The Tate Forcier Dilemma
Angelique Chengelis tweeted yesterday that Tate Forcier is attempting to schedule a meeting with the Michigan staff, to try to get eligible and re-instated. Rivals reported that Tate’s father, Mike Forcier, has flown to Michigan from California.
When Forcier was kicked off the team prior to the Gator Bowl, the official explanation was that he “did not meet University standards.” Most people assumed that he flunked out, but neither Forcier nor the university itself actually said that, and there are many ways (besides merely a poor GPA) that one can fail to meet standards.
I am not going to list the possibilities, but let’s just say that I think it’s something worse than merely getting a surprise D, where he needed a C to stay eligible. Your dad doesn’t need to fly all the way to Michigan to meet with the school, when that is the sole explanation.
Michigan’s dilemma, assuming Forcier’s infraction is capable of being remedied, is whether to take him up on it. Despite his obvious talents on the field, Forcier is a bit of a drama queen: he attracts attention for the wrong reasons. Unfortunately, players who do that tend to keep doing it. If he somehow makes it back onto the team, you’ll always wonder when the other shoe is going to drop.
But Michigan’s well of quarterbacks is very close to running dry. There are just two scholarship QBs on the roster, one of whom is a transfer risk, and there are none (as yet) committed for 2011. You have to figure that anyone Hoke recruits at this late date will be, at best, a “project,” and nowhere near ready to play Division I football if Denard or Devin goes down.
Amazingly, not a day goes by without someone suggesting that Denard should move to another position, apparently assuming that Devin Gardner as a first-year starter will be better than Denard as a junior, and ignoring the question of who would play if Gardner gets injured or doesn’t work out. Even if you believe Gardner wins the job eventually, the outcome isn’t such a foregone conclusion that you could afford to have Robinson moonlighting at other positions: QB is a hard enough position to master when it is all you do, much less when you’re splitting time at slot, wide receiver, wildcat, or whatever else people think Denard would play.
But even assuming that Denard stays at Michigan as a quarterback, two experienced guys plus a middling three-star rookie isn’t enough. All of which says that Michigan probably needs Tate Forcier around, drama and all, if his unspecified infraction is at all capable of being atoned for.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:30 PM ^
I'm not touching that topic with a 10-foot pole and suggest others follow this lead. Too much speculation about a kid's personal situation - no good can come of this thread.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:31 PM ^
seconded times infinity
January 13th, 2011 at 5:28 PM ^
...but it kind of makes me wish Kevin Sousa would reconsider, if the offer still stands.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:34 PM ^
and refrain from speculating on the cause of his not being with the team, then it's a legitimate question, I think.
My answer would be: if he's eligible and he is willing to do what the new coaching staff asks, then yeah, you take him back.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:41 PM ^
I agree on staying away. It's good info. that he's meeting with the school and that his dad is flying in from Cali. The post should present this info. and leave it at that
January 13th, 2011 at 4:06 PM ^
... However, I would suggest the following:
Denard Robinson should be our starting QB until he has a full spring practice, fall camp, and regular season in Al Borges' system.
As Joe Montana and Steve Young have said many many times, it takes a FULL SEASON for a QB (Starter or Backup) to understand the basics of a West Coast offense. Pulling the plug on a QB who has had as much success as Denard without that full season would be foolish.
January 13th, 2011 at 4:31 PM ^
...Tate's dad, it's not an academic issue.
"I can tell you this — he didn't fail his classes," Mike Forcier said in the report. "I'm really not sure what's going on. I just flew into Ann Arbor to figure everything out and see how we can get this whole thing resolved."
A source told The Detroit News on Wednesday night that Forcier planned to meet with university officials this week to try to regain enrollment and eligibility.
"Tate wants to stay (at U-M)," Mike Forcier told TheWolverine. "I didn't come with a moving van. Our intent is to do whatever is necessary for him to rejoin the team and become a student-athlete again. We haven't talked to any other schools and we won't until we've exhausted every resource here. But Tate wants to stay and we want him to stay."
January 13th, 2011 at 3:30 PM ^
in short: the depth chart needs Forcier. yep. Also another reason to keep him, he truly wants to play for the team. If his willingness to stand aside and let the rise of Denard take off last year wasn't proof enough that he is capable of putting his ego away for the betterment of others, I don't know what would be. Kids struggle in college. It can be from a million reasons beyond just going to class. Many of us have been through that point in our life, many are currently there now. It's a time of transition and self discovery (no, I'm not talking about puberty) and a lot of people, myself included, fall off the horse a few times before figuring out how to ride. Cut Tate and his "drama" some slack, he's a kid and, as you stated, we need him on the roster.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:31 PM ^
all of what I just said is obviously dependent upon whether what he is in trouble for is something that can be resolved with him staying here or working his way back to the school.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:43 PM ^
...to be here, but would he walk here from San Diego?
/s
January 13th, 2011 at 3:33 PM ^
a LOT with this post while decrying assumptions made by others
January 13th, 2011 at 3:33 PM ^
Denard has to stay at QB all other options are foolish imo. I havent been a big fan of Tates antics at time, but if he can play we need him on the team for depth if nothing else. The idea of going into a season with 2 scholarship QBs is scary at best. We really need to pull a QB in this class too, even if just a project QB who has a minimal chance of ever seeing the field.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:52 PM ^
without the proper (knowledgeable) coaching, I really can't imagine denard realizing his potential. A dollar says that he does not put up (anything close to) 2500/1700 with michigan next year.
he needs a coaching staff that understands the unique talent that he is, and can continue to tailor the offense to those talents. Could Hoke & staff shoehorn him into their system? yeah. don't expect amazing results.
