Jake Long gave up one sack in his final year. That's the standard.
Taylor Lewan - "always somebody better that came before you"
Fuck that's impressive.
He would also need to limit penalties.
Sack total drops to zero when only considering players not roided out of their minds.
For those who didn't know. Roids? What roids?
The first picture is of Will Gholston.
The last two pictures are of Vernon Gholston.
Let that be a lesson, then, kids. Steroids may change your physique but they can also alter your identity.
Look what happened to Brady; roids, maybe? You be the judge...
Let's just call them both Tom and be done with it.
Here's a photo of Vernon Gholston in high school:
It's a small photo, but he certianly appears to have grown some new arm veins in his time at Ohio.
I gained 30 pounds throughout my 4 years of lifting at Michigan. I must have been on roids too....
Did you have PED rumors surrounding your time in college? Put up surprisingly small numbers at the NFL combine when there was a different set of procedures and tests?
And then did you become a huge bust in the NFL under that set of PED tests?
Because if you did I'd say you may have been on Roids in college.
it was a relatively brutal one during The Horror. Could be wrong though.
You recall incorrectly, it came against Ohio.
was a corner blitz that I am remembering against Appy then. I just know that somebody coming from the left side decleated Chad Henne at some point during the first half of that game.
I thought I read Long only gave up 4 sacks in his Michigan career. Can anyone confirm this? I am still looking for link.
Taylor Lewan is the best ever if he has 20 pancakes, Fitz (or starting RB) has 1,500 rushing yds, Devin has 3,000 passing yds, we win the B1G championship, and we win the Rose Bowl. Oh, and if he doesn't go pro..
i hope i am wrong, but i think he is going pro this year
i do think if he stays for his senior year he could reach a jake long level, though
would need a good year out of devin and a solid running back for it to be noticed, though
The new rookie salary structure in the NFL financially weighs against his staying. While Long stayed an extra year, being drafted #1 landed him a huge contract (5 years/$57 million, with $30 million guaranteed). Compare that to Luck's contract this past year of 4 years/$22.1 million, (all guaranteed).
Under the new CBA, it's the second contract, signed after the 4th or 5th year, that really breaks the bank. There's much less of a difference in being picked first vs. being picked 10th (in 2007 it was $57 million vs. $18 million; in 2012, it was $22 million vs. $12 million). There's incentive for Lewan to get to his second contract as soon as possible. (All this is dependent on him being rated a top 10-15 pick). If he's not rated one of the top 2-3 OTs, then he should think about coming back.
As an aside, there was a good Grantland article about how picking Megatron, Suh, and Stafford under the old system had totally screwed up the Lions salary cap.
Grantland article: http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8676418/detro-albatross-contracts-rest-week-12-news
The bad news, though, is that the Lions were the last team to be truly hit by the loser's curse of perennially grabbing top-five picks under the old CBA. The rookie contracts of Detroit's big three — Stafford, Calvin Johnson, and Ndamukong Suh — produced about $108 million in combined guarantees on the day they were drafted. If a team like the Colts had three top-five picks in three years today, those picks would only cost about $60 million in guarantees and have far less onerous terms at the end of the (shorter) contracts. When the final year of Johnson's deal tied the Lions up with a $24 million cap hold this offseason and threatened to create a situation in which the Lions wouldn't have been able to franchise2 Johnson the following year, they were stuck with no leverage and forced to give Megatron a deal that guaranteed him $60 million, a 20 percent jump on the guaranteed cash given to previous record receiver Larry Fitzgerald. The extensions that Stafford and Suh are likely to receive in the near future will likely be of similar size, guaranteeing Detroit's stars around $180 million while preventing the Lions from building up the rest of their roster.
Jake Long played perfect football for 2 full years. The 1 sack he gave up Senior Year was on a frosh Mallet. Lewan could definitely reach Long's level next year but he will not surpass him.
I don't think the fact that it was Mallett really changes anything. He still was beaten pretty badly, and it's not like Mallett held onto the ball for 15 seconds.
I don't remember the situation, but what if it was one of those "this guy needs a nasty blindside hit to set him straight and I'm just the guy for the job....indirectly" sacks? Not out of the question with Mallett.
I would certainly hope not.
In fact, I'd hope such a thing never happens.
If I remember correctly, it was Vernon Gholston in a game against OSU. I doubt Jake Long would allow the team's biggest rival to hit his quarterback just to teach the QB a lesson.
I think this is the one we're talking about; it was Henne, not Mallet.
No, it was a sack... But I do think it was Henne, not Mallett, who got sacked.
EDIT: It's at the 3:45 mark of this video. And it was Henne, not Mallett.
Ah. Thank you for spelling it out slowly for me--I for some reason I found the evidence of Long getting blown up and was thinking "this must be it!" I am a moran. A dum, dum, moran. I attribute it to being Friday. Here's a completely offtopic kitten for putting up with me:
Long was the best I can imagine. I walked past him once and just shook at the size of the man and reports said no one worked harder.
