Other Big Ten teams:
Ohio AP #4 Coaches #3
NW AP #18 Coaches #16
Wisconsin AP #24 Coaches NR (#27)
Michigan State AP NR Coaches #24
Glad to see Wisconsin not being penalized too much after that BS loss.
Other Big Ten teams:
Ohio AP #4 Coaches #3
NW AP #18 Coaches #16
Wisconsin AP #24 Coaches NR (#27)
Michigan State AP NR Coaches #24
Glad to see Wisconsin not being penalized too much after that BS loss.
That is the risk you take when you try to center the ball. They should have just kicked the field goal rather than trying to center the ball. I agree that the refs should have spotted the ball faster (don't see anything wrong with what the ASU player did - that is the correct thing to do at that point) - Wisconsin should not have taken that risk
It was never clear that the WI QB actually took a knee. I sure as heck didn't see it. It looked like he missed the ground and the. just placed the ball on the ground. This is like the same as the phantom double play. Usually the SS or 2nd basemen gets away with it and sometimes it bites them. This time it not Wisky
Then you didn't see the replay shot from behind the QB - it wa very clear. Wisky really got screwed.
Ahh yes all defensive players should watch all replays before jumping on a believed to be fumbled ball.
The whistle was loud and clear...and he sat on the ball...It clearly should have been a delay of game penalty.
It's clear only if you see that photo. But it's hard to see in real time that Stave's knee actually touches since the LG backs into him the split second this happens. Even the announcers missed that he had taken a knee.
His knee doesn't actually have to touch the ground. He was giving himself up. When a ball carrier simulates putting his knee down, the ball is dead.
whistles blew pretty much immediately, indicating that at least one official saw him take the knee. Stave's only mistake was not handing the ball directly to the official. Everything else was on the officials failing to control the situation.
Stave shouldn't hand the ball to the ref, and wait for him to spot it. The clock is still running. He should have left it exactly where it was, so that his team could lineup immediately so they could stop the clock.
But it's the refs' job to spot the ball. They hate it when players try to spot it, and will always move it a little when that happens, just because. The other thing is that when you hand the ref the ball, you avoid any shenanigans by defensive players (as the ASU DT successfully pulled off).
That's the risk you take when you run a play inbounds. Actually, only around 10-12 seconds went off in between the time when that play ended and when the final snap started, which isn't much at all for a play that doesn't stop the clock. If you're going to run a play inbounds with 18 seconds, there is a real chance that it will end the game.
The play was whistled dead with 15 seconds left. The ref was still standing over the ball with his arm extended as the playclock hit zero.
There was unnecessary confusion due to how Stave kneeled the ball down. He tried to spot the ball himself instead of flipping it to the ref. It looked like a fumble to the opposing players which is why they jumped on it.
It is the correct play for the ASU player.
Here are the three options:
1. You get up, Wisconsin clocks the ball. Kicks easy field goal, you lose.
2. You sit in the ball, refs call you on it. 5 yard penalty. Wisconsin kicks easy field goal and you lose.
3. You sit on the ball until the ref finally makes you get up, confusion everywhere, time runs out and you win.
That's exactly what happens whenever a DB grabs a WR's jersey when he gets beat off the line or a lineman grabs his guy from behind when his block gets avoided. Yes, it's the correct play.
They got screwed. The refs took 17 seconds to reset the ball. Part of the reason that it took 17 seconds was because ASU jumped on the ball after the whistle for some reason. That should have been delay of game on the defense, which would have meant that Wisconsin could have just taken their 5 yards and trotted the field goal unit onto the field for a chip shot to win the game. Wisconsin fans should be furious.
It didn't take them that long. The play started with 18 seconds. By the time Stave had run over to the center of the field, taken a knee, and the officials had blown the play dead, a few seconds had elapsed. The officials got everything lined up with 2 seconds left. So it actually took them about 10-12 seconds, which is a pretty normal timelapse for getting everything set up after a play in bounds. It could have been quicker still if Stave had just handed them the ball instead of trying to spot it himself. But Wisconsin just shouldn't have called for a knee there. That was a completely unnecessary risk.
Seems fair considering Akron did this to us on Saturday...
We did it to ourselves..
But I thought Akron played a really good game and made big plays all game. To say that we just did it to ourselves is not accurate.
No, M did it to themselves. You heard the coaches and players. They clearly overlooked Akron and did not take them seriously. Have M and Akron play again or even a few more times and M dominates them each game.
On field performance really did not indicate that. Akron marched down the field the whole fourth quarter.
Nice analogy. I've got a pug he fucked over the big dog while the big dog wasn't expecting it.
