StoneRoses

February 7th, 2014 at 2:38 PM ^

I'm honestly stunned by this development. I wonder now what this is going to do to our D-line play, because if they improve significantly, then what was Hoke doing trying to micromanage this part of the team.

Joined: 05/30/2012

MGoPoints: 510

StoneRoses

February 7th, 2014 at 2:48 PM ^

Clearly...

I'm honestly want to see now how much of a difference this makes on the D-line play because I've always thought that a HC's job is to oversee all of the position coaches and not Role-Play as one. I think it will be better having one coach who will specifically coach the D-line rather than manage the whole team and then coach the D-line.

Joined: 05/30/2012

MGoPoints: 510

DonAZ

February 7th, 2014 at 2:51 PM ^

>> because if they improve significantly, then what was Hoke doing trying to micromanage this part of the team.

Let's assume the D-Line play does improve.  Some thoughts come to mind:

  • Players were a little intimidated having the HC coach their position?
  • Mark Smith better at the nuts-and-bolts of coaching than Hoke?

Hoke said he did the position coach thing to "stay grounded" or something like that.  Maybe he's come to the realization it's just better for the team for him to step back and let others manage that level of the system.

Joined: 12/05/2011

MGoPoints: 16679

WolvinLA2

February 7th, 2014 at 2:59 PM ^

But the DL could improve simply because of the players.  Maybe returning so much talent on the ends will make the job of the DTs that much easier?  Maybe returning all starting LBs (and having JMFR full-go) will make teams game plan differently?  Maybe an improved secondary will have a similar effect?  

Regardless of the change, positive or negative, it will be hard to say how much, if anything, is do to this rather small shake up.

Joined: 11/13/2009

MGoPoints: 58191

DonAZ

February 7th, 2014 at 3:07 PM ^

>> But the DL could improve simply because of the players.

I almost had that as one of the bullets -- "Players one year more improved."   Let's cross our fingers and hope for a healthy and improved Pipkins.

>> it will be hard to say how much, if anything, is do to this rather small shake up.

Someone needs to work up some before and after charts. :-)

Whatever the cause, I'd sure love to see some improvement on the DL interior.  I'm no expert, but I've heard some say that it all starts on the inside.  If the inside gets push, then the rest of the defense's job gets easier.  Therefore, if we could get better on the inside due to Hoke wearing polka-dot underwear ... then I'd argue for polka-dot underwear.

Joined: 12/05/2011

MGoPoints: 16679

getsome

February 7th, 2014 at 6:40 PM ^

if they improve on DL then hoke did his job as head coach, he found a way to improve the team overall.  stepping back and overseeing the entire program on daily basis could be what he feels he needs...maybe wants to get better feel for his team by focusing on all groups rather than just checking in with other position coaches and coordinators after DL sessions.  or maybe he just wants to free himself up to oversee installation of nussmeiers O as well as helping to mold his young OL, along with all other executive type tasks.  i always thought it was strange the way they had the D staff structured anyway (not criticizing, just curious allignment of responsibilities)- the DC and HC handling the DL groups while 2 assistants handle the ILB and OLB....just very odd, not sure ive ever heard of similar setup.  itd be great if the DL improves and they may marginally do so just due to natural progression and maturation of younger kids....but they also do not have enough talent yet to truly make a difference.  i think theyll be better and more sound on back end and might be better against the run after another year but i dont ensivion any drastic improvement in 2014 given the absence of pass rushers to win 1on1s  (unless charlton or someone skyrockets up with 9-10 sacks and the DTs chip in along with clarks likely 4-5 sacks - yes people frank clark will never be the all american or first team all leauger some continue to predict each offseason, he is what he is and thats a pretty decent ball player).  encouraging though to see hoke realizes changes needed to be made and a small shuffle on D hopefully freshens things up along with nussmeier on O

Joined: 09/07/2013

MGoPoints: 7385

DonAZ

February 7th, 2014 at 2:40 PM ^

Interesting development. 

Having a HC also be a position coach is not unheard of, is it?  (I think Saban is also secondary coach, if I'm not mistaken).  Still, if that distracts Hoke from his broader responsibilities, then on the whole this is a good sign, I think.

Joined: 12/05/2011

MGoPoints: 16679

WolvinLA2

February 7th, 2014 at 2:48 PM ^

You're right, it's not uncommon.  It's quite common for the HC to have a very big role in either a position group or an entire side of the ball, e.g. as the play caller.  

Since this isn't a huge change, I doubt we can say it was a good thing or a bad thing, even if the positions involved perform a little better or worse.  Though I think it's a good thing in the "let's shake things up" point of view.  

Joined: 11/13/2009

MGoPoints: 58191

FreddieMercuryHayes

February 7th, 2014 at 2:46 PM ^

I personally like it just from a resource management point. Having a whole coach for just one OLB position (Manning) was pretty much a waste. I just hope Smith is good at coaching DL as well. Maybe it was me, but I also didn't like having the DL coached as such a fractured unit. Like with Montgomery, GMatt had the WDE, Hoke had the NT, and Montgomery had the rest. I suppose it means more one on one time with a coach, but I feel like the DL needs to be coached more as a unit by one guy to develop the unit cohesiveness. Maybe this is 'feelings-ball' though.

