Sorry Guys, The Writing is on the Wall
I'm a be short and sweet with this one.
First, the stories leaked out, one by one, right before the first game of the season. Once it happened, the hits just kept on coming. It kind of culminated with the Bill Martin bank thing and then the riduclously silly Gradeate--when we saw, for maybe the first time in the history of the NCAA--a coach almost having to apologize for the classroom achievements of his football team.
Now, Bill Martin is oot. The season is going into the tank.
Well, like I said: Short and sweet. Rodriguez is a goner. Dead Coach Walking. This isn't the time to think like a FAN, ladies. It's time to realize Rodriguez was sabotaged by someone at UM, the university hasn't exactly come out to support him, and well, Year Two has turned into a disastah.
He won't be here next year if te team doesn't go to a bowl. It's not my call--I'd give him a third year before I'd can him. Trouble is, next year doesn't look terribly promising (unless we play Delaware State seven times).
I like Rodriguez. I think he did a good yob at WVU. But he has not done a good yob here, and the Big Shots at UM won't keep him around too long after the final gun goes off at the end of as ass kicking at the hands of Ohio State. The only way RR buys a third year is to go bowling.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:39 PM ^
I like youer spehling
November 13th, 2009 at 9:37 PM ^
It seems to me that a lot of people think that by canning RR that our team will become a national title contender sooner rather than later. If RR is gone after this year it will mean more players transferring out, the players that stick it out will be forced to learn another system, and our weak defense will go through yet another change. So whether we keep RR for one more year or get a new coach 2010 does it really matter in the scheme of things? Give RR one more year to prove that things can be turned around and give our QB situation another year to mature.
November 14th, 2009 at 1:04 AM ^
A lot of people are just unhappy with what he's doing at this point, on various levels (Personel decisions, scheme, what ever). Such as myself, but i dont think he should be canned, infact i want to see his offense in its WVU form here. A lot of people are "in a fight" with him to say, we don't want a divorce, we just dont want to rake the leaves every 2 days.
Now i know some people, such as the OP here, are essentially calling for it, I think a lot of people have had their complaints taken further than they meant.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:43 PM ^
The only writing on the wall that I see is two games remaining and that we have a shot at winning both of them. Play Wisconsin tough, pissed off, like we did WMU and ND and we win. Pressure Pryor three times (to force three interceptions) and we win.
7-5. Write it down now.
IF not 7-5, who cares. There are greater travesties in life and the new AD will at least give RR one year (just to see if the "fit" is right with the ADs goals). I give RR two (but that is because I know how decimated the defense is going to be after graduation this year).
The only thing I am wondering from this weekend is this: if the whole stadium doesn't boo RR on that 4th and 2 from Purdue's 20 yard line, before Zoltan's out of this galaxy punt, does RR still go for it on 4th and 10 at our 25? I am wondering if he didn't try to appease the fans on that call...I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'
Kudos to him for having the brass to let it all hang out. High Risk High Reward.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:46 PM ^
You severely underrate Ohio State.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:52 PM ^
I may be severely underrating OSU, but, never will it be said that I let the results of 5 games change the skip in my step. I will be there on the 21st cheering the loudest that I possibly can to show my support for the team...
November 8th, 2009 at 8:58 PM ^
I'm not burrying Michigan if that's the vibe you took from my post. I'll be there cheering as well. But to say that it's as simple as pressuring Pryor (Which is difficult in itself), thats too simplified.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:46 PM ^
Call me crazy but I don't think RR got where he is today by appeasing the crowd.
November 9th, 2009 at 9:23 AM ^
Rod never had to worry about appeasing the crowd before - everthing he did was magic to the fine people of West Virginia.
I think his problem is that he cares far, far too much what the media and the fans think.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:51 PM ^
....I haven't seen anything on the field defensively, particularly in since we got out of September, that leads me to believe we can stop either Wisconsin, or Ohio State. At some point I think we need to have a realistic conversation. I do hope you're right. Just site me some actual proof or substance that would lead you to believe we have even a prayer against either of these teams.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:53 PM ^
Right now just fandom. I will try to get something other than fandom before next week's game.
