Question: Why Do NFL Coaches Rarely Make Lateral Moves To College?
With the NFL coaching carousel set in motion, it got me wondering why we don't see more pro coaches make lateral moves to the college ranks, especially head coaches. It's not strictly about money. The average NFL head coach salary this year was $4.6M (per coacheshotseat.com), compared to an average of $3.5M among the top-30 highest paid NCAA football coaches (per USA Today). (What's a cool million anyway? Just another Porsche 918 Spyder for a guy like me. I'll show you my sweet new U-M plates later).
But seriously, we've seen our share of Weisses and O'Briens and even Sabans move from NFL coordinators to college bosses, but the Mattisons who go from coordinator to coordinator or head coach to head coach from NFL to NCAA seem less common.
Is there a clear reason for this? Are college jobs just not as esteemed? Or maybe way too much work for the same money when you factor in recruiting, schmoozing boosters, etc.? Will this change now that college coach salaries are ballooning like track-home prices in 2006?
I would think that someone like Schwartz or Leslie Frazier would be a dynamite college head coach candidate. Recruits seem to really like the idea of signing up to play for a guy who has coached in the NFL and knows what it takes to get there. I'd be throwing money at Frazier if I were Texas or Penn State (. . . or Michigan? <ducks>).
December 30th, 2013 at 5:15 PM ^
Because they are lateral moves.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:18 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 5:19 PM ^
But I believe you're right when you point to workload. NFL coaches work extraordinarily hard by any normal standard, of course, but I think their offseasons are less intense than the offseasons of college coaches because they don't have to recruit. Being a college coach at a place like OSU or Texas is also, as you allude to, like being a politician. You have to do a lot of work to please a lot of people.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:20 PM ^
More work for the same or less money.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:23 PM ^
To most NFL coaches, college is a step down in prestige. They also get used to working with grown adults and may not want to deal with teenagers again. There's a certain type of person who really likes college coaching, and a type who really likes NFL - most coaches gravitate toward one or the other. It's not too common to see a guy succeed at both levels. The same can be said of the NBA/college hoops.
December 30th, 2013 at 7:29 PM ^
There are only 32 NFL teams, and even the most mediocre are still huge operations with more money and more prevalence in society than college - the NFL is the most popular sports organization in the country. Only a few colleges can hope to compete, and even those that can still aren't "top dog", so to speak, in the football world or the sports world.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:23 PM ^
you could say an NFL coach has an easier job. No recruiting, no babysitting, no donors asses to kiss.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:26 PM ^
One is almost 100% a coaching job. The other 50% coaching + 10% teacher + 10% life coach + 10% mentor + 10% babysitter + 10% stuff I'm probably not thinking of.
December 31st, 2013 at 1:23 AM ^
I actually think this is pretty spot on.
December 31st, 2013 at 11:41 AM ^
I assume it's you.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:34 PM ^
I think recruiting has lots to do with it. During bye weeks college coaches are on the road visiting recruits. NFL coaches are probably still working, but don't have to spend time away from home.
December 30th, 2013 at 8:20 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 5:38 PM ^
Because successful coaches, like successful athletes are hyper-competitive. Hyper-competitve people want to test themselves at the highest level. For football coaches, that level is the NFL. If you reach that peak of your profession, you stay there as long as you can, you don't step back a level.
Sure there are exceptions, but as you point out they're exceedingly rare. Most of the guys that move from pro to college take a step up in level (say from coordinator to head coach) or their opportunity at the NFL level has vanished.
December 30th, 2013 at 7:51 PM ^
Sure people like Schwartz, etc. are competitive. They did stay there as long as they could. Now they are never going to be Nfl head coaches ever again. Is a lifetime of interviewing for NFL asst positions, and getting passed over more likely than not, really better than college coaching? Greg Schiano is going to be a used car salesman next year if he doesn't go back to the college ranks. How is that not stepping back a level?
January 17th, 2014 at 9:36 AM ^
right - because Schiano has no NFL head coaching options. He wants to be a coach, he's going to have to do it at the college level. My point was, few people competitive and talented enough to be NFL Head Coaches voluntarily step down a level in competition. When it's not voluntary, sure.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:44 PM ^
NFL coaches only have to worry about their players remaining healthy and unincarcerated.
College coaches need to make sure their players go to class (or the proper "independent study" courses).
NFL coaches deal with players that want to continue receiving a paycheck for their Sunday labor.
College coaches deal with players that think - despite overwhelming odds - that their DI status entitles them to play in the NFL.
NFL coaches - even the assistants - make a lot of money.
College coaches only make a lot of money at a handful of schools.
