Will he or not? I think he plays next season and beats out Bellomy as the backup.
i refuse to even consider this a possibility
Hopefully redshirt unless he's needed..
burning his redshirt would mean that people are getting hurt, so no thanks.
I'd be very surprised if he is not redshirted. Assuming DG gets his redshirt, why would you want only 2 years of Shane when you could have 3? If he's pressed into action due to injury so be it but he has a lot of learning to do and a reshirt year would be very good for him.
Now, if DG doesn't get his redshirt and Shane would need to start next year it's a different story. Then you may want to get Shane out there for some garbage time so that he's comfortable and has some experience next year.
to take every meaningful snap next season but in today's game that's unlikely especially when factoring in his ability to run. Is Russell Bellomy the second best option at QB? Guess we will see.
Look at this year's O-line situation. There is no doubt in my mind that Kalis could have started from at least the middle of the season on but the coaches decided not to burn his redshirt. If Michigan can get to the middle of the season without any injuries, then Bellomy will get first crack. If he fails again, then they might burn Shane's redshirt. As for the idea that he could be injured - of course that's a possibility, but I don't know if I'd expect it. He is not a running quarterback, he's a quarterback who can run when plays break down. You'd better believe the coaches are going to admonish him to get down or get out of bounds before taking hits. As it is, I expect the O-line to be good enough to keep him off his back most of the time. I'm being very optimistic here, but I'm not going to factor in an injury yet. If he does get hurt, Bellomy has to be the next option, and then Shane (at this point, if Shane can pass Bellomy on the depth chart, then of course it would be okay for him to be the backup and burn a redshirt.
1. Gardner may not get that redshirt.
2. Even if he gets it, he might elect to go pro if he has a strong 2013 season
3. If the difference in talent between Morris and Bellomy is great, playing Morris may be the best move for the team. We don't want to be in another Nebraska 2012 situation.
1. According to coaches and the media, the school will know before the season whether or not Gardner will get his redshirt (they keep saying they should know soon).
2. While it wouldn't be out of the question for DG to go to the NFL, he was very, very, very far from being a high enough pick to consider coming out early this year. He was good, but far from great - we were just over excited by a guy who could actually make throws. If he makes the leap that would be required to be a first or second round pick, then Michigan will deal with it when they get to that point.
3. You're again making a big jump. i was super-excited by Shane for a long time, but the fact of the matter is that he has a lot of work to do to be college-ready. He is not nearly accurate enough, he needs to learn how to put more touch on the ball, and he needs to learn an offense. To put it bluntly, he just isn't ready to be a starting QB at the college level (and there's nothing wrong with that, very few kids coming out of high school are). I'd take Bellomy and the potential that is Michigan's running game over Shane at this point. If Bellomy doesn't improve, however, yes - you would have to at lesat consider giving Shane a shot.
Re #2, Someone (I think it was Sam Webb) stated that the redshirt might be a moot point because he got the sense that Gardner would consider going pro regardless. Keep in mind, by the end of next season he'll have 18 or 19 starts under his belt, assuming he stays healthy, and he reportedly is on pace to graduate on time.
Re: #3, I'm not predicting that Morris will beat out Bellomy - but it's not out of the question.
Plus after next season, Devin will have been on campus for four years (my high time flies...). After he has the experience of being the Michigan QB, he might be ready to move on with his life, especially if he has the great season we hope and expect him to have.
I live in NY and the WTKA site never plays on my computer, so I haven't listened to Sam Webb since graduating. If he thinks DG may go pro after next year (which, unless there is a vast improvement is a mistake) then I take it back. In that case, Shane is going to need to see the field some this year (at least in a mop up role) just so that he has some on-field experience before taking the reigns next year. I really do hope that DG reconsiders because 2 years of him would be ideal.
If DG, after just a couple of games played while DR was injured is suddelnly NFL worthy, then what would we gain by not RSing this kid. It is tantamount to saying we red-shirted DG until we no longer could, and now he's NFL ready. Ain't buying it. DG needs another, maybe two years under the lights until he proves to the nation he's ready, and you can do the math from there. If DG gets a RS, he will not go pro, and Shane will not go without a rs tag.
