When we went back down by 21 and Forcier got us back to 14 and then 7, the crowd noise was impressive. It was a definite upgrade from last week.
Positives from the Game
especially because it looked like a lot of people left early
You said it before I could.
I haven't heard the stadium get that loud since the Wisco game back in 2008 when we came back to win.
...is like dating a 400 lb woman and bragging about the size of her breasts. C'mon, we got killed two weeks in a row by significantly better teams. Don't let the scores or yardage comparisons fool you. The games weren't that close.
We played like crap and we still were within one possession of the #15 team in the 4th quarter. Our offense put up about twice the normal yardage and nearly three times as many points as Iowa usually allows. This was without our starting QB and our most consistent O-lineman for a significant chunk of the game.
We still have a good shot at 8 wins for this season, and we should be pretty dangerous next season. Nobody expected us to contend for the Big Ten this year, even before the injuries started to pile up. The team is making progress. I see that as a positive, even though the losses are painful.
Yeah, but, like, her boobs are really big.
Don't forget about Tom Pomarico. He did an excellent job long-snapping on the extra points.
Our receivers are monsters.
Those three straight completions from Forcier to Stonum for first downs were really impressive. That is the kind of execution that we need to be capable of with regularity.
Our O torched one of the best Ds in the country and has yet to be stopped by anything but its own miscues.
Our D forced 5 punts.
We outgained them by 140 yards.
If we catch one of the Rick Sixes or recover Smith's fumble or if they drop one of our picks, there's a decent chance we win.
We outgained them because they played on a 50 yard field all day and we played on an 80-90 yard field. That's not a big picture positive.
I get that you're in angry torch-and-pitchfork mode, but don't try to turn that into a negative. Iowa came into this game giving up an average of 242 yards and 10 points per game. We more than doubled both of those. That's a good thing.
Who said RichRod couldn't recruit in state? It was great to see him step in and play like a Michigan man today.
Depth, it is building.
When he's on he's on and throws one hell of an accurate ball, but the turnovers are killing.
I'm still glad to see the kid get another chance and play alright. Great leadership on the sidelines pumping the team up. He's growing up, that reflects well on Coach Rod.
Sucked, plain and simple, we had them down 7-0, with more than enough stops on D to warrant a W, and our O callapsed.
Coming into this game, Iowa was giving up 242 yards per game. We had 522.
Coming into this game Iowa was giving up 10.2 points per game. We had 4 turnovers and put up 28 points.
We had 187 yards rushing on 4.5 per carry.
We averaged 7.4 per pass.
those numbers are really nice, don't get me wrong, but don't tell me you weren't looking for sharp objects after watching the offense through 3 quarters like the rest of us
As others have said, the O put up 522 yards. I don't think you can say they suck. You can say that they've sucked at finishing recently (only for the last 2 games though).
Kovacs is becoming someone we can count on to make an open field tackle...for a walk-on sophomore, he's doing the job!
Enough with the walk-on crap already. The kid's earned his free ride, let's please stop harping on the "walk-on" meme already.
He is a great tackler and good near the line of scrimmage. I don't like him in space covering moving objects, but that's just me. Kovacs is the least of our worries on that side of the ball though.
I'm sorry...did he or did he not make the team on a campus tryout? I believe he did, and by calling him a "walk-on sophomore" I'm not criticizing him by any means, I'm actually trying to point out the impressiveness of what he's done on the field. He earned his scholarship by his hard work...
I hate that we have a walk on sophomore as a starter, but if it has to be a walk on, Kovacs has more heart and plays with his head more than a lot of much more experienced players on ANY team.
I'm confident we can beat just about anyone. We lit up THIS defense for over 500 yards. Do it to it.
If we didn't have any turnovers and scored more than our opponents, I'm pretty sure we could beat just about anyone too.
Oh.... I see what you did there
Hagerup had a booming punt in the 1st half
I honestly don't understand what this means. Does it mean we made mistakes? Ok. But Iowa beat us. They were the better team and their discipline was the key to the game.
Don't get me wrong. I'm not a downer on this team. But let's not just chalk this up to "beating ourselves.". We were not the better team. Look at stats all you want. A good team doesn't make these mistakes in the big game.
to beat myself
That people think things like turnovers and facemask penalties are either easily correctable or simply a matter of bad luck, and thus are not an indicator that the team will struggle going forward.
When we had 3 turnovers last week, we decided not to correct it for this week?
Discipline as a football team cannot be fixed by flipping a switch. It's not as simple as just "fixing it."
comment mostly applies to the personal foul penalties.
