Soooo, he's the next Monte Ball, but bigger???? I'll take it.
Sorry...I got a Derrick Green Question. Let's call it DG post # 134 on this board
Everybody's highlight tapes look good. I'm pretty sure that's why they are called "highlight tapes."
Except for a few of those on the board who see things through a coach's eye, we have no idea how good someone really is, or how they "predict" at the college level, until they actually get there. It's fun to specuate, though.
In the AA game he had like 53 yards on 9 carries for a nice little 5.9 YPC average against the best competition he's likely faced to date. Showed good burst through the whole, ran with some power, broke off a few long runs. He's not a guy that's going to wow you with great moves. He's a one cut and go downhill runner. I have no idea if he's he's going to be any good or not, but I'll trust this coaching staff, all the other coaching staffs, and the evaluators.
The guy he reminds me of is Jamal Lewis. He's got those same short choppy steps that are good for wading through the trash at the line.
Thread jack, because I need to vent. I like listening to 97.1 most of the time, but today's topic with Voldemort is really pissing me off.
Agreed. He's not nearly as impressive as the RB in the AT&T commercial doing the backflip. Too bad Stoops beat us to him.
When you watch running back film, you all expect to see jukes, cuts on a dime and things of that nature. This is a north south runner with great feet who isn't going to be brought down by the first tackler. I see a kid who follows his blocks well, and gets up field quickly. The explosion he showed at the AA game against top flight kids was enough for me.
I looked over Green's tape. What people have to realize is the comptition he's playing against. The teams he is playing against are bigger and more athletic than other recruit's tape. For instance go look at 2015 target Damien Harris' tape. Dude looks like a man playing against boys. Not taking anything away from his abilities (he's a stud) but he should stand out playing against that level of competition. IMO, Green is a quality run between the tackles back.
The competition is better than SOME other running backs, but not necessarily all of them. Richmond puts out some decent football talent, but it's not Florida or Texas or California.
Virginia puts out some decent guys, but a lot of it comes from the Tidewater area around Newport News, Chesapeake, Virginia Beach, etc. Richmond isn't the top talent-producing area in the state, although a few quality guys have come from there in recent years (Tim Harris, Brandon Minor, Curtis Grant, etc.).
What is the topic on 97.1 you speak of? What is Mikey spewing today?
Hating on Lewan.
Without turing it on it's probably going something like this, " Michigan basketball hasn't played anybody, I mean come on Pitt...(fart noise), West Virginia (fart noise) and NCSU (burp)." Then Terry will come in and say, "Come on now bud why aren't we talking about the problems in Detroit on a sports radio statio, this is preposterous." Then Dery will attempt to calm them down with soothing talks of the Cleveland Indians......the end. Sports radio in metro Detroit is just the worst.
You can always play the Matt Dery drinking game. Take a shot every time he says "you're right, Mike" or "you're absolutely right, Mike".
What's your Derrick Green question?
Don't ask. I had too much time and tried this just for fun. Here is my breakdown of Derrick Green. I also did an amateur breakdown on DeVeon Smith, Ty Isaac, Thomas Rawls, and Kevin Grady. If anybody, for some reason, wants more, I might post it.
- Number one is he has bad balance and therefore lacks any kind of lateral agility
- That can be partially explained by his high pad level.
- Another separate weakness is his lack of vision
- Runs with authority
- Hits the hole hard and fast
- Has good straight line burst
- Does have a good power base, not entirely sure if he will put it to good use every time
Verdict: Hugely dependent upon a great O-line, he fits well with Michigan's philosophy of overpowering Ds
Metaphor: Wrecking ball. Or punch in the mouth. Mainly concerned with hitting you with power.
The ESPN scouting report(insider) also mentions that he just has to keep his pad level low and he'd be fine. And I also saw he was better in that aspect in his senior film. To me, he's not even a one-cut-and-go runner. Ty Isaac is. Derrick Green is more like a no-cut-and-go runner.
I agree, for the little it's worth.
My theory is that Green's raw size/speed numbers and his impressive burst are making everyone excited about him, even though he's got a ways to go as a runner.. Most of all, his balance, as you note, is a weakness. Looks like something he improved in his senior film, but it's a downright liability in the junior year stuff. He hits people hard, but doesn't seem to bounce off them or push a pile very well - something that is borne out in the AA game. Just kind of rams into people and falls, though usually falls forward, I guess. He can outrun people in the open field, and he's a big boy, but I think people expecting him to come in and look like an All-B1G type back from day one are going to be disappointed. Maybe with some time. I honestly think Smith might be a better back, especially early on in their careers.
Also, as for the A-Train comparisons elsewhere: he always had trouble when people went at his legs, too, but I think he broke arm tackles better than Green appears to.
I kind of agree that nothing really jumps out about him, but there must be something there for multiple services to have him highly rated. What is a little weird to me is that for the #1 RB there isn't alot of hype surrounding him like there is most #1 position players. However I think the combo of him and D. Smith could be deadly.
I know. I was expecting someone to say "HELLO!" as he flipped over a DB. And then for Bob Stoops to come walking up like a dope and say hello in a rapey voice.
