how do they have the scholarships for that?
PSU RB Silas Redd considering transfer to USC
The NCAA is considering waiving the scholorship limit for teams that accept PSU transfers.
H/T Brian's frontpage post.
But then, under every propsal I have seen, they would then forfeit a scholorship the next year. So if they went 1 over their limit this year, they would have to be 1 under their limit next year [even if they just get a senior player who is gone after this year]
Yeah, but it'd be worth it if it secures them the MNC this year. That's a giant recruiting bump to see them out of sanction-town (not that they seem to need it).
But, do they really need another running back? Redd is good and would help their team, but its not like they don't have any running backs. Also, aren't they basically at their 2013 recruiting limit as it is?
In any event, I do agree with you that if he helps lead them to a MNC it would be worth it regardless.
And its not like we, or they, know the exact scholorship rules we are working under. Its an interesting situation.
They do. With a spring injury to a converted linebacker trying his hand at running back, they only had two guys on the depth chart with any game experience and three total for the whole roster.
For everyone whining calling Lane a scum bag, he could be like the multitudes of other coaches who are sending third party runners at these guys offering them under the table. Kiffin was up front and got permission. This is consistent with how he's run things at Heritage Hall. It's all business and button down compliance. If you aren't family good luck getting a pass to practice or to the sidelines for games. The celebrity hollywood presence is gone.
If the Paterno deal taught us any lesson about college football is be very careful about passing judgment based on a guy's public posturing, the way he talks to the media, or the way he looks. Paterno was not only the cheerleader of righeous, he went out of his way to dress the part.
We see how legit that all was.
and Emritt and the Oregon St. Dude just proved it by having Lane Kiffin benefit. That is all.
Would that make it a Redd letter day?
But would you still think that if the player in question that was going to help the new team was transferring to Mich instead of USC?
are waiving the ban on USC, due to PSU.
If Lane Kiffen took some online classes at the Saban/Miles Institute for Creative Roster Management.
At Lane Kiffin University they don't rebuild, they take an entire roster every year, because they lose an entire roster every year. I neither worry over, nor acknowledge Kiffins recruiting prowess. He's likely expecting his yearly average of total attrition (jk, but seriously) so there'll be plenty of room.
They are limited to be at 75 total and 15 per year. For Class of 2012, they technically took under 15 because they backdated. If they have less than 75 scholarship players on the roster, then they have no problem.
Emmert said today there are also exceptions for going over scholarship limits to accomodate PSU transfers, but it had not been decided yet if that applied to schools under NCAA sanctions.
How is it that these guys can just pick up and leave? Do they not have housing leases?
Serious? You think they are staying at PSU because of their house lease?
Uh, yeah. I've got a document that I signed last spring that says I owe upwards of 7,000 by the end of the lease term in total payments. As it turns out, I don't have 14,000 to drop on two housing leases, and I work full time for half of the year. Kids who don't have time to work any meaningful hours certainly don't have the cash to do that. The NCAA does not have the power to dissolve legal contracts, and scholarships don't include housing. Unless these housing stipends are much larger than I've heard of previously, I don't see how it's feasible.
Not to mention moving all of your crap from Penn State to California. That's not cheap either.
I don't know about housing arrangements at other schools, but most of the players stay in a "village" that is seperate from the regular dorms on campus. Graduate students and older students also stay in the same complex. It's right next to the Lasch building where most of the molestation happened.
I lived there during my time and enjoyed wearing my Michigan gear when PSU was ofer vs The Wolverines. I guess they still are ofer now.
So presumably they're not paying anything out of their own pocket for housing.
Not necessarily, they get a monthly stipend which obviously can be used to pay for housing but he would then be faced with paying 2 leases on 1 stipend unless on campus housing is "free"/covered under scholarship and he chose to go that route.
But it's a college town. How hard is it to find someone to take over your lease?
Plus, a lease can be broken if both parties agree, so all that is really needed is a sympathetic landlord.
And it begins.
I up voted your originalness.
$. Original. Nice!!!!
He should transfer to Iowa. He would be the entire depth chart at RB.
would you want to transfer to a school who has a fierce ARBHG to deal with? Clearly Redd values his knee's.
I'd like to formally make a motion to change the name from Angry Iowa Running Back Hating God to Angry Iowa Running Back Attacking God.
In otherwords, the new acronym would be AIRBAG.
Which fits because Iowa running backs need to be walking around with an airbag at all times.