Gardner's 2012 season (which I thought was very good given the craziness of a midseason switch from WR to QB) bears little relevance to where his draft status might be in 2014. Give the guy a whole offseason to prepare as our #1 QB and watch him next fall.
Webb (I think it was him) didn't say it was assured or anything, but that he thought Gardner would consider leaving if he had a good year. It wouldn't be shocking if that were the case. By then he'd have been here four years and started 1 1/2 of them.
Redshirt for serious. He needs a year to adapt to be physically ready for D1 hitting, speed, and the playbook.
If the backup is needed, they won't use the left-handed freshman. That doesn't sound very fun.
If so, redshirt even if he beats out Bellomy . If not, he'll probably play unless Bellomy gets a lot better.
No player should burn a redshirt just to play in garbage time or in a special teams role that could easily be filled by someone else.
Didn't we learn this lesson with DG already? You RS unless you have to play that person to win a game.
Very different scenario. You had a proven starter quality QB when DG hit the field.
A proven starter quality QB who also happened to be a head case.
I always thought it was unnecessary to demote him to third string. When you're a guy who has started every game of your freshman year, being demoted to second-string is already punishment in itself. I don't think Forcier would have been satisfied to play one snap against UConn and one against ND.
honestly I think that if Forcier had been shown some support, even tough love, he would have succeeded here.
I always think of the Justin Turner scene in 3 and out. Those coaches wanted to break that kid. It was almost like they were sacrificing him to prove to the rest of the team just how serious they are...
Then I think of hoke when our kicker fucked up and how supportive he was which has lead to a completely different environment/results.
I am a teacher and I have to use multiple techniques with my learners, it is just like coaching, and I have never, ever, sought to destroy someone in the hopes of 'building them back up'.
We had two proven commodities at QB at the beginning of that season (Forcier and Robinson). Redshirting Gardner was a luxury we could afford. It was only because Forcier was in the doghouse that we played him.
This year we have only one proven commodity (Gardner). If Bellomy makes a big leap in the offseason and becomes a guy we can have faith in as our #2 QB, then we can redshirt Morris, but if not, I don't think we can or will.
Yes, please. Especially after missing most of his senior year with mono, an extra year does nothing but help him.
He can redshirt. I would hate to see it burned by using him for mop up duty.
This is a silly question. Even if he is the second best QB on the team -- which he obviously will be -- the coaches aren't going to burn his redshirt just to give him garbage time plays against EMU. As long as Gardner is healthy, they will preserve his redshirt. If Gardner goes down and they need Shane to play, his redshirt will be burned. It's not a matter of choice.
Far from obvious to me that Shane Morris will be the second best QB on the team.
I agree completely. The latest on Shane is that he has a rocket, and needs a lot of polish. He is also not enrolling early, so he won't have a great handle on much of the playbook for most if not all of the season. Bellomy, meanwhile, will get lots of reps all spring and all of the second team reps in fall camp. Shane will need to show up greatly improved to pass Bellomy yet this year.
he could be #1
That a backup will have to play meaningful snaps next season at somepoint?
Of course a backup is going to play, possibly even meaningful snaps, but the hope is that Bellomy has improved to be adequate, and that our run game will be improved so Bellomy will only have to be a game manager
We don't play EMU. CMU, Akron, or UConn possibly though!
I know cool story bro is coming at me, but Shane has told me personally he is getting the red shirt unless there is some craziness like injuries, tranfers, or a Y2K event.
Not, hopefully. I remember Devin Gardner being significantly improved in his first start last year over his few snaps as a limited backup the years before, so I'm not ready to write off Bellomy as a Junior/Senior potential starter just because he got thrown to the wolves as a RS freshman. Shane will need time, too. I hope he gets as much as he needs.
Bellomy is not that bad. He had a terrible game, yes. But he was a 3-star QB from Texas, in his RS-Fr year, in a hostile environment for, what I believe, was his first meaningful amount of playing time.
I guarantee he's much better next year than he was this year...
Who would you rather have play if Gardner goes down, Bellomy or Morris? The Bellomy experiment turned out great last year.