His highlight tape is pretty filthy. I'm guessing that you're not that impressed because you're used to seeing Rawls and Hopkins run all over pathetic competition. Don't get me wrong--I think Rawls' tape is very impressive, and I still believe he could be our starting RB next year...
...but Green breaks loads of tackles in the reel, and breaks off some long runs where he outruns safeties and corners. And he's not playing low level talent--those kids are big, strong, fast kids he's up against. Not every run is a TD, but when I compare his tape to Rawls, Green is better, and I'll give you some comparisons:
- Green does a great job of FINDING the hole and getting upfield through the path of least resistance. Rawls runs where the play tells him to go, breaks the tackle of a tiny LB, and then outruns a pathetic defense. Green's vision seems far superior to Rawls, who spends most of his tape just running straight ahead. Look at how often Green moves laterally, how we waits for his blocks, and how he finds seams in the defense. Rawls just steams forward.
- Green does have very good speed. Look at the play that's snapped at 1:11. While it's not a TD, he takes a pitch and beats the defense to the outside. Notice the safety that attacks down and ends-up behind Green...that was a bad angle, but that's a fast safety who is used to making plays with that speed. Rawls is the fastest guy on the field every play...which, if you've seen him play in the NCAA, should raise red flags about his competition in his reel.
- Green's tackle-breaking is more subtle than Rawls. Rather than pinballing (running into players and bouncing off or knocking them over) Green frequently makes subtle lateral movements so that tacklers are sliding off of him or missing arm tackles. Again, Rawls pounded his HS competition, but that won't happen often in D1 football (unless you're playing Purdue).
- Green is MUCH bigger than Rawls. Rawls is 5-10, Green is 6-2. They have a similar build, but Green is more toned and more powerful. And I think he's just as fast, if not faster. Watch the snap at 2:00--again, Green outruns the entire defense to the sideline.
- Rawls tends to run towards the open space; Green is comfortable staying in tighter spaces. This has proven true in Rawls' career at Michigan--he bounces outside too early because he sees green. In HS, that equalled in TDs. In the B1G, that equals 2 yard gains that should have been 4 yard gains. Look at the snap at 2:58 on Green's tape. That run is more impressive than many of his TD runs. The blocking is okay but the safety fills the running lane well; Green cuts behind a block and turns it into a gain.
I could go on, but the point is that Green spent his HS career doing the things that college backs need to be able to do, and Rawls spent his HS career running and over and around lesser competition. As a result, Rawls is having to learn to play the game a different way; Green will be able to play the same way and be successful. Both have impressive physical tools. Green is a more polished back that's played tougher competition. Also, I wouldn't discount the intangibles--clearly Green is known as a hard-worker and leader (he was picked as Captain of his Army AA team) and I think that gets packed into his evaluation.
All that said, I think Green will need some good blocking to be a star, and he should get it at Michigan. Ty Isaac, IMO, can create more yards without help, but isn't going to move the pile.
Fantastic breakdown. Thanks. Kevin Grady, being the last top 25, solidly built running back that michigan signed is the name that keeps popping into my head when i read about Green. This makes me feel better.
Rawls's highlight tape was impressive because of all the big runs, but I still had questions about his ability.
I was not impressed by Stephen Hopkins's high school film. It was pretty boring.
3:30 into his senior film says it all http://michigan.247sports.com/Article/New-senior-highlights-of-2013-Mich...
Ziff, will you ever learn?
And Derrick Green plays in a garbage district / division. They they play Godwin, John Marshall, Patrick Henry, Thomas Jefferson, Freeman etc. These are historically sorry teams. These are teams that good teams schedule for their homecoming games. I went to Varina class of 05 went to school with B Minor class of 06. When Hermitage played Varina he simply only got the yards that his OL gave him. He carried te ball 33 times for 114 yrds. There were plenty of times when he was one on one with the safety and he went down. The safety for Varina is 5'9 165.
My suggestion to you if you seriously think Rawls and Hopkins have better tapes is to never start a recruiting evaluation site cause neither of them is even in the same league as Derrick Green. Rawls is the most overhyped back I have ever seen at Michigan on message boards and Hopkins had what 10 career carries?
Who has a better tape. I'm jus debunking the theory that Green plays against good competition. Look at the records of the teams hermitage played against. And a lot of ppl don't even think he's the best RB in VA. That boy from LC Bird balled out this year and his team beat Hermitage in the playoffs
Nobody's saying that the teams he's playing against are #1 in the country. It has to do with the kids he's playing against. The linemen and linebackers aren't 5'8", 160 lb. hicks from the middle of nowhere in northern Michigan. And you say Hermitage doesn't play good teams, but they did play Varina (which went 10-3)...and Hermitage won.
Doesn't validate your schedule. The colonial district is trash. The capital district which Varina is in had 6 teams with a stronger SOS than hermitage. Herm won in OT against Varina in which Derrick Green didn't look like the num 1 back in the nation. Check the highlights of that game. U might see 3 good runs from Green. And in OT the ball starts out on the 10 yard line... When Herm got the ball in OT they ran the ball 3 times and green didn't carry the ball once.
From the colonial district