Joined: 12/29/2010

MGoPoints: 40856

WolvinLA2

February 7th, 2014 at 2:51 PM ^

Having a guy like Roy Manning coach just one position isn't a waste because his biggest roles on the team are, youth, recruiting, and motivation.  He's also a good coach, so having him coach these positions isn't a bad thing either, but lots of teams have a guy who is a position coach for things other than his ability to coach a certain position.

Joined: 11/13/2009

MGoPoints: 58191

maizenbluenc

February 7th, 2014 at 7:01 PM ^

both times he went to linebacker camp. At least some of the leverage drills they teach the ILBs they also teach in the D-Line camp. Coach Smith seems like a detailed technique instructor / teaching kind of coach. He has a good presence, and is great at getting the reasons why behind the details across to young minds.

So my sense is the drills may differ, but the instruction skills are there.

Joined: 07/21/2009

MGoPoints: 10630

Avon Barksdale

February 7th, 2014 at 2:49 PM ^

I may have missed something. . . . . Who's going to coach DE's? I guess their production has been so great the last six years that they really do not need any guidance.

 

/s

Joined: 04/27/2013

MGoPoints: 12859

bluesalt

February 7th, 2014 at 2:52 PM ^

Maybe by increasing Smith's and Manning's duties, this is a way to keep either or both from being poached by another school (like whomever we lost to OK last year).

Joined: 11/02/2011

MGoPoints: 8490

Blue in Yarmouth

February 7th, 2014 at 2:54 PM ^

I think I like the move. I doubt this will diminish Hoke's involvement in the defense as a whole and it gives Roy more responsibility which I like as well. I would like to see them start grooming him to be GMAT's successor personally. 

Joined: 02/18/2009

MGoPoints: 6522

Sllepy81

February 7th, 2014 at 2:56 PM ^

we need to stop having D linemen in for 1-2 plays then sprint on and off the field. I used to be young, inshape and I'm big(lighter then dlinemen) but all that sprinting is wasting energy and you can see it sometimes especially against faster moving offenses they look tired before the snap getting in there stance from running back in the field. It's my biggest and only issues with Mattison, love the guy but leave guys who are having a great game in longer.

Joined: 01/02/2013

MGoPoints: 7976

Seth

February 7th, 2014 at 3:09 PM ^

In my post-liveblog text conversation with Brandon Williams he was talking up Roy. Ever since they were in school together there's been a belief by his teammates that Manning would end up a successful college coach. That's just his friends' opinion and that's pretty much what we have so far except we didn't get much pass rush out of the guys he's coaching.

What bothers me a little is if they're moving Smith down to defensive line, and on this staff that seems like a demotion, why didn't they just find Smith a cushy job elsewhere and jump at Larry Johnson Sr. when he became available? I think Johnson would have preferred Michigan to Ohio State, and that's the kind of coup that only comes around once in a lifetime. I understood that we weren't able to jump on it because Hoke coaches the DL. Now...

Joined: 10/14/2008

MGoPoints: 149089

FreddieMercuryHayes

February 7th, 2014 at 3:41 PM ^

Yeah, in retrospect this makes not taking a run at Johnson, well, very bad? Not to say it's downright terrible, and the Nuss hire was quite the coup itself, but man....Not even taking the chance to sweep in on Johnson seems like management to me. They had to have known the Smith move was coming, and putting an LB coach on the DL, all the while a universally well thought of, and experienced, DL coach landed at your rival? Ugh.

Joined: 12/29/2010

MGoPoints: 40856

Magnum P.I.

February 7th, 2014 at 4:00 PM ^

I agree with this sentiment very much. I wonder if we didn't pursue Larry Johnson or another big-name DL coach but were spurned. I mean, it's hard to attract top talent to what is perceived by many to be a coaching staff on the hot seat. Urban Meyer is much more stable in Columbus right now than Hoke is in Ann Arbor, and Hoke and staff would probably admit that off the record. 

Surprises the hell out of me that we got Nussmeier, all things considered. 

Joined: 07/16/2009

MGoPoints: 30622

I Like Burgers

February 7th, 2014 at 5:57 PM ^

Nuss was being encouraged to look around at Alabama since Saban wanted to bring in Kiffin.  That rumor was going around a few days before the Nussmeier hire.  Michigan wound up being a perfect landing spot for him.  If he turns around Michigan's offense and Michigan starts winning 10+ games a season, then he's as hot as of a head coaching candidate as there is.

And if things go awry at Michigan and he and the rest of the staff are out of a job in a year or two, he'd still be able to land a good OC position elsewhere as the failures at Michigan would be seen as Hoke's fault and not his.

Joined: 10/06/2012

MGoPoints: 30574