That makes sense to me. Minnesota has totally kicked our ass the past couple years.
Sid Hartman loses his mind re: Kill v Hoke
Old age can really fuck with your brain, huh?
He is 93...
70 years older than you!
Oh, surprise surprise, another insightful post!
Anyways, Kill does actually have a pretty good record of turning bad teams into good teams. Not that I don't admire Hoke, but Kill does have some strong talking points.
Took over Southern Ill. U. in 2001. Went 1-10 first season. By 2007 they were 10-2 and had been improving every year. He went 6-7 in 2008 at Northern Ill. U and was 10-3 (undefeated in conference) two years later. He then went 3-9 in his first year and 6-7 his second at Minn.
Honestly, the guy has proven that he can make a losing team win. Hoke just did it a lot faster.
You would know why that's a problem, wouldn't you?
Relevant; someone should find a way to get this to this guy:
I am going to miss Denard
Check your tense
One guy gets to coach Michigan, one gets to coach Minnesota. Perhaps a peek at the scoreboard is also in order. Yep, just as I thought. No Sugar Bowl win or 58-0 dusting in the little brown jug game for Kill.
I actually find the fact that Brady Hoke turned down Minnesota one year before getting hired by Michigan funnier for some reason. It's just that Minnesota's AD obvious had a good judge of character, but Hoke wasn't walking across the country for just any program.
It wasn't the year before, but just a few weeks before we offered Hoke. They fired Brewster during the 2010 season.
Finger spasm double post.
Scoreboard. I am unconcerned.
Clearly the words of a person that doesn't understand how scoreboards work.
(Subject line wasn't large enough to hold my laughter).
I don't know. It's like trying to compare the Egg Genie to the Flowbee, cain't go wrong with either one.
After all of these years the concept of the Flowbee still seems to hold up. It just makes sense.
93? Put him down.
Watch it... watch it...
You'll never win a political office if you make AARP your enemy.
HEY(!) Who told you you could stop signing your posts(!) There are RULES here.
C'mon, make up your minds people. Half the time I get yelled at by people FOR signing and half for NOT.
Don't worry, I'll alternate to piss off both groups.
I do not think it means what you think it means.
I belive proper grammer in this case would be "Sid Hartman lost his mind"
Like about 30 years ago.....
Let's pony up and see if we can hire Kill away from Minny. Not only is he kicking ass on the field, he's killing us on the recruiting trail as well.
They are too good, I dont want to mess with them and anger them more.
For the record, Sid Hartman is a senile old man that has spent the last bunch of years making an ass of himself and ruining the legacy that he had. I don't think he represents the thoughts of any Gopher fans.
A twitter search for Sid Hartman will give you a sense of how he represented himself at the press conference today. Apparently he asked something along the lines of, "Mr. AD, you're suppose to be a basketball genius, why did it take you so long?" (Note: The search took 9 days)
Hey probably meant turned out better as in Hoke would have left Minnesota after only one year.
This quote summarizes Sid Hartman's role perfectly in Minnesota's sports media. Despite his age, he remains one of the most connected members of the media and routinely writes breaking information. (This is the first time I heard MN offered Hoke) Because of his age, he is becoming senile and makes statements that make no sense. (Yeah, that Brown Jug is not going anywhere)
That story Kills me.
as much as the fact that he's just a fucking idiot.
I am very happy to have Hoke at UM (yes this UM not that one).
However, it is really hard to point to 58-0 and thus conclude one coach is better than the other. The only real test of that would be creating some alternative universe where Hoke coaches Minnesota and have Kill coach here. In that case, does anyone really think Hoke and the Gophers would win 58-0?
As Bear Bryant (supposedly) said: "I can take mine and beat yours, and I can take yours and beat mine." Not sure if that's true here. Forceful argument on either side is just guesswork.
I think the point is a lot simpler: it's absurd to call one coach better than a guy who beat him 58-0. Hartman is literally making that claim.
That Hoke's teams have twice beaten Kill's teams soundly is not indisputable evidence that he is a better coach than Kill, given that he inherited a better program - but it sure isn't any kind of evidence in the other direction.
It's whether Kill's Wolverines WOULD win 58-0.
I'd take a wild guess and say probably not.
