This tweet was just retweeted by Tremendous Twitter account. Glad to see the maturity in this young man. Hope he is right.
Would like to apologize to our fans, alum, UofM, and all of wolverine nation for the performance displayed lastnight. Will not happen again.
— Tim Hardaway (@t_hard10) February 13, 2013
I think it's it rather sad
Ditto
Ditto. Even sadder are the people who feel they're owed an apology/explanation.
Maybe from professional athletes, maybe. Though at that level I'd say stop buying tickets/shirts/jerseys and cancel your cable if you're that upset with it.
At the college level, a bunch of 18 - 22 year olds putting in 80+ hours a week of work owe nobody an apology or an explanation.
I agree/disagree...
Yes, it's sad that 18-22 year old kids should have to apologize for their performance. They definitely shouldn't be held to the same standard as those who are getting paid to play.
But, it's a credit to him for making the statement...and taking responsibility for what was, at best, a very flat performance by the team. I'm sure Coach B is holding them accountable for their lack of effort...and maybe THJ felt the need to make a public statement as a way of motivating his teammates.
That being said, I still think that this team has the ability to make some noise in March (and maybe in April?!?).
I don't think it
was a pronounced lack of effort, simply fatigue. That game was the perfect example of wrong place/wrong time. That was the finale of one of the most brutal streches of conference ball I can remember. I did not think they would beat State before the Wisconsin game, and after the Wisconsin game I was virtually certain there was no chance. That game was a morale breaker, and the second of two really tough overtime games. Michigan simply had no more "primetime energy" left. They have been under the spotlight of the sporting world for the like 3 weeks. Michigan was flat out dog tired and MSU made everything they shot. All that game means in that Staee fans are going to be brutal until we beat them at Crisler, nothing more. This team is still good, this team is still a contender.
The fatigue excuse is cliche...
and I just don't think it was a huge factor in this loss. The Wisconsin game being a morale breaker is certainly a possiblity but we all saw that coming. And you don't think other teams are tired? It's not like they play games on back to back days. If these kids want to play in the NBA they'll often have twice as many games per week as they do now, against much tougher competition. I'm not trying to be overly critical, but I just think fatigue had less to do with it than GRIII and Stauskus getting frazzled in the face of much stiffer and bolder competitors, as well as THJ going ice cold from the field
"That's right. It's an off-tackle play. It's coming right over you. And there's not a thing you can do about it."
okay, failing to see how a direct response to another comment
is offtopic but i guess i should have seen it coming
"That's right. It's an off-tackle play. It's coming right over you. And there's not a thing you can do about it."
Why people downvote when they disagree
Is beyond me. I think you are wrong and that fatigue is a factor, however there is no reason you should get downvoted. Your opinion is equally valid
You can be blue and still be green
There is
such a thing as mental fatigue. You can only convince yourself so many times that this is "the biggest game." They have been doing that for weeks now. You cannot find three more difficult places to play than Assembly, Kohl and Breslin. Michigan has had like 3 basketball superbowls aleady this year. They televised the introductions at Indiana for crying out loud. They did not have enough in the tank for this game. I am telling you, throw last night in the garbage and then take the garbage out to the road, then have it run over by a semi. It is an outlier. We are going to run Staee at home just they ran us at their place.
Michigan needed a cupcake last night. They needed a breather. They got the opposite. It was very unfortunate timing. They are fine.
He should apologize.
Not for the loss, but for ignoring Bellein's suggestion that he go work on his shot at halftime. That is worth an apology.
"Everyone gets dumped Gabe. Let me give you some advice: a little coverup on your Adams Apple will make it appear smaller. Which will make you appear less like a transvestite."
I don't disagree with anything you said, however
we all know there are players who thrive in adverse circumstances. Players who love nothing more than to go into an opposing teams house and rip their heart out. I understand they are not the norm and I think my personal frustration is the slow realization that we don't have many of those right now. I don't care what the reason is. I don't care that some of these players might, in the future, develop that quality. I don't dislike this team or its players. I don't blame John Beilein. I don't want to bench players or do anything drastic. I am just dissapointed that our team has demonstrated the opposite. And the way it has transpired, with this repeat "theme" being revealed on national TV against our biggest opponents, has made this exposure more public, which probably enhances my emotional response.
They seem to need a nice comfy environment and they don't want to play someone who gets in their face. I find that mildly annoying. I actually think THJ wants to be the guy to carry the load when the chips are down and I love him for it. Under the circumstances, I am prouder of his 1-11 than I am anyone else, save Burke. His apology is awesome and I love it. We don't need it and we don't deserve it, but that makes it even more admirable in my opinion.