What about HAIRBAG-Hateful Angry Iowa Running Back Attacking God.
If you don't know what a Hairbag is, you can't afford it.
That way any B1G team who has a running back injury can just say 'Effing URBAN!!'
The players did nothing wrong. They should be able to transfer wherever they want. If that happens to be to another school under sanctions, then so be it. It's their choice and they should have that right.
Just like the PSU sanctions have nothing to do with the players. More has to do with the school being punished.
Permitting transfers like this to a team under NCAA sanctions allows USC to avoid the full effects of their own sanctions.
I find it hard to believe that USC is the only possible fit for Silas Redd. Redd is good enough that there will be plenty of schools knocking on his door. The kids who are going to get screwed are the ones who are not good enough to get that kind of attention and are trapped at PSU.
I hear there's a school in Michigan that might be in need of a new starting RB...
Haven't you heard...you too are on probation.
Can't allow Michigan to benefit while being on NCAA probation through Nov 5 2013.
At the end of the day, it's all about what the players feel is in their best interest. Players can currently transfer into USC/Michigan/OSU/UNC and any other school on probation...so why create a special rule forbidding it in this particular situation?
I don't care about him transferring to a team on probation (or to USC, Boise or Ohio if the scholarships are organically available). Allowing USC or another school to get a waiver for their scholarship penalties to punish PSU for their scholarship penalties is pretty stupid, though.
Its strictly a one year waiver, though. The one year waiver does make sense - most 2012 recruiting classes are full. To not have the waiver would mean a team bringing on a PSU player would have to pull a scholarship.
But in order to restore competitive balance that USC unfairly gained during the Bush/Carroll era they were limited in the letters of intent they could sign. Allowing them to skirt that punishment because Penn State also got into trouble makes no sense. Just because Penn State also committed infractions doesn't (or shouldn't) reduce what USC did.
Michigan is not under any type of scholarship restrictions like USC there's a difference. USC is using this as a way to get around those restrictions.
Not that I would want him at UofM, but I was hoping the PSU players would stay with in the conference. I enjoyed watching Silas Redd, better then OHiO I guess.
I would want him at UM. He good
for them to waive penalties at USC to make room for players fleeing the carnage at PSU. What a joke.
You counldn't make this stuff up.
We also don't have much better RB's than PSU did. Redd is solid and could start at M.
What goes around comes around. When SMU got the death penalty in the late '80s, Penn State sent recruiters to scoop up players.
"Among the larger schools that were reportedly represented on campus were Penn State, Arkansas, Texas A&M, Texas, Oklahoma, Houston, U.C.L.A., Arizona, Tulsa, Alabama and Kansas."
All the different places around the country SMU bought kids from, lol.
andre reed was a corner for SMU that played for MSU's 1988 rose bowl team. perles and saban picked the SMU carcass and andre reed was the starting corner opposite harlan barnett on that steriod-ridden mandarich-led team.
Of course he's considering going to usc, every kid in the nation seems to be going to usc. Hell, my three year old son tore off his michigan jersey, slammed it on the floor, and told me he's transferring to usc cuz Lane doesn't make his kids drink milk every day.
All your transfers belong to us.
You misspelled USC.
I wonder if bringing in these kids would present chemistry issues, though. All of the earlier threads drooled over Zettel et. al. and the possibility of bringing in a DT.
What does that say to Will Campbell and Jibreel Black. They've been busting their butts all offseason to prepare for their starting roles and, POOF, you're second string cause we found someone better? If I were BWC, I'd be pretty pissed if I got replaced by an outsider.
Scooping up recruits? That's another thing, entirely.
IIRC, the only thing that BWC busted with his butt this summer was a car hood.
Valid point. Regardless, I think Hoke emphasizes senior leadership and the process of growing through the program to bring on big-name transfers.
If Hoke thinks a player will help M win, I'm all for him coming on board. I don't see it being much different than bringing in a freshman that could beat out Campbell or anyone else. If he can beat Campbell (hell, let's say we find a guy that could beat out Denard or Lewan or Kovacs) he's obviously been working like no other as well.
I'm sure Hoke has it drilled into everyone's head that starting is a privilege of the highest order and that it's something that has to be earned by beating everyone else on the depth chart. I'm assuming he also makes it clear that (football decisions wise) winning > all, and that they do that 115 strong as Team 133.
4 arrests since the end of the season. I have confidence that Hoke will get things under control but these failures so close to summer camp are a big disappointment
I thought Black moved to SDE
From SDE to DT. Roh moved from WDE to SDE. They're both bulking up.
