Anything to keep him away from VT. They do have a strong engineering program.
spoiler alert: i linked this
Anything to keep him away from VT. They do have a strong engineering program.
My best friend is his DC right now. He is in an interesting situation. He isn't a prima donna, he is very down to earth and a very very smart kid. He does want an engineering degree and loves that Mattison is recruiting using the entire school and not just talking football.
He loves VT, because of Bud Foster, not Beamer. He also has only been to schools that are within driving distance. His head coach is a Michigan fan, and Hand is not a fan of the bias. I am actually going to with them to Columbus Beauty School for the GAME. I have 8 hours in a car with him to play the Victors and talk about Michigan...
"His head coach is a Michigan fan, and Hand is not a fan of the bias." Does that mean that Hand doesn't like the fact that his head coach is outwardly pro-Michigan, and therefore gets a feeling (whether true or not) that he is trying to steer him there? If that's the case, and your riding with Hand for 8 hours, maybe it's not best to talk about Michigan the whole time and play the Victors. Or I could be reading the line all wrong.
Then again, I've seen more people misuse the word "bias" than just about any other word.
You're bias against people who use the word "bias" is bias.
usage of you're is bias.
Misuse of bias is one of the most dominate mistakes I see in written English.
I wish I could say it doesn't phase me, but it does.
Who gives a shit? I could care less what you think.
see what you did there
Dominate = VERB. Dominant = ADJECTIVE.
especially since I will be a guest of his while visiting Ohio...I will have to keep the Pro-Michigan to a respectable minimum. And to be honest, as a fan, it would be nice, but I could care less where he goes to school. His coach however, I'm the best man in his wedding so, I don't mind doing a favor to go to my first OSU/UM game. I will take the opportunity to say some good things from a fan perspective however, but in the end, he's a great kid, very funny, and i'll root for him ALMOST anywhere he goes lol
Ha 20 minutes south...if you're in Marine One :)
I wouldnt hold my breath (or buckle my seatbelt) on this one. The next high profile, 5 Star recruit that actually places academics on the top of their decision making tree will be the first. They all claim publicly how vitally important the quality of their eduction experience will be in choosing the school but at the end of the day I think it ranks significantly behind other, more immediate factors: coaching staff's ability to place players in NFL, weather (sadly), night life, girls & sometimes payolla.
Actually, the next 5 star that actually means what he says about academics will be at least the second. Myron Rolle chose FSU largely because they taylored a program that allowed him to do all his pre-med requirements in 2 1/2 years and gave him extensive grad level lab work in physiology. And it worked out pretty well for him.
Speaking of FSU....Wouldn't EJ Levenberry be another good example?
I'd also add Josh Garnett to that list. When he chose between two shirts saying "Michigan Football" and "Stanford Medicine", it definitely showed that academics were huge in his decision making.
Aaron Burbridge chose MSU because of academics.
The opportunities from the packaging school are second-to-none and, if the need ever arises, the prison-to-work program is beneficial. Can't really blame the kid.
Although academics were high for Josh didn't it come down to proximity to his family in Puyallup WA?
Five-star recruits that are also smart enough to handle a pre-med or engineering role are pretty damn rare. So yeah, probably shouldn't be any breath holding.
You forgot Myron Rolle already? 5 star. Rhodes Scholar.
You guys are right. There ARE two and I stand corrected.
I, however, get the other 5116 players though who make the claim how important their education is and then pay zero attention to academics when they actually "put on the hat" on signing day.
means caring about the "best" or highest ranked program....it could mean something like the best academic support.
Let's also not forget that considering the backgrounds of a lot of these kids, "going to college" is much higher on the academic ladder than a lot of their peers will climb, and if you never thought you could ever actually go to college and aren't planning on trying to get a job with a high-powered Wall Street firm, one college is as good as any other.
That's a very tactful way of saying "easy," Voltron Blue.
Are you really keeping score?
I still remember the premature celebrations around here when Myron Rolle said that he wanted to go to medical school. Everybody thought that it automatically meant he would end up in a winged helmet. After all, nobody with those kinds of aspirations would want to go to FSU, right?
I think people make two basic misconceptions regarding recruits who say that academics are important in making their decisions.
First, academics may be important, but that doesn't mean that it is the only consideration. Recruits will consider all kinds of things; just because academics are publicly cited as one consideration doesn't automatically mean that it's the only thing they'll consider.
Second, even if the recruit is putting academics above everything else, that doesn't automatically mean that Michigan is the best place for them. Someone above mentioned Levenberry. That was a recruit that took academics seriously and wanted to pursue a degree that Michigan doesn't offer, so he went to a good school that offers the program he was interested in. And as someone else mentioned, recruits who want to pursue an engineering degree will have an extra logistical hurdle of having to contend with commuting between practice and N. Campus. If a football player wants his engineering degree, maybe the problems created by the layout of Michigan's campus means he shouldn't come to Michigan.
