Snowflakes: The Fans
I saw a lot today. I saw special teams make plays. I saw defense try to stand their ground despite 3 and outs by the offense. I saw lots of poor playcalling, in my humble opinion.
That’s not what this is about.
I saw a stadium of fans boo their team in front of 4 commits and 15 prospects. (it was probably meant for the play call, but how would they know?)
I had to listen to an idiot next to me talk about how he thinks Devin Gardner is the worst QB in the world and that he wanted him to get injured so that Morris would play.
After I got home, I saw a thread polling fans about cutting their support for the program.
For a school that prides itself in being one of the best, to me at least this seems like a low point for the fandom.
Brady Hoke is doing an excellent job of recruiting, and he has an aspect of aggressiveness (fakes, going on 4th down) that we have not seen in the past, and I think we like it.
Greg Mattison’s defense created the Heininger Certainty Principle, and who can forget the drastic improvement in guys like Jake Ryan and JT Floyd?
I’m not happy with Borges, but I do think that we will improve in a couple years, given the opportunity. Borges seems unable to adapt to an RPS situation where Rock is more like clay and is really weak but scissors is made of titanium as he doesn’t want to keep throwing out the same thing (would this make paper the bubble screen?). Once we have the talent and experience to execute reasonably on run and pass they will put up points (I hope).
If you want to fire Brady Hoke, you are asking for a decade of mediocrity. Who would want this job where 2 coaches have been fired in 6 years (one of them being the “Michigan Man” that everyone wanted after Rich Rod)? Even if you hate Borges, I'd prefer to keep it to the message boards and support the team on the field.
There is a reason why the team touches the banner at the start of the game.
None of this would be possible without the support of the fans. 250 consecutive games over 100,000 was a mark reached today. That is another record for Michigan, but in the midst of that, I guarantee that the one thing that will end this program is if the fanbase gives up on their team.
I’m not asking you to not get upset when things don’t go well; that’s what makes sports what it is. The highs would not be highs unless there were corresponding lows.
I don’t know I was feeling really bummed after the game and thought I’d start a thread for the first time. Hopefully there’s not too much hate because that would make me a bit sadder. I was gonna add some crap about work and how I've seen people get frazzled when they don't perform and get fired eventually, and others rebound with proper support, but now I am tired and I just want the day to end.
I’ll end off with the words of someone wiser than myself.
"We want the Big Ten championship and we're gonna win it as a Team. They can throw out all those great backs, and great quarterbacks, and great defensive players, throughout the country and in this conference, but there's gonna be one Team that's gonna play solely as a Team.
No man is more important than The Team. No coach is more important than The Team. The Team, The Team, The Team, and if we think that way, all of us, everything that you do, you take into consideration what effect does it have on my Team? Because you can go into professional football, you can go anywhere you want to play after you leave here.
You will never play for a Team again. You'll play for a contract. You'll play for this. You'll play for that. You'll play for everything except the team, and think what a great thing it is to be a part of something that is, The Team. We're gonna win it. We're gonna win the championship again because we're gonna play as team, better than anybody else in this conference, we're gonna play together as a team.
We're gonna believe in each other, we're not gonna criticize each other, we're not gonna talk about each other, we're gonna encourage each other. And when we play as a team, when the old season is over, you and I know, it's gonna be Michigan again, Michigan."
November 10th, 2013 at 9:47 AM ^
i'm afraid that doesn't add much substance to the discussion (especially on the internet)
November 10th, 2013 at 9:49 AM ^
It does in the context of this jackass stupidly declaring none of the players' special little feelings are hurt by the boos, when I can tell him for a fact that he is wrong.
November 10th, 2013 at 10:03 AM ^
Public Service Announcement at each game declaring it illegal for fans to boo. I'm sure that will prevent it from happening. The fact that I can provide to you is that the vast majority of Michigan fans are not in agreement with you evidenced by 80%+ fans booing at the game, which is a more substantive fact than your perception of players feelings.
November 10th, 2013 at 10:23 AM ^
I would make it my mission to outlaw booing. I'd lobby local and state legislatures to pass ordinances against booing and then I'd have any fan caught booing arrested. Next I'd work to create some sort of futuristic technology that could determine if a fan were booing in their head or thinking about booing and have them shipped off to gitmo.