As for the turnovers, As I've been saying in other threads tonight, I think turnover margin is simply a function of luck and we've been on a 2 game downswing.
So you're saying it's just a coincidence that our turnover margins plummeted when we started playing legit Big 10 defenses.
Good teams force/create turnovers or play a physical style that makes them more likely. Chalking this up to bad luck seems incorrect.
is a skill. I think it's like "clutch hitting" in baseball. The natural human desire to attribute ability to a helmet that happens to land on a football in a running back's arm because the idea that much of what goes on is just luck and randomness scares the crap out of us.
We could have committed 4 turnovers against Bowling Green but we had good luck that week. Whereas this week, we just had back luck against a top Iowa defense. This makes little sense.
for dramatic effect. But yes, my view is that that is far more the case than anyone wants to admit.
Today is a perfect example actually. Our QBs made about 4 ill advised throws. Three of them were picked off. And we had a RB cough up a ball on a play where the defender wasn't even going for a strip. It's not crazy to think that on average at least one more of those ill advised throws won't end up in the arms of an Iowa defender. It's also not crazy to think that Vincent Smith usually doesn't fumble in that spot.
By contrast, Stanzi threw a clear pick 6 in the first quarter that was dropped. And his 3rd down throw on the last drive was a pass that he was incredibly lucky not to have picked off.
On average, I think we come out of that game with a turnover margin of -1 or -2 rather than -4. That we didn't is bad luck, and it may have been the difference in the game.
I say you make your own luck. Sorry to jump into your conversation with Dreisbach, but I can't sit back and just say, "Oh well, just bad luck I guess". Sometimes you make your own luck. Iowa did, we didn't. That's about all you can say. Hopefully we make more plays on defense and value the football on offense moving forward.
Or you can just keep hoping we get better luck...
Like it's fate that causes one to throw into coverage, or you can't learn to protect the football and tuck it away.
But this is supposed to be a positive thread, so I don't want to rag on it here. But I think this place has perpetuated this a lot.
Denard could have checked down his throw on the first pick. I'm not sure if that would have resulted in a first down, but the turnover would have been avoided. Young kids learn from these mistakes eventually.
So can you stop starting every comment with so? It's so annoying. So.
Turnovers also share variance with youth, which we're chock full o'.
Turnover margin will regress to the mean somewhat, but I'm afraid we'll be above average in turnovers/penalties so long as our team is mostly frosh/sophs.
Iowa was a good team, but their defense wasn't as good as people made it out to be. Like the the previews said, if we played perfect we could win it - we didn't and we lost.
There were plenty of Michigan penalties, and turnovers. Examples: Taylor Lewan got a 15 yard penalty when we were driving. Tate's first interception should have been a pass thrown out of bounds for example. That was not skill on Iowa's part, that was Tate trying to force soemthing when he shouldn't have been.
I thought our defense actually played better than I expected.
We beat ourselves.
Having Demens means that we at least have a functional MLB who hopefully improves with experience.
If we protect the ball, we win this one.
We're kidding you.
Ignore all posts for the next 6 months, then come back. Maybe people will be serious at that point.
How were we awful today? Our offense played okay versus a pretty damn good defense and we lost because of some miscues versus a good Iowa team. I don't feel so bad. I've read some of your past posts, so I won't be too much of a dick, but still, I don't feel too bad. i know that others have given me heck for that, but I feel good. 5-2, with our 2 losses being to top 15 teams.
I feel okay.
I'm legitimately happy with today's game and contentedly drinking a glass of scotch.
There were plenty of positives. This isn't 2008.
As long as Rich doesn't slap himself at a press conference I think he'll go on to future seasons with better results.
For a team with a lot of sophomores and freshmen at key positions, our team is really going to be good in a year or two. We are just a few plays a game away from being a legit top 10 team (force turnovers, commit fewer mistakes, etc.).
You can probably say that about 40 other teams. Thats what seperates the winners from the losers. We've said the same things about the lions the last 10 years.
when do we stop saying just wait until next year or two years from now? I am not a RR hater. In fact, I really want him to succeed. I am getting tired of towing the line with "wait until 20XX". I see the progress on offense. I do not see where the defense is going to make a huge leap to next year, but I could be wrong. I did see some some positives today but positives alone do not put a W in the Win column.
Wait did you steal a handle from the movie Hackers? Good God man. I mean Angelina Jolie was hot in that movie and all but have some self respect. I mean a skateboarding villian and all that trying to visualize electronic transmissions with cheesy CGI...
