Duke that low?
Seth Davis tweets his Top 25 (UM #1)
Yep no way shape or form will duke drop 13 spots.
He has Duke dropping 12 spots
You mean he didnt have duke to good to be ranked and listed at #0??
At the same time, they just haven't looked nearly as good without Kelly
Where should they be ranked then after 2 losses one of which was a 30 point blow out to an unranked team?
Those wins over Louisville and Kentucky don't look as impressive as they they did earlier in the season.
The thing that is ridiculous is that MSU is number 5. They where ranked 13th before they lost to Indiana so I doubt they jump any spots after a loss
MSU should be around 15. No 4 loss team should be 5.
Didn't sparty lose...
But remember than Sparty beat the team that beat us.
I'm so sick of Lil Bro. Can't wait to crush them.
And we beat one of the teams that beat them...we can do this all day.
Sparty looked good today. So did the Hoosiers. Rather not play either of them...
We'll beat Indiana Saturday night. Write it down.
What up Rawls. How you still alive yo?
Glad you're not on the team.
Agreed. I get the maize colored talk but please 4 losses or not they went to Indiana and gave them all they could handle with Appling playing like a joke. Harris is there with GRIII and Canadian Bacon as Big 10 freshman of the year candidate, Payne is playing out of his mind since he started fighting teammates and Appling has played well ex Indiana. And Dawson is still getting into playing stride. It's a good team - is it #5 or #12 or whatever. Who knows - but this team is talented with a coach that is good. Indiana also tough, Zeller played like junk most of the game and they still won. Those seem to be the top 3 in the BIg 10 and without UM playing either of them yet and losing to Ohio on the road it's still a toss up. I expect all 3 to be 1-2 slotted in the NCAA, maybe one falls to 3 if there are some injuries, but if you are a 2 seed you are top 8. Ohio is a 1.5 man show so I think the next tier down but going to be a tough game always at home.
I get the maize colored talk but please 4 losses or not they went to Indiana and gave them all they could handle with Appling playing like a joke
But Minnesota did the same thing, and Wisconsin beat them there. Is it possible Indiana's homecourt advantage is not as great as we think?
I understand them getting a small bump (or holding steady) from a good showing on the road. What I don't understand is why they seemingly aren't dinged for their close wins. As I see it, MSU has 3 quality wins (KU, OSU, Wisc). But their resume is 8 points away from being total garbage. That just seems unusual for a top-5 team, especially one with 4 losses.
Whisky quality win? They aren't even ranked and shot 7-18 from the free throw line against MSU, ah, NO.
Even if they are more boring to watch than watching paint dry, I'd say that winning at Indiana is quality.
EDIT: My bad, I thought you meant that Wisconsin didn't have a quality win this year. None the less, winning at Wisconsin is still a quality win in my book (Has Michigan ever won at the Kohl Center?).
16 after losing to Drake this week? Seems a bit high for them. I figured they would drop out of the top 25. Louisville at 12 seems high as well at this point.
I love who is #1 for obvious reasons. But that's still a questionable poll.
Sparty loses yet they go from 15th to 5th? Butler and Oregon are too high. And although Duke get spanked, I'm not sure about them being that low. I hate them, yes, but they still have some impressive wins.
Yeah, that poll is jacked.
Agreed. I'd like to see his poll from last week to get some perspective because this looks ridiculous. Should be grounds for pulling his vote.
Wisconsin needs some love.
They've lost four straight...not too surprising.
You guys seen Duke without Kelly? They ain't a top 5 team. They're still good but Seth I think obviously feels that they belong lower without Ryan Kelly. Sparty, unfotunately, is picking up it's level of play and though they might not be a top 5 team I have no arguments by putting them a top 8-10 team.
Also, Oregon is a sneaky good team. A team that could go knock a team or two out in the March Tourney. Butler is legit. They lost to LaSalle, yes, but a very good and very well coached team. No problem with them top 10. Georgetown is also a good team and will rise I feel. They have talent a,d similar to N.C. State when they put it together they're a damn good team; when they don't they're very mediocre.
Re: MSU, it doesn't matter how "good" you are if you can't win...
But they are winning. They won 6 straight Big Ten games before today. 2 of those were road games at very tough venues (Carver Hawkeye, Kohl Center). Today they again went to the wire with a top 5 team nationally, in their own house. Obviously one can argue with Seth Davis' poll, which I personally agree with save for a bit of rearranging of a few teams, but the guy watches basketball day in and day out and has a good idea of who's good and who's better. You're right in that Sparty has 4 losses and that should hurt them a bit when it comes to the polls. But they are playing excellent ball right now and for a guy to rate them higher than other really good teams right now isn't far fetched; Sparty at this point in the season can compete with top notch teams (as they showed today). KenPom has them has them at 16 FWIW. Also FWIW, it pains me to write positively about Sparty!
Yeah it's cool a guy tweeted us as #1, but this top 25 is not even close to what it will be tomorrow.
Seems to me this is more of who he thinks are the best teams in the country. Not necessarily what the polls will reflect. I.e., MSU barely lost to IU and will drop due to that. However, they're probably still playing like a top 5-10 team right now.
Not even ranked my man. Not an impressive enough win to cancel a loss.
The only top 25 that I care about at all is:
Florida seems high at 3. There wins are basically Wisconsin, Marquette, and Missouri. The SEC is incredibly weak this year.
Can't hold that against them. And they're absolutely murdering teams. The question is does beating bad teams by 30 say as much about you as beating good teams by 10-15. Rankings like Kenpom/ sagarin/ LRMC are built on the assumption that it does mean a lot and that it is predictive. And those rankings have Florida #1
You can hold how bad the SEC is against them. It happens all the time. Gonzaga is 19-2 and would be ranked higher if they were in a better performing conferene. The same goes for Oregon.
