He was never going to end up at UM. This one was USC all the way. Best of luck to him.
landing spot. will be interesting to see how he does.
He was never going to end up at UM. This one was USC all the way. Best of luck to him.
Not surprised at all.
So you're saying there's no chance?
this gif captures my sentiments perfectly. A USC lock deciding to go to USC? well I'm not surprised.
However, rejection kinda sucks
I really hate USC.
Exactly. Hoke is probably the worst recruiter that we've ever had. Our recruiting classes under him have been a joke
We didn't lose out on them but did we loose out on them? I'm not sure because I don't follow the tweeters and face books but loosing out sounds bad for sure. Damn kids and their newfangled lexicon.
A couple things there playa-
1: "The best I've ever seen." You're like what, 14, 15? The best recruits you've ever seen probably haven't even played a down of college football yet.
2: In this recruiting class, there are maybe 3 top line recruits who we've missed out on. Cravens (asSuming he goes to USC), Levenberry, and Isaac.
Cravens has been favoring USC this entire time, it was an uphill battle from the start. It would have been a longshot to get him even if he did visit. There was no reason to expect he'd come here over USC.
Levenberry was also a guy who favored FSU at the beginning of his recruiting process. Hoke made a great push for him, and only missed on him because of the major he wanted. He would have been nice to have, but considering our LB hauls over the past 2 recruiting classes, and Levenberry would have been a best available type player, we'll be fine.
Isaac is one we did miss I feel we should have gotten. A 5 star back from the Midwest who seemed to love Michigan for a while. I thought for a while we'd get him, credit to USC for that one. But RB is a position I'm not too worried about either. We haven't gotten a 5 star back there, but we have a very good back in DeVeon Smith coming in, and The Mathlete has done a ton of stuff showing how RB is one of the least, for lack of a better word, important positions.
If we miss on Treadwell, then I'll start to worry.
It will also be interesting to see how these recruits turn out in college... I'm still not convinced that Levenberry isn't over-rated. And that's not sour grapes, but my perception may be due to the fact that the difference between Levenberry and our current LBs seems pretty insignificant (as opposed to the difference between Isaac and our current RBs).
You're implying that you need to get EVERY top prospect to be successful? By that logic, Bama will be bad for the next 4 years because Shane Morris is going to UM.
Patience. Success begets success. But it's not all going to happen in one year. If you think about how bad Michigan has been recently prior to last year, it really puts into perspective how great the recruiting classes of '12 and '13 are. And sure, Michigan was good last year, but even so, they were not good enough to win the Big Ten or contend for the National Championship.
But those days will come... it may not be this year given the schedule, but in the next 2-5 years, you are going to see Michigan back in its prime on the national stage, and with that will come the Ty Isaac's and even the Su'a Cravens. Give it time.
Quick question: was uber-all-world five-star Kyle Kalis a lock when he was committed to Michigan's biggest rival in the Universe?
With that in mind, I don't think we should stop recruiting Cravens. I know by all accounts he is a lost cause, but he had planned on doing a bunch of visits, and he seems to have put himself in a big jam by commiting to a commit date that isn't allowing him to really explore his options. It's a long way to February, and I don't know what Kiffin's policy on visits is, but never say never.
Garnett and Diamond are both really good O-Line prospects, but we had a great O-Line class last year, and even better one this year. Neither of them are can't miss prospects, especially oversome of the O-Line recruits we brought in this year.
Isaac I agree I thought we would get, but no one bats 1.000.
Levenberry is the same as Garnett and Diamond. Really good prospect, but by no means a
"can't miss", and many people, including Magnus IIRC, don't think is as good as many of our current committs. Also, with Levenberry we DID start from the bottom and rise up, essentially to a tie based on his recent quotes. We just didn't have his major. It'snot often we'll lose a kid over academics, I won't lose sleep over that.
Cravens was a USC lean since the beginning, not sure why you're so convinced we should have gotten him.
Reeves was by no means a can't miss. You're grasping for straws here.
The only one who was ever considered a can't miss was Pryor, and look what happened there. He completely screwed over OSU. 99% of Mich fans are glad we missed on him. He was also the previous coaching regime.
You really need to pick better examples, which you can't really as of now, because there aren't any. Hoke has done a tremendous job recruiting.