And yeah Taylor is playing with a different o-line and without the leading rusher in U of M history behind him (Lond definitely had something to do with that but I still had some "wow" moments with Hart) but his words still put a little onion in my eye. This tradition is really something special.
It's gonna be a big switch going to the NFL and battling with the likes of Aldon Smith, Terrell Suggs, James Harrison, Jason Pierre Paul, Demarcus Ware, Von Miller, Jared Allen and their like. I'm sure Taylor is weighing very carefully if now is the time to take that step or not. I think he'll be a great NFL Tackle, though, and I'm sure he's gonna love to compete with those pass rushing beasts. He can go this year, and likely be the first lineman taken, but I wouldn't say him leaving is a guarantee. Wouldn't surprise me if he goes, wouldn't surprise me if he stays. Article really got me thinking about it.
Whenever a young player is billed as the next whatever, it's rare that they ever fully live up that expectation. I'm very proud of what Lewan has become both as a player and team leader.
No other UM offensive lineman has ever ridden a twosie.
It is tough to compare to Jake Long as he still stands as the only offensive lineman in history to go number 1 overall in the draft. I am not sure that Lewan can live up to that, but then again who can? I will say that Lewan is one of the best offensive lineman we have ever had and that is a very presitgious group of people coming from Michigan. He is now the second person in a row to wear 77 and earn first team all American honors.
you should check your facts before posting...Orlando Pace went #1 in 1997
My mistake don't know what I was thinking. None the less it is a very rare and impressive feat
There's been a few tackles drafted #1. Orlando Pace comes to mind.
jonathan ogden was #1 overall I think. Ravens got Ogden and ray lewis in the same draft, that's pretty incredible.
And let's not forget Ron Yary out of USC!
Long was a more dominant run blocker. That's the biggest area where Lewan needs to improve if he wants to reach Long's level; not that he doesn't have the talent, but he needs to be more consistent. And I think Lewan could afford to add another 5-10 lbs.
Of course, that's if he comes back...
Lewan vs. Clowney has to be one of the most intriguing 1-on-1 matchups this bowl season, doesn't it? Taylor probably has much to gain and (given Clowney's high profile) not *too* much to lose.
Being that he'll be facing that sort of beast every weekend in the NFL, I'd say he has plenty to lose.
Eh, Clowney is probably better than a lot of NFL defensive ends right now.
I was going to say the same thing. If Lewan holds up well or neutralizes Clowney for much of the game I would say he is ready and goes on to the NFL and I would not blame him.
I haven't read the article, but that's a very wise observation by Lewan. It is very difficult not to compare yourself to others. Ultimately, you have to be the best that you can be, in the context of the team you are part of.
Comparison of player A to player B is a fun pasttime. Records give some sense and ability to do this. However, there are too many variables for comparisons to work purely. In this case, it has to do with the play of the rest of the offensive line, and the ability of our current running backs. Comparison of Lewan to Long also really is affected by the play of the rest of the offense, and by the caliber of the defenses played against in a particular set of games.
Regardless, we can all agree that Lewan has been a good one, and is following great footsteps in not only Jake Long, but other tackles who have been part of MIchigan's tradition.
Lewan vs Clowney will be a great matchup as long as Clowney is fully healthy. From what they've said on espn he's been dealing with a nagging foot injury that has caused him to lose a step. Could require surgery at the end of the season. Hopefully the time off before the bowl game gets Clowney close to 100% so we can get a true assessment.
I want the best chance to win.
We don't even know what kind of boo-boo Lewan has had for a good part of the season.
That's just ESPN setting up an excuse for an SEC player.
had a false start in three seasons? I think that is impressive.
not give up any sacks one year (as a guard)?
I want a win also but since were comparing Lewan to Jake Long I hope Clowney is a 100% so we can see how good Taylor really is. Hypothetically speaking I would expect Long to completely shutdown Clowney. He was just a different kind of animal out on the field.
Taylor still tends to go on stretches of dumb penalties which I don't ever recall Jake doing. Either way, he's still a 1st rounder and is darn impressive but I don't know how you can be better than the #1 overall pick unless he gets so much better that he also goes #1
That stretch of dumb penalties included all of 2010...none of 2011...and all of 2012.
What would Taylor Lewan have to do in his senior year, should he return, to become the greatest ever?
Making Jadaveon Clowney look foolish in the Outback Bowl would be a good start.
The mere fact that we're having this conversation speaks volumes about how good Lewan is.
I would live it if he took someone out of the field a la Michael Oher. I know he would get a penalty on the play, but it would be awesome to see.
As an aside, I was watching a Dolphins game earlier this season (yes, I'm a glutton for punishment) and Long looked like he was struggling a bit -- is he injured?
and was put on IR, so he's out for the season. No idea if he was hurt before that.