November 10th, 2013 at 9:51 AM ^
My response was also not terrible, and the fact that you've chosen to derail the conversation rather than address any of my points, tells me it is you who has no good response.
All you've said is nonsense.
November 10th, 2013 at 10:04 AM ^
OH MY GOD, YOU ARE AN IDIOT, THEY WEREN'T BOOING THE PLAYERS AND THE PLAYERS KNOW IT
November 10th, 2013 at 9:22 AM ^
Tl;dr - Coaches better perform if you don't want people to boo after charging us to sit in our seats.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:13 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 7:43 AM ^
The starting price for a Detroit Lions ticket is $47. Without the seat license. http://www.detroitlions.com/tickets/individual-tickets.html
While there should be a respect for the players, those involved in the multi-million dollar enterprise are fair game. ESPECIALLY from those shelling out thousands of dollars a year to see it in person.
November 10th, 2013 at 8:44 AM ^
See I thought so too but apparently I was wrong. I've learned over the past 12 hours that once you sign up for season tickets you are obligated to keep renewing them, regardless of cost, regardless of the performance of the team or YOU ARE A FAIR WEATHER FAN!
What I find especially hilarious is that for the most part - those telling me that my desire to tell Brandon to shove my tickets straight up Borges's ass makes me a fair weather fan are NOT season ticket holders and have no money invested in the team. I guess it's a lot easier to spend other people's money and time than your own
November 10th, 2013 at 8:49 AM ^
Anyone who says you're not a real fan because you choose not to renew your season tickets is dumb.
That is the way you voice your displeasure.
Stop buying stuff.
Stop going to games.
Leave DB's office a message or fire off an email.
Booing, or haranguing players and coaches is not the way. It is a net negative for the program.
November 10th, 2013 at 9:03 AM ^
here here
November 10th, 2013 at 9:03 AM ^
We're on the same page then. But read the comments made in response to both mine and others saying we've had enough and arent going to financially support this crap anymore. You'll hear the term "fair weather fan" bantered about quite a bit and especially by those who invest nothing on their own.
I know you are a season ticket holder like me so I have to ask. How in the Hell can you watch that and not be totally disgusted by what Borges is doing out there? I feel sorry for our players right now and not cause they're getting boo'd. You used the musical analogy in another post, I agree with it but not in the same way. I see Borges as a director making the performers sing horrible songs that make no sense that the audience clearly hates. I makes them keep singing them cause he thinks the reason the audience hates them is cause they're slightly off-key. But it really doesnt matter cause the song is horrible either way.
I see Borges like that. Or a retarded cow. Both work.
November 10th, 2013 at 9:28 AM ^
borges is conducting a choir where he has a few guys who haven't had much formal teaching. so what does he do? he puts them front and center for all to hear loudly and out of tune; instead of featuring the guys on the sides who know what they are doing and sound great. in fact, every now and then he does feature those other guys and it works. but then he reverts back to giving the young guys solo opporunities and it fails. and then the audience complains about the concert.
November 10th, 2013 at 9:27 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 9:11 AM ^
but I still want your tickets !
November 10th, 2013 at 12:19 AM ^
But did fans reference Yost and Crisler, as if it somehow belies criticism, when times got tough the way that we reference Bo? Obviously, there weren't message boards, etc. But, it seems like we've been living in Bo's shadow for 25 years.
I understand our devotion to tradition, and I love it (I'm a historian by trade). But, I have to say that it seems like we're constantly looking for the next Bo rather than the next great coach. Our clinging to Bo by the fan base almost feels like an albatross now. None of the kids on the team were alive when he coached at Michigan.
It strikes me as odd that every single time there's criticism of a coach we hear a quote from a coach who coahed in 1989. Is it relevant? Sure, I guess, in the same way that quotes from Abraham Lincoln might be.
Lloyd Carr won a national title and was a play or two from playing for another one. He's also alive.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:20 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:37 AM ^
If you don't understand then you shouldn't be a Michigan fan. If you don't believe in team work, in playing tough, playing fundamentally sound, and doing so ethically then you should cheer for some other team.
Bo set the standards for this program. 13 Big Ten titles, almost 10 wins a year, and doing so in a manner that made Michigan fans proud to be supporters.