Roh is a Goliath of a man now a days.
Black moved to 3-tech.
but how are your points going backwards?
Edit: Jeez, I didn't realize this thread was four page scrolls long. That was addressed to Phil Brinkman.
If you think Lane Kiffin is the only coach talking to PSU kids then I have some ocean front property in Arizona for you.
This is a scam everyone. Arizone does not border the ocean and he is not a prince and he will not give you a million dollars if you give him a thousand first.
Arizona's not on the water? What the fuck was the Alamo for??
Redd should totally go to USC. PSU has a below average OL this year and no go to receivers so teams will load the box making it very hard and painful on the legs to be an RB. In the Pac12, against those defenses, Redd could tear it up behind a great OL and Woods demanding double coverage on most plays. He's got to think about his NFL stock
The rich get richer. I'm sure that's just what Emmert had in mind when he changed the rules regarding the time frame, standard of proof, and severity of punishment.
I want the OSU and USC cases reopened, and I want the "new" standards of evidence and severity of punishment applied to them.
Whether or not you agree with the punishments handed down today, the NCAA showed what they can do when they strip away all of the bullshit that they have perpetrated upon the public for the last fifty years, make decisions based on evidence that didn't come through testimony before any committee, and decide they don't care who they hurt.
I want those standards applied to Ohio's ten years of cheating.
I would like to see Michigan being held to those same 'new standards' you suggest for USC and OSU. Perhaps your own probation would be extended beyond Nov 5, 2013.
Yes, because illegal benefits should be compared to practicing too much or with too many coaches in attendance. Good point.
Created an account just to post that, eh? So happy to have a Boy Scout join the party! MAJOR VIOLATIONS!!! Hyuk, hyuk, hyuk.
If the USC investigation was reopened, it would in all probability result in far few sanctions fo USC. The LOI Committee was the chaired by the corrupt Miami AD, Paul Dee, while his school was battling with USC for the #1 recruit in the country. They had a ND committee member passing judgement on USC as well. Still the NCAA, after 4 years of investigating could only find one football player who did anything wrong, and he was being paid by a would-be agent to leave USC early.
For this, USC got about half the effective total sanctions that Penn State did...
losing 45 scholarships instead of 60
losing 2 bowl games instead of 4
Having all Junior and seniors being able to transfer with no 1-year wait period.
Did the football staff cover-up anything? There is zero real evidence they did, except for the cell phone record of a dubious 2 minute phone call at 1:30AM after Reggie Bush's last year from campus. There is no doubt Reggie took money, but this happened at his family home over a 100 miles from campus. The person giving the money was not even an agent. He was a family friend bribing Bush and his family so that he would leave the school a year early and allow him to represent him.
The NCAA added a lot of fluff the their report, but none really had substance. They (after USC self-reported it) found that a Slovenian Tennis player was secretly making phone calls home from the USC athletic office, which allowed them to nail the Trojans with Lack of Institutional control, but most of the national media has now decided, that altough they deserved some sanctions for this, the whole investigation was mainly a witch-hunt to knock USC off their pedestal.
Redd would be a transfer like any other transfer, except he would not have to sit out a year. USC already got one transfer this coming year, and the NCAA had no problem with it. They even granted him a hardship waiver allowing him to play immediately. If USC has room for one more transfer (which they do), then they can take him.
....the downside is that he will probably go pro after this year. With so few scholarships (15), it will be difficult to use one on a player who will only stick around for only one year, instead of getting another 5-star caliber recruit that will help the program for the next 4 years.
MSU offered a PSU commit hours after the ruling came out. Shit, a situation like this is the only way Dark Mantonio can get a decent recruit these days.
Nah, it's just b/c they recruit nationally, brah.
I wouldn't be surprised if Hoke doesn't let anybody come. Even if Zettel or Robinson would love to come back to the state of Michigan, don't be be shocked if its not us. Hoke wants Michigan men and he has shown not to take Transfers. Zettel had his chance, I think he would have to really show why he didn't commit last year was because his parents told him to honor his commitment to Penn state.
Speaking of PSU, here's the latest rationalization of the scandal. It seems that our national culture is actually at fault:
My favorite reply:
Our Founding Fathers would have beaten the crap out of Sandusky in 1998. He would have never done it again.