"close your mouth and open your mind" - Al Borges
For some reason
your post got me to thinking (again) about what an ass Dan Dakich is.
go blue
I don't disagree with anything you said, however
we all know there are players who thrive in adverse circumstances. Players who love nothing more than to go into an opposing teams house and rip their heart out. I understand they are not the norm and I think my personal frustration is the slow realization that we don't have many of those right now. I don't care what the reason is. I don't care that some of these players might, in the future, develop that quality. I don't dislike this team or its players. I don't blame John Beilein. I don't want to bench players or do anything drastic. I am just dissapointed that our team has demonstrated the opposite. And the way it has transpired, with this repeat "theme" being revealed on national TV against our biggest opponents, has made this exposure more public, which probably enhances my emotional response.
They seem to need a nice comfy environment and they don't want to play someone who gets in their face. I find that mildly annoying. I actually think THJ wants to be the guy to carry the load when the chips are down and I love him for it. Under the circumstances, I am prouder of his 1-11 than I am anyone else, save Burke. His apology is awesome and I love it. We don't need it and we don't deserve it, but that makes it even more admirable in my opinion.
"close your mouth and open your mind" - Al Borges
Agree / Disagree
I agree that our biggest problem is the freshman crapping the bed when a truly aggresive & physical defense gets up in their face.
Howeva* 3/5 of our starters last night were true freshman. Playing four top 25 teams in 11 days, 3 of them on the road, is pretty grueling if you're not used to it (even if you are). Sure, in high school you play two games a week. You also have about 20 minutes of travel to those games.
What was the record of that same MSU team when they had to play a lot of underclassman in 2010 - 2011? 19 - 15.
It takes direct-to-NBA talent to pull off being an elite team full of freshman. Even Kentucky had some non-freshman key contributors.
It's scary/fun that we're sitting 21-4 right now and our expectations should actually go up in '13-14 and '14-15...
* (Ref: Smith, Steven A. birth-2013)
So, we should have all seen the Wisconsin loss coming????
No, we should have won the game if it had not been for another coaching blunder by Beilien.
And, to top off his coaching issues he continually plays the freshmen when he has a senior in Vogrich that has played the last two seasons yet sits on the bench game in and game out. What a loss of leadership and experience. Some of JB's decisions are pathetic at best.
I am dreaming so I can pretty much say anything and get away with it. So, I think I'll say, from my heart, kiss my ass....Eddie Murphy
Marquee rivalry games in
Marquee rivalry games in hostile environments are the situations in which experience makes the biggest difference. The more experience a player has, the less likely he is to be rattled by 20,000 screaming fans rooting for him to fail. And experience is the area in which this team is most lacking. That's what I chalk last night's performance up to.
It's also possible that our players just don't feel the same intensity towards the UM-MSU rivalry as MSU players do. We only have a handful of players who are actually from the State of Michigan. Only one of them, Jordan Morgan, is a starter. In addition to Morgan, Jon Horford is the only other player from the State of Michigan who plays significant minutes. In contrast, fully half of MSU's roster is from the State of Michigan. I would guess that guys like Keith Appling and Derrick Nix have a lot more built up resentment against U-M than guys like Trey Burke and Tim Hardaway have against MSU. Now, I'm confident that Beilein will fix that problem and eventually bring Michigan's in-state recruiting back to parity with MSU. But they've dominated us in local recruiting for so long that it will take some time for us to regain our foothold at top basketball schools like Pershing and Flint Northwestern.
Having said all that, THJr's apology shows that he's mature beyond his years.
There's a difference between something that's "owed"
and an expectation. No, the player's don't owe anybody anything at all. I suppose they could go out there and lollygag up and down the court if they wanted. But in the words of someone we all hold dear, this is Michigan fergodsakes. The sports teams are expected to excel. I'm fairly sure that's precisely the reason why these players came here, or else they'd just go to Grambling where there would be no pressure and they wouldn't have to worry about underperforming. I don't think THJ should feel the need to apologize because of pressure from the fans, but I do think it's good that he recognizes the team failed on an epic level last night and that people expect much better than this.
"That's right. It's an off-tackle play. It's coming right over you. And there's not a thing you can do about it."
I agree
He should be playing for himself and his teamates, which I'm sure he is. They're competitive enough that they don't need extra pressure.
That's it? Just him and his
That's it? Just him and his teammates? Not the players who came before him? Not the students? Not the alums who support the program?