Movie still amuses me so +1
I think people need to give Iowa credit for making UM "beat itself." Iowa's line forced Tate and Denard to throw some bad picks, their LBs made Smith cough up the ball, and their offense was able to capitalize. Sometimes, when a team has 3 TOs and struggles to score, it is because of bad luck and some bad plays, but it is also likely because the other team played well and capitalized in those mistakes.
Exactly. The announcers kept describing Iowa as an opportunistic team, one that takes whatever they get and makes the most of it.
It's something Michigan can aspire to do. We need to capitalize off of other teams' mistakes, and I think that comes with experience.
We only let up 383 yards to a decent offense. Imagine what we'll do against PSU. (I'm hoping this isn't just an aberation and will qualify looking at one game because 1.) that's what this thread is about and 2.) DEMENS!)
We scored...wait, we gained 522 yards against a top 5 D. Imagine what we'll do to PPSU. (start the immature laughing in 3...2...1...)
If we're all guessing on a 7-5/8-4 season then PSU is the difference maker. After this game it looks like we should be able to beat them. This is good. A win @PSU means we most likely go 8-4, which is a game ahead of most preseason expectations.
A 8-4 finish sets us up for a NC run the following year, where we have a better passing Denard, Dee, and a more experienced D. This, again, is good.
If the 8-4/7-5 hinges on PSU then we're in a good place because it seems like right now we're better than PSU. Yes. Win. Touchdown. Good.
There isn't a game left on our schedule, save OSU (probably), that we can't win if we just stop killing ourselves with stupid friggin' penalties and turnovers. We fell behind against Iowa mostly because of what we did to ourselves. And once we fall behind by 14 points against a good defense, we're pretty much cooked because we can't rely on our D to make stops.
By the way, I don't want to see us kick another FG the rest of the season, unless it's from the 5 yard line or closer. Two kickoffs out of bounds? Two?! Special teams is in dire need of an extreme makeover.
Are you high? This team isn't close to a NC run any time soon. It's one thing to be fan...it's another thing to be delusional.
Not good overall. In fact, we look quite...
How many MAC teams put up 522 yards against a top 10 D?
Is Iowa really a top 10 D? Or did they feast on extremely weak offenses to run up their stats? They have a good defensive line and decent linebackers and safeties. Their cornerbacks were weak and gave up big passes against all competition with a pulse: Arizona on the road and Tate today.
Dude, you're an ass. Why don't you go root for the buckeyes. We don't need fans like you. Please go away.
Or maybe do it two or three times, that might get the job done.
There is a place where I can come and discuss football with people who understand the program. I just read two Facebook status updates cutting down Denard and Rich Rod.
Some dumb girl on my feed was lobbying for Gardner because he has "potential."
Man, he could in fact be the next Vince Young, but as long as Denard is in maize and blue, I'd take my chances. I'd bet dollars to donuts in 10 years they will be comparing some great young stud to the next Denard Robinson.
God, people are so fucking stupid.
Denard, Molk, Martin were out for significant stretches due to injury.
Demens showed nicely today
I was concerned that we were so thin that any injury would weaken us severely. Thrilled to see how the team maintained.
The crowd in the fourth.*.
*Although earlier in the third there were four idiots behind me screaming 'We want Harbaugh" The other three cheered for the team in the fourth while their friend was getting medical attention for his bloody nose.
We have a punter.
Gallon doesn't make me as nervous anymore in the return game, and he looks like he will be a nice WR down the road as well.
We put up plenty of yardage on MSU and Iowa. Two solid Big 10 defenses. Once we mature and quit shooting ourselves in the foot, look out!
Give Hopkins the damn ball. Dude is a stud.
on that list as a positive. His personal foul killed a drive and changed the entire complexion of the game. We were marching, up 7-0, and that happened. Hogwash.
So his first quarter penalty was more important than the Smith fumble? Shows what I know, I thought that fumble was the real turning point.
and needs a lot more carries. Vincent Smith should only carry the ball 4 or 5 times per game, maximum. The rest of his touches need to be catches out of the backfield. How many times did Smith get stuffed on first down up the middle? The fumble was irritating. Hopkins or Shaw (if healthy) need a lot more touches.
Was way above average today. He is turning in to a good CB, and he will only get better.
As for the freshman DB's Talbott had his best game and I think Cam Gordon wasn't too bad today either.
This team is getting better, they have just run into two really good teams.
what was with that broadcasting team? Old guy and dumb guy. Pam Ward must of had the shits today and couldn't make it...
