Looks like it so far. Buster Olney reporting that the Rockies are getting Drew Pomerez, White and McBride.
Can't wait to see how Ubaldo helps their hitting.
<ed> Apparently throwing one inning, giving up 2 hits, allowing 4 earned runs and walking 4 batters was enough to convince Cleveland that they needed to throw P Joe Gardner into the deal. Indians giving up three of their best minor league pitchers.
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20110730&content_id=22531086&vkey=news_mlb&c_id=mlb
Ubaldo
i'm a tribe fan and I'm a
i'm a tribe fan and I'm a little torn up about this. Pomeranz and white were elite prospects but in return they get an established ace. It helps but I don't like what they lost.
Touchdown Manningham! MICHIGAN WINS!
Doesn't help the back end of
their rotation or fill any of the holes in their lineup. This is just a bad move for the Indians, this may give them a chance to stay in the division race, but they still would have no shot if they somehow made the playoffs. Other teams made the right move by not taking the bait on Jimenez and not mortgaging their future.
Jimenez may have ace stuff, but he is not pitching like an ace this year. He may get back to his form from last year at some point, but at the moment he still has only had one really good season in his career.
This year's Ubaldo
is still a bug upgrade over Carmona. Ubaldo at a 4 ERA and a .500 record probably nets them 3 more wins instead of starting Carmona. That's one more than they need to take first place. On paper the difference between Fister and the Tiger's 5th starter is even bigger, so I don't know that it will get the Tribe 1st place, but they didn't trade for a veteran rental player. Jimenez is still young, talented and under contract.
If he nets them 3 wins
in 60 games, he will have pitched better than Roy Halladay. According to Fangraphs' version of the Wins Above Replacement stat, he's only been worth 2 wins more than Carmona for the entire season up to this point.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
Wow
That's a bit less than I'd have expected the Rockies to get. Pomeranz is very good but, from what people are saying, there's a pretty decent chance White is a reliever.
That seems a bit light for a 27 year old cost controlled pitcher who is locked up until 2014 and who has been worth 20 wins in his short career.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
From everything I heard about White, the
Indians were expecting him to be in their rotation in the near future, not relieving. The other pitching prospect they gave up was also somebody who they thought could be in their rotation in the next couple of years.
Keith Law in particular
I think has said repeatedly that he thinks White's long-term future is in the pen. If Law is wrong then the deal is obviously way better for the Rockies.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
Jimenez is good, but thought
Jimenez is good, but thought the asking price was always too high. He'll help that team, but he's another Scherzer IMO. Real good when he's on, but inconsistent. Nasty stuff though.
He's really good
Career FIP of 3.57, xFIP of 3.8. 20 Wins Above Replacement over like 4 and a half seasons. Strikes out like 8 per 9 innings. And all of that in Coors Field.
The real problem is that the Indians just aren't a very good baseball team and aren't in a position to be trading their best prospects for immediate help.
I think I kinda hate this deal for both teams.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
I agree with the Scherzer
I agree with the Scherzer comparison going forward for both. Too much inconsistency this year to think Ubaldo's future performance will more closely resemble his 1st half last year than the last two halves. As a White Sox fan, I'm only slightly more concerned about the Indians staying in the race until the end than I was earlier today. Still think it comes down to the Sox and Tigers.
Saw on another site, that
the Indians may be in position to acquire Ryan Ludwig. That may change things somewhat, since it fills a hole in their lineup.
Also saw that Jimenez is still making his start for the Rockies tonight. Deal must not be finalized at this point, you would think he would scratched if it was.
Jiminez to Cleveland is
Jiminez to Cleveland is official. The big prize coming back is Pomeranz. The Rockies also get White, a former first rounder albeit with injury woes, and McBride, a 26-year o,d who will likely be organization fodder.
If it were official
Ubaldo wouldn't be warming up for the Rockies right now.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
You're right
It appears the writers may have jumped the gun. But, it's really weird to send him out there even if the trade, or any trade, has yet to be consummated.
