Trade Beilein for Huggins?
Not saying that I don't like Beilein or his system because I do but if we had the choice would you send Beilein back to WVU in trade for Huggins? I personally loved his Cincy teams and this WVU team! Up tempo athletically based system that can run and play with power. Where Beilein's system is so structured and not all that fun to watch(at least this year).
I wouldn't trade a guy who head up the NCAA ethics committee for a guy who has no ethics. Not in a million years.
I can't take anything you type seriously with your avatar being right there. It's like someone wearing a tie and short sleeve dress shirt not named Dwight.
Close your eyes and try. It seems to work well for me most of the time.
Nothing new here other than boosting up Mgo points...move along.
Beileins system is very fun to watch when we dont shoot -45992 % from 3. I would rather see a dribble drive offense at Michigan, but I still think Beilein is a top notch coach that can get us to where we want to be.
southpaw? I never knew. Arm kind of hangs low like Tebow's, though.
Apparently Chewy is a practitioner of the Frittata as well.
I would trade for Huggins if he was as classy of a guy as Beilein. He's not, though. Huggins used to, and still may be for all I know, a drunk. He doesn't seem to be the class act that Beilein is. I'm not a huge fan of Beilein's system. I think there is too much focus on shooting threes, and when they aren't falling or you don't have enough shooters, look at this season, it is hard to even function as a team. I'm definitely still in support of Beilein, though, and I hope he can continue his successful career as a coach.
Huggins had the WORST graduation rate in the NCAAs when he was at Cinci, if my mind serves me correctly.
For that reason alone, NO.
Huggins is dirty, in every possible way. He would be the last person we would want to coach this team, with the possible exception of Ed Martin himself.
What a fascinating and novel question! Is there going to be a new thread every time a Huggins-coached team wins a game? I sure hope so.
I mean, I know the lions traded away charlie parker and shiat...but i didn't think you could actually do that in college basketball! Wow.
Why don't we trade for that guy who corches Duke?
Captain there looks kind of horny.
Wouldn't you be, too?
are the raddest dudes
I don't know why I saved it. Sometime next week it will go into the trashcan and I will wonder what I saved it for.
I'd trade a case of Bud Light for Huggins. Then I'd fire him.
I loved vacating the Fab Five wins. It was, like, one of the greatest moments in the history of the university.. no, wait... it was the exact opposite of that. Huggins is a scum bag. He graduates zero point zero percent of his players. What is winning worth to you? Wouldn't you like to do it the right way?
Did he graduate none of his black players or no players at all while he was at Cincy?
None at all, IIRC.
not exactly true - Juco players don't count towards grad rates, and neither do guys that leave early (natch), Huggins had lots of both. Jason Maxiell of the pistons graduated, for one, as did Kenyon Martin.
Lots of programs have JUCOs and guys that leave early. Only Huggins, to my knowledge, has managed to pull off the "perfect" 0% rate for four-year guys.
IIRC, the 0% graduation rate was from the mid-to-late 90s, not his entire tenure at Cinci. Huggins coached Cinci for 15 years or so, so I'm sure during that time that someone graduated.
"so I'm sure during that time that someone graduated. "
Yes, that didn't come out right. Anyways, I bothered to look it up and it turns out, "27 of 95 Huggins' players graduated from Cincinnati or another university in his 16 years."
http://www.collegehoopsnet.com/story/bob_huggins_just_win_baby
..is like binge drinking. It feels great at the time, but it really sucks when you wake up.
good comparison since Bob was basically run out of Nati for puking on the side of his car during a DUI pullover. also rumors of schtooping one of the regent's wife.
If you're looking at the amazing job Huggins has done getting WV up to a 2 seed, you also have to look at his effect on Kansas State. KSU was garbage for the 10 years preceeding Huggins getting there. Although he was only there for on season, he turned the program around, and they probably should have made the NCAA tournament. If you look at their roster now, as the 2 seed, all of the stars were recruited by Huggins. I think he's direclty responsible for their ascension too.
Huggins was never a serious candidate here at Michigan, so this topic is moot, but just thought he should get some credit for the success of K State too.
I was going to rant about Huggins, but I felt this sudden, strong feeling of deja vu...
Many people said it best, the dude is a scumbag. He coached at Kansas State for one season. He got fired from Cincy for getting a DUI. He has shady recruiting connections up the wah-zoo (a la Calipari). He is the anti-Beilein and it is possible that I would NOT root for UM basketball if Huggins was the coach. Have we changed your mind yet?
for two of ours instead?
Would you trade RichRod for John Madden?
Would you trade our stadium announcer for John Madden?
Since we are talking purely in the hypothetical, can we trade having Pam Ward announcing our noon ESPN2 games for Meghan Fox?
Didn't Bo run Bill Frieder out for being too dirty? He and Michigan might not mesh.
last huggins bit - he is a West Virginia grad, so this is likely his last job and the only one was would have left his previous job for.
As far as I know, neither Cincy nor K-State were every put on probation under Huggins. Yeah - he got some sketchy recruits and had a poor graduation rate, but he successfully resurrected two programs that had basically been dead. To my understanding, he is a basketball coach and - whether good or bad - his job is to win; otherwise, he doesn't have a job! Granted, there are other factors that must be considered other than just winning, but if results don't show up on the court, it doesn't matter how nice you are, I would want you looking for another position.