Bellomy was also a Redshirt Freshman playing his first real snaps. On the road. At a pretty raucous stadium. At night. With no run game to speak of.
It was the perfect storm for a disaster, and I don't think that game is a indicator of his ability. He's not going to set the world on fire, but he's not that bad either
i was shocked at his lack of zip on some of his throws; lack of arm strength.
I'm sure Bellomy has the ability to be a descent QB. But he evidently went to Nebraska unprepared. Just because he's the backup does not mean you don't practice like your the starter, watch film like your the starter and stand on the sidelines and act like your the starter. He went into that game and looked lost. Ya, some of that is on the coaches but more of that falls on his shoulders. It does not boad well for his confidence at all either. I'm not sure if Bellomy seen any meaningful playing time he would be able to shake that uncomfortable feeling of the last time he played. Maybe he can, but Im not to confident.
Did you see Shane play in the UA game? It didn't look any better than Bellomy, and that was against high school kids, not Nebraska's starters. Add in the fact that Bellomy likely knows the offense and the receivers better, and I think I'd want Bellomy.
Maybe you don't remember Brian Griese's debut season. Got a few games in, like against Northwestern. At home. We lost. He couldn't throw 5 yards past the LOS.
Couple years later, he was winning the national championship for us.
Point is: Kids are kids. Will do as kids do. Not saying Bellomy is Griese 2.0, but, a really poor outing that one time does not condemn him to eternal uselessness for the next three years.
Unless, of course, when Hoke said he was suffering from a "condition" he meant "condition, as in, lacks talent."
DG has QB on lockdown. But they must have the second best QB at backup. Not having Gardner ready against Neb costed us a shot at the Big Ten championship last year.
Because he wasn't taking many/any QB reps so he could learn the receiver position. This was a calculated risk by the coaches and I bet there would have been a decent chance that DG would have been the QB in the games after Denard's injury even if Bellomy didn't have the issues we saw at Nebraska.
This will not be the case with Shane, and if burning a RS is required due to a major injury to DG it will happen if Shane is the better #2 option. If DG has to come out for a series or mop-up duty is required, I think you will see the coaches protect Shane's RS for the long-term benefit of Shane and the team.
Pro-tip -- google the word "costed" (the more you know...)
If Shane is substantially better than Bellomy AND Gardner gets a serious injury -- something that would keep him out of a large portion of an important game -- then let's burn the redshirt. Otherwise, I want to see the kid play with the rest of the class when they've fully matured in 2017.
Two potential issues with this kind of reasoning:
1) The coaches don't necessarily know right off the bat how serious a player's injury can be. Sometimes a guy is in pain but is able to return after a series or two. Sometimes he can't go at all. When your QB comes out of the game, someone's got to come in there, and that guy may have to play the remainder of the game.
2) Any Big Ten game is important. Take away our starting QB and suddenly a game against Purdue/Illinois/etc. becomes much more loseable.
No. Shane needs to redshirt.
What does your "Dark and difficult times lie ahead" tagline refer to?
I put there at the beginning of the 2010 football season. Probably need to get rid of it now.
It is a quote from Harry Potter and the Goblet of Fire.
OK. Yeah, at this point you can probably retire it (unless you're really into hockey).
I'll give you an answer once the team is two weeks into Fall practice.
I'd rather give Bellomy garbage time over Morris to preserve that redshirt. Besides, it will certainly help Bellomy to have more in-game experience.
I hope Shane's just holding a clipboard next year. He needs a year to learn the system, work on his accuracy, etc. Bellomy will be in the system for his third year. As of now, I'd rather give Bellomy the nod. I do think he's better than he gets credit for. He was just thrust into a really bad situation unexpectedly this season.
Have we all so quickly forgotten what happened when the 2nd best QB on the roster wasn't ready to go at a moment's notice? Allow me to refresh your memories: we lost and also lost our chance at going to the Big Ten Championship game.
Would it be great to redshirt Morris? Absolutely. Do I want to just shelve him for the year and put our whole backup QB hopes on Bellomy? No effin way. I know he's a good kid and obviously tried hard against Neb., but he clearly wasn't ready to play at that level.
