Also, donnal is 89th.
Peppers at 10, which seems low.
Also, donnal is 89th.
when we first got going with beilien about three years ago I figured we would be decent, make the tournament more often than not and every five or six years have a shot at a final four...
Now, I don't see us missing the tournament any time soon and I see us having a shot at the final four year in and year out...
And I feel safe that we won't be having any recruiting violations any time soon... which is worth its weight in gold.
I agree. At this point, I think the only reason we'd ever have a seriously down year with Beilein (i.e., no NCAA tournament) is if we see an exodus to the NBA one year with early entrants.
We will probably have at least two players leave (gr3 and mcgary), lose Morgan, and potentially have Irvin and/or Walton leave.
I'm not saying 2015 will be a make or break year, but I do think it will be a great indicator of whether or not we've put ourselves on the path to sustained dominance that msu and the like have built.
If Walton leaves after next year...then we probably won the national championship.
Burke almost left after his freshman year, and we got bounced in the first round of the tourney...
Lets just say the talent surrounding him at that time was less than stellar...
had 4 players leave early this year. Granted, we almost won the nc, but our tourney run only boosted mcgarys draft stock out of thj/mcgary/gr3
3 guys in the top 89? Hoke and Beilein are kicking some serious ass on the recruiting trail.
I'd say "Two in the Top 30 and a third in the Top 90." Sounds exactly like last years class come to think of it.
I was always a huge Beilein defender (both here on the board and amongst my friend group), but he's been far better than I thought possible. I figured we'd get to Sweet 16s occasionally and that when that happens you always have a shot at the Final Four, but this recruiting is making returning to elite status not only possible, but probable. The 2014 class will be criticial for maintaing momentum, but really how can anyone doubt Beilein at this point.
McGary and GRIII will be gone for sure. The 2014 class could be the difference between the program returning to elite status or only being average.
Already we have Walton stepping in to a situation where Spike may very well start for the first third of the season. This means that Walton is less likely to track to the NBA after only one year. In this light, looking at each position in 2-3 years:
Of course any position may have a super-recruit come in and steal the show. If this happens with seasoned veterans as listed above then coming off the bench, the wild swings we saw these past seasons will be smoothed out considerably. Eventually I think the program will reach a steady-state (of excellence) under Beilein, hopefully in time for him to hand the reigns off to a protege.
Football and basketball ladies and gentlemen, I think we are zooming in on one of those 2006 Florida Gator years when they won the Championship in both sports. That thought makes me happy...
ohio for both of them as well?
The trend appears to be to pick up players who are highly rated but not high enough to be clear cut 1 and dones. Geting those players who would be low first or second round NBA draft picks after their first year and having them stay for a second year really helps build more continuity even though you have players nearly as good as the 1 and done types. Throw in a few 4 year players and you build a team that should be good every year even though you lose a player or two to the NBA every year.
The problem is that Beilein is so good with talent development that after a year, the 20th-30th ranked prospects at Michigan will probably be as NBA ready as the 1st-10th ranked prospects at most other schools.
I am okay with this problem.
I've always admired Beilein, thought he was a good coach and a great man. I expected under him to make the tournament most years, maybe miss a few, close the gap a bit between Michigan and MSU, and make run for a Big Ten title every third year or so.
All I can say is: wow. Beilein very well could have Michigan among the upper echelon of college basketball programs. It will take a couple more deep tournament runs (hopefully a championship!) to solidify that status, but with the way Hoke and Beilein are recruiting Michigan should be a Big Ten and National Championship contender most years.
Just think about it.
This means that they suddenly got better, right?
...Coach sure can spot talent...he def makes the recruiting services job a little easier!
I had some serious doubts about him a few years ago and even this past season during that late-season swoon we had. I was wrong and Belein is as good of a coach as there is in CBB today. He's really stepped his recruiting game up the past few years and seems to be letting his players play in a system they enjoy. I do think he could do a little bit better in coaching defense but thats a small issue at this point.
There are only
1314 Big Ten signees (including Maryland) in that top 100, and 3 are headed to Michigan. Not bad!
EDIT: Obviously, I can't count. LSAClassOf200 is correct (see below)—there are 14.
How far is Walton away from that 5* ?
Irvin is actually the last 5* at 22.
I am concerned that the 5*s we recruit are at the tail end of 5* players. How can we hope to match up if other schools have better 5*s than our 5*s?
2 years in a row now that Beilein has signed 2 top 30 recruits in the same class. Impressive stuff, especially considering where this program was only 5 years ago.
Biggest thing there, Donnal listed at 225lbs. If he is indeed up to 225 even by start of the season he will be a major contributer.
What was he listed at before?
132 lbs. He's put in some serious time in the weight room.