November 10th, 2013 at 2:18 AM ^
and had an atrocious bowl record. He did not "set the standard." He revived it. Our program's greatest coach is Yost, which is why I don't get the hero worship of Bo.
Our Bear Bryant is Fielding Yost. Bo Schembechler is our Gene Stallings.
That's not a disparagement. It's just a side by side comparison of coaches who coached Michigan before our entire team was born. I certainly hope that our standards are higher than spoiling Ohio State's chances at national titles and trying to stay competitive against the Pac 12 in Pasadena.
November 10th, 2013 at 8:08 AM ^
http://fishduck.com/2011/09/the-michigan-series-how-oregon-demolished-1…
No one will be writing one of those articles in 2020.
In the 50s-60s, Michigan was just another football program with occasional success, the 1964 Rose Bowl win season. And then Bo took over and turned it back into a perennial Top 10 program, one of the handful of programs that were college football's elite. Just about EVERY year.
Bo's success contributed mightily to the resources that support the football program today. The $227 million stadium renovation, the practice facilities. The preference Michigan gets in bowl selections and TV appearances. Gary Moeller's and Lloyd Carr's maintenance-of-a-great-program level of success.
In a way, you're right, that's fading away, as we wait and hope for for the next Michigan resurrection.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:30 AM ^
It doesn't matter how long ago a person lived or coached. What matters is the meaning behind the words spoken.
We would be wise to heed the words of Abraham Lincoln. His words are much more relevant than anything you or 99.999% of humanity has uttered or written.
And what you believe came from the minds of people who lived long ago. So do the rights you enjoy. So yes, the past is relevant.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:00 AM ^
obviously not relevant when it comes to winning football games, which, correct me if im wrong, is what football is all about
November 10th, 2013 at 8:11 AM ^
but perenially suck at football? (But for the occasional Pillsbury Throwboy)
Because the past does matter in attracting current success.
November 10th, 2013 at 10:10 AM ^
then why aren't princeton, harvard, and yale good at football? minnesota has 7 national championships. teams are good consistently because of the year prior, kentucky is good this year not because they were good 20 years ago but because they were good last year and put a bunch of players in the nba, and if they are good next year its because they were good this year and put a bunch of players in the nba. this isnt rocket science
November 10th, 2013 at 11:24 AM ^
They spend a ton of money on coaching. They didn't go to Calipari and say, hey, Adolph Rupp created this great program, would you like to take a discount and come coach here?
No. They said, we're a program with tradition, we SHOULD pay top dollar to maintain it. Just like Alabama and Saban. That includes top assistants, etc.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:18 AM ^
So yes, I agree with you. I literally write history books about people like Lincoln. There's a difference between learning from the past and hero worshipping to the point of it being an impediment.
The OP basically says, hey, things look good at times, here's a Bo quote, if you criticize Hoke you're going against this Bo quote. Bo has basically become a crutch for those who like Hoke because he really like Michigan the way we all do.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:37 AM ^
I think you might be on to something. I think Michigan and Nebraska both have a hard time with this.
Honest to god, not once during osu's coaching searches did I ever hear anyone say that they need to try and find the next Woody. Never. Not once. They realize Woody made their program, but they don't reference him like we reference Bo. Maybe it does hold us back. In fact, I'm pretty sure it does hold us back.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:55 AM ^
They don't reference him like we reference Bo? Have you ever seen a Dead Schembechler's performance?
Really, all OSU needed to do to find the "next Woody" after the generally unpopular Cooper years (a guy hired in no small part because he beat Michigan in a Rose Bowl) was get a guy who could do what Tressel did in his first public minutes on the job: Get to center court, make a boilerplate glad-to-be-here speech, and close with a timeless, Woody-esque atom bomb of a quote about Michigan. They had a guy who got it like Woody did (and not the way Cooper didn't). Unluckily for us, he proved it on the field.
