Rosenberg; on the Carr retirement.
Well, you are all used to my railing against The Free Press, Michael Rosenberg, Mark Snyder, publisher Paul Anger and the angry mosh-pit of mouth breathers known on the internet as "Freep.com."
No links here. Not today. It's summertime, and the livin' is easy.
Just a couple of quick comments on Michael Rosenberg's obituary on the career of Lloyd Carr. (I use the term "obituary" after some reflection today. If you read it, it comes across like nothing so much as an obituary. I read it a second time, and then it seemed all the more like an obituary.)
Rosenberg is perfectly well-qualified to write about the career of Lloyd Carr. Let's all face it; that much is true. It is probably all too true; tragically, pathetically true. Rosenberg nicely summarizes the announcement of Carr's retirement.
But even when writing about something upon which he is an acknowledged expert, Rosenberg veers off course, as soon as he mentions the word "Rodriguez." Rosenberg writes that Rodgriguez replaced virtually the entire Michigan coaching staff when he arrived in Ann Arbor. That much is of course true, and, probably anticipating a thread just like this on on MGoBlog, Rosenberg adds parenthetically, "as was his right."
So that's it for Rosenberg and his readership; Rodriguez canned all of Michigan history that went before him, based on some weird legal right to do so.
Of course, what Rosenberg left out -- what Rosenberg should know if he doesn't already -- is that that is precisely, exactly what Bo Schembechler did upon his arrival in Ann Arbor from Miami University of Ohio. Indeed, Don Canham had specifically asked Bo Schembechler to retain much of Bump Elliott's staff, and Bo refused. I think Bo retained Tirrell Burton. Much like RR retained Fred Jackson. Otherwise, it is an absolute truth to state, "Upon his arrival, much as Rich Rodriguez did 39 years later, Bo Schembechler replaced virtually the entire Michigan coaching staff."
It's just a small window into the world of Mike Rosenberg.
Here's an open question to my friends at MGoBlog: Rosenberg suggested that Lloyd Carr inaugurated the business of having a dictionary parked on a bookstand just outside of his office. Players coming to see Carr for any reason were asked to recite a new word from the dictionary. Now, I am truly uncertain, but I thought that practice had originated with Bo. Perhaps I am wrong, and Rosenberg is right that it began with Carr. Anybody? Bueller? I don't wish to accuse Rosenberg of an error (there are enough Rosenberg errors and outrages for two lifetimes) without knowing for sure. The "dictionary" story is not an easy one to confirm, by its nature. Anybody know?
Here is a +1 against the horde, its a nice article and a much better read than whatever the OP was blabbering about
and they routinely understand the nature and the animus of Rosenberg's personal vendetta against Rich Rodriguez.
I'm surprised that you don't get it. Whatever.
associated with Carr on various occasions. Never saw it associated with Bo, nor does it sound like him. Perhaps someone knows differently?
...dictionary in Bo's Lasting Lessons using Google's search a book utility and came up empty. Did the same with all of the related books they displayed and nada. Not definitive, but a data point.
that there was a section in "Lasting Lesson's" about a dictionary he used.
Well I guess my post is even less definitive.
but the vitriol against rodriguez no matter the source or reason needs to completely stop and just support the guy as the coach.
I find it funny that media has such vitriol against Rich, Lloyd had more of a fort mentality then Bo and way more then Moeller and was very short if not blatantly rude towards the media most of his career. Did few interviews and little promotion of michigan football.
Rich on the other hand welcomed them in with far greater access then anyone else. And he has been pounded into the dirt by the media here....
Again, not saying anything about records or anything just let Lloyd retire and thank him for his service, appreciate what he did. But the bo era is gone and is not coming back anytime soon as in it has changed forever. Sure another former player/coach could be hired but that doesn't change the fact that Bo is nolonger with us.
I find that astonishing. I plussed you.
Yes, it is absolutely true. Lloyd Carr was the Lt. General of Fortress Schembechler. Rich Rodriguez is 1000% more open, more genial, more candid and more unguarded with the press. And for that, apparently, RR gets into trouble. With that same press. Huh!?!?!
But it may be more subtle yet; Carr was often publicly standoffish. But I don't honestly know what Carr's private relationship has been with Rosenberg, in particular. And I don't know whether Rosenberg's tow-year jihad against Rodriguez is part and parcel of Rosenberg's no longer having a special place of privilege within the Michigan football program. The kind of special realtionship that Rosenberg might have enjoyed with, say, the kind of Head Coach who was willing to write a Foreward or a publicity blurb for one of Rosenberg's books, eh?
...when the team starts going 9 and 3 with regularity and blowing s**t up against the Little Brother again.
As it should be.
