Do we have a chance of bringing in a pro style QB in this class still? I love Denard as much as the next man, but I have serious doubts about him playing QB in a pro system. I think that Devin will be just fine, star like even in this system and he will likley start. The rumors of Tate not being enrolled is scary though, we could be in a situation where we have one scholarship QB for this season. My question is are there any pro type QBs we could land. Hoke had the #10 QB according to rivals commited, will he follow Hoke here? What does this do with our chances at the QB from Glennville? I'm very uneasy about our QB depth this year right now.
QB depth, potential recruits
You are just the worst kind of person.
Well when you consider Hoke has always had a prostyle QB through his 8 seasons as a HC, I think its safe to say thats what he will target.
I think "prostyle" isn't much of a reality these days. There is no single "prostyle." Offensive systems vary greatly throughout the NFL. The days of uniformity in having a two back sets with one TE and two WRs are over, mainly because it's not a particularly useful set against the complex defenses run in the pros.
What you mean to say is, any chance at recruiting a QB with the skillset required of most offenses in the NFL? It's probably pretty late in the game to recruit someone with real star potential, but we might be able to get a guy to provide some nice depth behind Denard and Gardner.
The pro-style doesn't refer to nearly as much of pro potential as a skill set. You could be a pro-style QB with no chance of ever making the NFL, but that's the style player you are.
There needs to be a way to distinguish between Pat White and Denard Robinson as a recruit and guys like Ryan Mallett and Matt Barkley. Both are talented QBs, no doubt, but all four would be less than ideal fits if put in the opposite offense style.
I understand that, but lots of people don't. Thus, I don't like the term. The term has been co-opted by people that say stupid things like "the spread isn't real football," or "only teams with a fullback are tough."
Honestly, if it weren't for recruiting rankings, would their be any use for the term as it applies to high school quarterbacks? Obviously coaches know the difference between Denard Robinson and Ryan Mallett. They know what skills they want in a quarterback in their system. Even with guys who have a professional skill set, there are subtle differences that might make a guy solid in one system and not what you're looking for in another. For instance, the passing spread systems often value a quicker release over the stronger downfield arm.
So in other words he meant to say "water-buffalo QB"
If Hoke is smart, he would go after a dual-threat QB. This would help persuade Denard and Devin, our only two scholarship QBs, that he is committed to utilizing their skill set.
Since when does a QBs' ability to run qualify him as a poor passer? Denard and Devin will surprise many people, including you, with their passing ability in the following seasons.
Whatever QB we bring in this class will be (hopefully) red-shirted and will be the No. 3 QB in 2012 behind Sr. Denard and RSo.-Devin. It is next year that we'll need to take a 4-star caliber Pro-Qb to start after Devin graduates.
I think QB turned into a must for this class now, no matter what Denard does. Even if Denard stays, we still need that depth especially if Tate is no longer going to be on the team (which is not a sure thing as far as I know).
Hoke's not dumb. He knows that Denard will give him the best shot to win at QB, so he'll tweak his offense to make it work for Denard. I think we have at least an OK shot with Cardale, although I have a funny feeling that he ends up at PSU. Hiring Miles would have helped more in his recruitment, IMO (not that it makes a difference). No matter what, the recruiting board could drastically change over the next week. I wouldn't get down yet
Hard-headed? From his quotes about the spread, very much so.
What is the most likely drop dead date for current players (see Denard) to leave? Do they need permission to leave? I want to know when WE will know who is staying and who is going? Who is stilling committing and who is decomitting?
Everything is just speculation right now but I want to know WHEN!
Coaches have to grant releases, yes.
Players can still leave without a release, they just can't have conversation with the coaching staff at the new school about transfering and can't get an athletic scholarship until they've attended the new school for one year.
40 recruits for this class so the transistion isn't so bad
We would have offered Les the job
It looks like most all of the pro-style QB's are snatched up at this point, with the exception of Cardale or a lowly rated (sleeper?) guy. That said, we need to take someeon.
Also, Chad Jeffries is the guy SDSU has and he's a very good QB. Since we brought SDSU's HC and OC, I think we have as good a shot as anyone, unless the kid is turned off by the distance. I wouldn't be surprised at all though, if a kid previously committed to SDSU who all of a sudden gets a Michigan offer jumps at it, especially considering we know he's already sold on the staff.
Someone on hear said that there is usually an agreement between the former coach and his school that he wont come after recruits that are already committed. I guess we will see what happens.
Yeah, you really can't say that. First, it's up to the kid where he wants to go and who he wants to play for, and secondly, Hoke and Borges have just as much claim on him as SDSU does.
Pulling a kid from LA to SDSU isn't bad, but pulling a kid from LA to Michigan could be harder, depending on his openness to being far from home.
OK, these are the pro-style QBs in the Rivals top-30 who aren't committed: OH QB Cardale Jones, OK QB Archie Bradley (who apparently doesn't have a single offer despite having interest from some solid programs) and CA QB Jerry Neuheisel, who is Rick's son and lists only UCLA (but does not show an offer from them).
We could go after dual threat QBs too, some of them still make good pro-style QBs, but most of them are snatched up as well.
Looks like we might need some snake oil for this one. It's also interesting that there's not hardly a single in-state QB that pops up anywhere.
Jeffries is a high 3* to Rivals (5.7 RR, #10 PQB) with offers from SDSU, Utah, Oregon St, and UTEP. Rivals put out on article on his thoughts regarding the coaching change. Sounds like he'll probably stay with the Aztecs.
Most pertinent quotes are:
"Right now I'm just kind of waiting to see what happens. I want to see what coach is there first before I make any big decisions."