And Nebraska went through the dark ages with Callahan in a much different way than we did with RR. Callahan pretty much did everything he could to go scorched-earth on Tom Osborne's program. This wasn't a RR misunderstanding/miscommunication, but an obvious attempt to put his stamp on it while doing away with what was still working when he got there. He had the power of an entire state against him by the time it was over.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:07 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 1:13 AM ^
As I said, I like the tradition. What Alabama doesn't do is constantly reference Bear for every single thing they do. They also didn't go to Saban and say you get the honor of coaching where Bear coached in order to lure him. They gave him an 8 year 32 million dollar base salary.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:34 AM ^
Actually that's really not true. Alabama and Michigan are very similar in those terms. Alabama was constantly trying to find their next ''Bear'' after Bear left. And yes, they were using those exact words. They went through 13 years of shit until they lucked into firing Shula at the perfec time and Saban leaving Miami at the perfect time. They truely did find their next ''Bear'' and that was damn hard to do. But there are probably not two better coaches in college football history than Bear and Saban, and reality is Michigan is not going to find one similar to either of them.
November 10th, 2013 at 1:46 AM ^
Gene Stallings won the national title. Franchione and Dubose both had successful seasons. They struggled with Shula (and sanctions) and eventually paid Saban. Nick Saban has never had to worry about Bear Bryant. He undoubtedly references him when useful and repsects what he did, but he's never been burdened by it the way our coaches are by Bo.
November 10th, 2013 at 5:33 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 7:19 AM ^
A lot of the old timers who speak with such reverence for Bo were also booing him at times, and jeering him about his playcalling and the whole, "football is 3 yards and a cloud of dust" mentality.
Don't let them fool you with their "in the good old days" shtick. Fandom has always been a crapwhole. If you actually take the time to read a lot of the things Bo and Yost said about "the fans," it's not exactly complimentary.
Most of it is along the lines of... The guy in section 24 booing right now and screaming about playcalling is an idiot. He can't tell you the first thing about what we're doing as a team. He hasn't been through the wars, the endless daily grind of practice. He hasn't given his blood, his sweat, his tears, his heart, his soul, to Michigan. He's just some stupid guy. Ignore him.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:14 AM ^
We are not an unusual fanbase. We expect to win, many of us handle it poorly when we lose. No fanbase is free of these issues. Not Alabama, not Florida (did you see the empty crowd pic this morning?), not Tennessee, not Washington, not Oregon, not Ohio State, not Texas, nobody. Why do you think TWIS exists?
November 10th, 2013 at 12:14 AM ^
I'm not fucking reading your novel. This team is a joke. Borges is like a retarded cow that keeps trying to get through the electric fence. Our coach says the same thing after every fucking game. The fans are the only ones acting like they give a fucking shit!
November 10th, 2013 at 12:23 AM ^
It's past your bedtime.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:25 AM ^
The cow comment wasn't nice but I did laugh.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:28 AM ^
You're right mentally challenged cows everywhere should be offended. I honestly don't know why I can't stop caring about this team. Why does Michigan football have this much impact on my life?
November 10th, 2013 at 12:53 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:28 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:37 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:43 AM ^
Yeah I worded that poorly. I'm mad at coaches not players.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:15 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:33 AM ^
November 10th, 2013 at 12:19 AM ^
I wasn't there but I would have been booing with the fans if I had. I'm sick of Hoke and Borges turning in abysmal performances then putting the blame on the players by saying "we just didn't execute." At some point you've got to realize it's not the execution, it's the gameplan.
This in conjuction, with the changes to basketball season tickets and to student seating at football games does not make we want to support this program at all.
And the worst part of all of this is that Brady Hoke just doesn't care. He doesn't yell at the refs when they miss a call, he doesn't show any excitement when we score a touchdown, he isn't angry when the O-line misses their assignment time after time. I hate how everybody lauded his hiring because he was a "Michigan Man." You don't get to be a Michigan Man just because you were an assistant coach here once. You've got to go to the school. Hoke went to Ball State. Cut him loose.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:27 AM ^
CE - sparty gonna spart.
November 10th, 2013 at 12:54 AM ^
Bo, Yost, and Crisler did not attend UM and they are the ones who defined what a "Michigan Man" is.
Yelling is not a sign of anything. Bill Walsh did not scream nor did Tom Osborne. And acutally, Hoke is plenty demonstrative enough. He isn't Jim Schwartz, but he does some emotion on the sideline.
November 10th, 2013 at 7:21 AM ^
Bill Belichick is probably the greatest living football coach and he has the personality of a dead moth mixed with grumpy cat on the sidelines.