Florida has beaten 1 ranked team all season. They lost their two biggest non conference games to the #2 team in the Big12 and the #3 Pac12 team. The combined Sec records of the teams Florida has played is 13-23 and that contingent has racked up losses to Southern Youngstown St., GT(last place in the ACC, USF (last place in the Big East), Iona, Troy, Providence, Loyola Ill, and Alabama A&M.
In my opinion no one would be scared to see Florida in their bracket come March.
has them as the best team in the country.
Seth can keep his #1 vote. The rest of his ballot however might be better left to his helpers.
No. Just no. This isn't college football where Northern Illinois can fly up the polls by default. Gonzaga and Butler are among the top 15 programs in country. Butler's conference is probably the 5th best conference this year.
Butler (and Gonzaga I suppose) are probably 10-15 in the polls, becuase they will both lose games they should win, but in tournament play both of those teams are top ten programs. Butler's team defense will mess with even the top teams (maybe not Michigan though), because it isn't like what anyone else plays. Rotnei Clarke is Jimmer Fredette-lite, and Kellen Dunham is Stauskas-lite, Roosevelt Jones is every bit as good as Shelvin Mack was, though he's not much of a jump shooter. Butler is a team you do NOT want to have in your bracket, trust me.
cat tweet("seth davis") | head -1
MSU is solid. Gunna be great games. Should be toss ups with edge going to home court.
They have a team that can beat anyone at any time. All they're losses came when something went wrong. Appling tonight, for example. Honestly, they are good. Should be can't miss games.
But they've also had a ton of close wins - Iowa, Nebraska, PSU, Wisconsin. It's not like all their wins have been convincing. They've basically played to the level of their opposition in every game.
This seems like a huge overreaction to Duke loosing without Kelly and States "moral victory" against IU with Appling fouled out.
They lost by 30. That's not a loss, that's a massacre. Duke is not a top 5-7 team without Kelly. 13 may be a bit low, sure, but it's his poll and one can't complain too much about it. They should be at 9/10, not a big deal from where they are in Davis' rankings.
Sparty's loss isn't about morality, it was a statement that they are playing very good basketball right now and to deny that would be naive. Again, 5 is probably a bit high but a top 10 estimation of that team right now is legitimate. Positive things can be proven even when a team loses; the same holds true for when a team wins ugly, bad things can be taken away from said loss. Sparty is showing over the past couple weeks that they're getting it together. Which sucks. I was looking forward to some for sure a**-whoopings at the hands of Michigan.
But State isn't playing good. They played good against OSU and Indiana, but played like complete ass against Iowa, Nebraska, Wisconsin, and PSU. That is 4 out of their last 6 games that they have played pretty poorly. A team that plays down to shitty opponents and has 4 losses on the year doesn't deserve to be in the top 5.
Eh agree to disagree I suppose. I get what your conveying to an extent but I watched a team today and a few days ago that looked the part of a typical Michigan St. team I.e. good! Yes those games you mention were not pretty and to go against what I mentioned earlier, they WON those games (I mentioned how wins can be "bad" wins). But again, they won and have been winning and especially this past week and a half they've looked very good, even in defeat today. Essentially, don't color me shocked if we end up losing to them.
...but with next four games @ Indiana, Ohio, @ Wisconsin, and @ Michigan State it will be hard to stay at no 1. 2-2 would be great, 3-1 would be incredible, 4-0...
But then after that it eases up considerably, with a bunch of home games down the stretch as well. That should help us get momentum into March and hopefully some good wins at the end of the season.
3-1 would be "incredible"? Why? I think that's likely to happen. I think we'll sweep Ohio and Wisc and win one of the other two (probabyl Sparty).
get us the Tourney #1 seed if we remain near the top, especially if we take care of business on the road games. Split with Indi and beat Sparty twice (or vica versa) and we get it. Having POY Burke won't hurt our chances!
they also have the four Final Four appearances in eight years thing going for them, which was more recent than their National Championship
"We're not very good, and we just played a legitimately great team. I'm not sure why people are surprised at the outcome. Michigan is the best team I've seen this year, and it's not close.
Honestly, out of our Top 8, do any of them play in Michigan's Top 8? Maybe Brandon as a bench player? They were better at every single position. Their bench is better. They have a great coach. They have size, quickness, shooting ability, and they share the ball. That is an impressive squad."
Davis knows that MSU lost today, right?
I think it's very well done, probably one of the most sane polls when you looks at all of the teams' performances and current circumstance instead of preseason expectations.
MSU is playing like a top-5 team. They have arguably the best win of anyone in the country vs Kansas.
Miami just pounded Duke by 30 and beat MSU by almost 20 earlier and have a stranglehold on the ACC. Can you really rank Duke ahead of them at this point given Duke is a .500 team without Kelly who's not coming back soon?
Louisville lost three straight games.
Minnesota lost four straight including one to Northwestern, definitely they should drop out.
Florida may be in a weak conference but they are blowing everyone out that they play.
Oregon is at the top of the Pac-12 pecking order.
Tough to judge Kansas until tournament time. Their conf is crap. Sort of like Florida of the Midwest right now. They might not lose again by who can tell what that means in that conference. By the time it's all said and done MSU by be their toughest opponent of the year!
If you take a stab at predicting the Top 25 based on updated power ratings and RPI, a couple sites actually run with this as a guess with only minor variations (below is TeamRankings and Massey's prediction).
|16||Wichita St||Wichita St.|
|23||San Diego St||San Diego St.|