Rich Rod vs. Carr decision-making
On WTKA Brian repeated something he has written as well -- that he's more forgiving of bad 'in the heat of the moment' decisions (like calling the ball spike on 3rd down at the end of the half) than bad philosophical decisions (like always punting, even in enemy territory).
I'm not so sure. I think bad 'heat of the moment' decisions are symptomatic of something else -- lack of composure, lack of preparation, lack of smarts, what have you. Bad philosophical decisions are more frustrating, sure, but you can always hope for a JoePa-like reawakening where the coach realizes the error of his overly conservative ways.
A pattern of bad 'heat of the moment' decisions, in contrast, is something that might never be remedied. So while I might forgive them, they also scare me more.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:08 PM ^
Remember when we passed down the field at will on the opening drive of the '06 OSU game and then Lloyd the Great decided to can the passing game in favor of running up the gut 3 times in a row every drive? That was fun. At least Rich Rod makes mistakes going full speed and keeps it interesting. We might drop our jaws when he does a fake punt on our own 16 but at least we aren't slamming our heads on the table in frustration at the same old boring crap.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:12 PM ^
You know, I never realized that the problem in that game was the play calling the left us with only 38 points.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:15 PM ^
Then you must not have watched it. Quite a few of our points (including our last TD) could have been considered garbage time points. The broken items littering my dorm room were evidence of the offensive frustration. So many drives stalled after that first one, OSU jumped down our throats and had us playing catch up the whole game.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:01 PM ^
My memories of the game were different than yours, as I didn't recall at any point feeling like we had entered a "garbage time" situation. Checking ESPN's play-by-play of the game reveals that we scored our second to last TD 8 seconds into the fourth quarter, making the score 35-31 OSU. Certainly that's not garbage time.
Our last TD was scored with 2 minutes left on the clock, and put us within three points. That TD was almost certainly against a prevent D, but doesn't come close to "garbage time" given that if we'd recovered the onsides kick, we'd have had two minutes left and needed only a FG to tie.
October 26th, 2009 at 8:29 PM ^
Lloyd was a football coach of principle and extreme stubborness, but I always felt he was making his decisions due to an honest belief in the strength in our team, whether it be punting away at questionable times, leaving our defense one stop away from a hard fought win, it felt like he was saying I have confidence in my defense. RR is the opposite, and I don't feel like it is out of weekness, but I think it can come across a little desperate when the circumstances don't call for desperation. Sometimes you can let the clock run out, sometimes you need to say to a team, you can't score on us anyway so go ahead and try. Granted he doesn't have the talent to employ such an attitude right now, but just a thought. Many times I felt Lloyd not to be conservative necessarily, sometimes just ultra confident would be a better way to phrase it.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:12 PM ^
If you really think the spiked ball was due to a lack of preparation or lack of smarts I feel sorry for the human race.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:20 PM ^
It happens, and had we converted on second down (instead of fumbling the snap) this is all moot. In the scheme of things, it probably would not have mattered Saturday, as we were dominated by a better team.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:29 PM ^
Everybody loves the risk taker. The coach that "goes for it". Pedal to the metal baby. Do you know why some coaches play it safe? Because it's the smart thing to do. Lloyd built up a pretty good record early in his career playing ball control, good D, and field positioning. Same with Tressel now. It shouldn't be considered safe or chicken, but a sound winning philosophy. What would have happend Sat. if Tate wouldn't have spiked the ball on 3rd down? Maybe he gets sacked or it's another bad snap. Then we don't get the FG and we have no momentum at all. Perhaps on the safety play UM should have lined up in the I, just ran it, and let Zoltan boom a 50 yard punt. Sometime playing it safe is the way to go. Last year in the Utah game we got the ball back with a minute left in the 1st half. Instead of just running it and going into the half down a score, RR lets Sheridan throw a ball that gets picked. Utah scored a TD a few plays later.