Who are the 1% of us who wish T. Pryor had committed to us?
Lots of these 5* players don't always pan out - recruiting services hype kids to the moon at times, and they don't always pan out. The reason LSU and Alabama do so well is in part because of recruiting (and massive oversigning), but also because they have a system in place that methodically develops talented kids into talented stars. That's what Hoke and co. seem to be doing, and that's the type of success I want to see at UM, not just great recruiting classes. Heck, FSU has been pulling in great classes for most of the decade and look where that has led them? Player development is at least as important as player acquisition.
Do yourself (and us) a favor. Stop following recruiting. You're trying to keep score in a way that makes no sense and you're never going to be happy.
... It's officially time to freak the F out.... or win a National Championship and start turning all the 4-stars down.
Methinks you're confusing "can't miss" with "really good prospect" or "player for whom Michigan is a prohibitive favorite."
Su'a Cravens is a really good player. But we are in good shape at his position, and he was a longshot to leave the west coast. If that's the definition of a can't miss for Michigan, we're proper screwed.
No doubt, hoke's a great recruiter.
but the fact of the matter is that some truly elite players are still reluctant to join hokeamania...especially when we are in a 50-50, 40-60 type of odds with another school in the mix
i am getting a tad bit tired of the garnetts, isaacs, cravens etc. HOKEfully we beat some 'elite' school soon for a recruits services.
You must chill.
For real. I'm sick of having the best recruiting class in the nation. We should be ranked at LEAST -12.
Further proof that some high school kids don't deserve the internet...
That kid is my least favorite poster
I was about to ask "what about me, do I deserve the internet?" , but then I remembered that I finished high school last week. Yes, some people with -99000+ need some restrictions. Then again if negbangs existed when I first started posting I'm sure I would have had something close to that.
It was touch and go for a while during the UMxGoNightgames days, but you turned it around. We can only hope for the same from Mr.Mario.
Log off and go do your homework, three day break is over.
Once we start having multiple players drafted in the first 2 rounds of the draft the top 25 prospects will notice and we'll start pulling 2 or so per year. Its no secret that there hasn't been a lot of NFL talent the last 5 years, save for Graham, Mesko and Martin, plus I think Molk and Hemingway will be good NFL players. But the kids in the top 25 want first round money and they believe that USC and 'Bama can give it to them.
Did you really think we had a chance to land him? I get the feeling from this post you don't really follow/understand UM recruiting very much.
Well that was a scintillating discourse.
Too bad, he'll never know what he's missing. He could get such a better education (school, life, and football) from Michigans coaches than he could from kiffin. :/
"I wish they all could be California girlllllllls" would be his song of choice if he attended Michigan.
Don't sleep on USC's academics. It's a really good school with a passionate alumni base. One of my good friends has degrees from UCLA and USC, and he fervently believes USC has the best connected and helpful alumni base in California and the western US in general. Cravens could do much, much worse from an educational standpoint.
Kiffin is a demonstrated tool, but he's done really well to keep USC up as the pain from sanctions start to kick in. It will be really interesting to see what happens after this season there, but things have gone really well so far.
Ohio would be much worse.
Your friend's homerism is shining through.
You can count on one hand the schools in the world (Harvard...maybe Oxford) that have more resources, prestigious alumni, and brand recognition than those wacky Trees.
Last I checked, Palo Alto was still a part of California.
PS A colleague was an undergrad and went to medical school out in Stanford. He had a freaking medical device patent on his resume. Part of their med school curriculum was to pair together medical students, biomedical engineer PhDs, and MBAs to figure out the need for a product, create said product, and then market that product. On the school's dime.
I wasn't talking about quite the same thing. His feeling was that USC alumni looked out for each other and really cared about seeing other USC folks succeed. Stanford's status as one of the truly elite universities in the world isn't in question, but that very status goes hand in hand with a dispersed alumni base that doesn't have the concentration in California that a less excellent school might have.
Either way, Stanford is pretty sweet and has a much better campus than USC--although it's a little too isolated from Palo Alto for me.
I used to have a co-worker who went to Harvard, and he was jealous of how U-M grads seemed to look out for each other, and there was a camaraderie. His fellow students seemed so anxious to screw each other over to get ahead, where Michigan seemed more like a family to him. Harvard better school, obviously, but he envied the overall experience.
