UMBig11 Week 1 Practice Notes
UMBig11 posted some notes from fall camp going into week 2. I won't post them and take away hits from TTB but here's the link.
http://touch-the-banner.com/forum/topic/some-football-notes-heading-in-to-week-2/
August 6th, 2017 at 12:18 PM ^
I am very surprised Speight is so far ahead of Peters. I thought Peters would have made the strides needed to claim the job.
August 6th, 2017 at 12:24 PM ^
smokescreen
I think you mean a "false flag" rather than a "smokescreen." Hmmmm, thought someone like you would know that, Putin...
I think both of you mean "intent to deceive."
I think you all mean "red herring"
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Well, whatever we call it, it's definitely a tactic and not a strategy...
It's a feature, not a bug.
it's a journey, not a destination
in a bush are better than a dead bird in the hand.
That's just what they want you to think they mean.
I think it's a blue heron
Stephen Herron
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August 6th, 2017 at 12:33 PM ^
A redshirt freshmen would have to make insane strides or basically be a no doubt All-American to unseat an incumbent starter. It's Speight under center unless Peters makes some serious noise between now and September 2.
A few of us got negged earlier in the week for suggesting as much. "Harbz don't care about ur experience blar, blar, best qb will be the starter!"
Based on UMBig11s report, it sounds like Speight is visibly outperforming the competition. That's fully harmonious with the idea that Harbaugh runs a meritocracy.
Cause just a few days ago Lorenz (sp?) said it was a battle.
It being a "battle" is also harmonious with Harbaugh running a pure meritocracy. The only variable being that between Lorena's "battle" (which sounds like a parroting of Harbaugh/Drevno's coach speak) and UMBig11's "looks like Speight's well ahead".
(Unless you're just noting it's funny how quickly the reports from camp change, which I agree with 100.)
a close contest with the outcome in some doubt. It's OK for Harbaugh/Drevno to use it to mean nothing more than they're competing. From Lorenz or other insiders, it should mean something more.
I'll believe Speight is unquestionably better than Peters when I see it with my own eyes - like O'Korn vs IU...
Until then I have my OWN narrative to spin!
Because experience isn't the only factor. Just like arm talent isn't the only factor. It's part of it, sure. But Speight won't be QB simply because he was the starter last year. It'd be because he went out there and showed that he's the QB that runs the offense the best and gives the team the best chance to win. Experience can certainly be an aspect of that, but it's far from the reason he would start.
This is difficult for people to understand.
It's always easier to throw out strawman arguments than to debate honestly.
Harbaugh obviously recognizes the value of experience, and the value of talent. Both play a role in determining which player gives the team the best chance to win. It doesn't have to be one or the other.
It's also possible that Speight's experience is part of what is making him better. These things affect each other.
Exactly this. How do people not understand this by now.
for hoping that is the case.
August 6th, 2017 at 10:45 PM ^
I agree. That part of it isn't surprising to me.
What IS surprising to me, tho, is that Peters has not separated himself from O'Korn!?
Henson was as good a prospect as you can get, but Brady was the better player at the time and won out over Henson easily his senior year, and second year starting. Henson killed it as a Junior, but QB is a very tough position to come in young and unseat an incumbent.
I think this speaks less of how Peters is doing and more of how well Speight has continued to grow. Hopefully he has the down field stuff figured out by the season. With this group of recievers, there are going to be people open down firled and we need a QB to take advantage.
I take issue with the vague descriptors used when we all know the two individuals in question.
If the two players are of comparable talent and skillset, then yes, your assertion is likely correct in just about every case, but I think to many fans who are rooting for Peters over Speight, this scenario is undeniably different because of a few undeniable points, primarily that to a lot of fans and those posting here, they've concluded that Peters is more talented.
Speight was recruited by the old staff that's not held in high regard, wasn't a big name recruit, and had his struggles last year on a team with big aspirations, while Peters was recruited by the current Head Coach, was a big name recruit who's presumed to be more talented, and who outplayed the incumbent starter on TV this past spring.
That's where the conversation is, not a general topic about redshirt freshmen and incumbent starters.
August 6th, 2017 at 12:31 PM ^
It's not really that surprising that a good qb last year would be far ahead of a guy whose never taken a snap in college.
True, but Speight was a mediocre qb last year.
Not pre-injury. Tell me which other BIG QBs you would take ahead of him? For some reason, many on this blog cannot understand just how painful it is to play FOOTBALL with a separated A-C. I'm not his biggest supporter, but you gotta cut him a break. We'll see soon.
Big Ten QBs were hot garbage last year brah
August 6th, 2017 at 11:42 PM ^
what is the difference between hot gabage and room tempurature garbage?
