Rudock v. Cook: common opponents in 2013 and 2014

Submitted by Dawkins on

I've been getting a little tired of the media praising Connor Cook as one of the top QBs in the conference while discussing how Michigan's QB situation is in trouble. 

Any of you who have looked at Rudock's and Cook's respective 2013 and 2014 stats know that they put up pretty similar numbers on a seasonal basis (albeit with a slight edge to Cook). I decided to go a step further and look at all of their common opponents during the 2013 and 2014 seasons to see how they fared. I've color-coded the QB that had the better QB rating in each game.  I'll let you draw your own conclusions, but here are a few basic points:

- They played 9 common opponents during 2013 and 2014: 6 in 2013, and 3 in 2014.

- Rudock had the better QB rating in 6 of those games, while Cook had the better QB rating in 3 of the games.

- In all 3 matchups where Cook has the edge, Rudock also played well against the same opponent, but the reverse isn't true (see Minnesota, WMU, and both Nebraska games). 

- Cook is probably best known for his 2013 performance against Ohio State in the BTTG. Cook had better stats than Rudock against OSU, but Rudock was not far behind (despite having to play them in Value City Horseshoe Stadium). 

I guess my biggest takeaway from this is that the sky is most definitely NOT falling for Michigan with Rudock as our probable starter. Far from it. If MSU can have success with a "game manager" at QB, then so can we. Also, HARBAUGH.

Note: while the QBs' respective ratings in the 2014 Maryland and Nebraska games might appear to be a sloppy copy/paste job due to them being the same, they are in fact correct. In both games, Rudock had a 112.9 and Cook had a 110.2. 

Dawkins

July 24th, 2015 at 3:21 PM ^

Come on, man. Don't believe the hype. You don't find it a little absured that a guy who throws 24 TDs and 58% completions appeared on many draft boards last year right along side guys like Winston and Marriota who throw for 4,000 yards, 40 TDs, and have completion percentages in the high 60s? You take away MSU's defense and W-L record, and just evaluate Cook on his stats, and he's a 3-5th rounder at best. 

Nothing about my post should read to you as "Connor Cook is bad at football." The point I'm making is that he is overrated, and Rudock is underrated, based on the #s. 

Space Coyote

July 24th, 2015 at 4:13 PM ^

The guy has a strong enough arm to make all the throws (not Henne strong, but a average NFL arm). He has great touch over the top of the defense. He's a good enough athlete to relieve pressure. He makes many good throws on the move. He still makes some really bad decisions (mostly, he struggles when teams are heavily multiple in coverage), that and throwing to RBs are his major weakness (his footwork gets sloppy when he gets lazy which hurts his accuracy, when he sets his feet he has really good accuracy).

I've watched him progress from a guy that they didn't trust throwing more than double slants and mesh concepts to a guy throwing triangle concepts whenever they ask him to. If you said this after 2013 I'd have no issue believing you, but they guy got significantly better and played really, really well in 2014.

He isn't without flaws, neither was Henne. But Cook is good enough now and has potential in his game to improve in the areas where he's weakest. Winston and Mariota were the top 2 picks, I said Cook will be selected in the first 3 rounds. He would have gone ahead of Grayson and Mannion last year, two guys selected in the third round that Cook was better than. I don't know what hype I'm supposed to be believing here, I'm not calling him the second coming or Tom Brady, but he's a really good college QB.

Franz Schubert

July 24th, 2015 at 5:59 PM ^

The point is that Rudock has performed pretty well, but not as good comparatively. This shouldn't offend your RCMB buddies too much.I don't think anyone is saying Cook is terrible, just acknowledging he is probably overrated a tad. The guy has more interceptions dropped than any QB I can remember and his completion percentage is not good when he has a terrific O-line and running game. BTW why do you use Space Coyote here and not on RCMB?

bronxblue

July 24th, 2015 at 8:40 PM ^

I largely agree with this analysis, though it is hard to single out some of his performances given the quality of the line ahead of him. Langford had great seasons is struck me as a pretty average back. Cook under pressure wasn't great, and compared to other first round QBs, which I've seen him listed as, he's not spectacular enough at anything to compensate for. As a college QB, I think him and Ruddock are closer than people think. For example, Barrett at OSU and Winston at FSU are wildly different, but on their teams they were both deadly. I think Cook is a solid QB if given time, but put him on Iowa and I don't see him doing much more than Rudock. Similarly, MSU is not some hugely vertical team, so Rudock and his meh arm would not be a huge issue. Given what I've seen of him here by Brian and a couple of early Iowa games, I could see him winning about as many games as Cook at MSU. So that is my knock against the Cook hype; he absolutely is a fine QB, but he benefits immensely from the team around him. He strikes me like a slightly stronger but less accurate Cousins. The knock on Cousins is that he thinks he can make all the throws and the NFL CBs eat that up. I agree Cook has better touch and a better arm, but his accuracy is worse and I think he gets lazy with his footwork on the run because of it. Him as a mid 2nd or 3rd rounder sounds right.

