Except that it is. Sure white gets to move first, but somebody has to.
Mike Lantry, 1972
Except that it is. Sure white gets to move first, but somebody has to.
...but if you really want to tilt things back toward the defense, go back to the old rule that made any grasping by a blocker illegal, even if it was inside the frame of the body.
That was the biggest rules change of my lifetime.
should just stop complaining about it. It's a great strategy on keeping the defense on the field with the same personnel. They get to run the play before the defense is set and tire the defense out. That's the purpose of the uptempo offense. Indiana ran it beautifully all game long. If Michigan is doing the same thing, you would not be complaining about it at all.
It's not necessarily the tempo that is causing the rising of the scoring in the game. It's the proliferation of spread offense with innovative minded coaches that is a big factor.
He just misses the days of the black shirt defense.
but I also presume to think UM fans hearts are with the D as well.
The offense/defense balance has become too skewed in the offense's favor. Safety rules like the crackdown on targeting can't be changed, but rules that give the defense more of a chance to substitute between plays would be a good idea. (And I've felt this way for awhile; it's not a reaction to today's game.) Seeing all these 49-42 games with 500+ yards of offense for each team gets tiresome after awhile.
I don't think they should change any rules that favor one side of the ball or another. Its artificial and it bastardizes the game.
But I do not like these sorts of games, either, as a spectator. I've never been so bored by a game before last night. No particular play seemed very important until the last 5 minutes or so. Big third down early in the game? No such thing. Huge PA pass over the top? We'll need 4 more of those. It is just not exciting to me. It reminded me of basketball, in which nothing is ever decided until the last minute or so. Its not for me. But that doesn't mean football should change to fit my viewing taste.
Haven't they already bastardized the game? Isn't this just trying to restore equilibrium?
Interesting question, Chicago B!GRed.
I think change in college football comes and goes in cycles; it may take some time for defenses to innovate and come up with the way to beat the uptempo offense.
It's interesting also that Kevin Wilson today acknowledged that his uptempo offense puts pressure on his team's defense. So while it kept them in the game today until the last quarter, it may have also cost them the game.
The same complaint was made of the pressure the RR offense put on a defense, in terms of how long they had to be out on the field.
It may be that we will see this trend temper itself without any rule changes, especially as defenses catch up and learn what to do to stop it.
I'm not sure what the counterpunch to this could be, given that defenses have a hard time substituting. That really limits what you can call defensively and can cause your D to be more tired. I think changing the rules to allow the defense more of a chance to substitute is only fair.
was light-speed fast compared to what Rich Rod did here. It's much faster than Oregon's as well. It felt like that game was 5-6 quarters long. I thinkthe offense has a huge advantage by being able to come to the line as soon as the ref places the ball and then have the sideline call a play, handcuffing the defense. I don't know what the solution is, but aside from Michigan winning the game, that wasn't very enjoyable to sit through.
The one rule that MUST be changed is that a ball cvarrier be called for face-masking when they stiff arm. It is NEVER called and should be. Why can the offensive player grab a facemask or a helmet and not get penalizied.
Also, the hits like the ones that Roby did today need a stiffer penalty. He made helmet-to-helmet twice before being tossed. I think if a player is kicked out of a game and also the next one, then it might change the way DBs hit.
That's more bang for my buck.
RBs aren't tackling people by the facemask or otherwise jerking their necks. They're just holding them off.
If you hire fatter refs they won't be able to set the ball as quickly and the game will slow down.
with hip replacements.
or refs in wheel chairs
"Remember 17-10 games being fairly common?"
Didn't Notre Dame just beat USC (ya know, one of the game's most storied rivalries) 14-10?
To batte an up tempo offense, teams need an uptempo defense. Problem solved!
Just have the d line start rushing before the ball is snapped and the o line gets set. Knock out a couple of qbs and problem solved!
I think most fans prefer a lot of offense. So yours is a minority opinion. Most people don't want to see a lot of 13-7 games.
When the offense gets a first down, allow the defense time to sub.
that officials has to let the defense sub if the offense sub. If defense tries to sub while the offense doesn't sub and snap a play, tough luck. That's exactly what happened on the first TD play.
Just fake injuries more often
But not really
I'm embarrassed that the D gave up so many yards. Sure, our O put up even more yards, but honestly this was kind of embarrassing. I miss seeing a dominate Michigan D, where all 11 helmets are flying to the ball like hungry, wild dogs.
Oh for Pete's sake people, it's DOMINANT not dominate.