USC is ranked by USNWR 23 to our 28. Ever been in Ann Arbor in the winter?
While I hate to lose any recruit, there are certain realites you have to face and that is that Michigan does have competition from other schools which sometimes have excellent academics, better climate and equally good coaching. The fact of the matter is that you can get great educations at many schools, and a lot of very highly ranked players are looking toward the NFL, not schoolbooks.
Did anyone honestly think we had a shot?
If he took a visit I would say we had a chance. But Even then our chances were still low.
And it's not just about a possible commitment... getting him on campus improves Michigan's image in California where it would be nice to make some recruiting inroads. Remember when Mathis talked up Michigan so much and all of a sudden, several elite west coast guys were talking about their interest in Michigan. Have any of them panned out? Not yet... but it's about building those relationships and improving word-of-mouth.
So even if Cravens would have never commited to Michigan, not getting him on campus is a disappointment.
I wish him a healthy career and nothing but horrible luck on the football field.
(although he probably will), it's really, really discouraging to see USC seeming to not be affected at all by the NCAA punishment recruiting-wise. They seem to be signing HS All-Americans like nothing ever happened. If there ever was a more arrogant program in terms of thumbing their nose collectively at the system of rules in college football, I'd like to see it. I guess they've been successful in convincing a lot of recruits that they've changed their spots.
If your program has sufficient brand equity - and I think USC has quite a bit - then you would have to do more than the NCAA is perhaps willing or able to do to really hurt the program rather than merely inconvenience it. Sometimes, I wish they would scale the punishment to the program. Other programs would have been crippled for years under similar conditions, but USC has a sufficiently adept staff that it can also manage its way through this period as well. Not every program can say that either.
A two-year postseason ban and a reduction in scholarships over three years still allows them to win the Pac-12 South, which essentially means that you're right, it is as if nothing happened save for the lack of postseason play, and that portion of their overall punishment is done now. They still have a shot at (and will likely get) all-American recruits because they are who they are, they still have a rich tradition, and they sit in the middle of the talent machine of southern California.
It seems like an unfortunate truth that while the rules are for everyone obviously, some programs have built themselves into a position where the application of the rules can materially affect them less for the same transgression.
In any event, wherever Cravens ends up, I wish him well - seems like a pretty level-headed kid from what I have read.
I think the sequence of the sanctions is why there hasn't been much of a difference in recruiting. Had they implemented the 3 years of scholship restrictions, THEN the 2 year post-season ban, I think it would have had much more effect. Imagine trying to get a recruit to come to your school and having to explain to him his 4th and 5th year at the school, he wont be able to play in a bowl game or conference championship. IMO that would have had a lot more 4/5* guys reconsidering knowing they're prime years in college football would go unrewarded.
Sure they're landing top talent, but where the sanctions hurt them is when the top talent doesn't pan out, which is often the case. In order to keep their success going they need to hit on every recruit, which is nearly impossible. If they don't they're going to lack huge depth.
We're way overdue for some good news. I believe I heard some strong rumors last week that we could get one or possibly two commits very soon. I'm still buckled up....
Remember what Sam Webb does for a living. He uses WTKA recruiting roundup to draw fans into paying for GOBLUEWOLVERINE. He's 50/50 just like everyone else.
Best of luck to him in all of his endeavors, except any games against Michigan. Look at the bright side as soon as Urban offers him, he'll flip to tsiO. Just ask any buckeye fan!
Unless it is a non-committable offer. That's the only way they wouldn't get him.
Is this the kid that is cousins with Joe Mathis? Will this have any impact on his recruitment? He's a stud.
Mathis recently drove by University of Nevada Reno on his way back to his home and proclaimed it his favorite... so I don't know how good our chances are with this guy!
Guess he was a bit too craven to come to Michigan??
Nobody in the nation is close to USC when it comes to tradition, facilities, academics, girls, and geographic location. They have everything! However, I do believe that Hoke has won a couple of recruiting battles with them. Does anyone know off hand what 2012 and 2013 Michigan commits that had A USC offer? Thanks!
Michiagn has superior academics, a richer tradition, and a better coaching staff. I'm not positive on this one, but doesn't Michigan have better facilities as well? I'll give you the weather, and the girls (but just barely) for USC. In general, Michigan's program stacks up to USC's.
