...msu started from the 50 for most of the game. We didn't move the ball well and didn't give our guys a break. Sure the defense wasn't great but comon now
The Snowflake Thread: Coaching
that's why we should fire the OC. . .
They are no better now than they were when RR was in his 3rd year
Actually we are worse. In RR's third year the team was on a upswing, and the following year won the Sugar Bowl with his players and scheme. Under Brady the team has regressed each year.
Whoa there- we definitely did not run RR's defensive scheme in 2011.
You meant "In my opinion" rather than "actually".
In this world, this team is better than any of RRs teams, and the program is much healthier. We even recruit linemen.
When your baseline is 3-9, it's hard not to be on an "upswing."
Wow. You've got some reall twisted logic there. It's kind of entertaining to watch, but doesn't make much sense.
-48 yard rushing for the game, makes 27 for 27 look amazing!
Guys I usually do not respond on this site, but I feel as a proud alum, I need to say this. Until Michigan lets go of the past, we will never be able to compete in the future. We always want to pull up the all time records against other teams that happened 20-30 years ago. Those days are gone. Bo football is gone. Those days were great, but we are well past that. You insisted on hiring a coach who was in touch with tradition and not with winning. Meyer and Dantonio don't give a crap about tradition, they care about winning now. They are trying to create their own legacy and tradition. Our fan base want the coaches to live up to the tradition of a man that coached 30 years ago. If they are not in touch with that tradition, they will be cast of into the abyss. If we are serious about becoming relevant again , we need to get rid of this michigan man nonsense and hire a quality coach. Period. We have a share if a national championship in the last 50 years. We can do better. But we need to stop blindly following this team. Dave Brandon is milking this thing and taking advantage of all of us. He has not put a quality product on the field in a couple years. As long as we keep buying tickets, he will continue to increase prices. Stop buying tickets until we get a quality coaching staff to go along with our top of the line facilities.
MSU before taking the head jobs? They both are very much about the tradition of their respective schools.
I do realize that.. You don't hear these guys saying "we need to get back to michigan football" or " this is Michigan". The are of few words and they go out there and win.
I can maybe see your point about Meyer, but not Dantonio - he's all about bringing back the Perles/Saban days at MSU. There's nothing particularly innovative about him - he's just an old-school power football guy.
Let's count the number of national championships saban has to the number Carr, Bo, moeller, rr and hoke. Get my drift.
I couldn't agree more.
Thank you sir. At some point, as a fan base, we have to be honest with ourselves.
If as a program the coaches set the bar high for Michigan, you must act when players and coaches do not meet that bar. Funk MUST be fired to send a message and Borges really needs to go too. Also need to pull Gardner for a series at least when he literally takes steps backwards. He played like a scared little girl. We might have just lost a couple key recruits, especially Hand and McDowell.
the kid finishes his 5 step drop and gets dropped. . . the poor guy had post traumatic stress after that game. .
Including Hoke should be seriously evaluated at the end of the year. Not saying fire him or him, but if there are better options at any spot, including Head Coach a change should be considered. The excuses of youth, QB, OC, RB, Rich Rod etc, are getting old. This is big boy football and 3 years is enough to not be embarrassed by teams that are on par or slightly better or worse than freaking Michigan. Especially with the recruits that have come in the last 2 years.
Evaluate all but get Funk out now. On pretty much any other team in the B1G I think our linemen play much better. No one in their right mind can defend the development and play of this disaster of an O Line
I hope we don't lose any recruits because of this.
Hand wants to win. I see him going to bama or FL. We lost out because our team plays poorly. Every big named kid wants to play for a winner. We just need to try to get those hidden 3 star gems.
...why would he go to Florida?
...but I doubt there are many recruits reading this thread, so I'm not going to worry about their reaction to it.
I would tell him his job his on the line depending on the outcome of the season. With two weeks to prepare I expected more. Sad
He is going to get killed next year. This line can't help mobile quarterbacks. Statues like Shane are going to get busted.