Maybe I'm just not as cynical as other posters here, but I don't automatically assume that because a high school kid is a highly regarded football recruit that he's blowing smoke up everyone's ass about wanting a good education. There are plenty of schools that have good football programs and good academic reputations. Just because a recruit says education is important and then picks a school besides Michigan doesn't mean that he was lying.
Academics are an important part of the mix, but there are many and varied reasons to go to a school.
And let's be honest: if you want a good education, there are many places you can get it.
There are other factors in the academics than just the school ranking. For instance, iirc, there have been potential Michigan recruits interested in architecture and nursing. Unfortunately, the way classes are scheduled at Michigan, my understanding is that it is impossible to do the practicums and be on the team. (something like being required to do something in the afternoon that's required, and a direct irreconcilable conflict with the football practice schedule.)
It would be great for Hand to come to Michigan, but in the end, he will neither make nor break the 2014 recruiting class.
I can't imagine how awesome a player of his caliber would be with the seemingly magic DL coaching abilities of Mattison and Hoke.
I think Montgomery often gets overlooked but I've only heard good things about him. Hand will have three coaches to help him become the best player he can be if he chooses Michigan. When you couple that with the academic aspect, I think that makes Michigan a contender for him.
I'd almost recommend against Michigan if he wants to do engineering and football. I don't know that I've heard of a M football player who has pulled that off yet what with the huge workloads of football and engineering school.
I think Mark Huyge did. But, your point still stand because im sure it is a short list.
I don't remember who exactly, but I remember someone on the O-Line majoring in nautical engineering. Anybody remember who? Or am I just making this up?
Edit: Answered before I even asked it.
for his major is Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering.
Isn't Omameh an Engineering major?
Hugye was too. I think it's do-able, but it won't be easy. I got a Mechanical Engineering degree at Michigan and it was tough by itself. The advantages he will have are:
All the academic support
year-round classes - no 20 credit semesters for sure
any/all AP credit - I came in with 28 credits due to APs and the Engineering School's foreign language program (instead of retroactive credits, they just give you credit for whatever you pass out of on the exam during orientation)
I think you could pull off being an engineering major and a football player, as a couple of our linemen have proven.
I thought he was, too, but mgoblue shows a double major in sociology and communications.
I think he started as an engineering student. That is what he told us in the countdown to kickoff video.
And I don't think that's anything new. I remember that from a couple of years ago.
EDIT: Hadn't refreshed my screen over lunch-- the "correct" was referring to the sociology & communications major. It's possible he started in engineering, but if he switched, I don't think it was recent. Whether that was because of the demands of the engineering or not, can't say, but I seem to remember him really liking a sociology class early on...
But I believe it's possible and do not think they are discouraged from trying. Most players take 12 credits a semester and make up for this by taking classes spring and summer (in order to receive scholarship checks).
I think a redshirt year would go a long way. No throw away classes and 12/13 - 12/13 - 6 - 6 credits and I think it can be done. Loads of academic support available for our athletes as well. Just takes a special individual to want to pursue that kind of work.
OK, reasonable point but then where would you tell him to go? Somewhere where he can get an engineering degree without going to class? Yes, it would be tough at Michigan but it would be tough at any school. If he wants to do both, I don't see why Michigan would be a worse choice than would other engineering schools.
this. an engineering degree is difficult anywhere.
you would make an extremely bad advisor. First of all, as others pointed out, last year's OL had an engineering major. Second, if he wants to go to any engineering school he's going to have a heavy academic workload, even if you try to push him into a less competitve program.
...is getting an engineering degree. There may be different workloards re: basketball and football but it seems comparable.
Basketball might be even tougher academically, since it stretches across two semesters, and the grind in the first semester starts at the same time as basketball pre-season practice.
Garrett Rivas did it back before Brendan Gibbons knew how to think about brunettes....
Going back a ways - Stephan Humphreys. I believe he had a dual major in engineer and some sort of biology/pre med program and went on to medical school after his NFL career.
Stefan Humphries .
I don't know how ENG students do it. Playing football, the problem sets and projects - this is a tough road especially for a guy with this much NFL potential. I would love to see this happen. There are very few ENG students in the draft for many reasons.
Are most the ENG classes on north campus still? I hope the academic counselors bring their A game.
Aren't English classes on central campus?
Obviously sounds like he's got a good head on his shoulders. But the prospects that REALLY makes their decision on academics are few an far between. Usually the "academics are important for me and my future", really means "academics are important to my Mom", and "what I really want to do is bang hot chicks and practice to become a 21 year old millionaire". Not that I may have thought any differently if I were such a prospect, but we'll see exactly how important a degree is when he choses his final few schools.
Unfortunately, the college of engineering being on N Campus is probably going to be a big negative against us. Getting to and from class was enough of a challenge, especially when my schedule included going back and forth more than once a day, but throw in getting to and from practice literally on the opposite end of campus, and its going to be a nightmare that's really going to cut into a player's already limited time.