In short, NFL coaches do what they love - coaching football and making money without the bullshit. It really is that simple.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:46 PM ^
...and, NFL coaches don't have to watch the small stuff as much. They do, but no where near as much as a NCAA coach. Remember, the NFL is a 'world' sport (England, bro!). The NCAA is a favorite in America.
Also, money...Schwartz just got paid 12 mil to go home...sounds like a plan to me.
Even before he was fired ppl were linking him to other jobs (Cleveland). He's going to do just fine without Detroit.
On the flip side, Detroit will be fine without Schwartz. As long as they don't take the under the radar guy. Open the checkbook and find a guy who has a pedigree, I.e. Wisenhunt, Gruden, Dungy.
The lions don't need someone to turn the program around. They aren't dead. No more 0-16. The lions aren't bad, they make dumb mistakes and the worst times. That's not a turn around, that's discipline. Get a guy that will get in players face.
Call us the 'Detroit Cowboys QB's'
...see what I did there? Romo and Orton always screw up at the worst times. No? Ok? Back to work.
December 30th, 2013 at 5:48 PM ^
can't work in the NFL. Errrrbody know that
December 30th, 2013 at 5:56 PM ^
It's an interesting question actually, and even moreso when you consider that there are a few current FBS coaches who have some experience as an assistant or even head coach in the NFL. For example, I believe David Shaw was an assistant in the NFL for the better part of a decade (I know he was with Baltimore and Philly at various points), as well as Jim Mora with his two short stints as a head coach in the NFL. Further, you have Bo Pelini, who was an assistant with the 49ers and Patriots in the 1990s and Mike McIntyre at SJSU, who was an assistant with Dallas for a few years, I believe. I think the OP is right though in that there aren't a lot of readily available examples of this phenomenon (Saban, of course, but after that....).
It would be interesting to talk to some of these guys to see why they went back to the college ranks, although I suspect that these are guys that must want to do the things that are required of a college coach that aren't part of the NFL version of the position. As others have said, the NFL seems easier and does not have the political and teaching aspect attached, but some people clearly enjoy being a teacher, do not mind the schmoozing (if you will), and like the general campus environment.
December 30th, 2013 at 6:22 PM ^
...trying to think of guys who have gone from being HCs in the NFL to HCs in college the other day. Other than Saban, I could only come up with Bill Walsh, John Robinson (most famously of USC and the LA Rams), and Lou Holtz (who coached the Jets for one season).
December 30th, 2013 at 6:26 PM ^
Pete Carroll and Steve Spurrier are two others.
December 30th, 2013 at 6:35 PM ^
What we can apparently take from the list is that guys leave the NFL for college if they've been fired, washed out and resigned, or won three Super Bowls.
December 30th, 2013 at 7:31 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 7:59 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 9:34 PM ^
Bobby Petrino
December 30th, 2013 at 8:54 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:00 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:07 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:09 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:10 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:15 PM ^
difficult since there is constant turnover (graduation, early entry to NFL and strict rules regarding player relations and practices). There is more team instability in college and unless one is a terrific recruiter tenure at a high profile college can be iffy.
Also, developing players is very labor intensive and is absolute necessary for a successful college program
December 30th, 2013 at 8:15 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:28 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 6:40 PM ^
Saban's NFL narrative is like Spurrier's. The NFL game is the top end of the profession and, I think at an ego level, where the elite of the profession want the challenge.
Once Saban gets found out like Pete Carroll and Chip Kelly he'll be back in the league.
December 30th, 2013 at 7:34 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 11:55 PM ^
I figure eventually the three blind mice at the NCAA find out Alabama is guilty of something (like so many other times) and Saban flakes (like Carroll and Chip Kelly) before the dust settles on his successor.
December 30th, 2013 at 8:31 PM ^
December 31st, 2013 at 9:32 AM ^
Of those 10, only three played at the BCS level, a number equal to those who have no college coaching experience (two of whom, Dungy and Cowher, are on both lists). Only 5 played at the FBS level at all.
December 30th, 2013 at 8:48 PM ^
December 30th, 2013 at 10:06 PM ^
I'm sure part of it is a prestige thing--similar in some ways to the difference between movie actors and television actors. The pay can be similar, the work itself can't be that much different, but while tv actors leap at the opportunity to get into movies, the opposite doesn't happen nearly as often.
December 30th, 2013 at 10:24 PM ^
I think it's probably oversimplifying to say that NFL coaches don't have to deal with the bullshit as much. You're talking about a lot of egos in these locker rooms. Any coach that had Terrell Owens on his team (to name one ego) would disagree that he didn't have to put up with a bunch of bullshit. College players can often be intimidated into compliance, or at least, there's quite a lot more that a college coach can hold over a player's head. You almost never hear of a college coach that has "lost the locker room." The issues are different, but not necessarily better in the pros.