Shane would get destroyed by this OL. A pro style QB would get destroyed behind an even younger OL in 2014. But Devin will be here in 2014... SHane begins in 2015 when in theory this AWESOME RECROOOTING pays off on the OL as they are upperclassmen finally.
Because Devin Gardner is leaving early for the NFL draft. I mean, the Browns would still pick him in the first round, but no. Devin is coming back.
Serious question: Is there an OC who Hoke can get to come to UM who is known? I dont know if he has the connections to do so. Also could coach Heck be an OC?
Who cares if he's known? Did anyone know Narduzzi?
No but you have people who believe that its not all Narduzzi when it comes to the D. And when I say known, I mean known as a great offensive mind. And yes it does because our HC is not an offensive guy and gives he gives his coordinators total control.
he's young. He can develop quarterbacks and he can recruit. . .
Guys, I understand everyone is upset with the loss. But, putting historical consideration aside, is it that difficult to understand why MSU is better than Michigan at this point? Dantonio took over in 2007, and dominated in-state recruiting until just recently. I keep going back to the "pipeline" issue and so many just disregard it as if I am claiming it's aliens or something. Michigan's pipeline broke down, and MSU not only remained in tact, but it actually benefitted from Michigan's breakdown. Right when Michigan was descending, MSU was ascending. The upperclassmen on both teams were recruited in 2009 or 2010, right after Michigan's 3-9 season, or a year later amidst the RR turmoil. The 2009 and 2010 recruits should be the backbone of both teams, and they are for MSU, not so much for Michigan.
Again, is it THAT hard to understand? I know Michigan fans vehmently refuse to admit that MSU can be better than Michigan. But, it sure seems pretty obvious to me that they are, and the reasons WHY they are better are pretty obvious as well.
Now, in terms of today. This was pretty much what I expected to see. MSU defense is the best in the nation, and Michigan cannot run nor pass block with any effectiveness. MSU had no respect for the run, and as they just came after Gardner. I thought Borges called as many quick passes as possible, he tried to screen them, and basically called a decent game given the fact that he knew he was going to be one-dimensional. With no pass blocking, even when going max protect, it's hard to air it out. Press coverage, blitzes up the middle, and that's all she wrote.
I realize that many of you think I am an apologist for this coaching staff, and I suppose that I may be. But, it is only because I think that the struggles are roster based, and that unless those roster issues are resovled, the next guy (if there is one) will struggle as well.
The MSU coaches are good. They can coach up 2 and 3 stars into awsome college football players. It may not this big of a blow out, but Michigan wil most likely lose again next year in East Lansing. We lose both Lewan and Schofield.
We understand what you are saying, but we all still think we have the talent to play and call a better game on both sides of the ball. We do not accept the fact that we are underperforming so badly. Can you understand why we feel this way?
I most certainly understand why you, et. al., feel the way you do. But, that is why I have always been emphasizing personnel issues as if you really understood them, you might not feel as pessimistic as you do now. When you say what you said above, it indicates to me that you intellectually understand what you're seeing, but emotionally you cannot bring yourself to admit just how far Michigan football had sunk at the end of Carr's tenure and into RR's three seasons. I know it's hard, but an honest look at the roster/recruiting issues is so important.
An unwillingness to accept what is the ultimate cause of poor performance is not how a multi-million dollar organization should operate. For example, University of Florida was recruiting lights out under Zook, but they weren't getting the performance they expected out of those recruits. They hire the young hotshot Meyer, and bang he wins an NC and looks like a hero. But, if you read what Meyer said about that first NC team, he gives credit to Zook for giving him a roster fulll of experienced and talented UPPERCLASSMEN. Look it up.
Again, I understand, and I am NOT saying that Hoke is the guys to get Michigan back to the promised land (although in my now too big gut, I feel he will be) I am saying that unless he's given time to rebuild the pipeline, the next guy will struggle as well. If he isn't the guy (because of development and game management issues) but he's able to turn the program over with a roster of experienced upperclassmen, the next guy can succeed.
