing down the machine that is the Michigan offense. Our D, as bad as it has been, showed glimpses in the 2nd half of being average. That may well be the best offense we face the rest of the way. We are in for more gutwrenching games, due to defensive play, but can you imagine when our defense actually helps our offense by getting off the field on 3rd down. Our offense will break the opposing teams' will week in and week out. The future is so damn bright.
Yes, our defense gave up 568 yards and 35 points today, but let's dig a little deeper. IU averaged 5.8 yards per play on 98 plays. If our offense wasn't dilithium powered, our scoring drives would have lasted a little longer than a minute or two. Let's say instead of us getting 45 plays and IU getting 98, it was split 50-50. That gives IU 5.8 yards per play * 70 plays = 406 yards. That's more than I care for, but not too bad. If our offense doesn't have scoring drives of 46 seconds, 1 minute 54 seconds, and 3 minutes 56 seconds, IU doesn't get that last TD of the 1st half.
IU was only 11 of 19 on 3rd down. I know, I watched the game and it seemed worse than that to me, but that's not horrible. That gets your defense off the field for 8 drives, except that they went for it 4 times on 4th down and got 2.
Good numbers: they punted 4 times. We got an interception. We stopped them twice on fourth down. Let's just face it that our expectations for the defense are going to have to be adjusted by the fact that our offense is scoring so fast. It's not the Michigan football of Bo, Gary, and Lloyd, but damn is it fun to watch.
P.S. IU 5.8 yards per play. UM 12.8 yards per play. UM 42, IU 35. Enough said.
This is a critical point. In football each team gets about the same number of chances to score (give or take one posession because of time running out at the end of each half). Michigan's average scoring drive was about six plays and about two minutes long. If there is any single statistic that you can take to the bar when you talk about this team, that is it. I have never seen anything like it.
Anyway, If that kind of efficiency keeps up, the defense against any competent offense (and say what you like about Indiana but their passing game today was outstanding, and their quarterback very good) will get a lot of plays and a lot of time of possession, not only because they want to keep the ball away, but because, frankly, it takes them longer overall to score.
This is another way that the insane numbers being put up by this offense make us reconsider our traditional indicators of a team's effectiveness. Time Of Possession? Throw it out the window. It's a waste. Total plays run? Even that is a little suspect, because Michigan will score in 4-8 and their opponents will need at least a dozen, generally speaking.
The defense on a team with an offense like this like this could actually be pretty good, and still have wildly disproportionate time of possession, as well as running a lot of plays, just because the ball changes hands so many times, and because the offense scores so fast. We do have to look at average yards per play, total yards, and the final score.
At the end of the day, though, it's the team that scores on a greater percentage of their possessions that wins the game. I thought that the defense did okay today. They shut Indiana down for most of the second half. They were putting ridiculous pressure on a quick-release passer with a three man rush, which meant that the line is good, and more importantly, THE ZONE WAS WORKING. The linebackers didn't make we want to die (although Roh, man, that's just mean, put the dude on the line, that has to stop). The crazy assignment errors that we saw in Notre Dame didn't happen. Indiana couldn't get their running game going, and it took a lights-out performance from the best wide receiver we've played against to keep them in the game.
So, lemme wrap up what *I* learned today:
Each team gets about the same number of shots to score
We do more with ours, and we do them faster than anyone else in college football
That kind of arrangement makes defenses look bad, even if they are not.
We are going to see a lot of games this year where we win by maybe two touchdowns, and it won't really be that close.
12.8 YARDS PER PLAY!!!
Sorry, that deserves caps. I wasn't able to find the single game record, but man, that's gotta be up there.
I hope shaw and toussaint can play next wk.. I think toussaint can be one of those other running backs that can step up and show us what he can really do in the coming wks of the big ten.
We know Denard is dilithium. We know our offensive line is for real. We know our receivers are solid. We know our RBs are good, not great.
We know our defensive schemes can't stop anyone. We know our secondary can't stop anyone. We know we have no faith in our kickers.
Maybe there are two things we learned. First, our D is in great shape thanks to Barwis. Second, Hagerup is decent when he gets going.
Oh yeah, we learned what was suspected. This team has balls, never quits and the heart of a champion.
Vincent Smith has had 7 TDs in Michigan's last 7 games
I dont know what the fuck else you people want out of the guy.
Also: Look who had the game winning block
After the block he layed on the last touchdown, I'm good with Vincent Smith.
The D is bad, but not as bad as i thought it would be. Unlike the previous two seasons, the D this year can slightly improve in the 2nd half of every game (due to some adjustments?). In the Indiana game, our D had a few stops in the 2nd half, and our offense has many chances to make 2 TD lead in the 2nd half to seal the game, but they failed to do so.
Full on nickel defense with Roh floating around in the backfield (?)
Lots of blitzing, especially for this team; they blitzed about ten times during the day, and had a lot of success with it. Often on early downs.