Is that game film?
It's the end of the third quarter
Of all the things that happened in that game yesterday......this is the one thing that has made me laugh.
Surprised we didn't drop further. But will definitely take the W.
Classic pessimistic Michigan fan response. Team looked like dogshit but still won, dropped 4 spots in the polls. SHOULDN'T BE RANKED.
You should change it. We didn't dominate shit yesterday.
That win clearly augered a drop; expect voters will look carefully the next couple of weeks to see whether we are more like the team that beat ND team or the team that scraped by Akron.
Voters are very short sighted. Ugly wins are all but forgotten after one week.
The real question is why did our offensive line across the board get dominated by Akron??? Fifteen is too high considering the issues that were exposed yesterday. And the fact that the ND win is looking a bit shallow now.
Because it's one game and the guys felt they could just walk out there and handle akron. Sports are way more mental than physical. This wasnt a physical problem it was mental....
This guy gets it. There's a little rumor going around campus that Thomas Gordon said the team wasn't as pumped as they should have been when they saw the student section half full entering the game
general admission rabble donut game rabble rabble ND hangover rabble overrated rabble rabble ND sucks rabble we're gonna lose all our remaining games rabble rabble rabble
If it takes fans to pump you up to play a football game...then team 134 has deeper problems.
It's true. The deeper problem is that they are human and are living with human brains and emotions. WHY HASN'T HOKE INSTALLED THE ROBOT TEAM WITH INTENSITY SWITCH YET?
Hardly. I'm pretty sure every team in any sport ever will tell you the crowd gets them more pumped up. Shouldn't be to the degree that you almost lose to Akron, but come on.
Yes because playing at home has never been an advantage.
If this is why they came out sluggish then their attitudes need to change. This type of attitude explains why we aren't a very good road team. They should realize that the stadium still had 107,000 crazy fans that were cheering their asses off on those 3rd downs in that final drive. Devin Gardner needs to be smarter, O-Line needs to play smarter, D-Line needs to start wrecking havoc. We get one game to see if we can find out spark, then a necessary bye week before Big Ten play. I think we will see whether or not his coaching staff is good or not. Let's be honest, our O-line and D-line have regressed each year since 2011, it's still early for 2013, but through 3 games we have a lot of work to do to get to what type of team we can and should be.
That's the thing though...there weren't 107,000 crazy fans when they walked out at first. Might have been there by the end of the game, but frankly the rest of the student section needs to show up. That was hands down the worst showing I've ever seen at the student section. I understand it was magnified because of the new seating policy, but students need to be there on time. That was just embarrasing on AND off the field, and students should be ashamed of putting up such a lousy showing for kickoff.
doublepost...instead, here's a penguin gif!
I agree with your overall point. However, just being loud on those 3rd downs late in the game is not enough. The last drive or two it should have been every play considering one play could have handed us a loss.
The unique thing about college sports is the interaction between the athletes and the people who support them, primarily their fellow students. If the students don't show up, it looks to the players like they're not being supported unless it's a huge game. Which, especially with young kids, could probably affect play, yeah.
We have to keep remembering we basically don't have fourth year players. Some fifth years, but the class of 2010 is largely gone. Cripples leadership on an already young team.
So not true lol i've seen most of our current players high school high light tapes and most of them the stand are empty. The lines need to play angry and confident
You think it isn't true that players can get more fired up when the stands are full? Have you played sports?
The lines regressed between 2011 and 2012. There's no evidence that they've regressed between 2012 an 2013. To this point I'd say they've stayed the same at the worst, but I also doubt last year's Oline would have stood up to ND's Dline as well as what we saw.
Totally coincidentally, center has been the weakest position on both lines.
Left guard has been our worst spot this year, probably the weakest position on our team. He has been dreadful in pass protection, much worse than Miller.
And right guard hasn't been appreciably better than center either.
No rumor he eluded to it in his post game interview.
Exactly! The sky isn't falling and this season isn't over! It was one terrible performance. They'll recover and be just fine!
ND won against a Purdue team that always plays them tough, similar like MSU. There's nothing shallow about a win over ND. They have some high end NFL talent on their team.
I think ND-Purdue is a bigger rivalry than people realize. Especially for Purdue. Little brother syndrome...
I think this is fair placement and accurately reflects two thing that have received very little attention here: (1) that Akron coaching staff did and OUTSTANDING job of preparing their team and game planning for Michigan (which should surprise no one when they have two fairly high profile FBS coaches as coordinators and Tressel, who always game planned exceptionally well for Michigan, as a consultant) and (2) that game was an aberration for Michigan with respect to the turnovers and poor execution. It's embarrassing, but at some point we need to recognize that Akron's coaching staff called a very good game.