Bottom line: if Shane is the 2nd best QB talent-wise on this roster, he has to be ready to go in case of Gardner going down. Sure, hold him out until he's needed. Garbage time can even go to Bellomy if Gardner doesn't get hurt. In case of long term injury or in a tight game I'd go with Morris, assuming he is more talented at this point than Bellomy.
size is a little small to write him off. He wasn't good but that doesn't mean he won't be. I had a bigger issue with the coaches not having Gardner ready I any way for that scenario. Which means Bellomy must have looked good enough in practice.
... In terms of performance unless he's Heisman material. Only the really really good QBs are ready to run a major-college team as freshman, and even then they usually have to come in early, not have a senior QB blocking them from first team reps, and not, y'know, be recovering from mono.
I predict that if he does play, we'll see laser to Tacopants and defenders - much like Bellomy v. Nebraska, but perhaps marginally better. Arm strength does matter, but not if you don't know the plays, blocking and patterns.
all about it last Spring on MGoBlog.
Yes please. I also think that a redshirt year will slow down the hype train, which can't hurt.
Build some muscle in that time! Kid needs to bulk up a bit.
If Devin gets his redshirt and stays injury free, then why burn it if we don't have to ?
The coaches will probably plan to redshirt him unless they feel like they have to burn it. That only happens if he's somehow better than Gardner, which is really unlikely, or he's a significant upgrade from Bellomy and Gardner goes down with an injury. Even then, the injury would have to threaten Michigan with a loss, be for an extended period, or be in the Ohio State game with the game on the line. Regardless, he'll definitely travel with the team next season.
There was a period during the OSU game last year when Lewan looked like he might be knocked out of the game. I honestly thought Braden or Magnuson was going in on the next series, and I would have thought it was the right move--even that late in the season.
It's going to come down to whether or not he can win the #2 job. If he's our second-best QB, I think he'll play. If not, he redshirts.
I think he will be the 2nd string but will only go in if Gardner goes down in a big game. Barring and big injuries to Gardner I think Morris redshirts
Doesn't mean he'll play.
He can be the #2 in practice and on the depth chart, but if Gardner is healthy all year and you're just talking mop-up duty...why would you put Morris in?
You don't get "game experience" in mop-up duty...so don't give me that excuse.
had to come out of a game during the Big Ten season and Michigan is trailing by say 4 points, who do you want to see take the snap??
Are we assuming Shane has never seen a college snap before? Then for sure Bellomy.
I would hope that if Gardner had to come out of a meaninful game that Michigan would play the guy who gives them the best chance to win. I think Morris will prove to be that guy.
OK, but that's purely an opinion, the last part I mean.
We have no evidence at this point that Shane would give us a better chance to win than Bellomy. In the on-field play that I've seen from each of them, I think Bellomy is the better QB right now, and he would give us the better chance to win. Shane has tools that Bellomy doesn't and certainly has the higher ceiling, but I don't think he'd help us win more this season than Bellomy.
So far? 4 of 21 and 4 picks. If he is not a better option than Bellomy next season I will be surprised. Forget saving a redshirt, you would be more confident if Michigan were in a situation that they had to throw the ball with Bellomy over Morris??
You keep ripping on Bellomy, but what evidence is there that Shane would be any better? Bellomy had crazy high school stats, in Texas no less, but when in his first season playing in college, things looked bad for him. Why do we think this wouldn't happen to Shane, without the benefit of a redshirt? Just because he has a big arm?
Bellomy was not ready last year, but this will be a whole year later. DG sure improved a lot in one year. I think Shane will need that year (at least) to get to where Bellomy is at now.
Bellomy was a RS Frosh this past season correct? And we kept hearing that he was the #2 QB and looking good in practice which enabled them to keep DG at WR. But when called upon Bellomy wasnt ready and since that game hes had a mysterious injury. I hope Bellomy is ready so Shane can RS but im not optomistic about it. Also highlights why a qb shouldve been takin in 2012 class.
This is exactly right. I have a comparison - Kyle Kalis. I bet Kalis was better than either Brzynski or Glasgow by the middle of the Big Ten season last fall, but when garbage time came around, they went in at the guards in his place so he could redshirt. Now, if we had had major injuries on the OL where we needed a back up OG to play a full game, things may have been different.