November 8th, 2009 at 9:29 PM ^
I have nothing as far as evidence in stats because there is none but the fact of the matter is that no matter how bad our record may be I think we can win both games and I hope and pray that we do. I am a fan and no matter what may come our way I am going to watch the game and hope to the very last that we pull off the wins. Call it blind faith, call it what you will but I am a fan of the greatest football team ever and no stats are going to change that. Stats don't win a ball game, players do, and I happen to think that the ones in the winged helmets are the greatest of all time. Disagree with me and it is your loss.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:10 PM ^
i wasnt at the game yesterday...people booed? i think that might be the first boos of the season, right?
November 8th, 2009 at 6:31 PM ^
the only boos came when we didn't go for it on a 4th down. Cant recall exactly which drive it was but it was the only time when i heard it.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:34 PM ^
I also heard some boos when we decided to go for it on 4th down. Mostly I heard people say wtf, but there where some boos there too.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:43 PM ^
I know I'm probably wasting my time replying to a troll, but I think you might want to review what Mary Sue Coleman (the biggest shot of all) said about RR just a few days ago.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:46 PM ^
What else could she possibly say?
November 8th, 2009 at 5:58 PM ^
She could have said nothing at all. She's not going to put her reputation on the line now by going back on this. If you don't believe that, you don't know what kind of person she is.
November 8th, 2009 at 7:26 PM ^
And you might want to get your facts straight. Coleman's quote did not come out "just a few days ago." It was from an interview with the Wall Street Journal on Oct. 30--before the Illinois game.
November 9th, 2009 at 11:07 AM ^
Please. That was nine days ago - hardly eons ago. Nowhere in it did MSC say anything about the rest of the season affecting her judgment. If you don't like RR, fine. But claiming that MSC will go back on her word and let him go is flat-out delusional.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:47 PM ^
...you're likely right on several points (Rodriguez is in trouble and that there are definitely people out there sabotaging him from several fronts) I think the talk of his demise is slightly premature. Mary Sue Coleman will not get rid of him this year (she's come out publicly repeatedly and said he'll get at least four year). She wouldn't come out like that and not stand behind it barring the NCAA coming down HARD on us some time in the next few month (can't really hire a new coach after February can you?). I'm not saying whether its deserved or not, just that Mary Sue just won't do it and is her call since Martin is a lame duck. I think we'll RichRod will be coaching here in 2010. After that, I dunno.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:10 PM ^
"There are definitely people out there sabotaging him from several fronts"
Could you elaborate on that?
November 8th, 2009 at 7:55 PM ^
And about the grades, I thought the team turned in one of its better GPA performances in recent years. Gotta link to back that up?
Barring major NCAA findings, RR is definitely here in 2010.
November 14th, 2009 at 12:57 AM ^
First: Let me say, I love the website. I really do. I'm a Buckeye living in Michigan. As such, I watch Michigan every week. I wouldn't call myself a fan of Michigan, but I do respect the program, history, tradition, all that good stuff. I will treat the board and posters with respect, and would appreciate a level of the same. I know it's your board, and I am a guest on your turf.
Second: Richrod, if given a chance, will win a NC. He will. UM just needs to decide if they are willing to give him that chance. If you are not willing to push all the chips into the table and take your lumps possibly even next season, you should can him now. The ship is gaining speed and will be tough to stop. Two major changes to a program will lead to a FSU-like 10 years.
If you are willing take your lumps for a shot at a NC, deal with the next year or two, and support your damn team.
Good luck.
EDIT FOR GRAMMER
November 16th, 2009 at 10:06 AM ^
people are negging this post? i don't care if you agree or disagree, but negging for the fun of it is weak form imo.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:53 PM ^
"He won't be here next year if te team doesn't go to a bowl. It's not my call--I'd give him a third year before I'd can him. Trouble is, next year doesn't look terribly promising (unless we play Delaware State seven times)."
The key here is "next year doesn't look terribly promising."
Does a coach other than RR make it look more promising?
Remember, the people making the decision about RR will also be asking this question.
Whether you like RR or not, to think he will be gone next year is completely delusional.
The only thing that will jeopardize his job is major NCAA violations. He will be back next year. Even those who loathe RR need to come to terms with this. He's our coach, will be at least for the next year, and likely longer.