Ive seen him play a couple times and he was not 132 lbs. He appeared to be about 190, which at 6'8" looks scrawny. He needs to obviously bulk up and also become more constant. There were games he would dominate and others where he would get tossed around. With the depth we have at C I really hope he can redshirt. It would benefit both him and the team in the long run. Add some weight and he would be a PERFECT fit in Belein's system. Hes like a very poor mans Dirk Novinsky.
I'm usually here a couple times a day just to keep up with all things Michigan. Most of the time I'm at my boring jobjust passing time. It just seems that every time I do have the slightest insight on a topic I get negged for no reason. I would be better off just posting funny or attractive female pictures.
in the post you replied to. Nobody was seriously claiming Donnal weighed 132 pounds.
The poster you're responding to was joking when he said 132 lbs. You didn't get the joke and replied seriously, thus the negging. No sweat though, take the hit and move on - we've all been negged to pieces on this board. It makes you part of the community
Last year he did *appear* to be 132 lbs. so the joke went right over my head. I guess this negging was a bad example. Well if being negged makes me apart of the community, nag away.
Your karma is at 0. Every post you make starts off as negged.
We already KNEW the '13 class was going to be fantastic...
We're hungry for 2014...Come on Devin, pull the trigger!
per year, this program will be staying in that elite status - which is where we belong. I agree that the 2014 class will be very important to maintaining where we are. Getting Booker and 1 or 2 other top 100 guys will be important.
Beilein is recruiting great and we all know he has an eye for talent.
On another note, that Kentucky class is ridiculous... 5 in the top 10 and 6 in the top 25.
It will be interesting to see how Calipari handles the mintues for everyone. They have 5 5-stars coming in the 2013 class, and they return 2 5-stars in Alex Poythress and Will Cauley-Stein. They are also bringing in high 4-star Marcus Lee along with returning former high 4-star Kyle Wiltjer. With 7 former 5-stars and 2 other near 5-stars, there simply is no way to give each kid the minutes he will expect. But that is a pretty damn good problem to have.
but I believe UK is one of the top contenders for espn #1 andrew wiggins which would have to be unprecedented.
With that much talent you give them all @ 25-30 minutes and tell them to play their butt off for the time they are on the court. Kind of like how Mattison treats his D-Line. The real question is when there is a close game, who are the 5 on the court for the last 5 minutes. That's where the issues come into play.
That has 5 of the top 10 guys? That's insane.
just ask Robert Morris University.
They didn't have the 6 out of the top 25 players then. They also were missing Noel too, not saying that they shouldn't have been able to beat them. Next years Kentucky team will be very good. I look forward to their early season matchup with Msu.
I think it was a joke...
Beilein is having two great recruiting years in a row, while Sparty is struggling to get elite talent like they used to. Since both teams recruit the same region, this balance is always important.
However, in basketball, everything is very fluid due to the age at which players can enter the NBA. It means that a coach almost can't afford to have even one year where he doesn't pull in elite talent. Beilein is great because he is now able to mix four year players with one and two year players, and can usually find a way to make it work.
The four year guys will mitigate the "down years," but it's going to be very difficult to go to the Final Four every year. More often than not, even the best teams have a series of two year "windows" followed by a couple of average years. Luckily, the average year at Michigan should mean an NCAA Tournament berth.
At any rate, as Brian has said here, the 2014 class is going to be very important. If Beilein can recruit classes like last year and this year every year, the Wolverines can be a perennial top ten team. But the 2014 class isn't a "lock" yet by any means.
I just plan on enjoying MBB one season at a time.
MSU has a great team heading into this year, and they'll likely end up with 2 top-5 guys for 2014 in Jones and Okafor. They aren't going anywhere for a while, at least as long as Izzo is there.
They may have had a bad recruiting season this year, but they could afford to put all their eggs in the Parker basket with 2014 looking extremely promising.
I ended up getting distracted by the football recruiting section.
Sure, the 2012 and 2013 classes have been awesome and have and will probably take us to great heights but we just lost Burke and THJ and will almost definitely lose GRIII and McGary next year. That's 4 of 5 starters from the tourney run. If Irvin is good enough, he may be gone after next year.
If we can't continue to recruit at a high level in the next 2 classes, we may see a significant drop off for a few years somewhere between 2014 and 2016
One of the things that makes the ratings of this class to date relevant to how well recruiting has gone and how we should be able to do in the Big Ten in particular is that the Big Ten only claims 14 of those ESPN 100 players. Those 14 players are split among only 7 of the 12 teams, and the only team in the conference that has more on the list than we do is Indiana. It's just something else that says to me that we firmly intend to be in the conversation, as they say. Like others, I am completely amazed - in a most excellent way - by the talent we're getting and Beilein's ability to develop said talent.
Just to add some more context, 247's composite ranking has Irvin at 29, Walton at 47 and Donnal at 88. Supposedly it was updated today, but I have no idea if the update actually includes the new ESPN rankings. It shouldn't matter too much.