It was 3:47 AM on a Saturday night. Relax.
would be to change the rules on OL holding to what they were 40 years ago, and then instruct the refs to throw the goddamn flag.
I'm guessing you had no problem when NU perfected their option and simply ran roughshod over the Big 8. It's the same principle. They and ND were the only two teams running it as their standard offense and that is why they were successful. This, however, was prior to the great equalizer; the spread. I like it. Defensive masters will still win fb games. Look no further than Alabama to justify that statement. You say you're sick of "pinball games" but every team other than WI and MSU use this as "their balanced attack" as you stated. I see nothing wrong with this. NU,UM, NW all use it as part of their attack and, of course, OSU, uses it as their standard. The difference being though between this and the option of the 90s is the qbs can actually throw the football. I think it makes for a very exciting chess match, myself. ^As a kid growing up I recall the "triple threat" was a back in the single wing that could throw, pass and catch. Now it's reduced to a "dual threat" where you don't have to worry about him catching it out of the backfield, but you pray he's not on target with his passes. I believe today in the Top 20, Oct 19, 2013, 5 teams went down to defeat. History dictates that all things evolve or become extinct. ^Yeah, for those teams that can go out, and we're one of them, and recruit the top prospects in the nation year after year, those teams, if we play "within an accepted element of offense" of course will continue to thrive and nothing will change. You saw what Michigan likes to do. Run the ball between tackles and then throw. But that is not how we gained advantage. It was the added element of the "now accepted" dual threat and principles of the spread that allowed us the victory. Perhaps in two years, we'll be a Bama where we can keep their offense off the field with long extended drives, then actually stop the opposing offense. But not yet. I don't mind at all DCs earning their pay and not being embarrassed by giving up 40 points. ^ The one aspect you are ignoring here, imo anyway, is only a very small amount of teams can assemble the talent required to play the game in the manner you like. Bama can. They've proven that. FSU, is on their tail. They don't ask Jameis to run the spread because it's not needed. Michigan is recruiting in similar fashion and within a couple of years will have that talent assembled. If they have the coaching staff in hand to handle it, we'll take that step. And our talent on both sides of the ball will be too much for the majority of our opponents to handle. ^ You Braska fans weren't here yet some 15-20 years ago, but you enjoyed the same priviliges of OU in the Big 8. Just get more talent. Then Joe Tiller came to Purdue with his version of the "modern spread," actually the run and gun and changed things. Alvarez took over at WI and took home grown, corn-fed boys and put together a great program, one that would eventually move to the top of the league. Barnett at NW, of all places, introduced his offensive philosophy and NW beat UM 54-51 and the Purple were on to the Rose Bowl. Suddenly the Big X was kicking ass everywhere, including the bowl games. Why? Because certain coaches dared make changes and although it wasn't lasting in terms of power shift in the conference, it certainly introduced a new wave that other conferences followed and the results were the same. ^Ultimately the Big Boys regained power but the face of football was changed forever. There was no longer the Big 2 and the rest in the 10 and the 8. There was always a team out there ready to challenge. If you want to regress to those days then yes, your recipe is the correct one. The traditional powers will once again no longer be challenged. But as a fan of one of the traditional powers, I am all in favor of coaching and strategy being every bit as important as simply signing four and five star players and saying, "do this," and expecting victory. If we're really all that, then it's as every bit important that our coaching staff and not just our players be four and five star as well.
Wonderful post. While reading I felt the underlying message was that of act and react. The reaction to these new forms of offense are not at a point where one would call them anywhere near successful. You stated that certain coaches dared to step outside the box with regards to offense. The same will have to be said about defensive coaches to curtail these offensive onslaughts.
People like touchdowns
While it is true that the rules have been skewed to help the offense, teams need to do better on defense. In this day and age your secondary has to be elite, your LBs have to be able to play man coverage and the defense as a whole needs to have great awareness playing zone. I hate watching shooutouts too but nothing is better than watching a defense dominate a great offense.
"Time to change the rules and give defense a chance. Give me games with some big hits, slobbernocking, trench warfare, defensive struggles, praying the field goal will be missed......"
I have to wonder if athleticism and innovation on offense have a lot to do with what you're discussing here as I believe coaches over the past 20 years have been looking for ways to not find themselves in the 17-10 games of old. That being said, which rules in the book would you consider changing specifically? That might help the discussion here.
I think that college football should go to the NFL style of clock management. The clock doesn't stop on 1st downs and put the 2 minute warning in. Regular games are taking 3.5 hours and spread games are taking 4+ hours every week.