I also thought the quarterback played very well - dude was accurate on almost all his passes. Give them some credit.
First, thank you to the OP for posting this--I'm sure I'm not the only one on this board who follows the polls, and analyzing movement can be fun.
That said, and having nothing to do with the OP...
In my opinion, there is nothing more irrelevant for Michigan until November 3rd (day after MSU game) than the polls. All that matters are Ws. Based on following polls for a while (abliet in a decidedly non-scientific way), voters in AP and Coach's polls at the end of the year tend to forget about "bad wins" if there are good wins. At the end of the day, if Michigan is fighting for a BCS bowl--either as an at large bid or for a better bowl as a conference champion*--the close win over a bad team should not overcome the actual win over ND and (at this point) hopeful wins over MSU, Ohio x2, or Nebraska.
* Yes, I know it is hard to imagine being in contention for a BCS bowl after almost losing to Akron....color me an optimist; my glass is 1/10th full.
Don't write off Penn State and Northwestern yet as potential quality opponents.
BCS Bowl at large teams have had shaky games before... The VaTech team we played only beat a 5-7 ECU team 17-10, and the game was tied in the 4th with ECU holding the ball. They also beat a 3-9 Duke team 14-10 and Duke had the ball in the red zone twice in the 4th quarter for a chance at a go ahead TD and walked away with 0 points.
I'll take it. We won't be ranked in the Top 10 going into Big Ten play, and I'm fine with that.
We need to play soundly against UConn, no relying on big plays... Just control the lines, move the ball, and take the game one snap at a time. 10-yards at a time.
Seems about right. I know people want to worry, but it was still one lousy win after two pretty impressive ones. I still think UM is a top-15 team and, if the lines can improve somehow, a top-10 outfit.
Also, ND fell from 21 to 22.
Seems about right. I did think it would be between 13 and 15, warranted given our putrid play. The AP voters, IMO, are quite short sighted.
after the game feel like it was more of a loss than a win? I had that feeling for a while, then I woke up feeling better today. I hope that this week against an 0-2 UConn team and a week off is used effectively.
A million times NO. If you really feel like we lost, you need to reevaluate. We are still undefeated and have all our goals in front of us.
Even if we don't win the B1G, we could still make a BCS bowl because of that win yesterday. Lose to Akron and its Rose bowl or bust. That's a huge difference IMO.
Um, no. A loss feels like a loss. A crappy win feels like a crappy win, but it is 1000X better than a loss.
It is literally unbelievable that #26 in that poll is Michigan State. Proof positive that the ugliness of wins is irrelevant if you just win.
Or, they could have a phenomenal defense, paired with their first good offensive outing. #26 sounds right for them to me.
They could, but we don't really know that yet based upon who they've played. Their FBS opponents are a combined 0-6, so four other teams have also shut down those same offenses.
their defense is amazingly good? They can keep them in the game as long as they can.
I did, but I also stopped to think (since I've seen all three of their games) that they have played no one with any semblance of an offense, so we have no idea if their defense is actually good. We will know a lot more about their defense after next Saturday.
big question what did Drew Sharp vote?
Have Michigan in the top 25.
He pushed a child off his bike this morning. The boy had a Michigan jersey on.
What the fuck is his problem?
He's Drew Sharp.
I'm a little surprised the drop isn't further, because we'd certainly deserve it. But hopefully yesterday's game teaches this team a valuable lesson and serves as a wake-up call. Beating Notre Dame is great but it doesn't make you invincible, and you can't just walk into the Big House and expect to steamroll over anyone, whether they're a scrub MAC team or not. If there's any kind of silver lining, maybe this team will look at yesterday like how the basketball team responded after losing to Wisconsin in the tournament for the second time.
I really hope to see a focus come over this team next week against UConn. A focus akin to playing like a berth in the national championship game is on the line.
I'm going to assume Drew Sharp moved us to unranked and put ND 15?
More like the AP Pohl is out. Too soon?
I seen what you did there.
haha good one
Don't like how much stock is being put into Ole Miss beating Texas. Texas are awful. Just terrible. Beating them shouldn't move them up 4 spots, regard of who lost in front of them.
Also don't like how few votes TCU have. I know Pachall's out but look at their loses. To #6 on a neutral field and #25 away with some terrible calls thrown in to help TTU's cause. Regardless of record, they'd be one of my top vote getters outside of the Top 25.