Good zone defense from the linebackers overall
Defense Line lining up wider and unbalanced on a lot of plays, which seemed to confuse their coverage. The sack that Banks got he basically walked past the left tackle, who seemed really surprised to see him come around.
Overall this was not the same defense, in terms of sophistication or structure, that we ran in the last five weeks, and what was really reassuring to me was that it was actually executed pretty well.
They are getting killed because they don't have a shutdown cornerback, so they have to rely on zone defense. Teams get a lot of short yardage plays against this strategy. They get a shutdown corner and this defense goes up thirty points in national rankings overnight because they can add another body to the line.
recruit, recruit, recruit
What we learned today is that if an offense is able to run about 100 plays, they will carve up this defense. Beyond that, IU showed that they are a dangerous passing offense and not much else, but that was nearly enough to beat a pretty good Big 10 team. I do think that the defense will play better next week against MSU because what MSU does best (running the ball) is something that UM will be better able to stop than the short passing display orchestrated by Chappell.
What i learned today? JR Hemmingway is a clutch player worthy of the #21 jersey.
Whoops - didn't see this when I made my post.
No harm, no foul. I too, am excited for what he may do the rest of the season.
Lloyd Brady always smiles after a victory, and so should you.
The defense was on the field a long long time. Overall they didn't do too bad. This game can be counted as one where the defence made progress, inspite of the ridiculous stats.
If our secondary gets better, as they have more experience, this defense will be good
What did I learn today?
They are who we thought they were. I say that without a hint of irony. I expected an efficient IU offense and a bad IU rushing defense. I got an efficient IU offense and a bad IU rushing defense.
Someone said weeks ago that we stand a 50% chance of winning every game we have this year. I firmly believe that. This team is a mystery. It's exciting and agonizing all at the same time. Denard is having the greatest single season statistical performance of any collegiate player in the history of college football. Our defense is an abomination. We're 5-0 and could just as easily go 5-7 and I wouldn't be surprised. We could go 12-0 and I wouldn't know what to say. I feel like I'm learning about football for the first time, again.
I watched the game at a local bar today -- a friend of mine got up to use the bathroom twice and missed two incredible plays. He was genuinely remorseful.
What else is there to say? Keep your eyelids pinned open, or you may miss another highlight.
50 years from now, if I'm still alive, I will probably not have any grandkids to talk with about this season. Hell, I probably won't have any kids or a wife or anything of the sort. But I'll still have the memories of this season and who is shaping up to be the greatest player in the history of Michigan football.
Junior Hemingway, when actually healthy, is a legit deep threat. Our receiving corps is awesome.
Our defense did better than I expected. They were on the field for what 2/3 of the game. Now part of that is because they couldn't get the 3 and out, or stop 4th down conversions. But a big part of that was because our offense scored so fast. Our defense needs work, no one disputes that, but they don't flat out suck. We're talking about such young guys playing their 5th college game. To have so many young guys out on the field for so long, and still have them playing hard and not giving up, I'd say they deserve a lot more credit than they get. As to the recruiting arguement, I'm not a recruiting expert, nor am I any kind of football expert, but maybe RR recruited so much offensive talent instead of defense, because he wanted people to see his offense in action. Now that we have the offense rolling, we look way more appealing to defensive recruits. The good recruits now have a reason to consider Michigan, because they know we have the offense to put up points and win games, which can turn into championships. I think RR was right to recruit heavy on the offense to start out, because bringing in defensive players would have slowed down the development of the offense, leaving more doubt about his ability to put together this insane offense we have now. Oh, what else did i learn today? We are 5-0, and no matter what happens next week, for this week, I will enjoy being 5-0. Go Blue!
1. Indiana fans suck! Real classy move cheering when Denard went down. Next year I hope we beat you by 4-5 td's in Ann Arbor.
2. I get severe anxiety watching Michigan's defense and tend to throw various objects around my house.
3. I heart Denard.
4. These games give me another excuse to drink more silver bullets on Saturday.
I learned IU fans have a really fucking annoying first down celebration routine.
That too! My wife started doing it but flipping off the TV at the end which may have been almost equally annoying.
First time on the forum here.
The offense looked awesome (despite the stalled drives in the fourth when we really needed them to decrease our own "pucker" factor). I really feel like, because we score so much, that we have the potential to win any game this year.....if we play smart and don't turn the ball over.
The scary part is, how can our defense be so bad?! I know Indiana runs a complicated passing offense, but after 3 years we just have very little improvement on defense. I gotta believe that Grob is a knowledgeable and great coach....so what gives? Is it a lack of talent on D. I mean, despite all the defections and injuries, it seems like we would still be able to be at least average. As fast as our offense scores, we need a defense that is LAYERS DEEP. We dont have that, and I fear that it will haunt us down the road.
Also, just out of curiousity, what is up with Josh Furman? Does anyone have any info on him? Is he going to be redshirted? This kid looked awesome (on film and paper). I keep expecting to hear his name but have not. Is he going to end up a LB or a safety? Any info would be appreciated. Go Blue!