Know what they call the risk taker when that gamble doesn't pay off? An idiot
October 26th, 2009 at 5:31 PM ^
Remember that time that Lloyd the non-risk-taker lost to Appalachian State? That was pretty cool. Or when he refused to take the risk of publicly lobbying on our behalf for a rematch with OSU in the BCS title game? Also cool.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:00 PM ^
Not sure why you bring up the not lobbying, but the App St game is a valid point. The problem with that team is it didn't match the coaches' personality. That team played no defense. Lloyd's strategy, and most consevative coaches, works best with strong defensive teams and they play to that strength. What kills them is poor D and turn-overs. OSU would be undefeated this year with Tressel's style if they didn't turn the ball over against USC and Purdue.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:03 PM ^
It was more of a Rich Rod connection thing, I could sure as hell see him in front of every camera he could find explaining why a rematch was the right thing to do. Lloyd tried to act like he was above that. Epic fail.
October 26th, 2009 at 9:07 PM ^
and not our complete inability to stop a spread offense over the period from 2003-2008 that had anything to do with the Horror.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:36 PM ^
The reason coaches do things like punting from around the 30 and kicking field goals on 4th and goal at the 1 is because doing those things never gets you ripped in the mainstream media. They're still almost always the wrong decisions (there are exceptions, like when a FG would make it a 3-score game in the 4th quarter you probably should kick on that 4th and goal).
October 26th, 2009 at 6:02 PM ^
And just to prove my point that the mainstream media just doesn't get it on these moves, Bill Lynch made the right call twice this weekend - once going for it on 4th and goal from inside the 1, and a second time going for it on 4th and 3 from the Northwestern 33.
Because in both cases Indiana failed (even managing to give up a 98 yard TD drive after they failed on 4th and goal), his calls, correct at the time, earned him a "Thumbs Down" from Rittenberg. Woo Hindsight!
October 26th, 2009 at 9:05 PM ^
however, I don't think Lloyd Carr gave (or currently gives) two shits about the "mainstream media." He was a conservative coach, end of story. He didn't make punting decisions based on media worries. I'm pretty sure Paterno doesn't give a crap about the media either and it doesn't factor into his play calling.
October 26th, 2009 at 9:24 PM ^
"Know what they call the risk taker when that gamble doesn't pay off? An idiot"
Yup and this is why risk taking isn't rewarded. Because "they" have a lot to say about it. Not because taking calculated risks is wrong.
October 27th, 2009 at 9:05 AM ^
On one point: that when this offense has the ball inside its own 10 (or any other situation when getting 3 yards on a play can be considered successful) Rod needs either put the offense in the I or at least get the ball to Minor on a quick-hitting play. Preferably the former, IME.
RAGE does not tend to lose yardage.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:28 PM ^
was inexcusable IME. Anyone that has played or knows the game in-depth should know that with that much time left on the clock and it being 3rd down that you don't spike it. The average play takes 6 seconds so there is no point to not take a shot at the end zone. You can scream Tate's inexperience and he didn't want to lose a chance at points with an interception but if you can't trust your highly touted freshman qb to throw a fade route where the receiver gets it or no one gets it then that says something about Tate. So instead of going into the half at 19-14 we decided that a meaningless field goal which still leaves us two scores down is the right move. I'm not saying that it was lack of planning or lack of intelligence by the coaching staff but rather just a mistake during the course of a frantic last minute drive at the end of a half with inexperience from top to bottom. As this team gains more experience RR and company won't have to tell Tate what to do in that situation, he'll already know...
October 26th, 2009 at 5:33 PM ^
I think the marathon of quick touchdowns our world-class defense gave up to start the second half played a bigger role in this barn-burner. The spike is moot. I don't see how you guys can bitch about one spiked ball but brush off five turnovers in the Iowa game as growing pains.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:46 PM ^
You've complained lots about getting negged lately for having a dissenting opinion. Have you thought about that maybe you're not getting negged for disagreeing, but because you're being a complete asshole in your delivery?
October 26th, 2009 at 5:48 PM ^
At this point, I've become cynical and could give a shit, my unabashed opionions are coming out now. I'm thinking that I can be an all-time great next to bouje and King of Belch.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:39 PM ^
Guys, exmtrog is having a rough time right now. Try not to have any fun when he is around. Maybe he can pull out of this.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:21 PM ^
Tip:
For an example of a "good" delivery, review this classic from The Other Brian.