I live about 20 minutes from DKR so I went down to check out the tire fire that the Texas football program is quickly becoming - the alums are at their wits' end. That team plays with zero intensity and the fans know it. Not a good situation.
Here's the breakdown by voting rank per Pollspeak:
9th - 2 votes
10th - 2 votes
11th - 4 votes
12th - 7 votes
13th - 6 votes
14th - 9 votes
15th - 7 votes
16th - 7 votes
17th - 5 votes
18th - 2 votes
19th - 6 votes
20th - 2 votes
Unranked - Drew Sharp
So, this was an intriguing spread, to say the least. The average rank was 14.61 and the median was 14, so we fell almost three spots from the average voting position after ND.
Yep. Makes sense.
After i watched Hoke's locker room talk after the game as well as Lewan and Gardner presser, I am slowly moving away from the edge. I don't believe we will see another game like this one. When the coaches say it is their fault the team wasn't prepared, that is code for "you are going to have a hellish week of practice". I am also relatively sure that Lewan and Gardner were not among those running over to celebrate with the student section. They both appear to be take the win pretty hard, and I for one would not want to have Lewan pissed at me.
Devin was with the crowd to "celebrate" and sing the fight song. He was right in front of me. But he definitely was pissed and didn't want to be there
Michigan is #14 in the Coaches poll.
Drew Sharp do us all a favor and retire or move!!!!!
Drew Sharps articles should be in the funny pages.
Seems about right for M. I'm still surprised Florida isn't lower and ranked below Ole Miss. TAMU should have dropped more than 4 spots.
"TAMU should have dropped more than 4 spots."
They wouldn't do that to Alabama's strength of schedule...
A&M almost came back and won the game against everyone's #1 team. How far should they drop, how many teams can beat #1 two years in a row?
I figured we be no higher than 17 or 18.
One positive from the game is that it ought to be a strong antidote to all the smoke that was blown up the players' asses by friends, media, family, fellow students, and random internet/twitterers after the ND game. 18-22 year olds are prone to smelling themselves a little too much after a big win.
Stupid! We won, why the hell should we drop?
Did you watch the game?
I am going to have Quaker Oatmeal in the morning just because you made me laugh.
Well, first and foremost, the AP voters are not pandering to our fanbase specifically, so that's an incorrect assumption. Second, there has never - as far as I can recall - been an instance where a 4-point win of an ugly nature has taken a team from #11 in the AP to unranked, so precedent (and likely rational appraisal) would tend to disagree with you. Third, the requirements for being Top 25 are perhaps fortunately not reliant on your apparently stratospheric standards.
Relax man. Good teams play poorly sometimes. It's one game.
Top 25 if we are playing against top 25. Looks like they took their eyes off the ball, didn't take Akron seriously. We have no reason not to believe Coach, and Lewan when they say this will not happen again.
Yeah, LSU totally shouldn't have been ranked last year becuase they barely beat Towson....
Here is some perspective, if you like.
Last year, Ohio State went 12-0. En route to that perfect record, they beat UAB by 11 (favored by 36), Cal by 7 (favored by 17), Indiana by 3 (favored by 19), and Purdue by 7 in overtime (favored by 17).
Sometimes good teams play poorly against inferior opponents.
If you want, you can continue this exercise:
I could continue on, but the point remains the same.
Exactly what I expected. Dropped 4 spots because of the ugly win. 3 weeks from now once the madness of college football knocks a few teams off with upsets this game will be forgotten. As long as we keep our record #-0 we will be in great shape.
As I said in another post, the only way this really hurts us is if we are somehow one of 3 undefeateds we might not get the bid for the championship. There is plenty to worry abut between now and then, hopefully the team realized they have to be on point every week. It was a inexpensive lesson to learn as it didn't cost a W.
Seems about right.
I have a feeling the players will be focused and angry this week. At least I hope so. While every part of the team played horrible yesterday, the play of the defense scared me the most. I never expected Akron to have all the time in the world to throw the ball AND complete some long bombs so effortlessly.
This why I hate ranking on principal. the goal is.to win and it shouldnt matter how u win. style points should not be apart of how u are ranked.
So Bama beating TAMU is the same as us beating Akron? Cuz a win is a win? I cannot go along with that.
and this is the problem with this and the big ten fan base as a whole.
Where you would rank Michigan. Especially after 3 games, all of which were wins.
I really don't think you understand college football. You're basically saying that the ND game and CMU game didn't count. Also, how about when USC would go 11-1 and have terrible loss? Clearly not a good team are they? Florida struggling vs. Bowling Green last year. It's a good think Florida gave up on the season after that because they clearly had no shot at a BCS bowl.