I just don't see how you can consider Kill a good hire. Minnesota is an extremely long term rebuilding project for anyone and Kill is likely going to have his career cut short by medical issues. Unless Minnesota gets lucky and Kill can groom an assistant to replace him, they're going to be wandering in the wilderness within a couple of years.
I will never understand the fascination with Jerry Kill. I get that he has seizuers and that is sad and everything, but he isn't a good coach or recruiter. How long can an illness keep someone employed who is unsuccessful in their position? I just don't get it.
The problem with your argument is that he hasn't been unsuccessful at his position.
His records have steadily improved everywhere he's been. At Minnesota he went 3-9, then 6-7. At Northern Illinois he went from 6-7 to 10-3. At Southern Illinois he went from 1-10 to 4-8 to 10-2 to 9-4 to 12-2.
So you're saying following records for three years at a program would be a succes?
I think you're going to need therapy to get over Rich Rod. He's not coming back.
Rich Rod replaced Lloyd Carr. Jerry Kill replaced Tim Brewster. Therein lies the key distinction.
Was Michigan as bad as Minnesota pre-Kill (hint: Minnesota was 3-9), Northern Illinois pre-Kill (hint: Northern Illinois was 2-10), etc.?
Kill also had 10-win seasons in his third year at Minnesota and Northern Illinois, something Rodriguez did not accomplish.
So it's not the same thing.
(hint: it was your stupid analogy)
It must suck to lose an argument to your hated rival.
You are such a fucking moron.
Jerry Kill's winning percentage at Minnesota (.409) is actually a shade better than Rich Rodriguez's at Michigan (.405). That kind of sums it up right there. When the Michigan coach delivers Minnesota results, he will not be long for the job.
It depends on the program you're at, in my opinion. At Michigan, no, that's a failure on all accounts. But when you're at a school like Minnesota that has been a football laughingstock for decades, those little baby steps in the right direction can be considered success. The question is just where is the coach's ceiling and how far can he take the team. I don't think Kill will be able to recruit like Hoke and Meyer, but if he can be like Bielema, find the right guys for his system and effectively develop them, I think they can return to a level where they're at least competitive in every game, maybe have some 8-9 win seasons.
What standard are you using to say that? He's at one of the worst tire-fires in major college football and it looks like he's turning them around, which he seems to have a good track record of doing.
I doubt Minnesota is about to bring its program back to where it was during the Great Depression, and I don't think Kill is as good of a coach as Hoke, but I'm not sure many people would say that Kill is failing, either.
6-7 isn't failing?
I'm so glad you aren't the coach of any team I anm a fan of.
Past program success can't define your definition of success. I don't care if you are the coach of Alabama or SW St. Louis State CC, you had damn well better define success as winning every game yougo out and play if you are a coach.
If I were a coach 6-7 would very much be considered a failure.
Well then I guess just about every coach in the NCAA is a failure, and therefore, nobody is qualified to be coaching at any school. Football should probably just be dropped as a sport, and Nick Saban should hang his head in shame for not winning every game last year.
Why are you trolling me so much? What is it with you and trolling me? I'm back from Bolivia and all you can do is troll me? Why don't you go write something horrible about some of our players on your sweet e-blog.
For some reason, I just picture you as one of the guys who drives a $4,000 1999 Honda Civic with $5,000 rims, an extended spoiler, massive stereo system, and the muffler removed. When you drive by, people lower their heads with slight embarassment, but then smile and nod to themselves ever so slightly... remembering that at least they're not you.
The stuff I get sent to Bolivia for is nothing compared to bullshit like this.
I'm actually a pretty normal guy. Drive a nice mid-2000's car. Nothing too fancy. No after market mufflers for me. I think they are a waste of money. No after market rims either. I am saving for a truck to help me start my own business this year. Looking to star a little LLC to keep me busy on the side. I have a bachelors from a directional Michigan and a MBA from The University of Michigan.
I do hate old people though. They smell like shit and they drive too slowly for my liking. Always fearful of change. Whenever I pass one I quietly think to myself, they should be more happy, you know? If they were born in any other time in humanity they would be long dead by now yet they find a way to not only be upest and surly about next to nothing, but they sit around and complain about every little thing. And they are poor tippers. Nothing like abusing the service lady who brings your coffee not quite fast enough every morning and then leaving her a nickel.