Brofessor

July 24th, 2015 at 3:14 PM ^

Nice comparison, thanks for the post. 

I'm pretty optimistic about Ruduck and I think with his experience and Harbaugh's guidance he is going to have a good year.

JOHNNAVARREISMYHERO

July 24th, 2015 at 3:20 PM ^

I know a lot of people like to pick on Ohio State's schedules, but conference-wise, msu has had some pretty damn favorable schedules as well.

Its almost ridiculous to point out that they haven't played at Ohio State since 2011.

They are paying for that this year though.

 

Dawkins

July 24th, 2015 at 3:24 PM ^

Well, they'll get that chance this year. But if last year in EL is any indication, it won't be pretty. OSU won in EL by 12, but MSU scored a garbage time TD, so the game was actually more lopsided than the score would indicate. They also play there in late November, when it will be blistering cold. 

JOHNNAVARREISMYHERO

July 24th, 2015 at 3:32 PM ^

Their last score actually came after a pretty sketchy INT reversal - nothing new considering the venue.

It was a pretty thorough curbstomping for a team supposedly on par with Ohio State.

Their game at Ohio State is a guranteed loss, that will be uglier imo.

123blue

July 24th, 2015 at 4:25 PM ^

I think it was way more than 3 times with OSU.  MSU has put together a good program, but it's one that benefitted massively from the RR/Hoke era and low-level scheduling.  While we played OSU (as we should) each year, MSU played Indiana.  We'll now see how things go with the universe coming back into proper formation.

Franz Schubert

July 24th, 2015 at 3:20 PM ^

This is a very informative post. I suspect we as a fan base have no idea how lucky we are to have Rudock coming here. Michigan is going to shock some folks this year.

ElBictors

July 24th, 2015 at 3:22 PM ^

I like the comparison for what it is and it is helpful to look at common opponents (esp in Conf) when comparing the two.  But more than an indictment of Cook, this comparison is pleasantly surprising for those who haven't followed Iowa/Rudock as closely.

And to that end, Cook has benefitted greatly from the success and exposure of MSU recently, the BTCC (mentioned) appearance and honestly from the sucess of former Sparties like Cousins (and even Hoyer and Stanton).

Cook also has that thing where he "wears the uniform well" and looks like a solid NFL back up.

I'm fine with Rudock and fully expect him to start this season for MICHIGAN.  Beyond next year will be fun and interesting!!

Vandigg

July 24th, 2015 at 3:36 PM ^

I guess this kinda shows stats are sometimes garbage and misleading. All you have to do is watch a game and you know who's a better qb. Take the maize tinted goggles off.

Where are the wins stats in those games? How many of those games did Iowa win and how many did MSU win?  If I'm comparing QB's and i see the big games that Cook lead MSU to win compared to JR, its not even close.  Then I see that fact that Iowa isn't mad that their QB bolted for another school in the same conference, I'd be a little worried.  I like how you're trying to talk yourself into JR but he's not the future of UM.

Dawkins

July 24th, 2015 at 3:42 PM ^

I'm not aguing that Rudock is the better QB. Wins are also credited to the defense, especially in MSU's case since their defense is so good, which is why it made sense to just look at how each QB farred against the same defenses when comparing them. 

Also, welcome to the board. 

BigBlue02

July 24th, 2015 at 4:36 PM ^

"All you have to do is watch a game and you know who's a better qb.." Just curious as to how many games you've actually watched Rudock QB in? I'm guessing it is less than 1

bronxblue

July 24th, 2015 at 6:10 PM ^

Well, Ruddock is gone in a year regardless. Also, wins attributed to a QB are kinda like wins attritbuted to a pitcher. Cook is a fine QB on MSU; put him on Rutgers and he might not look that much better than Nova. Put him on PSU and I don't think he lasts half the season. I think Cook will get drafted in the first two rounds, but he looks like a somewhar better version of past MSU QBs, and I'm not sure any of them would be considered even moderately successful pros.