No, you are allowed you express your opinion and others are equally allowed to point out how asinine it may be.
There are examples on examples of good teams barely winning games against people they should've blown out. A close win over Akron doesn't negate two good outings against CMU and Notre Dame. There are aberrations, this may be one of them.
That said, if we struggle putting away a bad UConn team, then obviously our concerns would be elevated.
Is that you?
Your grouchiness and pessimism brings a smile to my heart.
I did not say that but the rankings are bias in nature anyway. The SEC is seen as the best so lets say 21 ranked Ole Miss struggles with a Akron type but wins the game do they drop 25 in the polls or do they stay pat? I would much rather have ranking start latter in the season for this purpose. BAMA is not in my opinion better than Oregon. As long as your have unbalanced schedules you the ranking system is going to be flawed in CFB. You don't see this happen as much in the bball season.
I present the 2012 preseason and postseason polls for reflection on how meaningless polls are during this part of the season.
|2012 Preseason||Final||2012 Final||Pre|
|18||Ohio State||3||Boise State||24|
|21||Stanford||7||San Jose State||NR|
|22||Kansas State||12||Northern Illinois||NR|
Serious question. Are you a high school student?
That seemed abundantly clear.
No you didn't.
Diabeetus has stepped away so..
Oh crap did those first two games not count?!?!! Boy college football should advertise the preseason more clearly.
Michigan losing a few games in the future will not retroactively make you not an idiot now.
To "lost" 4-5 games I think he's safe.
Purdue ALWAYS plays ND tough. Most here won't like to admit it but that is a rivalry game and when Purdue is at home they keep the game close.
Point is, you get in trouble when you define a team or season by one game.
You just don't know when to shut up, do you? Go back to secretly dreaming you were a OSU fan.
With this post and the next there's no way you graduated from Michigan. Because last I checked English was a requirement to do that. Even in 2011.
They've lost 37 games this year?!?! Holy shit.
I was posting this to all the negative nancies last night... I think I need to restart
You've made it abundantly clear where you stand, but now it is bordering on overabundant trolling and there are consequences for such things, of course. That being said, it also seems clear that you haven't read a single evaluation of the performance yesterday posted on this board, so before you chime in with the rudeness, do take time to read some of the other opinions on the board so that you can make an informed assessment of how the board feels.
I'd suggest that you find whoever has been pissing in your Wheaties and tell them to cut it out.
While Akron has certainly been awful the last few years, this year's team is probably quite a bit better, because Terry Bowden has brought in a ton of transfers (something like 22) from other programs who are now eligible. They now have some guys who were recruited by FSU, Pittsburgh, and the school in Columbus. Many of them were in their starting lineup against us.
None of this excuses our performance, but it's likely that we weren't facing another 1-11-bound Akron team.
I would say the coaches and AP have an unbiased outlook, my biased ranking would have us still at around 12. Whereas Drew Sharps biased outlook has us as unranked. So 14-15 ranking seems about right.
That Michigan still has a top-25 victory on its resume, and a 50-point blowout. That alone, combined with current undefeated record, constitutes a top 25 ranking. Not everyone has played someone of ND's caliber yet.
But please, keep focusing on Akron, because obviously that's the only game that matters this year.
is hilarious. WE DON'T DESERVE TO BE RANKED!!!! CANCEL THE SEASON!!! AKKKKKKKKRONNNNNNN!!!!!!!!
Calm down, dude. Michigan is 3-0. We almost lost to a not-so-good Ball State team late in our 2006 season. Shit happens.
Newest troll. Welcome.
To be completely honest, you're mistaken.
To suggest that a college football team should drop form 11 to sub-25 for winning a game, no matter how ugly that win might have been, is asinine and smacks of trollism. No rational fan would agree with your position regardless of the team in question. No credible journalist would agree with your position either, which is why Michigan is still ranked in the mid-teens and Drew Sharpe probably has us ranked 40th.
Journalists and coaches are a lot less apoplectic than college football fans. Obvious trap game was obvious, we fairly handily beat a (perennially overrated) Notre Dame team, and smashed the requisite MACrifice. Definitely not top ten but fifteenish sounds about right.
how are we still ranked higher than Northwestern?
Northwestern ain't got deez nuts.
as it looked yesterday, we aint got any nutz. let alone "deez"
We're both 3-0, but we're still the only Big Ten team to beat a ranked opponent.
For reference, here is last year's poll at the same time of the season with the team in the first column and their delta position (negative meaning they dropped, positive meaning they rose) to the final poll. Teams that ended up NR are struck. The lesson? Polls change a lot throughout the season.