Wow you're just a total asshole, aren't you? Given the participation by so many people here, it seems this thread isn't so ridiculous after all.
These newfangled spread offenses need to stay off my lawn!!
If your defense can't get a stop, let the offense flow. There are enough playmakers on defense around the country, make plays!
It'll make a negligible difference, but I've long been in favor of needing two feet in bounds on a catch.
I think that would make a decent difference, especially the first few seasons. Could also rid the clock stopping on every first down. This allows comebacks much more easily. But I like that rule for college. I guess, I just don't know man..
As someone else stated, it's less about rule changes and more about scheme. So you want to offenses just because many coaches around the country have figured out how to score lots and lots of points (under the idea that at the end of the day, whoever has the most points wins)? Pretty sure Fielding Yost ran his teams under the same philosophy, as did the Mad Magicians. No need to change the game just because more teams are doing it now.
Look at the Oregon-WSU game: it looks very similar to UM-IU. The biggest differences were that Oregon was +2 and Indiana was better on 3rd down.
Big scores tend to happen when you play spread vs. spread. A clock-eating Manball offense is the perfect complement to a BBDB turnover-creating defense facing an uptempo spread team.
I was thinking during the game that the pace would be ok if the defense had enough timeouts to call one after 5 or 6 plays. It would be game theoretically interesting if the pace of the offense were somehow tied to the number of timeouts the other team gets. Of course I know that'll never happen, but it would add to the chess match element.
I mentioned this in the Defense snowflake thread, but if you stop the clocks to reset the chains, shouldn't you wait until the chains are set to start the clock? That is the point, right? If it isn't, then we might as well go to the NFL model of running clock.
If it is, you could get crazy and allow the home team to control the chain gang. Michigan could train their chain gang to move slow, while IU could train theirs to go fast. An added element to the home field advantage.
[Note: I don't necessarily advocate the second solution, I think it would be interesting.]
Purdue I think got into MSU's red zone once. MSU only scored 1 offensive touchdown, the other 7 came from a fumble and return.
Yesterday was silly, and I do feel that maybe some of the rules about pass coverage could bet tweaked, but no way should things like the targeting rule and head to head stuff be changed. We simply know better about how serious concussions are nowadays.
Has there ever been a team that plays manball use up tempo as a primary approach (not just when behind with little time left in the game)? It would be interesting to see what a team like Wisconsin could do with a no-huddle offense.
we could decrease the size of hockey rinks and have more fighting...
and instead of hand-checking, let Craft just grab guys...
etc etc etc
seems to know how to get stops. I'll be happy if we get half our yardage in the IU game when we play State.
Not really, but I was stunned after a long incompletion that while 3 defenders were still in the end zones a new ball was already spotted at the 50. You can't have a pace like that without cooperative officials. I sat behind the IU bench and watched the officials being lobbied all game long.
still, I saw how fast the refs placed the ball and backed out of the LOS so the next play could be run. When I watch other games last night, the officials moved much slower.
You can eliminate the O coming to the ball and then waiting for the sideline to scan the D and then call a play by starting a 7-second play clock once the ref steps away from the ball. The offense wouldn't be able to do all the shifting/changing and still get the play off. The ref could stand over the ball for 6-10 more seconds and the defense could sub. The offense would be forced to call two plays each time and then live with the formation and play they chose against the defense that's in. Chess match again.
I like touchdowns too, but I don't really enjoy each team running 80+ plays and getting 600-700+ yards on offense. Defense almost didn't play a part. It was kinda like 7-on-7 or flag football. Speed was the key, not necessarily the players, just the execution.
Until an Oregon plays an Alabama and Oregon embarrasses Bama winning 58-35 and gains 740 yards on Bama's world-class defense, nothing will change.
The point of the "spread" and no huddle offenses is to reduce the 'disadvantage' of not having 340 lb lineman and 245 LBs. By the third or fourth play in a drive at IU's pace, Bama's defense would be gassed and IU has the advanatge. That's the ONLY way IU could ever score on Bama.
If IU is as successful running it's speed offense against OSU. The Buckeyes will be in trouble. They rely on power and big hits from Roby and Shazier. If they can't get squared up, they can't intimidate IU.
will let the defense sub if the offense sub during a no huddle plays which is something that many forget. If offense doesnt' sub and defense sub, offense can snap that defense can get too many men on the field penalty or they get caught with their pants down just like Michigan did on the first TD play.
Complaining about it is stupid because IU is taking advantage of the Michigan defense who can't do anything to stop the offense.