(...or...)
October 26th, 2009 at 5:49 PM ^
you have had a small dick since you were born. why are you so pissed about it today?
October 26th, 2009 at 5:49 PM ^
Your mom decided to move on from it. It was a good run, though.
October 26th, 2009 at 7:17 PM ^
middle school?
October 26th, 2009 at 5:52 PM ^
you said world class
October 26th, 2009 at 8:07 PM ^
"Marathon of quick touchdowns".
I've been enjoying all the comments, for that matter, negging be damned
October 26th, 2009 at 5:55 PM ^
remember my first beer too. i dont think i was as big of a fucking idiot though. remember tuff guy:
no one knows how stupid you are until you open your mouth
October 26th, 2009 at 5:56 PM ^
Haha, that joke's so old, I almost fell off my dinosaur. Good Step Brothers reference. Next time, don't start shit, and I won't have to burn your ass and actually get some positive points for it. Go sit down somewhere.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:53 PM ^
Also, I'm your Daddy by the way, hence why yours is also small.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:58 PM ^
www.mlive.com/forums
This should help you find your way home.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:00 PM ^
Look a few posts up and see the origin of rodfather calling my dick small. When you step in to the Thunderdome, I'm bringing the heat.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:05 PM ^
You can take Rodfather with you back to mlive. Go have your dick waving contest over there.
October 27th, 2009 at 9:08 AM ^
I always thought the Thunderdome would be a little more intense and less dorky than an internet message board. Don't believe the hype, I guess.
October 26th, 2009 at 5:57 PM ^
your mommas got one arm and she swims in a circle
October 26th, 2009 at 5:58 PM ^
You are making my night, thank you man. It's like Lloyd Carr decided to try his hand at trash talking with a young whippersnapper.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:09 PM ^
his mom makes him turn off the computer at 8.
here ill get it out of your way
omg carr sucked, omg rr sucks,omg appy state, omg 97 neb. split, omg 3-9, omg to much practice, omg feagin rr recruits drug dealers, omg rr left a job to take a better one,omg defense is worst ever, omg i can almost see my dick.
hows that tuff guy? and the chair you learned to cut hair in does not constitute a dorm room.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:16 PM ^
You spelled it "t-u-f-f" Who's legit? You.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:13 PM ^
i usually am better than this. but ill be waving my dick around here today lol. what good would a troll be if no one bites?
October 26th, 2009 at 6:15 PM ^
Dude, you already lost, and people are neg-banging you now. Just move on, even I've made a serious post by now.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:21 PM ^
sorry i meant TUFF guy.
October 26th, 2009 at 6:24 PM ^
When you stare up at the ceiling in bed tonight thinking about what you should have said to at least be competitive in this little exchange, remember two things: My grammar was better than yours (thanks to the college I went to that is also better than yours, or the Ford plant you work in), and 2: I never even made fun of your stupid ass name. Rodfather? The you-loving-penis jokes were about to wash over you, but I'll save my best for a more worthy opponent. Later. Exmtroj, Out. *Bow*
October 26th, 2009 at 6:31 PM ^
sounds good. i live in a2 anytime you wanna discuss lol. that is if my foreman will allow me a little time
October 26th, 2009 at 6:42 PM ^
think any one worked at ford any more
October 26th, 2009 at 7:00 PM ^
I am sorry but this reads like some tOSU message board.
October 26th, 2009 at 7:00 PM ^
to play at a fast pace, but I wish he'd slow down sometimes and use the full play clock.
It gets a little infuriating to see us go 1-2-3 punt in like 40 seconds because we want to play at a fast pace, when what we should be doing is establishing a game plan and thinking things through.
Sometimes I think they try to play to fast, particularly with such a large number of young players.
October 26th, 2009 at 7:03 PM ^
Live by the speed and die by the speed......I agree though.
October 26th, 2009 at 7:08 PM ^
Then your example is of a frosh QB spiking a ball on his own.