Try the 2011 Michigan team where Hoke inherited a few high quality very veteran pieces from Carr's recruiting and Rich's development, including the most devastating two way player in the nation. With that schedule, it was enough to win double digit games (with a little luck, see ND and VT)
The Rodriguez firing was about trajectory, direction, and sustainability. How do you want this thing to look in 10 years? It wasn't about whether Rodriguez would win 8 to 10 games at Michigan in year 4 or 5, because he likely would have.
The only way to know if the Hoke direction is the correct direction and whether it is sustainable, is to allow the boys to become upper classmen. Year 3 is too early on that front and is for any coach.
What we do know:
Recruiting is very good to elite by any objective measure. Veteran players have stuck by this guy and had some break out years playing for him and the staff even though he didn't recruit them. There is now definite NFL talent on the roster in guys like Lewan (3 years of development), Funchess (year 2) and Gardner (year 3). There are also borderline NFL level guys like Ross (year 2) and Ryan (year 3)
It could get better or it could get worse, but it's simply too early to judge. As emotional as we all are, we'd do well to try to face that.
What he said word for word.
I agree with an earlier post about the defense today being a slightly bigger worry. Scheme wise, I think you have to be more aggressive against a guy like Cook and force him to make plays quickly and precisely. The longer he has to sit and wait for an open man to emerge, the more likely there will be an open man. Maybe use the athleticism you are recruiting and get them moving more in space like State does.
The Michigan offense needed big plays in the passing game to produce points against this defense. Every one knew it going in. Those plays are hard to come by with such little time play after play.
All this soft or not soft talk is a bunch of junk. Michigan is very young in the middle of the offensive line and ran into a veteran defense that attacks that area very very well.
People act surprised. They shouldn't be. Embarrassed is fine, but don't let it linger.
Unfortunately for all you impatient types, we can't honestly conclude anything about this staff and player development for another year or two minimum. Right now it's too many kids against too many men on other teams bringing disaster in certain games.
MSU played the men role to the extreme today and it was ugly.
Now about Coach Funk. The line does look disorganized in the middle and has all year, but let's see how it rebounds the rest of the year. This was not a good one to judge improvement because this is an excellent veteran defense at home.
There aren't easy answers. Continue to work and continue to give it time.
Its time to stop with the michigan arrogance. We are bad, our program is bad. This is no longer a top 10 program with the shape it is in now. It is pathetic.
We need to stop with the little brother shit, stop criticizing osu and calling them "Ohio," stop with all the bullshit. We are no longer int hat position.
We are not in the position to say "We will win this game, duh. Because we are michigan." We thought we had escaped the valley of death when RR left and we won the sugar bowel. Joke is on us.
Time to realize what this program has become, and will continue to be for the forseable future, and that is completely mediocre.
I love Michigan and Michigan football, but just fucking stop. We aren't who we think we are, the program isn't what we thought it was. We are a shadow of the pride and arrogance we proclaim week in and week out.
Other than ND, UM has been the worst performing "blue blood" program for 2 decades now. And if you want to say 1 National title offsets YEARS of 3-4 losses i guess you can. But we are a paper tiger but the fan base still thinks it is 1985.
Like a bitch. Are you on the team with that "we" shit?
I am obviously saying we as fans you dumb cunt. Does it hurt reading something you know is true? Are you one of those people that has your head shoved so far up your ass you cant smell the shit emminating from Ann Arbor the last 10 years?
We are not specail anymore, we are not a top program anymore. Crucify me for saying it, ban me, idc its the fucking truth and all of the competetnt fans, like the one above knows it is the truth.
Fire Brandon so I can at least afford to bring my kids to games and not get lied to.
If you think the high ticket prices are strictly Brandon's idea, you'll be sorely disappointed by his successor.
Get a better paying job.
Don't make this about Brandon. Thread is for discussing the coaches.
douche comment of the year