C'mon man. He didn't need to apologize (and nobody is saying he needed to), but he was venting his frustrations in a positive way. The team played weak, soft, wtihout heart. They should feel bad, just like any other competitive people would who performed well below their abilities. Good for him to "man up" and move forward.
As a wise man once said, "This is Michigan". And "Michigan", isn't just the guys on the team at that moment in time.
spot on
it's called being a team leader. i hope he even becomes more vocal and pushes the younger players.
Why is that sad? I would feel
Why is that sad? I would feel the need to apologize as well. It probably made him feel better.
They don't play in an empty
They don't play in an empty gym. They don't play for free. And they don't play just for themselves, they play for the name on the jersey and as THJ aptly put it, a "nation" that is much bigger than the players. There's nothing wrong with taking pride in being part of that family, nor is there anything wrong with apologizing to other members of the family.
Don't put up some straw man that Tim is giving in to "demands" from fans for an apology. Nobody's doing that. He wanted to take ownership of his performance, and he did. I like it, and I think it bodes well for his and the team's future performance.
"They don't play for
"They don't play for free."
Actually, they basically do. Sure, you can place value on the scholarship they receive but, let's not get it twisted, these kids are amateurs and students. He doesn't owe anyone but his coach an apology. Period. He didn't do anything questionable, harm society or anything like that. He didn't win a basketball game.
Touchdown Michigan!
No they actually receive a
No they actually receive a scholarship and loads of benefits that go with it. It's the opposite of free
Go Blue!
Actual Research
Here is some actual research on the topic you might want to read: http://www.ncpanow.org/research?id=0024
In short, these guys are not getting even close to what they would on the open market, they live just above the poverty line, and end up owing money because the scholarship does not cover everything.
See here:
"- Duke basketball players were valued at $1,025,656 while living just $732 above the poverty line and a scholarship shortfall of $1,995."
Bottom line: They are giving a massive gift to the university by doing what they do.
So apparently all college students live below the poverty line?
That's what I'm getting out of this. Plus, the vast majority of players even in the revenue sports would garner almost nothing on the open market. It's just the big timers like Burke and Denard. And what those guys get is exposure and access to 110,000k stadiums and multi-million dollar training facilities. They COULD go play in Europe if they wanted...
"That's right. It's an off-tackle play. It's coming right over you. And there's not a thing you can do about it."
Basketball players maybe, but
Basketball players maybe, but not football players. And it's not like hockey, where these kids are balancing a minor league or Euro contract against CBB. Recruiting, and the general current structure all but channels them into CBB, especially ever since the NBA stopped allowing HS basketball players go pro.
Touchdown Michigan!
Agreed
You should have seen the hordes that followed me to my tests. And the Grade Selection Show at the end of the semesters?
I can't believe I had to pay for that.
Poverty Line?
Whatever the "poverty line" is, it's pretty much irrelevant when you live on campus and all your food & housing is taken care of. College athletes also have plenty of (albeit school branded) clothes as well as medical & health care. They travel for free. And have ample resources available to them in terms of rec centers, libraries, tutors, etc
Frankly, other than tattoos, it's hard to fathom what a college athlete would need any money for.
Are you really suggesting
Are you really suggesting that the standard by which we should judge this is whether or not YOU can fathom what someone would need money for?
I'm shocked that you haven't be selected as supreme decider of what people need. This would solve a lot of the world's problems.
Lighten Up
I think he's just saying that the lifestyle that college basketball players lead doesn't equate to the lifestyle of most people truly in poverty. You can certainly want more than food, shelter, clothing and healthcare, but you don't really need it. That having been said, given what schools get from them, I'd say the schools are getting a pretty good deal
You can be blue and still be green
BUt what he fails to
BUt what he fails to acknowledge is that many of these athletes come from impoverished backgrounds. So while they have enough food and shelter in college, many of their families live below the poverty line.
Touchdown Michigan!
That would only be true if
That would only be true if the university was bringing nothing to the table. There are already developmental leagues and lower level leagues (especially overseas) if any player feels like they are not fairly compensated (good luck with that). Theses kids get scholarships and top level coaching not available elsewhere. To say that these players are exploited in any way is just not honest.
I didn't mean to start a
I didn't mean to start a debate about whether college athletes should be paid (I happen to think that they should). I only meant that it's not unreasonable for THJ to feel some responsibility above and beyond his immediate team members and coach because, among many other reasons (this is a relatively minor one, imo), he's getting a benefit from the university (a benefit that most students don't get). That's all.
Again, I'm not saying he owes anyone an apology. Just saying it's not crazy (and in fact, it speaks well of him) that he feels bad for the fans, alums, etc., who root like crazy for his team.