TrueLT

July 24th, 2015 at 3:42 PM ^

All I'm saying is if you do this exact same analysis for 2014 and add Gary Nova to those three teams, he finishes 3rd against Indiana and 1st for both Maryland and Nebraska, and he's easily the least talented of the 3 QBs named 

Your prompt is about being sick of Cook's hype but it's not linked to his stats, it's linked to his physical body and a ton of NFL scouts believing he would make a strong QB in the NFL - and statistically that analysis isn't a perfect comparison to actually draw any conclusions without weighing tons of contextual points (were there injuries on either side, wind/weather in general, did a strong running game open up things more for Cook and inflate those numbers) 

Let it be known, I personally think Devin Gardner has more NFL potential as a QB than Cook by far so obviously I'm not agreeing with anybody, am a total homer and would be laughed at by most scouts (am I crazy, I think his potential is insane), but let's just celebrate Rudock and leave Cook out of this. I also hate Sparty so arguing about the validity of this analysis is not me saying I think Cook is better than Rudock or even a good QB in general

814 East U

July 25th, 2015 at 12:38 AM ^

You are crazy. I'm serious. If you think Devin has more NFL QB potential than Cook I am convinced you are a 40 year old who paints his face half maize half blue on game days. Come on. The bias is insane.

I'd love to get your take on which UofM players have more potential than Shilique C.

Padog

July 24th, 2015 at 5:27 PM ^

Says who? He hasn't even gotten to campus yet. If he doesn't start, chances are he takes a redshirt. Obviously if he can't beat out everybody to start then he isn't heads and shoulders above either Morris or Speight. It wouldn't make sense to burn a year for him just as a backup.



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Michigan4Life

July 24th, 2015 at 3:47 PM ^

midwest area.  These are their thoughts on both QBs in which they've seen in all-22 films.

Cook:

Fearless QB who has strong arm and can make all throws.  When his footwork is set, he is very accurate and can make bucket throws.  Oddly, he is more accurate to his left as opposed to his right, but that's due to his footwork which he can be lazy at times.  Solid accuracy from short to intermediate but iffy accuracy in deep ball.  Solid athlete who can escape pressure and is a rhythm thrower who at his best when it's 3-5 step drops.  Cook has a tendency to trust his arm too much which is why he takes chances.  In addition to it, he struggles when there's pressure in his face.

Both don't have a final grade on Cook, but both have said mid 2nd to late 2nd rounder if the draft were to start today which is a starting QB in their book.

Rudock:

He's just an okay college QB but won't amount much in the NFL. Despite the completion percentage, his accuracy in intermediate to deep ball are awful.  Very indecisive and doesn't trust what he sees with his eyes.  Rudock would rather take a sack as opposed to throwing to WRs who are open in deep ball. Decent arm and is a solid athlete who can escape pressure. 

Like Cook, they don't have a final grade on Rudock, but they have him at UDFA right now.

Obviously, both have senior season to change their evaluations.  They thought that the B1G QBs are awful as whole.  They believed that Hackenberg, Cardale Jones, Cook are draftable prospects out of all of the B1G draft eligible QB.  They have Braxton Miller at RB/WR.

alum96

July 24th, 2015 at 4:25 PM ^

Rudock doesnt have a NFL arm.  He is basically a middle class man's Cousins.  The Lions have a very accurate QB who sits as 3rd string for them who won nearly everything in college but has a spaghetti arm.  You need to have a big arm to make those out throws vs NFL CBs.

Cook the jury will be out on how he performs when actually facing a pass rush.  It would have been interesting to flip Hack and Cook last year to see how the 2 would have done.  I'd imagine Hack would have had a splendid year as well when you only get sacked 10x in a season. MSU was #4 in the country on that count. 

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/468

Again, most games Cook didn't even suffer a grass stain - compare that to the hell guys like Gardner and Hack went thru.  Hack got sacked 44 (!!!) times last year.

 

GBBlue

July 24th, 2015 at 3:52 PM ^

Very nice work. After the last seven years, I'm having trouble mustering any optimism, so I appreciate any help I can get.

MGoBlogIsGreat

July 24th, 2015 at 4:22 PM ^

Well, Cook is pretty good. Let's be honest. Is he the best in the conference? Hell no. Give the kid some credit. I hate Cook and hope our defense kicks the shit out of him, though.

SFBlue

July 24th, 2015 at 4:23 PM ^

Hard to say. Rudock is not playing on the Iowa team from which these stats come. And State had a good team around Cook. Your QB does not need impressive numbers when your team dominates possession and can run the ball. What's uncertain about Michigan football is not the QB position, but the new system. 

ClassOf14

July 24th, 2015 at 5:31 PM ^

Excellent post OP. I didn't so much interpret this as a knock on Cook, but rather that Rudock isn't far behind by any means. I'm hoping that he can translate better playcalling and hopefully better OL play than he's had into more success, and can really surprise people this year.