Far from perfect but I enjoyed myself as much as you can from a loss. The game was semi on the line in the 4th quarter against a good team when we were making mistakes. Just did not make enough plays but I loved the fact that the on the sidelines the players were going crazy. I thought the team as a whole showed some fight today. I was more encouraged than discouraged by this game.
Rodriguez will be probably be gone before too long, and our long collective nightmare will be over.
Positives: Michigan is horrible at defense and special teams yet still had a chance in the 4th.
Negatives: In a day where the defense played somewhat OK, special teams and turnovers doom the day. Blah.
A tired bright spot next week, I'll wager, but wow. He is a RS Freshman. The donkey he rode today will be playing on Sunday. TL wore him out to the point where he had to take a breather. Giving the coaches two weeks to beat him might not have been his brightest move, but these things happen. He can't even call home and find sympathy.
Someone that Lewan should watch film of Long. It almost sounded like a comparison. Of a RS freshman and the first pick in the draft. Really? Life is good!
At the beginning of the season we were predicted to win 7 or 8. We have a bye week so that hopefully the bumps and bruises can have a chance to heal. On the 30th we play a struggling PSU which should be a win. Then we play ILL and PUR, which should both be wins. Going into the last 2 games am not sure that I will count those as wins just yet (as I write this I am watching them play and both of those teams look pretty good). Not saying we can't win them but they could both give us troubles. The positives that I am taking away from this game are that we have the opportunity to win a few more and possibly play in a january bowl. Next year with a more experienced D and Woolfolk coming back for one more year I think we have a pretty bright future.
- Stephen Hopkins: Totally awesome. Much faster than advertised.
- Rocko Khoury. Totally agree, encouraging to see depth building.
- Demens. I'll wait for the UFR.
- Stonum. Agreed, looked good along with Hemmingway.
- Forcier. Mix of great and facepalm.
- Lewan. Extremely encouraging day, stock is sky high.
I've got a new view.
Whatever it takes to get through the night...and the next couple of weeks...
Why does everybody insist on being so negative? For God's sake, you guys are looking fir things to get upset about. I thought the team would pack it in (twice) after being down 21 points. They didn't. Tate made some awesome throws. Stonum reqched his zenith and Roundtree looked great. Demens played well. Kovacs made plays. The team downed a punt inside the one yard one. Hagerup looked fine
Jesus, there is so much to be excited about but you guys just HAVE to cry over something.
That's the only way to describe this team. They roll up a zillion (give or take) yards on one of the B10's best defenses, but keep wandering into some tear in the space-time continuum, and turn the ball over, or otherwise penalize our way out of a scoring drive.
I was at the game today (up in a suite) and the offensive issues were even more maddening than they would have been on TV. I could see the whole field, so it was obvious when both of our QBs were not seeing the wide-open receivers. It was enough to drive me insane.
At least I got to meet Brock Mealer, though. That was great. Very humble, and a genuine hero.
Good to see the team keep fighting despite being down 21 and losing Denard to an injury. This was a very different feeling after a critical mistake (Smith's fumble) than the Illinois goal line stand last year.
Defense seems to be improving (having the enigmatic one at MLB instead of a nice but indecisive statue is probably a part of why). If nothing else, the defense overall looked better than OSU did today, which isn't something I thought I could say honestly this year.
Punt teams look much better. Hagerup could be past his jitters, and the punt return team never gave me a heart attack.
Hopkins looked pretty damn good. I wouldn't mind seeing him alongside Shaw or Toussaint in two-back sets instead of Smith. Maybe even in more single-back sets, though I didn't pay attention to how Hopkins did on passing plays. Nothing against Smith, but Hopkins's size gives an added dimension to the offense, and Shaw and Toussaint (if he can ever get healthy) both have more speed.
As much as the loss sucks, Michigan did look to be pretty clearly the fourth or fifth best team in the Big 10 (depending on whether Wisconson continues to look like they did against Sparty or against OSU). Pending any major surprises, 8-4 is a very realistic record. That's +3 wins compared to last year, which is a big improvement. I know that 8 wins is a bit disappointing for most Michigan teams, but considering the situation that the team was in just two years ago, that's a pretty solid improvement. I had been saying since January 2008 that it would take Rich Rod a few years to really get things put together on both sides of the ball because of all the talent leaving in addition to the total system overhaul, with either 2010 or 2011 being when he can really start to challenge for conference titles. Things look to be right about on schedule.