Da'Shawn is not your normal recruit. I don't think the article is as fluff as some will make it out to be.
1. He was definitely trying to get to Ann Arbor for the game. He was at least bringing his cousin (2014 ATH Marcus Boone) as well. Some issues came up a while ago that prevented them from making the trip though. He plans on visiting after the season though.
2. Virginia Tech will be hard to beat. He's developed a good relationship with their DC Bud Foster and they are recruiting Boone as well, which might be the biggest thing going for them.
3. Michigan does have a decent shot though. Mattison is one of his favorite recruiters and he's aware of the prestige connected to Michigan's engineering program. Last I knew he was interested in petroleum engineering specifically, but that may have changed, who knows.
he wanted to go this weekend but they have a rivarly game tonight, couldnt make it up. And also his cousin/best friend being a package deal will help and Michigan might not take a 3* corner to get a 5*...especially if McDowell signs on.
You don't think Michigan wouldn't take a flier on a 3-star corner to get one of the top prospects in the 2014 class? Not every commit is going to be a 4-star or higher, so why wouldn't they use one of those slots on a package deal that'll get you Hand?
If the projections for Hand come to fruition (better than Clowney), it would absolutely be worth it to pick up a 3* corner. A 3* doesn't mean you are a bad player - you're still good enough for a lot of DI programs.
OP Where in the world are you getting your engineering program rankings?
"I would say these are the competitive engineering programs at BCS conference schools on somewhat of the same plane as Michigan: Illinois, Penn State, Ga Tech, Auburn, Virginia, VaTech (well VaTech likes to think they are on this list). If you go further west, then Stanford (obv), Cal, TAMU, and Washington come into play. "
Illinois has a surprisingly good engineering program, on par with Michigan. Same with GT, Cal, Stanford. Somehow, the OP left out schools like UT-Austin (probably better than TAMU) and Purdue (better than PSU overall).
I thought I had read somewhere that he was interested specifically in Petroleum Engineering, which helps schools like PSU, VT, WVU, TAMU, UT, Stanford, etc.
I generally agree with you, but auburn?
You can also add Wisconsin and Northwestern
Why is Northwestern (NU) not mentioned? The 'Cats look to be an 8-9 win team again. They have had very good D-line players drafted the last few years, Louis Castillo, Corey Wooten, not to mention Napoleon Harris lined up at DE for at least a year. I know NU has an engineering program.
My sense is that engineering is kind of an afterthought at Northwestern. Obviously NU is a great school, but engineering isn't really what they're known for.
I read that he wanted to study petroleum engineering, a degree we don't offer. I'd say if he's serious about that degree then LSU or tamu
Med student Michael Ferns, Engineer Da'Shawn Hand. That's the Michigan difference.
Michigan may not have that specialty but a good friend of mine with a Michigan engineering degree is an engineer in the petroleum industry. As a comparison, it seems to me that Stanford was an odd choice for Andrew Luck's interest in architecture, but still a fine choice, obviously.
From a website on petroleum engineering schools.
University of Michigan
Prospective students can take courses like engineering geology, excavation and tunneling, and geoenvironmental engineering, to name a few, which all specialize in petroleum engineering. In addition, the college has developed state-of-the-art research in topics like structural integrity, construction management, materials in new construction, and wastewater treatment.
Here are the 2010 rankings for engineering programs by the Academic Rankings of World Universities (ARWU). They don't have subject rankings for 2011 and 2012 subject rankings haven't come out yet.
7)U of M
The first non-american school is Cambridge at 16, Ohio is 26, and 'Bama isn't ranked in the top 100
So we have Hand?
I got so much hand, I'm coming out of my gloves.
UT-Austin is indeed a good engineering school. Plus, it is close to the Gulf coast where many companies recruting for Chemical and Mechanical Engineers are located.
Also on the Michigan front, back in the day (on the hoops side), James Voskuil got an Aeronautical Engineering degree.
I just finished watching a movie from India, where a high value is placed on American engineering and business schools. In the film, a father asks his son if he has thought about what American school he wants to go to. When he says “no”, the father--speaking in the Indian language, Hindi-- lists three choices:
“Michigan, Carnegie Mellon, Wharton.”
So, here’s somebody who speaks Hindi, and lives more than eight thousand miles from Ann Arbor, yet has UM #1 on the list of schools for his son.
FWIW, independently of this father's recommendation for schools, I highly recommend the movie itself, which is based on the fight for independence in India and is titled Rang De Basanti. It broke a lot of box office records overseas.
Texas has a GREAT engineering school, but it's rare that they recruit kids from outside of Texas. His Rivals page doesn't list a Texas offer.
If he's serious about engineering, we have a great shot at this kid. We can also sell him on the fact that his position coach is also the head coach.