^^^ I blame Budaseal ^^^
for unleashing the threadjack
in which I participated :)
I have yet to see one marched to the middle of the court
with a gun.
Don't ask what I think should have happened to the first person that thought political and science looked good next to one another.
May you have a strong foundation
When the winds of changes shift
I have a 529 plan for my kids
I have a 529 plan for my kids that is more than $100,000 behind where it needs to be in time for college, that stands as evidence that "they don't play for free".
M'Dog
You're confused. I don't
You're confused. I don't think I've seen any fan demand that THJ apologizes, but it is nice that he did.
HAIL.
Exactly. No one demanded it
Exactly. No one demanded it and nobody should. But it's nice that he did and it's nice that he sees himself as connected to more people in the Michigan family than just his teammates and coach.
No. You can make a good
No. You can make a good argument that they play for compensation well below true value but really you can't make the argument they play for free. As others have pointed out, they get over $100,000 worth of easily tracked benefit and a large amount of "compensation" for other things. They would not get these things if they did not play (and were very good at) basketball.
I agree that THJ doesn't owe an apology to anyone (for one, he has been playing lights out this year) but don't make this into a "he should not feel any obligation because he plays for free" argument.
I hate this debate....
Let me ask you this:
Did you (or perhaps your parents as it may be) consider your university tuition, housing, meals, travel etc while attending univeristy free? I can tell you that when I was paying my student loan back it certainly didn't feel "free" to me.
Lots of these guys are out of state guys. Now I'm no expert on UM, but in Canada out of province tuition is a lot more than people from the province. I wouldn't doubt that between tuition and living expenses these guys are getting more than 50,000.00 per year. That is 200,000.00 for a four year player. Is that what you would consider free? That sounds like a good chunk of money to me.
In this economic environment there are plenty people out there that are trying to raise families on less than that and yet still we have people that make the asertion that these guys play for free. Whether they could make more money in a different environment is beside the point, saying they play for free is absolutely false.
Now I am not saying anything about THJ and his need to express an apology. I don't think he needs to but if he wants to, fine. I just hate this debate about whether or not college athletes play for free.
He didn't have to apologize.
He didn't have to apologize.
I got the shotgun. You got the briefcase. It's all in the game though, right?
sports exist in the capacity
sports exist in the capacity they do because of fans. Pro players would not have $100m contracts and endorsement deals if it wasn't for fans wanting to watch the sports they play. THJ would not get a free education and the chance to play pro basketball of it wasn't for the fact that u of m fans and alumni enjoy watching other people play the sport of basketball. If it wasn't for fans every game would be just another pick-up game. IMO, teams and players who have bad performances have a duty to apologize to the fans who make it possible for them to make a living playing a game.
Soon to be the #1 fitness and training center in AA
No, screw you
That's the David Stern argument that's full of shit. Players have bad games. There are no exceptions. Why apologize for that?
People pay to watch the sport; SOMEONE has to lose. Sometimes the loss is by a wide margin. These are 18-year-old kids playing on a big stage who are physically and mentally drained. Take your self-righteous attitude and cram it up your butt.
No excuses. Play like a champion.
well, then david stern is
well, then david stern is correct and you are just plain wrong. My statement was not incorrect, and if you want it to be incorrect then go back to the 1891 basketball was just starting and there were no such things as fans.....when the players played for fun and not for money. But they earn money playing this game because fans exist for the owners to make money off of.
Soon to be the #1 fitness and training center in AA
I find nothing sad about it
THJ offered this apology up on his own. Nobody asked him for it, but he felt that he had to make a statement. This is leadership at its best. I find this to be a lot more inspirational than sad.
Shades of Tim Tebow? National
Shades of Tim Tebow? National Championship run in the cards?
Hopefully this will be the
Hopefully this will be the kind of thing that will carry us moving forward.
Greetings from Bolivia.
"It's special how the real true people hang together. And if you don't support the program you're not a true Michigan guy. It's that simple." - Gary Moeller
It's okay THJ
We still l<3ve you
How many times have you been on the freeway and had someone fly by you at 100 mph then end up 2 cars ahead of you at the off ramp? What's the point? -Mark Harmon
He Should
He should apologize. Every single person on that team should apologize. Including the coaches. They lost the Big Ten title last night. I hope they're happy.
Walmart Wolverines are OK in my book!
Sir or Madam, I believe the
Sir or Madam, I believe the team with the best record over 16 conference games wins the Big Ten title.
I think it's it rather sad that a college kid feels the need to apologize to alumni for a poor performance.
The Team, The Team, The Team.