2012: Terry Richardson, Eric Magnuson, and James Ross all had USC offers.
2013: LTT and David Dawson both had USC offers
Dawson and LTT sill have USC offers... unless LTT burned his, and I missed the tweet.
The girls at USC are very attractive. I don't think we really compare based on going to A squared for four years and visiting USC. Their sixes are our nines.
That aside, I agree with your other points.
to be choosing your school, where you will be spending at least the next three years engrossed in football and classes, based on the alleged hawtness of the local chicks? Yes, I am familiar with the mindset of teenage boys, but I still think that even the weather should be more of a reasonable deciding factor than ladies.
Richardson, Magnuson, James Ross, and Pipkins all had USC offers.
I have to say that when you look at the offer lists of the Michigan commits, it really puts the occasional lost recruit in perspective.
That's right, and Magnuson is from Cali. USC obviously has a lot going for it, but we hold our own.
Thank you for making a blunt assertion not supported by facts, then accusing someone else of not "speaking w what you know"
Wow, the hits just keep on coming. Hoke and coaches cannot recruit to save their lives. They let MSU take all of the instate talent like Reshcke and Arnett. Then, they try to recruit nationally like Dantonio but to no prevail. They probably don't even have a pipeline state in NCAA 2013. Fricken' pathetic!!!!
Either you are a moron or are being sarcastic. Let's hope for sarcastic.
Who is the moron now?
Thank you now everybody can move on to the next one.
He and Mathis could both go to USC. After Mathis came for a visit and had Michigan as his top school then, changed his mind. He seemed to be playing musical chairs with every school he visited as his #1. he seems like the type of kid that doesnt seem loyal. Michigan commits are hardcore team 134 once commited, he just doesnt seem to fit the bill. Some fresh snake oil and Mathis seems like an easy flip. Maybe Cravens isnt like his couzin but ya never know.
Can't we let Kate dance anyway? Just for the hell of it.
But then again, I never thought our class would be this awesome and highly ranked this early.
why would cravens even consider yacht? the radiation levels in cali and the west coast are dangerously high after the fukushima meltdown. seems to me a recruit would want to be somewhere with low radiation, like Michigan. cancer risk is exponentially higher in cali from the radiation
levels. kid can go where he wants, but the smart choice is Michigan for obvious reasons.
Can't say I'm surprised on this. USC has always seemed to be his favorite. As much of a d-bag as Lane Kiffin is, I'm pretty impressed with the manner in which he's been able to recruit and keep USC in the spotlight. That having been said, I don't think his team is national-title ready next year, and probably won't be for the next few years.
They are loaded with first-string talent, but they will be feeling the pain of lack of depth for the next few years. This is the time when those scholarship reductions are really going to hurt. USC's first team players will be really good, but they will have very little depth behind them. If a Matt Barkley or Robert Woods-like player goes down on injury, the team is virtually screwed.
I have never heard of it or seen the exact UofM-USC point you mentioned painstakingly argued about right here on this blog after the Ty Isaac commitment.
Do you mean the list that he included a link to in his post? Me no understand.
Recruit - Chooses school not named Michigan
User 1 - Questions why recruit would ever choose School X over Michigan, citing academic supremacy
User 2 - Cites US News list of best colleges detailing how Michigan academics are not so superior to School X
All Users - argue about validity of said list
Me - yawn
The US News & World Report Rankings are pretty much the respcted go-to for all comparative needs.
USC has improved a lot in these rankings and Michigan and Northwestern have dropped. Interestingly USC is 4th in education in the PAC 12 behind Stanford, Cal, and UCLA.
Hey True Blue. 1st of all. The punishment given to USC was too severe. Considering all that's happened at tOSU and North Carolina. Secondly, from what you've posted here your probably not a very big Trojan fan you should remove John Wayne from your site here because he was a USC graduate. http://www.usc.edu/uscnews/stories/15465.html And finally if Michigan or anybody else from the Big 10 beat USC sometime this century maybe you can finally steal some recruits away from the Trojans. Fight On!
I'm guessing you're a BIGmouth bassmaster?
If they've finally stopped cheating.
But at least if they get caught again, with their new management they probably won't be stupid enough to dare the NCAA to do something.