Like that, I expect Bellomy to take the back-up snaps just like last year unless there is a longer term injury.
Yes, RS plz
I think of it this way:
Don't you wish Denard could have been redshirted his Freshman year when he clearly wasn't ready to play QB in the B1G? Imagine having him back next year as a HB/WR/QB weapon.
Same thing with Shane, I'd rather have another year of him at his prime than a year of him learning the ropes as a true Freshman. Unless ofcourse Gardner and Bellomy are hit with long term injuries, but thats unlikely to happen because they are not DBs at Michigan.
The fact that the entire freshman OL group redshirted despite having almost zero depth on the line suggests that Hoke will reshirt people even if they are as good/slightly better than the backups suggests Morris will get a redshirt
After watching that Nebraska game, Bellamy and Michigan dont go well together..we are short on QBs so we should have Morris as a backup to Gardner.
Had already graduated...
So because Bellomy had a bad game, the true freshman must be better? Please elaborate.
If Gardner goes down, we would be screwed. Bellomy is not good. There is your explanation.
You're right - hopefully Shane can tear it up like he did in the UA game or any of his HS games.
Look - I think Shane will be good, I just don't think Shane will be good this year. And I don't think Bellomy is as bad as that one game showed. Tie breaker? Bellomy actually knows the plays.
Is still waiting for the ball.
bellomy may have had the worst game for a QB in the history of UM football. i seriously doubt the top 5 QB in this recruiting class would do worse. i would think a talent like morris would perform more like a frosh henne or henson than bellomy.
I thought he played well once he settled in, up until he was injured.
Shane is not like Henson or Henne. Both of those guys were far more polished than Shane (and much higher ranked recruits, as well). Shane has a very high ceiling, but isn't as close to it yet as either of those guys were. Plus, Henson had Terrell and Walker and Henne had Braylon, Breaston and Avant. That helps the transition as well.
Might as well. What's the point of burning the shirt for a little garbage time. The only reason he wouldn't be is if he is way ahead of Bellomy and something happens to D Gardener (Lord help us if he gets hurt).
Needs he redshirt. If DG goes down, bellomy will be in, no way he couldn't be better than Shane. Nothing against Shane, he'll probably be a god qb but he needs to RS.
1.) Will DG get his RS injury?
2.) If Shane is far superior then Bellomy in summer camp.
If 1.) is No and/or 2.) is yes, then I don't see Shane getting a RS. Though I'm hoping that 1.) will be Yes and 2.) will be a wash in summer camp and Shane gets the RS.
RS him and keep Bellomy as the backup. God forbid Devin goes down.
RS, unless emergency occurs.
Unless Devin gets hurt Shane is absolutely RSing.
if he is better than bellomy, he should play- injury, mop up, whenever he is needed.
i believe we gave up in nebraska because we did not play our 2 best QBs-DR and DG!
Was Bellomy's injury again?
Ideally, if the coaches thought he was near or better than Devin last year he should be a solid backup
I believe it is possible that Gardner isn't on our team in 2014 (not llikely, but possible). With that in mind I would prefer that Shane see as much time on the field as possible...
That said, I would imagine we will see Bellamy in the case of an in game injury long before we see Morris.
And Morris is better than Bellomy? Could Morris get meaningful time if the season hangs in the balance?
Of course the best case is a redshirt with DG tearing it up, but that's an easy decision.
Food for thought: Tom Brady's first collegiate pass was a pick 6.
If they can reconfigure the offensive line to make his blind side safe...it all depends on how much the OL coaches can get the guys to learn. If right-handed pulling is this hard to learn might as well leave left-handed pulling out of the picture for another year, at least in games.
I am hoping that he can redshirt to get back what turned to be a lost season in 2012 due to mono. He has plenty of arm; now, all he needs to do is control it a bit better. An extra year to do that and acclimate himself to major college ball would be great.
This is what happened in 2010. Gardner played when he didn't have to, and now there are questions about whether he'll have a fifth year or not. Unless something bad happens, Morris should redshirt.
I say redshirt him. Let him sit & learn