Past Beilein recruits: GRIII finished 17, McGary 28, Stauskas 82, Brundidge 87, Trey 93. Aaaand that's as far back as 247 goes because they hate backdating. But between Scout, Rivals and ESPN, Smotrycz averaged 80. D-Mo was 77 to Rivals, 100 to ESPN and the 20th best PG to Scout. Vogrich was 100 to Scout, 131 to Rivals and the 40th best SG to ESPN.
Obviously the trajectory is pretty good. Also helps to see that Beilein does have some misses (Vogrich and Brundidge) but everyone else contributed as a freshman and at least showed flashes of things to come.
Interestingly, ESPN seems to do a pretty good job, with Brundidge being their only true miss (other services all missed too). ESPN had vogrich the lowest and Burke the highest. That being said, every roster needs players like vogrich, so he was only a miss in the sense that expectations were much higher for him, but his role was still important.
Beilein has recruited during his tenure thus far. Assuming JB continues to be able to develop point guards the way he has, even if Walton has a bit of a rough freshman year (which I dont' expect), we should be able to expect a great sophomore year.
Morris and Burke each had one.
It's kind of funny to see people worrying about whether Beilein can keep the recruiting going. It's a valid concern, but a fun concern to have.
One thing people seem to have forgotten is that in the fall of 2014 Stauskas, Albrecht, LeVert and Horford will all be juniors or seniors. Unless one or more blow up next year that should hopefully be a pretty solid group of upperclassmen with a good amount of experience returning. Not saying that guarantees a deep tourney run and elite status, but you mix in some solid younger guys and that has the makings of a pretty solid team.
Everyone is (rightfully) talking about how Beilein is a great recruiter, but I think a lot of credit is also due to Bacari Alexander. He seems to connect very well with players/recruits
As does LaVall Jordan - the "Beyonce'" of the basketball coaches.
(I don't love that metaphor, but I guess it is apt)
This article has Derrick Walton as #1 on their sleeper list.
I'm a little confused by this list though because they define sleeper as "players outside our top 25 who could outperform their final recruiting ranking at the next level."
I don't see why they don't just rank the players higher, who they beleive to be sleepers. Regardless, nice to see a michigan recruit on the list.
Anyone care to post the others?
That's what a sleeper is - someone who is not considered as good now, but could surprise (i.e., be better than we thought) down the road.
I mean they say someone outside of the top 25 who performs above their rankings...but Derrick walton has the same "rating" as the 23rd ranked player in the class of 89 so I'm not sure if they even distinguish a difference between them. It just seems kind of silly to call him a "sleeper". To me, nobody is really a sleeper in the top 50 and I feel like sleepers are players like LeVert or Spike. I suppose it's semantics but I feel like if he was a "sleeper" like they suggest, then they should just rank him higher.
I think that blurb summarizes what I see in Walton's game from his videos. His dribbling and passing seems very "Burke-ensian". Maybe not the same scorer Burke was, but also he may not need to be.
My non-UofM friends were relieved when Burke declared, but I think Walton will be the next in a long line of great PGs. Think about what Beilein has given us at the PG spot:
-David Merritt and CJ Lee: both played well above what anyone thought they were capable of.
-I think Manny Harris played a little point as well as "2" and he was very solid, especially at the top of the 1-3-1 on defense.
-Darius Morris - a good recruit who flourished with the pick and roll and cashes an NBA paycheck after declaring early.
-Burke - another "good" recruit who far surpassed expectations winning every award under the sun and soon will be making NBA bank.
The PG spot is, in my opinion the position Beilein has "coached up" the most. It's also absolutely critical for post season play to have solid guards (as we saw this year). We will always have a fighters chance as long as Beilein is coach and pulling in these talented PGs.
looked at all the other top B1G teams' recruiting classes out of curiosity....Izzo has two 3* players coming in? I get going all in for Jabari Parker but that's woeful for a program of their caliber. And it's not like you can't recruit other players while recruiting Parker.
It would be nice if outstanding football recruiting reaped immediate benefits as is the case in basketball. Burke's value was obvious, but without the difference McGary made to the lineup, we would not be as optimistic as we are, especially considering how most of us probably felt after losing to PSU and the MSU blowout. The sweet 16 seemed like this team's ceiling. After winning a Sugar Bowl, those warm and tingly feelings were being stroked by yet another outstanding class put together by Coach Hoke pooping gold. Alabama quickly dashed those hopes. Perhaps, though, getting ND at home will spur the boys on to an undefeated non-conference and inject some confidence into a team who was in every game but one last year and is better at QB. If Ohio can take advantage of an easier non-conference to work out their kinks and run the table, there is no reason that Michigan cannot do the same. There's no doubt watching last years team that they have caught up to both Ohio and ND talent wise and could soon pass them with superior coaching.