So, yea that's my only real problem. Old people. Oh and fat stupid fucking morons. Two little things that annoy me is all. Two little insignificant things. Meaningless really. Completely meaningless to the world. Useless if I do say so myself.
It makes me sad that you have a degree from Michigan. Really sad.
Oh well, like they say, don't like a few bad apples spoil the whole basket!
I'm happy you're still here, Herm.
Thank you. I actually like you more than david from wyoming. That guy is a real chachbag. You and I just don't see eye to eye. Oh well, live and learn right?
Have a good one.
Have yourself a nap, Herm.
You do understand I do this just to needle you right?
I'll make you a deal. You give up your fake schtick, racism and sexism and I'll stop driving you nuts.
A guy who's truly as old as your avatar wouldn't even know what $5,000 rims are.
Herm has admitted he isn't an old man before. It's all fake.
You could have Bill Belichick at head coach, Chip Kelly as OC, Nick Saban at DC and the rest of the Big Ten head coaches taking positions and I doubt there's any way Minnesota does appreciably better than 6-7. Would you continue to employ that staff at 6-7, or should they not be employed because of their failure?
Coaching won't take Minnesota's current roster into Ann Arbor or Columbus or Madison or Lincoln with more than a prayer at winning; it's Kill's job to upgrade that roster and it looks like he's doing a good job at that.
I'm sorry, man. That staff would kick ass no matter where they coached. That's insane to think what a coaching staff like that could do.
with Alabama's roster would roll Minnesota's roster with that staff, and it wouldn't be close. One Marquise Gray doesn't make up for an entire defense that will be on an NFL roster in a year or two, no matter how good the coaching is, and we saw what happened against their OL with a DL far superior to anything Minnesota could put on the field.
That's my entire point in a nutshell, really; if Kill doesn't have a roster capable of beating lower tier Big Ten teams in a year or two and getting through OOC at 4-0 or 3-1, then maybe consider he might be failing. No amount of coaching would allow Minnesota to win all their games last year and even that staff would probably get one extra win, possibly two (Texas Tech and Northwestern were their only losses by single digits).
Exactly. Even the great coaches go through some downturns or some rebuilding years, including guys like Nick Saban.
You didn't just say 6-7 is "UNACCEPTABLE" literally five minutes after a post defending Rich Rod's record, did you?
To be fair, he was arguing with me. So he'll say just about anything to try to prove me wrong.
Holy cow . . . I thought you were joking about him being 93. Other interesting facts: he's a high-school dropout and was the first GM of the Lakers.
"This is Minnesota, fer-god-sakes!" just doesn't have the same ring to it.
but it's apples and oranges comparing the Individual success of Hoke and Kill.
I wonder if Sid Hartman's comment was tongue in cheek? He doesn't like the AD Norman Teague, disagreed with the firing of Tubby, disagrees with hiring the young, new unexperienced Richard Pitino to replace Tubby. He is noted, from his biograpy, of making outrageous comments to bring sense of humor to his sports radio program. So maybe his comments are a way to sort of needle Norman Teague for his recent hirings???
Good luck spinning that story Hartman. Because when I think of Brady Hoke, it is hard to ignore the many years he dedicated to Gopher football.
Hiw has he turned out better?
And this is coming from a guy that thinks Kill is a goodo coach. But this is craziness.
Sid Hartman can't look me in the eye and tell me that Kill, who's squad has been beaten soundly by a combined score of 93-13 over the past two years, is a better coach than Hoke. He's been out-coached, out-classed, and thoroughly out-recruited. Both were relative unknowns when they came into their respective jobs, came from mid-level schools that get little attention, and while Kill may one day get Minnesota to a 10 or 11-win season, Hoke won 11 games and a BCS bowl in his first year. Kill won 3.
A lot of people might say that Kill doesn't have the same resources at Minnesota as Hoke has at Michigan, and I wouldn't argue that, but resources only get you so far. Have to be able to coach and get the most out of your players, even if they're not "your guys." Hoke did that.
Hartman just sounds like a bitter, senile old man. The last remnant of a pack of hopeless Gopher fans hanging onto the glory days of Depression-era Minnesota football. Wake up, pal. It's not 1935 anymore. Your program hasn't been relevant in decades. Just be thankful you've got a guy who at least seems to have your school on the path to respectability.
Is this a seizure joke? I can't tell.