We should not forget or dismiss the level of insecurity/latent anger and/or outright disdain for Michigan by many in the mainstream media. After 30 plus years of dominance in state and nationally, after Bo, after Mo, after Lloyd and his remarkable disdain for all things media it's clear there were many who were more than ready to skewer the program at it's low point. Things will change, however, and most likely this autumn...and then maybe RichRod should consider his open relationship with a media that has royally screwed him.
As for Lloyd Carr...Lloyd Carr was a great coach, a National Champion coach and a guy who was very supportive of his players obtaining degrees from Michigan. Let's wish him well in his retirement.
12-1 or 13-0 with regularity, but I do enjoy watching the improvement this team has made each year since RR came.
-UMichGA
Why are you reading the freep? If everyone stopped reading the freep they would go away.
Just a couple of quick comments
I would hate to see the long version.
Rosenberg will never write an even-handed article about UM ever again. He just can't. Not after everything that's happened in the last year.
Of course, what Rosenberg left out -- what Rosenberg should know if he doesn't already -- is that that is precisely, exactly what Bo Schembechler did upon his arrival in Ann Arbor from Miami University of Ohio. Indeed, Don Canham had specifically asked Bo Schembechler to retain much of Bump Elliott's staff, and Bo refused. I think Bo retained Tirrell Burton. Much like RR retained Fred Jackson. Otherwise, it is an absolute truth to state, "Upon his arrival, much as Rich Rodriguez did 39 years later, Bo Schembechler replaced virtually the entire Michigan coaching staff."
Why should that have been mentioned? It would have added nothing to the article whatsoever. From the article:
And yet, some things do. Carr never said as much, but I think he envisioned a coaching retirement similar to Schembechler's retirement: that he would have an office in the athletic department and would mentor the coach -- who, presumably, would be one of his former assistants. That changed when Bill Martin hired Rich Rodriguez and Rodriguez fired virtually every coach on Carr's staff (which, of course, was Rodriguez's right).
but it's hard to say that carr has been supportive of RR. Bo had the highest regard for bump elliott and the way he handled the transfer.
Never complained publicly about the state of the program he was left with either. Certainly allowed Bump to be more magnanimous to his replacement.
Really! What the hell could Bo complain about, with respect to "the state of the program he was left with..."?
Bump Elliott left Bo with these guys:
Jim Mandich, Tom Curtis, Phil Seymour, Barry Pierson, Dan Dierdorf, Guy Murdoch, Billy Taylor, Marty Huff, Henry Hill, Don Moorhead, Garvie Craw, Jimmy Betts, Thom Darden, Reggie Mckenzie, Cecil Pryor and Jim Brandstatter. Among many others. That's a handful of All-Americans, and two handfuls of All-Big Ten talent!
What did Rich Rodriguez inherit? Brandon Graham and Donovan Warren. Oh, and Threet and Sheridan.
(All that strength and conditioning we hear about), they were lazy and had expectations of where they stood without the effort (ask Dan Dierdorf sometime...), the facilities were a mess (which aren't true of Football now...but we hear that as a program problem for basketball a lot), and apparently Bump recruited a bunch of quitters, from all the people who left the team.
Hmmm...any of that sounding familiar?
Oh, and Tim Jamison, Zoltan Mesko, Terrance Taylor, and anyone from any later class who still becomes an All-Big Ten performer...(should we count the 08 class, too, since it's never considered a full class for Rich when considering the talent currently on the team...? Anyone good in that class, Lloyd gets the credit, right?).
And really, bringing up Threet and Sheridan is as stupid as saying "hey, Rich had Mallett...".
I can't think of when, or how, Rich Rodriguez "complained" about the program he came into. What is beyond dispute is that Rodriguez had some huge holes, personnel-wise. I don't much remember Rodriguez "complaining" about them; indeed, he didn't have to. Everybody else did.
I'm not a Carr-hater. I've never been a Carr-hater. I'm a Michigan Man, and as part and parcel of that, I've been an ardent supporter of Bump Elliott, Bo, Gary Moeller, Carr and Rich Rodriguez. All of them, without exception.
The whole "not after I got here", "last 3 or 4 February's have hurt us a little bit" and so forth. Which has been debated ad nauseum on how accurate, and how much and so forth. Which I don't really want to do at this point, because it's year 3, and really doesn't matter anymore.
And I won't tell you what you are or aren't...I won't propose to say I know you better than you know yourself. But I know what you've done on here. I remember the Lloyd-Trent blow-up. And that you were rather unapologetic after it. So, the way you have presented yourself, it seems a bit disingenuous.
But again, the original point was that meme that BO NEVER DID IT...and the situations were handled differently by all parties than they are today.