I think the main answer is money, money, money, money. The lowest-paid NFL coach likely makes more than 90-95% of college coaches. Add the prestige of one of only 32 such positions in the whole coaching world and you've got the answer.
December 30th, 2013 at 11:05 PM ^
Agree with this post. Re: money- If an NFL coach gets a college gig at a name school then recruiting takes care of itself- its much easier to cruise at USC or Bama for decades with a stable job and a +75% winning record. In the NFL its all equal, you have to actually be a better coach. I think college is easier than NFL at a brand school like USC- if you get fired after 3 years NFL how much more did you make than 10 years at Bama? I really think its all about prestige, Sundays, the world at your feet. BTW - can someone explain how to create clean paragraphs as easily as possible? I have tried to use full HTML tags w/ the filtered HTML and they don't work. I have never seen a system like this before. Also- is word verification always necessary- i am thinking of quitting posting b/c its just so much work here- every edit requires another verification.
December 31st, 2013 at 12:02 AM ^
I think once you get to 100 points, you don't have to use word verification anymore. I gave you an upvote to help you get there.
As far as paragraphs go, you should just be able to hit "Enter" if you're in the rich text editor format (which is default).
December 31st, 2013 at 1:14 AM ^
Thanks for the help- unfortunately hitting "enter" doesn't create paragraphs for me in the default rich text mode in either Full HTML or Filtered HTML (I've tried both). My "Format" reads in the upper left corner reads "Paragraph" which is the default. I don't know if it should read "normal" or something like that- I know i am tired of experimenting.
December 31st, 2013 at 1:53 AM ^
Mine reads normal, but that is besides the point. Do you know how to add paragraphs? If hitting enter doesn't work then you can go into plain text editor and put this before each new paragaph <p> What it looks like you are doing is adding a ton of spaces. Thus you are getting the code &nspb; which just create spaces and not paragraphs.
Put it exactly like that. So to get a paragraph it should be something like this <p>This is a new paragaph. Here is a few sentences. Michigan is the best. Then we add a this little guy at the end to stop the paragraph. </p>
<p>Now this is a new paragraph. Because I put a <p> at the beginning of that sentence, so therefore it will create a new paragraph. Now I will end this paragraph and then show you what this looks like if you do it in plain text editor.
Note, I did this in rich text editor, so the paragraph breaks wouldn't actually happen when I added the <p>
Essentially, you just need to switch to plain text editor. Type what you want to say. Then add a <p> anywhere you want a new paragraph to start. And then add an </p> to the end of the last sentence of each of your paragraphs.
December 31st, 2013 at 1:50 AM ^
Now this is what the stuff would look like that I typed above if I had used plain text editor. Just to give you an idea of how the stuff works.
So to get a paragraph it should be something like this.
This is a new paragaph. Here is a few sentences. Michigan is the best. Then we add a this little guy at the end to stop the paragraph.
Now this is a new paragraph. Because I put a <p> at the beginning of that sentence, so therefore it will create a new paragraph.
This is what your post would look like if it had correct <p> breaks.
Agree with this post. Re: money- If an NFL coach gets a college gig at a name school then recruiting takes care of itself- its much easier to cruise at USC or Bama for decades with a stable job and a +75% winning record. In the NFL its all equal, you have to actually be a better coach. I think college is easier than NFL at a brand school like USC- if you get fired after 3 years NFL how much more did you make than 10 years at Bama?
I really think its all about prestige, Sundays, the world at your feet.
BTW - can someone explain how to create clean paragraphs as easily as possible? I have tried to use full HTML tags w/ the filtered HTML and they don't work. I have never seen a system like this before.
Also- is word verification always necessary- i am thinking of quitting posting b/c its just so much work here- every edit requires another verification.
December 31st, 2013 at 2:22 AM ^
Taking a shot at this in plain text w filtered HTML
wonder why nothing happens when I hit enter
December 31st, 2013 at 2:30 AM ^
This system works when I write in rich text, change it to plain text and filtered HTML. Plain text also shows me that rich text already added <p> symbols. But the real problem may be that when I hit "enter" to start a new paragraph in rich text, nothing happens. I do not jump down a line in my draft. Is there a reason the "enter" key would not work in rich text? What other way or setting would allow the "enter" button on my keyboard to work and create paragraphs in my draft?
December 31st, 2013 at 2:34 AM ^
BTW- I do appreciate your help, I guess I can live with this. I've never been on a website before where "enter" is disabled in the draft box
December 31st, 2013 at 9:50 PM ^
Are paragraphs working for you now by using the <p>? I'm not sure why hitting enter doesn't work for you. I have seen a small handful of other users say that it doesn't work for them either. If you know how to take a screenshot, you could do that to give me an idea of what your stuff looks like.