November 8th, 2009 at 5:58 PM ^
however, as to Coleman, the first sign of a coach in trouble at any level is a high ranking shot caller giving a vote of support. Once the chatter warrants a response, the issue has become legitimate. I am not just saying this and attempting to stir things up, but I really do believe that he is lame duck coach at this point. I don't think Rodruguez has shown the characteristics needed to make it work in this program. He is sloppy with the media, he does not seem to really embrace his players and often hangs them out to dry (at least by implication) in his pressers. Rich Rods acts like a coach who has never had to answer to anybody. He has to answer for his conduct and decisions here, he is being held to a high standard but acts as though the standard just doesn't apply to him. Why, I don't know. Not good. I think Michigan's AD's departure was curiously timed and I think the relatively little interest shown by many big named and previously interested recruits is really alarming, in some ways telling. This is one die hard Michigan fan that actually does believe that if he loses these remaining two games, he is out, like ASAP. Call me crazy, and I presume you will....
November 8th, 2009 at 6:13 PM ^
Its been known in University circles for a very long time that Bill Martin would step down after the football stadium was built. Nothing curious about that. Again, aside from MSC saying he'll get four years, they're not going to want a lame duck AD making this decision and leaving it on the new person(even if they pretty well know who the new A.D. will be, which I think they do). Plus, he still has three years on his contract and anyone they hire will likely have a buy out clause of several million in it.
Like I said earlier, barring the NCAA dropping a bomb on the program, RR will be back in 2010 BUT, he will be in boiling hot water under tremendous pressure to produce. FURTHER as the earlier poster noted, I just don't see how this team will get any better in 2010. We lose arguably our best offensive (Minor) and defensive players (Graham) and none of the recruits appear to be the kind of kid who can step in RIGHT AWAY and be a difference maker in the secondary or at linebacker which means we're essentially looking at a very similar defense and that isn't a good thing.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:21 PM ^
If this were a pro sports team, I'd agree that the lack of big "signings" (recruits) would be a sign that we might not improve. But this is college, and a lot of improvement is made just from having young players (of which we have a ton) maturing physically and mentally. The vast majority of our roster comes back next year, and we hopefully will sign enough recruits to raise our dangerously-low scholarship total (69) to something more reasonable. Let's see what happens when the guys RR actually recruited himself get another year under their belts.
November 8th, 2009 at 10:28 PM ^
The big difference next year is that our starting QB(s) will not be Freshman OR Walk-on's. The extra year of maturity, the extra year of watching film and practicing SHOULD be enough to cut down on our biggest issues on offense: turnovers and inconsistent play.
A better offense means our defense faces less plays which means they give up less points. This alone would have meant we win at Iowa, MSU and Purdue this year.
Assuming a 5-7 finish this year, I'll take an 8-4 season next year. All RRod really needs is 1 more year to get things in place.
Really, it will be ok in the long run.
November 8th, 2009 at 7:51 PM ^
I listened to what Saban had to say at halftime of the LSU/Alabama game. The first thing he did was call out his QB for not hitting open receivers. Then he said it wasn't the plays that were being called, it was the execution of those plays that was the reason they only scored 3 in the half. I can't believe he would hang his players out to dry like that. He should be canned because I don't like what he was implying about his players, which we all know should take no blame for anything. All the coach's fault and he should reiterate that every chance he gets.
November 8th, 2009 at 7:18 PM ^
All of these dumb posts following a loss make me miss the preseason days with Macfarlin and R_mahorn
November 8th, 2009 at 6:06 PM ^
... but, I have a hard time believing that our defense is that severely understaffed compared to some other teams that are playing comparable schedules and still making bowl games. Also, I don't think that anyone can say that our team is over-achieving relative to it's talent level. The big perk to Rodriguez was supposed to be that he could get the most out of our talent. Talent depleted or not, I challenge anyone to say that he has done that.
Being Michigan, we should be able to reel in the big-fish recruits. What we wanted, post-Lloyd, was someone that could get those big-fish recruits playing to, or past, their potential. While we're not a national-title caliber team, I do think that 5-5 with losses to Purdue and Illinois, is at best, achieving at the talent level of our team.
Maybe it is time to start looking past RRod. I'm not saying it's the greatest idea ... but there seem to be a couple of viable coaches out there that might be able to better-recruit and coach our team. Even if it's too early to say that the verdict is in on RRod, when do we say that perhaps we should cut our losses? Maybe he isn't the savior a lot of folks believe him to be, I think that Brian Kelly could step in and almost ensure that Michigan makes a bowl next year. Also, he may be a bit inflamatory, but Harbaugh has shown similar promise at STANFORD!?!?!
November 8th, 2009 at 6:18 PM ^
Haven't we had enough of:
(1) outsiders! If a switch is made, I want a Michigan Man in. Particulary since we can all name two very qualified candidates who fit that bill.