If this is all reduced to some sort of hypothetical sportstalk radio-style debate of "Did Bo Schembechler complain about his predecessor? Has Rich Rodriguez complained about his predecessor?", it has to be one of the all-time great wastes of time.
You can search forever, and you won't find one negative word that I have ever written about Lloyd Carr's tenure as our head football coach. And if I offered any mild criticism of Carr in his role as 'Retired Coach'/Senior Associate Athletic Director, I'm not changing my mind about that. And I am certainly not retracting anything I said about the idiotic comments of Morgan Trent and Braylon Edwards. Braylon is the guy who has been doing most of the retracting, for that matter.
Michigan has a head football coach. And it's high time that a lot of people recognize that, if they want to win.
It's really weird to me -- how many internet fanboys want to make a big deal about what to wear to football games, and whether to stand, and how loud to yell -- but won't fully back up Rich Rodriguez.
Because you completely deflected and changed the point. From discussing what Rich DID say...to something about supporting the coach, which had nothing to do with the discussion.
And I don't need to go back and read your post after post rants about what you think Lloyd Carr owes you to do in the Trent situation. It's all there. (Again, deflecting with Trent and Edwards, neither of which I brought up). If you thinks that was mild, you either have reading comprehension with all the responses to you in those threads, and after, or your just dishonest. But if you didn't change your mind then, I'm not thinking you will now.
And I haven't read anything funnier on this blog in weeks than a comparison to sport talk radio style waste of time debates, coming from you, in this thread of all threads. It's seems you've proven you have tons of time to waste on just such types of debates. And analysis. And attacks on the media for slights and perceived slights. Pot, meet kettle.
That's all.
And still is, backing up, and compliments, are a two way street. Bump didn't throw Bo under the bus (though I don't know that he praised Bo anymore than Lloyd has Rich), mainly because Bo didn't throw Bump under the bus for frankly, not doing a great job of getting his talented players ready to perform. Everyone wants Lloyd to do the same and send endless praise Rich's way, while Rich has made multiple little digs about the problems he inherited. How accurate you believe they are or not doesn't matter. Because just saying it isn't a diplomatic way to get some lovin' back.
But you keep changing the topic with how big a Lloyd fan you are, and what constitute a worthwhile discussion or not, and ignoring the points you keep asking for. So you're right. I this case, it is pointless.
Yes, I am looking for stuff to complain about.
I am not a neutral observer of Michael Rosenberg. I am looking to find errors, omissions, and ways to criticize Rosenberg. I don't like Rosenberg, or his paper. I'm just more honest about my open dislike of the Rosenberg and the Freep, than Rosenberg is about his (now-barely concealed) dislike of Rich Rodriguez.
I am looking at everything that Rosenberg writes about Michigan, and fly-specking it for accuracy. I hope to rebut him and refute him at every available opportunity.
Remember, too, Seth, that I first and foremost mentioned that one of the better people around, to write about the subject of Lloyd Carr, is in fact Rosenberg. Of course, one of the worst and most biased people to write about Rich Rodriguez is the same Michael Rosenberg.
I have no problem with your scrutinizing Rosenberg articles for bias against Rodriguez. I wouldn't choose to spend my time doing so, but I see nothing wrong with it. What I do question is where the anti-Rodriguez bias occurred within the article you talked about. He mentions Rodriguez once and is completely neutral about him.
The problem here, as I see it, is that many here on this board have when evaluating the Freep and other media outlets classify articles about Rodriguez as either positive or not positive and condemn all articles that aren't positive. The problem here is that then articles that are patently neutral are condemned by extension, and it seems to me that the article you mentioned falls decidedly in that category. If he wanted to be negative, he could have gone on to talk about things like NCAA violations or losing seasons as reasons that Carr might be displeased with Rodriguez, but he did not.
And at the same time, if I had wanted to be more fully elaborative about my loathing of Rosenberg, I could have gone on to talk about the details of Rosenberg's August 30, 2009 story, and how the subsequent investigations by Michigan's lawyers and the NCAA's lawyers showed that the Freep allegations were mostly all untrue.
But I did not.
Frank Maloney and George Mans were the two holdovers from Bump's last staff in 1968. They stayed on with Bo through the 1973 season.
Tirrel Burton did not join the Michigan staff until 1970.
+1 for you, which is a little like donating a dollar to Bill Gates.
...RR retained Fred Jackson in order to land Sam McGuffie.
Then I suppose you would also conjecture that he's kept him on after Sam's transfer to land his son, Jeremy...
From what I've seen of RR, he kept Fred because he respected him, Fred meshed well with the coaching staff he was building, and Fred gets the job done coaching RBs.
Fred also probably told Rich Rod how the crop of RB's was the best he had even seen at Michigan, and how Minor and Brown were going to be first team All-Americans at the same time.