"Right now I'm just kind of waiting to see what happens. I want to see what coach is there first before I make any big decisions."
The article also notes that Jeffries was one of the best QBs at his regional Elite 11 camp and the LA NIKE Camp.
Cardale Jones is the most obvious name. Jones is athletic, but definitely is considered more of a "pro-style" QB than a dual-threat QB (even if he is solid with his feet).
He wants an OSU offer, and it;d be tough to compete if he got one (he's a Glenville kid and teammate OL Aundrey Walker is likely headed there), and he suggested recently he might get one. It was originally thought OSU wouldn't have room to offer him.
Any chance they make a play for him, or has that ship sailed?
If I'm Hoke, I have a video guy put together a highlight package of Michael Vick from this season. As far as I know, the Eagles don't do any read option, utlize a tight end, and are pretty standard "pro-style," yet Vick has had an incredibly successful season. Vick is the potential parallel I would use to try to convince Denard that this could work.
The Eagles actually use the read option quite a bit. It's another example of how spread ideas have spread throughout the NFL.
If I was Denard I would respond with a video of him in the zone read and running for over 1500 and passing over 2000. Then explain to Brady Hoke that 2 spread zone read teams just played in the NC game and that their defenses worked fine. I would then show him a film of Miss St. and their defense destroying Michigan with Zone Read offense on the sidelines. I would follow with an offer of RR's offensive playbook as a peace offering and hope he made the right call as the new coach.
First, can we end the "Denard won't work in a pro-style attack thing"? You can teach a fast kid to stand still, but you can't teach a statue to move fast. He has a big arm and makes good decisions for a true sophomore. He needs work on mechanics, but this is fixable. His only disadvantage is his height and seeing over a pocket, but Troy Smith was about his height and was a very good passer. And he was mobile. He did alright. It may not be the best use of his talents, but if he stays, I'm sure Hoke will find a way to make is mobility dangerous to defenses.
Second, we do need a QB recruit, especially if Tate really is no longer on the team. I prefer ones that can move as opposed to statues.
That's just what I was hoping for next year. To take arguably the nation's fastest and most explosive player at the QB position and teach him to stand still.
Maybe we can teach Mike Martin to stop shedding blockers while we're at it?
Also, maybe we can get David Molk to stop getting low and using leverage when he comes off the ball.
Possibilities are endless. I'm so f$&%*n excited about 2011.
You're right, it's not ideal nor the best use of Denard, but I'd rather have a guy that can take of for 20 yards easily when a play breaks down, than a guy that can just protect the ball and take a sack.
I hope Hoke sees the wisdom of multiple sets, and produces a hybrid style. I see NFL teams gradually warming up to spreading the field out because of NE's success. Hoke's style seems more collegiate, with more play-fakes than I see in the NFL.
I see football evolving to a spread-NFL hybrid approach. There are good points to both, and neither is the be-all and end-all. Even though I prefer the spread for college, I can see that it has its own limitations. The low-scoring NC game is an indication that defenses may be close to "catching up" with the spread. They won't ever neutralize it completely, but they can slow it down some.
If we're lucky, we may get to see Hoke be on the forefront of a hybrid approach. The old saw that "necessity is the mother of invention" still rings true, and it will be neccessary for Hoke to run some spread formations and rollouts if he wants to keep Denard, while staying true to his core beliefs.
As I see it, it doesn't matter which side it is being approached from, as long as it eventually gets to the middle. And the "middle" I see is a multi-set attack with a lot of play-fakes and misdirection, but with also the ability to run that "quick-opener" that LC never seemed to put in his playbook, much to the chronic dismay of many fans.
And I would like to see it happen with Denard for the next two years. Looking at the roster, I would imagine that Hoke knows keeping Denard and utilizing his ability to the fullest are probably the best way to make a positive impact at the University of Michigan. Hoke may not be a spread coach, but I'm pretty sure he would rather have Denard at the top of his depth chart at QB than not. And I'm pretty sure he knows enough not to handcuff the best rusher he has on the team right now.
At least I hope...
This picture makes me smile.
it makes me smile too.
i will say this: i've never seen denard without a smile on his face (unless he's on the field playing).
since they have Braxton (4 star, next coming of TP) coming in.
What about Tanner McEvoy? He was a guy we were looking at for TE and maybe QB, but now that we are looking for a more pro-style QB, we would likely be an even more attractive option for him. He's 6'5" and has us in his top 4 along with Rutgers, USC (NTUSC) and UNC - teams that we should be able to recruit against.
He was part of the group that was supposed to visit last weekend. Hopefully we can get him in soon, introduce him to the new coaches and give him a hard sell on why he needs to be a Wolverine.
I like Tanner McEvoy, but I'd be nervous about him being the only QB in the class, since he's only played QB for a year. Now that Forcier is gone and we don't know about Denard, I would be nervous about the QB position being left to Devin Gardner and a severely inexperienced freshman like McEvoy.
I absolutely agree with that, but the options are thin. DG and McEvoy are a lot better than DG and no one, and about as good as DG and most of the other options left. Chad Jeffries would be great, so would another decommit from a kid who would have loved to play at UM but for the spread offense. There just aren't a lot of midwest QBs this year either.
DB just confirmed Tate is not with the program anymore :(
I still think Hoke will go after dual threat guys, But more of a pro style first, but are also mobile as a secondary attribute. I say this just because of the players we have already and that Hoke will probably ajust this style to suite them a little more.
think SHOELACE will stay.We will have to see about bringing in a QB in this class.