(2) Guys who have made their name dominating bullcrap leagues. Yes, I think the Big East is bullcrap. If we had to hire an outsider, I'd like to see someone who got it done in the SEC or Big 12 or even the Pac 10 over a guy who dominated the now impotent Big East.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:55 PM ^
Just...no.
Oh, please, can we go back to being 8-4 every year w/no chance at a national title unless God is playing corner, WR, and returning punts? And can we go back to losing 2-3 games every year to teams w/inferior talent? (And if you think we've lost to anyone w/inferior talent this year, I question your ability to judge talent.)
By the way, Yost, Crisler, and Schembechler were all outsiders. Crisler and Bo came from "bullcrap leagues." Tressel was an outsider from a bullcrap league when he took over at OSU. Urban Meyer came from Utah and BGSU before going to Florida. Mack Brown was in the ACC before Texas.
I don't want Kelly, either, but I don't agree with your reasoning.
November 9th, 2009 at 10:12 AM ^
This is an interesting trend - people defending Rodriguez by saying that all those 'accomplishments' you think Michigan earned under Lloyd were, under careful scrutiny, just mediocrity.
In 8 out of Lloyd's 13 seasons, Michigan had 9 or more wins at the end of November. Maybe the lesson to be learned with Rodriguez's hire is how fucking hard it is - yes, even at Michigan - to sustain that level of success.
I'd give my left nut for Rodriguez to win as much as Lloyd did.
EDIT: Also, 'Michigan only won a national championship in '97 because of Woodson so let's throw that out the window' is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. So a coach won a championship in part because he had a truly great player? Stop the motherfucking presses. Most teams only win championships because of masterful scheming and convincing 22 hardworking but unspectacular guys to all pull in the same direction, right? Pull up a list of all the national championship teams that didn't have great players, and I'll be convinced that Lloyd was a fraud.
Also, this is college football, right? Who was responsible for young Mr. Woodson's commitment to Michigan?
November 14th, 2009 at 12:38 AM ^
What the fanbase as a whole has done to Lloyd Carr in the past year, especially in the past 3 months, is sickening. Listening to some people, you'd think Lloyd drew up the transfer papers himself and escorted the guys out the door just to screw over RR.
Lloyd Carr is more of a Michigan Man than any of us who spend our time dissecting UFR's and being "All-In!" for this, that, or the other thing.
November 15th, 2009 at 9:41 PM ^
I think a lot of people are sick of revisionist history. Most Michigan fans couldn't wait to get rid of LC. I personally liked him, even if our offense was boring, we were out of the MNC race by the end of Sept. and he had problems with The Vest. I would have been fine with him staying as our coach for the next decade. I was terribly saddened by how 2007 worked out for him. But I can say with equal clarity that he obviously did not have his heart in recruiting over the last few years, and we are finally paying the price for that. The cupboard is bare. That is LC's doing. It's not trashing LC, who I believe is a great man and extremely underrated as a coach. Rather, it is a cold, hard reconciliation with reality. That is, a depth chart that is bereft of talent and bodies that could have been avoided. The thing that baffles me more than the so-called LC trashing is that the RR haters are the same morons who continuously called for LC's head b/c his offense was boring, he was conservative, blah blah blah, and now blame RR for ruining what LC built. You all wanted a coach that is best approximated by RR. If you are patient, you will get what you want. If you're not, then we are headed toward a swift ND-like decline into irrelevance. Don't bother bringing up Harbaugh or Kelly or any other flavor of the week. No one could do better with the bodies we have, and no would be able to save a team that is already understaffed with 70 scholarship players and that would be certain to suffer more attrition. Folks, we have to face the fact that we stink and we need to relax for awhile and give RR a chance. That doesn't mean not being critical. It means being rational about why we are where we are. And any logical evaluation of where we are includes an evaluation of LC's recruiting and the bare cupboard he left Michigan. I'm sure it wasn't his intent, but that's what happened. I still love the guy, but he could have done better.
November 15th, 2009 at 10:20 PM ^
Paragraph breaks are pretty great for putting together cohesive arguments. Just a thought.
November 16th, 2009 at 9:44 AM ^
It's funny you use that phrase.
I have no problem with the assertion that Lloyd's recruiting tapered off somewhat at the end of his career (although this could partially have been due to the fact that he could no longer promise recruits - like he did in Mike, Chad, and Jake's class - that he wouldn't retire before they were done at Michigan.)