Huggins is one of the best recruiters and in-game coaches in the country. I would absolutely take him over Belein b/c the guy is a winner. Having said that, I would make sure that compliance people were on his ass constantly and looking at his every move. I would make sure he is running the cleanest bball program in the country, but was given the resources necessary to win.
Neg away...this is my opinion and I know it won't be popular with the pro-Belein bloc. Nevertheless, I want to play by the rules and win...have competitive and fierce teams that make the opposing teams' sh*t their pants b/c of how tough we are. WVU is that team now with Huggy. However, watching Belien's teams at WVU and UM was/is like watching the ballet.
Do "the rules" include, at a bare minimum, pretending that academics are important and pushing kids to go to class and graduate? What about having a coach who sets the wonderful example of driving so drunk that he actually pukes out the window during his DUI arrest? If all you care about is wins, just start cheering for Kentucky; they have a coach who's right up your alley
I honestly don't know and it's an issue that I debate with sometimes. Is the job of the coach to ensure that players are going to class and on track to graduate? Or, is the job of the coach to help them win and get a few of those players into the pros or international leagues? i would like to think the coach is doing both - but, honestly, I'm not sure if the top coaches are these days.
I'll use Kansas as an example. I love Bill Self. He has been an incredible coach since taking over for Roy and has taken KU to new heights that Roy never could. I liked Roy too when he was there, but Self won an NC - and I like my teams to win champioinships.
Now, under Bill Self, KU has had more recruiting and in-house violations that any other team. They may not have had to the same degree as a few teams, but they have tested the boundaries and scope of the NCAA rulebook more than any team the last 6-7 years.
Bill Self does not graduate most of his players. Most rarely go to class and - in fact - several have "tutors" that will help them get through school (ala by doing their work for them!). Now, the fact of the matter is, players do not go to KU for the academics or to get a degree from the LSA in Communications. Much like Kentucky, UCLA, and others, KU gets players that want to get to the pros and get there preferably sooner rather than later. Essentially, their job as "student athletes" is to nurture the skill set necessary to make it to the NBA or development league or international league...and Bill Self will certainly get them to do that.
So I guess I'm partially torn. Would I rather have my players reading Shakespeare and rating an Econ memo, or would I rather have them pursuing their life's dream of making it to some higher level of play...where they are getting paid for their game. Should the coach recognize what their end goal is and help them get there, or should he get them a diploma that will likely not carry the same dollars-and-cents that a professional career would or could?
Now, maybe it's because I'm from Kansas where our players come in with the intent of going pro. I suppose at UM there aren't too many lottery picks year-in and year-out. As such, I don't mind what Bill Self has done. He is getting players to the next level, helping them achieve their dream, and doing so with pretty sketchy recruiting methods and a wretched graduation rate.
You make good points, but we just see things differently. I guess I don't believe that preparing kids to make it to the next level and making sure they go to class and graduate are mutually exclusive.
I agree that for a lot of college athletes, their ultimate dream is to become professional athletes. Unfortunately, the reality is that most of them will never make it. Even if they do make it, pro careers are often very short. I'm not saying that athletes should be required to take pre-med courses, but some of these coaches, and schools, are completely failing to prepare these kids for a life outside of professional sports.
KU was pretty damn clean under Williams (I went there when he was there). The worst thing you could say was that guys were managing to stay eligible when they almost certainly weren't performing well academically, but I think you can likely say that about any major program.
KU was farrrrrrr from clean under William - KU just never got caught under Roy. That is a huge difference. KU graduated many players under Williams' tenure that never went to class. Also, Williams is a notoriously dirty recruiter...just ask Delvon Roe at MSU what it was like to be recruited by ol Roy, or other high profile players
What happened?
Self "has taken KU to new heights that Roy never could"?
Really?
It seems like Roy's done a pretty good job at UNC. I think he's capable of coaching a national championship team.
I'd take Williams over Self, for both on-the-court and off-the-court reasons.
i was referring to KU specifically. Roy never won an NC. Self did. Hence, self took the program to heights not seen for about 20 years. I think Roy is a great coach and has done a great job at UNC. Would I take him over Self? Nope...
is that, with the exception of the year he lost to U of M in the Final Four, his teams constantly underacheived in the NCAA tournament.
if you thought the Dorsey shit storm was big...
As much as I want to win, I want to do it the right way with good kids. Huggins recruits a bunch of 1 and done players, and/or players that are great but can't get into other schools because of a)grades or b) sketchy past. I don't want that kind of program, and on top of it, as many others have said, he is not a good guy himself. He may win games, but so do other coaches like Izzo and Coach K and they do it the right way, not the huggy bear (i don't graduate anyone) way. I would honestly rather have Bobby Knight than this guy, so my answer is Beilein all day.
I actually enjoy watching Beilein's system. It just hurts to watch right now because the shots aren't falling. Much like Rodriguez's offense which is horribly painful to watch when it's not clicking. When both offenses are "on" they are really fun.
Beilein is going to get Michigan into the tourney again; his teams play hard and he's doing fine recruiting. Give him some time. Selfishly, however, I do want Huggins to be the Head Coach for another school: my St. John's Redmen. I'd also take Billy Donovan or Jeff Capel. Yea, I'm realistic...