I was thinking the
I was thinking the same thing the other night when Hunter Pence got pulled in the middle of the game when the trade when official. So Ubaldo could pitch and get pulled (before he normally would) if the trade is sent into the league office.
Can anyone with information on the topic explain when a player has to leave the game. Would it be when teams agree to the deal, when the trade is sent to MLB, or when MLB makes the trade official?
Overrated
I feel Ubaldo is overrated. He's had 1 good year. The Rockies are trading him for a reason. Due to velocity issues or something we don't know about, but teams don't just trade players that are game changers. This reeks of something that the Rockies know and we don't. The Rockies are not a bad team. This just isn't their year.
The Indians just mortgaged their future. The Rockies are savvy sellers. We will look back on this like we look back on the Johan Santana deal. Injuries and overrated.
Plus, don't the Indians need hitters?? Haha maybe Ubaldo will play RF and bat 5th.
What every longshot, come from behind, underdog will tell ya is this... The other guy, may in fact, be the favorite. The odds may be stacked against you, fair enough. But what the odds don't know is...this isn't a math test.
The injury thing is valid
but I really wish people would stop saying he's overrated. He's a 27 year old pitcher locked up through 2014 with very good numbers according to advanced metrics. He's really, really good. He just also might be hurt. And the Indians aren't in a position to be buyers.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
Contract
His contract helps a ton, your right.
But if I'm going to sell the farm, I want Shields. His contract situation is even better for a team.
What every longshot, come from behind, underdog will tell ya is this... The other guy, may in fact, be the favorite. The odds may be stacked against you, fair enough. But what the odds don't know is...this isn't a math test.
If Jimenez is healthy
he's probably the better pitcher than Shields, though.
Jimenez:
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=3374&position=P
Shields:
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=7059&position=P
Better career k/9 (though more walks), better ERA and FIP numbers (though a worse xFIP). Virtually identical Wins Above Replacement numbers even though Shields has like a year and a half more service time than Jimenez does. And Jimenez is 3 years younger.
If Jimenez hadn't lost 3 mph off his fastball this year, I'd rather have Jimenez. The injury possibility is a real concern though.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
Yeah, but he did lose 3 MPH.
Yeah, but he did lose 3 MPH. Stats are stats and all, but give me Shields any day of the week and twice on Sunday.
CoE Class of 2007
obviously he is injured
you dont trade your ace who is locked up at such a low price if something isnt wrong
But sir, but sir, BUT NOTHING
Red sox are back in it for ubaldo
probably a good thing for cleveland since they are raping their farm system for a pitcher who can only make an impact every 5 days if he performs. this is what the rockies are doing right now. "we want your top 2 or 3 prospects for a pitcher who magically lost 3 mph off his fastball and he will not be given a physical until the deal is finalized" and clevelands retarded gm is going "ahh shucks ill destroy our future for that you got a deal" im soooooo glad the tigers didnt trade turner for him
But sir, but sir, BUT NOTHING
Turner
I liked turner's stuff. He's got moxie. Reminds a bit of Porcello when he first made the jump to the show. Seems as nothing bothers him. But, it's just 1 game...
What every longshot, come from behind, underdog will tell ya is this... The other guy, may in fact, be the favorite. The odds may be stacked against you, fair enough. But what the odds don't know is...this isn't a math test.
More unusual behavior
As Jiminez starts the game, Esmil Rogers is warming up.
showing his true value
has already given up 2 ers def not worth it so glad hes going to cleveland
EDIT: now 4 earned in the first
But sir, but sir, BUT NOTHING
Alex White
Alex White had a few very solid starts for the tribe and Pomeranz is a first round pick, this seems like the Indians are making a deal just to make a deal and I don't like that all. They need a big bat with decent speed or a 1st baseman that can at least hit 25-30+ HRs because Matt LaPorta is slower than Terrelle Pryor and hits softer than Justin Boren.