January 13th, 2011 at 4:26 PM ^
I hope he doesn't put up those kind of rushing numbers again. By that I mean, ideally the running game develops beyond Denard. I think expecting over 1500 rushing yards from him again is bad planning.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:35 PM ^
in these past 10 days, it is this: Don't assume all scoures know who is flying where.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:39 PM ^
flying here on a Dominos plane? That would be telling.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:41 PM ^
Obviously would love Tate back on the squad for depth concerns as he is more than serviceable but happens to be on the same team as one Denard Robinson.
As for your comments about him being a drama queen and attracting attention for all the wrong reasons I guess I just don't see it. He is what, 19, 20? The only thing that pops off the top of my head (other than academic issues) was him during the UConn game with a towel over his head, and yeah maybe not the best attitude but he is a competitor and pours hours and hours of his day into M football, and the camera crews and commentators were the ones blowing that up into a bigger deal than it was.
I wouldn't read a ton into his dad taking a 3 and a half hour flight to meet with coaches regardless of what the infraction was, whether academic or otherwise. This is a big deal for Tate and if my son was in the same situation my ass would be on a plane headed for AA as well.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:45 PM ^
He gave us a huge lift in 2009, and accepted his backup role in, albeit with some apparent frustration, in 2010. And he played well when got in.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:45 PM ^
"I'm not touching that topic with a 10-foot pole..."
I'll touch it. I'll touch it all over.
If you can get him on a path to get back on the team without compromising your integrity, you do it yesterday.
January 13th, 2011 at 5:26 PM ^
...situation, isn't it? I wonder if cross-dressing is involved somehow?
January 13th, 2011 at 3:45 PM ^
I'm currently under the assumption that tate's gone.
That said, I could see him thriving in Borges'/Hoke's scheme. Right now, he's the best pure passer we've got, and in an offense where he won't be asked to be a runner, with a solid ground game behind him, He could give us the smoothest transition to whatever the new staff has in mind.
How good Gardner is, and what systems he's most comfortable with, are the biggest unknowns.
It will be interesting to see what happens here. I'm not counting on his presence, but if Denard were to take flight, it would sure be nice to have Forcier back.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:53 PM ^
Disagree a bit. I think he could thrive in Hoke's system, but I disagree that he's the best pure passer. For what Denard lacks in passing mechanics, I think Tate lacks in decision making ability. Both this year and last, he constantly forces throws. For a guy that has been groomed his whole life to play QB, the lack of development in this area is troublesome. Sometimes he looks like a hero (hooray Illinois game!), but also results in a lot of frustration. Either way, I hope he makes it back because he is one of the beat back-ups any team could have.
January 13th, 2011 at 3:58 PM ^
Cowherd this morning took delight in mentioning that Forcier quit the team the second Hoke was announced since "the writing was on the wall" as far as his future at Michigan. Then he mentions how Hoke recruited Tate at SDSU. What a dufus. Why would the writing be on the wall when we just hired a coach that wanted the same kid 2 years ago. If anything it should be the opposite and maybe that is why Tate may try to return?
I have never emailed/called a sports talk show before. Until this morning. Wonder what blog he stole his "info" from before repeating it like a parrot for all the nation to hear?
(I know I should just not listen but I can only get FM and that is the only sports staion on FM here)
January 13th, 2011 at 4:12 PM ^
I thought the whole Tate SDSU thing was that he wasn't given any love from his local school.
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/recruiting/player-Tate-Forcier-55…
No offer from SDSU on there at least.
January 13th, 2011 at 4:26 PM ^
My Cowherd ban is just as strong as my Freep ban. He's a guy, talking to himself, for several hours a day. Fact checking isn't his strong suit.
January 13th, 2011 at 4:13 PM ^
A. You have to be dumber than a stump to flunk out of Michigan as a scholarship football player. I don't have to tell anyone here why.
B. If you are not dumb (maybe he didn't flunk out, maybe), you are most likely a lazy ass and would never be of great use to the team anyway.
Chances are slim (IMHO) that Tate amounts to much more at MICHIGAN!
January 13th, 2011 at 4:17 PM ^
Let me add, I do hope I'm wrong...
January 13th, 2011 at 4:22 PM ^
Were you a scholarship football player at michigan and tried to flunk out?
January 13th, 2011 at 4:22 PM ^
I think he got caught sniffing coke off a hooker's herpes
January 13th, 2011 at 4:34 PM ^
Any chance he was caught banging Mo's wife?
January 13th, 2011 at 4:25 PM ^
Forcier is still young. He's had his issues, but he has still contributed a lot to the football team. I hope they can work out a way for him to earn another shot.
January 13th, 2011 at 4:44 PM ^
I hope he can get it straightened out. I'd hate to see him miss out on the opportunities that a Michigan degree can afford him and although I dont see him as NFL level talent I think the kid could really contribute to our football team.
January 13th, 2011 at 5:01 PM ^
Hoke's criminal-justice education and emphasis on football as a means of "touching" the lives of his players means he will likely, if it is even remotely possible, give Forcier another chance.
January 13th, 2011 at 5:33 PM ^
I would love for Forcier to stay somewhere on the depth chart. I think there's a place for him there. Still, I am loathe to speculate too much as to why the current state of affairs exists until we know for certain if he is on his way back or on his way out. It just seems unfair to say much until then.
January 13th, 2011 at 7:23 PM ^
I think you just cut bait and run. Too many distractions and not worth the effort. Although it leaves you one less QB. Cancer is cancer.