I believe that knee has been bothering him for a while. He's been on the injury report for several weeks, IIRC.
Thanks for the info.
It was the Thursday night game a few weeks back (11/15 vs. Buffalo) and he got beat on a couple of plays (once a bull rush right at him) that just seemed so out-of-place for him.
All of this Jake Long being the greatest O-lineman in our history is a little short sighted. Did we forget both Hutchinson and Backus? I think that is what Taylor is saying. Here at UofM there have always been great players that have come before you. You cannot judge yourself off of them, you have to be the best you can be. Backus and Hutchinson have gone on to have unbelievable NFL careers. Long is coming off of a very mediocre year. I think Long is one of the best to come out of UofM, I just think Backus and Hutchinson have to be thrown in that discussion. There are likely more before them, those are just the ones I have actually seen play.
Dan Dierdorf too. He is in that Hall of Fame thingy. Might have been pretty good.
How about we all agree that we have been lucky to watch some phenomenal offensive line play over the years? It didn't start with Jake Long (who is awesome).
Bubba Paris and Jumbo Elliott
Steve Everitt was an outstanding, legendarily tough Center at Michigan before being a first round draft pick for Cleveland
The strength of michigans best teams has always been the ofensive line. It has been an NFL factory since Bo's arrival. From Lewan,Long,Backus,Hutchinson,Jensen,Runyan,Dierdorf,Jumbo Elliott,Jon Giesler,and Jim Brandstatter all played a bit at Tackle and were all pretty successful dudes. Also Les Miles was an offensive lineman but I dont know what position he played or if he played lol.
Skrepenak, Humphries, Big Ed Muransky
Did you just compare Jeff Backus to Jake Long? Uh, not even close. I'd take Long everytime. Backus was a very, very good lineman, but he's not Jake Long, and his NFL career has only been above average. His durability has been better than his play.
And I think we're mistaken to lump "linemen" into one categroy. An OG is as different from an OT as a slot TE is from a flanker. Jake Long may very well be the best OT Michigan has ever had; Hutch might have the edge on best lineman.
But Lewan's point is well-taken: there is a LONG (see what I did there?) list of players who should be in this conversation.
To answer the OP's question: 0 sacks, dominant run-blocking on the left side, 1 or fewer penalties.
the All American and Hall of Fame Wistart brothers. They just learned their history with the new honorary jerseys and no one came before them.
you can't take the time to spell Wistert correctly?
While I gree that Jake Long was amazing and perhaps the best ever at Michigan, I think that is thrown around a bit too easily considering the long legacy of great OL that played here. We all remember Long, he had a great career, and data/info is so much easier to collect now that it makes him seem all-worldly.
So let's take a minute to discuss other great OL from past years:
- Jon Jansen - Two-time captain, all american, started 50 games, good NFL career
- Jeff Backus - amazing longevity in the NFL
- Jon Runyan - a BEAST for years in the NFL
- Steve Hutchinson - not a tackle, but one of the best guards in the last 20 years of the NFL
- Maurice Williams - non-descript at Michigan, had a great NFL career
- Jumbo Elliot - first round pick with 15 year career in NFL
- Dan Dierdorf - hall of famer
- Mike Kenn - first round pick with 17 year career in NFL
Here's a list I found randomly on the web, most of the guys I know little about:
Consensus first team All-American 1971, College Football HOF, drafted 27th overall in '72 by Buffalo, where he was the leader of the offensive line that paved the way for OJ Simpson to be the first RB to gain 2,000 yds in a season in '73. He was first team All-NFL in '73 and '74.
Not only that, but Reggie was a member of the Den of the Mellow Men:
Most of the bloggers here were too young or were not in existence to remember the early 70s, less the mid and late 70s.
I was a bit too young to remember Reggie. Did not get the Michigan football bug until I turned 8 in 1972!
Friend of mine works at a school. One of the baseball players at the school is a good friend of Lewan's and he said he is gone.
I'm just saying...I could give 2 fucks about pancakes, sacks, draft status, etc bull shit, blah blah blah.
the nostalgic images of my childhood, but based totally on the eye test, Long was a much better player than Lewan is. Lewan is great, but Long went number one in the draft for a reason..
As the #1 draft pick, Long was clearly one of the best
Does anyone remember the biggest Left Tackle BUST in the NFL draft? Drafted number 2 overall before a number of future Hall of Fame players. Attended (graduated?) one of our favorite B1G sister schools.
Ill give them a hint...... was even on the cover of Sports Illustrated, and was a horse steriod taking Canadian.
Because he was more signable and demanded less money than Matt Ryan? Also, that year was terrible for QB's. Not saying Jake was underserving, but there were other factors to consider as to why he went #1. Going #1 overall does not mean you were the best lineman, err OT, in UofM's history. If he would have left a year early, he would have been the #2 OT on the board behind Joe Thomas. Hence, the reason he stayed for his senior year.