But when people are so desperate to defend Rodriguez that they call Lloyd's entire record into question, including the national champsionship - that shit is juvenile, it isn't based on any realistic understanding of college football, and it sacrifices great moments in the program's history for the sake of rationalizing a mediocre present.
That's revisionist history.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:20 PM ^
"I have a hard time believing that our defense is that severely understaffed compared to some other teams that are playing comparable schedules and still making bowl games."
Casually, your idea sounds reasonable. I mean.. we're Michigan, our name brand is all about winning and all.
However, did you miss the work of Misopogon and others this past week?
(see Tim's post "Dear Diary: the Inaugural" on Friday's front page for the full details).
http://mgoblog.com/diaries/decimated-defense
http://mgoblog.com/diaries/decimated-defense-part-ii-statisticating
http://mgoblog.com/diaries/more-attrition-fun-why-were-not-so-good-char…
November 8th, 2009 at 6:32 PM ^
... OSU, PSU, and Alabama, yes, we lack talent. However, compared to MSU, Wisconsin, Minnesota, and a host of other teams that are short of Great but better than God-Awful, I'd say we have roughly equivalent talent.
I'm not saying we should have a top 10 defense this year. Just that we should be on par with teams that we have routinely out-recruited for decades.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:54 PM ^
Again did you see the diaries? It's not the lack of talent. It's the level of depth and just attrition in general. How you can call yourself an mgoblog guy and not read some of the great research that some people have put out there.
In sum get educated.
November 8th, 2009 at 8:33 PM ^
didnt you read boujes amazing diary? geez, get with it
http://mgoblog.com/diaries/open-letter-michigan-faithful-and-unfaithful…
November 8th, 2009 at 10:49 PM ^
You are an idiot. I was obviously referring to the Decimated Defense diaries.
November 8th, 2009 at 10:47 PM ^
I guess if it's in an mgoblog diary, it must be gospel!
Duhhhh, I'm a sheep named bouje.
November 8th, 2009 at 11:00 PM ^
I generally am a contrarian who takes the other side of arguments against the crowd. Before MGoBlog was even a big deal I was a staunch "Fire Lloyd Carr" person for years. I wrote letters to the editor to the Michigan Daily.
So to say that I'm a sheep (if you've read anything that I've written on here) is completely stupid and uninformed. I've gotten negged even more than you and I'm a sheep?
I'm not a sheep you're just a troll who likes attention.
November 8th, 2009 at 6:36 PM ^
So your ideal coach is one who has won at a lot of smaller places and turned a mid-level Big East program into a juggernaut. Hm...Kelly sounds a lot like Rodriguez.
Let's all step back a moment. Prior to this year, Rodriguez and Urban Meyer consulted with each other very frequently in regards to football. Given Rodriguez's past success, and Meyer's continued success at Florida, this tells me that the schemes are not at fault.
So maybe it's a development issue. But I don't buy it. Rodriguez made championship caliber teams out of nothing at WVU. But the key is that it takes time. Rodriguez didn't make 2* players into first round draft picks in a year. If you look at his WVU teams, most of his starters were juniors and seniors. This is to be expected, and due a terrible series of events, we basically have no depth and no experience. This isn't something you can fix in a week, or possibly even an entire season. It takes time.
My advice for you all: We all know this team isn't very good. Lower your expectations. Expect us to lose the next two games. Expect us to miss a bowl game. Expect us to be 5-7, and if this team pulls it together and actually wins one of the next two, then be happy. But don't expect to beat these next two teams, because they're good and we're not. And our problems can't be fixed in a week or two. If you can't handle losing, you shouldn't follow sports.
November 8th, 2009 at 7:19 PM ^
"Being Michigan, we should be able to reel in the big-fish recruits."
Occasionally yes but as a rule no. I grew up in Michigan in awe of UM and then got three degrees from there and totally drank the Kool-Aid. It was a reality check when I moved away and realized the rest of the country isn't quite as in awe of UM as we think they are. If you think we're recruiting on the same level as Florida, USC, LSU, Alabama and even tOSU, you're kidding yourself. We've been a second tier school for a while.
And Jim Harbaugh might be showing promise but he didn't get Stanford to a bowl in his first two years. UM nation is in meltdown mode because we might not get to a bowl again. If we brought in Harbaugh would we fire him after two years if we weren't in a bowl?