Frankly I'd give a pass to Kiffin on this but then I remember that Ed Orgeron is on his staff. The same guy who started contacting Tulane about players immediately after Hurricane Katrina "just in case" the program was disbanded.
For those who don't follow the dregs of Div 1, we didn't disband and in fact have a nice, fancy on-campus stadium coming in 2014.
How in the hell did Ed Orgeron ever become a division 1 head coach in the first place?
If he ever tried to recruit me I'd just start laughing when he talked.
Kids really responded to Orgeron's intensity and hands-on style as a HC at Ole Miss. Plus he had a fantastic staff: Frank Wilson, Hugh Freeze, and Art Kehoe. Read Bruce Feldman's
"Meat Market" for more info. Basically, he's an aggressive Cajun with a big motor and an even bigger personality and he's all about recruiting and coaching the d-line. Houston Nutt's success at Ole Miss was pretty much based entirely on Orgeron's old recruits and truth be told me almost got Joe McKnight to come to Ole Miss! He almost beat out every big program in the country for him (it ultimately came down to Ole Miss and USC and we know how that went)! Quite an accomplishment if you ask me...
Not sure if I really care where Silas Red transfers so long as it is within NCAA rules. If USC has space under its current scholarship limits, then players should be free to transfer there. No big deal.
Agreed. I think it's just sour grapes for Michigan fans who are sick of watching prized recruits go to USC. If USC is allowed to take new recruits, they should be allowed to take transfers just like the rest of the NCAA.
Magnus, I think you are right re: sour grapes for Michigan fans. USC has has been getting the better of UofM in many recent recruiting battles, and that is frustrating to many posters considering USC is under NCAA sanction. That being said, however, I also think there is a point to be made (which other posters have noted) with respect to a school currently under scholarship reductions being able to take a transfer athlete and have that scholarship NOT count against it's current number. I guess the entire point of this situation is to help the PSU athletes, but it does seem hypocritical for the NCAA to allow another program under sanctions (specifically, scholarship sanctions) to circumvent its own sanction (even though it would be "helping out" a former PSU athlete).
You must be in that tiny group that prefers Dukes over LaRue, hurst over Vanderdoes, smith over Isaac, etc.
Sorry, that comment was intended for the poster below.
Sour grapes? Yeah, it sucks to have the #2 rated class in the nation. We're all jealous!
I was listening to espn radio and they kept raving about not just Silas' skills as a runningback but equally important his
character and integrity. his father was a marine and he's well respected. sounds like a Michigan man even though he won't be coming here.
I think that's an actual good idea, redd is really good, probably as good as Fitz and he doesn't like to drink and drive either!
don't be surprised to see Penn St players lining up at urbans front door either.
Penn State only has a few players who could come and start for a team like OSU right away, and most play positions where the Buckeyes are especially strong. No senior is going to want to transfer from one bowl ban to another anyway.
I would bet most PSU transfers end up in the MAC or Big East.
If Redd does go to USC, it seems that it would be worth a call from the Michigan staff to Ty Isaac to check in.
Reportedly, one of the reasons that Isaac picked USC over Michigan (in what was by all accounts a very close call), was early playing time. Given that Redd has 2 years of eligibility remaining, it seems that Isaac's early playing time just became that much more questionable.
If Silas does end up transferring to USC, could it possibly cause Ty Issac to decommit?
I'm pretty sure issac is aware he will always have competition at USC. If they don't get another Rb this year, they will next year.
Who is Issac?
Obviously with Fitz out for a few games, it would be imperative that we jump on this and at least throw our hat in the ring.
I feel dirty even talking about recruiting any of PSU's players, but if he's gonna go somewhere, it might as well be Michigan.
Redd is from Stamford, CT originally and I follow some of the football writers for the CT Post. Here is one of them tweeted 18 minutes ago:
It makes no sense to me that a team like USC, already serving NCAA sanctions, is allowed to poach the players of another school in the same situation. Apparently, breaking rules is the way to go.
Just got re offered by Michigan today, via his twitter
Visiting ND Thursday. Idk if we'll offer though.
I had a feeling Michigan would pick up his recruitment again... seem to want anouther CB in this class.
Silas would start with them. They have a few good and unproven RBs with DJ Morgan and Curtus McNeal but no one as good as Silas.
Ty Issac doesn't seem dismayed (according to his twitter). He seems to believe Kiffin's Pac12 speech that there is significant need for depth at RB. IMO, Ty Issac should be concerned about playing time with the other highly touted RB's coming in.