Hail To the Victors...In Ohio
Maybe the Indians wanted to
Maybe the Indians wanted to make sure Jimenez wasn't hurt.
well he most likely is
they have refused to let teams give him a physical and now he is getting shelled by the offensivally challenged padres
But sir, but sir, BUT NOTHING
Jimenez now hugging
players in the dugout looks like he is gone. hahahaha cleveland cant wait for miguel to give him a taste of the AL when he faces us
But sir, but sir, BUT NOTHING
Cabrera has already faced
Cabrera has already faced Jimenez. He is 4/10 with 1 walk and 3 strikeouts.
Fucking magnets, how do they work?
Indians reportedly adding another player to the deal
Joe Gardner, right handed pitcher who was 7th on Sickels's top 20 Indians prospects list at the start of the year.
There is no time, sir, at which ties do not matter.
They gave up a haul. I feel
They gave up a haul. I feel like Jimenez is pretty good, but I need to see him do that consistently before I can really fear this move. It helps for sure, but I'm not sure it helps enough. Who knows though, the Tigers are so wildly inconsistent it might be enough. Here is to Fister working out for us. Cleveland was kind of forced into this move once Detroit pulled the trigger. I hope they gave up too much because of it.
cleveland is desperate
Why else do you give up the farm for a guy who, albeit very talented, has some serious medical question marks this year which you can't check out until after the trade? He's not even a soon to be FA, so there's no draft picks coming back for arbitration.
If it all works out, its a great deal. A healthy Ubaldo Jiminez is essentially the best case scenario a guy like Pomeranz could develop into, and he's locked down with a team friendly contract. Problem is things don't always work out, and there's a giant risk to trading for a starter with dropping velociy and no medicals.
The good news for cleveland is that its unlikely the trade will really be a franchise killer type move. Even if he has TJ or misses extended periods, he won't hamstring the budget, and they didn't give up any real immediate impact guys like Chisenhall or Kipnis.
www.get2formaizenblue.blogspot.com
For all of your obscure college wrestling blog needs
So Cleveland,
who has given up some of the best pitchers in the league over the years, decided to give up their entire future of prospects to maybe contend with Ubaldo?
Whoever gets in from the Central is dead meat any way. Why give up so much?
mgoblog: it's a perfectly cromulent website
If Ubaldo ends up healthy, it
If Ubaldo ends up healthy, it sets Cleveland up for success these next few years. They weren't supposed to contend this year anyways. I don't think it does much for them this season - as pitching isn't their problem - but it bodes well for them the next few years. Of course, until his contract year and the Indians trade him because they're cheapskates
I talked to my uncle who is a
I talked to my uncle who is a die hard Indians fan and he hates this trade. Because the three guys they had to give up to get Jimenez were not just good prospects but elite ones.
"I tried to but a pencil in the light socket but it was too wide and didn't fit so I used a paperclip."-Terrelle Pryor, Future Rhodes Scholar
It was the equivalent...
of the Tigers giving up Oliver, Turner AND Porcello.
K, so what's that gonna do for them?
You kinda gotta luv the deal (in the long term) as a Tigers fan.
mgoblog: it's a perfectly cromulent website
The Indians really sold the
The Indians really sold the farm on this one...... As a tribe fan its kinda tough to see white and pomeranz headed out of town...
If they can get the bats
If they can get the bats turned around the al central will be a lot more interesting.
As a Rockies and Tigers fan,
As a Rockies and Tigers fan, I don't like this at all.
UJ could be viewed as a one year wonder, but he has a ton of talent. Now he will try to beat my tigers for years to come.
CHARLES WOODSON DOWN THE SIDELINE
He's a free agent at the end
He's a free agent at the end of the season, so he might well end up in the NL by next year.
Great trade for the Rockies.
Great trade for the Rockies.
It would have been nice if the Tigers got him but he isn't worth what they wanted for him.