We did witness his play before the injury and, unless you're putting a lot of stock in his games against poor competition, he did not perform well. He was ok.
This team was good enough to make the College Football Playoff, and you want to compare the QB play to just QBs within a conference bereft of good Quarterback play?
And yes, it is painful to play football with an AC joint injury. But I'll lead the charge in contending that if you're healthy enough to make the Overtime touchdown throw in Columbus, you're healthy enough to not throw the interceptions in the same game.
August 6th, 2017 at 10:54 PM ^
He had things he did well and things he did badly. He was, after all, a redshirt sophomore with only average physical tools. It's not unreasonable to believe that he will improve incrementally year over year. More consistent mechanics, better reads, etc. Harbaugh wants to run a complex offense. Speight seems best equipped to do it given his experience and aptitude. Peters may we'll throw a better deep ball, but if he can't make the right read it won't matter.
Oh stop.
Don't even act like Speight's play was good enough to win the conference. He was a major factor in the Iowa and OSU losses. And I think it's safe to say his ceiling is definitely lower than Peters'. The best qb should play, regardless of who it is, but some people think Speight's job is secure because he's a great qb and he was not last year.
August 6th, 2017 at 10:26 PM ^
WS is a better QB than Peters is right now. You don't play QB's based upon ceilings. If Peters is to supplant WS, which I think is unlikely, it's not his potential that's going to get him the nod, it's his ACTUAL that going to do it. Similarly, last year is irrelevant -- good, bad or indifferent. All that matters is RIGHT NOW! You can rant and rave about how WS played last year, but coach has said it's a level playing field ... roll the balls out and see who takes the position.
If WS's job is secure, which we're all speculating upon after one report on the first week of camp, than it's because he's that far ahead of his closest competitors. Complain all you want, but that's the way it is.
August 6th, 2017 at 10:45 PM ^
Just on a count of ALL CAPS used, I'd say it's YOU RANTING & RAVING!
Here's where last year is relevant: For game 1 vs Florida, at a neutral site, Speight has GAME EXPERIENCE!
Think how much better Peters would have to play in camp to overcome that... for THAT game.
I have said and will again, after that game (or Hell during it, if Speight were to really struggle or get dinged) Speight will have to continue to a) excel and b) stay healthy.
I saw - we ALL saw - in a quasi- game environment in Spring, Peters looked not just a bit better, but vastly superior. But Speight is starting vs Fla, so no use muddying the water now.
It's after Fla the true competition begins, I believe. We'll see, won't we?!
And that's a good point and fun discussion to have while we wait for the season to start.
Would having Florida in week 2 or 3 instead of week 1 alter the QB situation and how the coaches are handling it?
It seems like you are agreeing with me without realizing it. I do think Speight will start the entire season barring injury. My only point was that Peters isn't trying to dethrone a great quarterback. He's trying to dethrone a mediocre one (based on 2016 data). That isn't impossible if the kid is as good as we all hope he is.
It was good enough to win the conference...last year.
This year it won't be.
August 6th, 2017 at 12:36 PM ^
Are you really "very surprised" that an established starter who performed in the top 1/3 of B1G QBs last year isn't getting beaten out by a redshirt freshman with no experience? Because I would be very surprised if this is very surprising to you.
In the conference last season??
McSorley had good stats, but he's been called arm-punt for a reason.
Barrett's good in the ground attack, but he can't throw.
Who else is there? O'Connor, Perry Hills, whatever guy was behind center at Rutgers, Wes Lunt?
Outside of 3 or 4, the QBs in this conference suck.
Speight's a solid option, but he benefitted from a TON around him, both offensively and defensively. He was never asked to really put this team on his back, and quite honestly, I do not think he has that capability.
If you think Barrett and McSorley are bad college quarterbacks, I have no idea what game you've been watching. Are they perfect? No way, but at the *college* level, there's a reason why both of those guys are rated as top 10 guys right now.
On top of that, CJ Beathard was a third round pick and Clayton Thorson had a really nice year for Northwestern. Mitch Leidner's numbers regressed last season, but I don't think he's nearly as bad as some people like to joke about. Just a consequence of that crazy way too early NFL Draft projection a few years back.
Should people have been overjoyed with what Speight did last year? No, the revisionist history continues to amaze me. Personally, I was more disappointed with an upperclassmen line and upperclassmen backs that couldn't run the ball against competent defenses.
August 6th, 2017 at 12:38 PM ^
It's not surprising but it's disconcerting that Speight still needs work on the deep ball. I don't even care about accuracy into coverage just PLEASE don't overthrow wide open guys.
You "don't even care aboout accuracy into coverage."
I do.