Point Shaving from a BCS college
Disclaimer!- I am sure I will get a lot of feedback that I am just trying to make something up, trust me I have a lot better things to do then make up a story and put it up on mgoblog. I love mgoblog and it is for that reason where I can get the word out.
I was at the spring game for a smaller level college, but their HC told me and a few close alums that one of the colleges that he coached at (bcs team) was point shaving and they knew of it. This team is going to be hammered beyond belief, because things are starting to come out. I will not tell the names of the coach, school, or respond to anyone. Just one hint so when it comes out people will know I am not full of BS the school he coaches at and the school was at are in the same state.
I am thinking this is the other BIG story Yahoo said would come out
April 18th, 2011 at 11:54 AM ^
Is it just me, or does point shaving seem much harder to pull off in football as opposed to, say, basketball? You'd have to have some firm evidence for those allegations, because I'm guessing it'd be hard to detect on film.
April 18th, 2011 at 11:56 AM ^
For it to work in football, you'd have to have participation on both sides of the ball. With basketball, you really only need the point guard and one other starter.
I doubt there is point shaving in football. Too many people would need to be involved for it to actually occur.
April 18th, 2011 at 11:59 AM ^
you just ruined the entire premise of "The Longest Yard"
Nelly does not approve
April 18th, 2011 at 12:00 PM ^
in dominating wins, a lineman could fail to maintain blocks or a qb/rb could fail to gain yards that consistently allowed the other team to come within the spread or over/under
April 18th, 2011 at 12:12 PM ^
or perhaps you have a young, turnover prone offense and a terrible matador of a defense running the 3-3-5
gulp
April 18th, 2011 at 12:16 PM ^
Haha, my first thought was "well, that could explain why Michigan can put up so many yards and so few points." Good to know I wasn't the only one.
I seriously doubt Michigan was in a place to do too much point shaving, though. I'm no betting wizard, but I think you generally need people to bet on your team to cover the spread to pull it off.
then the guy could just intentionally botch offensive or defensive playcalls
April 18th, 2011 at 12:27 PM ^
You could have a player fumble intentionally on the goal line.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1999-02-06/sports/9902060081_1_nu-be…
April 18th, 2011 at 12:16 PM ^
it's in the kicking game. With spreads being 3 or 3 ½ pts etc...How many times have you heard an announcer make a comment about a missed FG or extra point coming back to haunt teams. Same can be said in Vegas or w/a bookie. Missing a FG as time expires can easily be attributed to nerves and pressure. The perfect combination for shaving and/or concealing motive.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:07 PM ^
I don't know, football is the ultimate "weakest link" sport. One player on defense could have a couple inopportune "bad plays" which result in touchdowns. A lineman could "miss" a block at a time that kills a scoring drive.
In some sense, basketball is harder. You need the best players to be in on it. If you have non-stars, you risk the star players having great games and risk your point shavers being benched. But, the reason I think you see more basketball scandals, is that if your best players are in on it, it's very easy.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:24 PM ^
I think that it would be pretty easy for a qb to manipulate the spread.
A couple picks in a game, a few failed throws on 3rd and 10, a couple fumbles on an exchange and you can leave 14+ points on the field no matter how hard your lineman, RBs, and WRs are trying.
As for defense or other offensive players, you'd need a group of players involved but I'd think it would be pretty easy to see such a schematic meltdown at play.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:25 PM ^
Texas 2010.
I challenge your premise that it's hard to shave points in football sir!
I'm probably the only one who will get this reference.
Good 'ol Scooter.
April 18th, 2011 at 11:53 AM ^
Anonymous sources are one thing. Anonymous facts? Seems pointless, but thanks for the "info" I guess.
April 18th, 2011 at 11:55 AM ^
How big of a BCS school? Are we talking something small like a Vanderbilt, or big like an Oklahoma?
April 18th, 2011 at 12:02 PM ^
Point shaving implies that people were betting on that school. It doesn't have to be, but my guess is that it's a school that regularly wins.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:08 PM ^
Not at all, after all, the two most recent point shaving scandals in the Big 10 involved Northwestern in football and basketball. That might have been during Northwestern's turn around in football, but they were god awful in basketball.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:12 PM ^
Like I said, it doesn't have to be, but it is MY guess that it's a school that's been winning. And yes, if they are shaving points, it means people are betting on that team.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:18 PM ^
What does winning have to do with "betting on that team"? You're not betting on wins and losses, you're betting on a line. You're betting against odds makers and the general public. The quality of the team has very little to do with weather money could be made by point shaving.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:35 PM ^
The team expected to lose will have to forfeit their game, while the team expected to win can just keep their games closer than what is comfortable. There is less downside to point-shaving when you are expected to win.
I think you are impoperly evaluating the values and concerns of a point shaving athlete. If you are the type of person who is willing to harm his team for personal benefit, you probably don't care much about winning.
I also think it's easier to shave points if you're on a bad team. If you're on a good team, you either have to shave points in games you're not favored to win by very much (thus negating your "forfeiting their game" argmunet) or games where you're heavily favored. If you're heavily favored, it's likely because your entire team is much better, meaning you'll have to do extra work to assure that you make up for any members of your team that play well. You also risk being pulled early in the game if it's a blowout. Finally, if your team is good and you are intentionally playing poorly, there's a better chance that you'll get benched than a guy on a poor team, since the better team is likely to have superior talent and depth. If you're a good player on a bad team, you probably don't risk getting benched even if you're playing poorly, probably don't have to worry about overcoming talented teammates playing well, and will probably get to play up until the final minute, regardless of score, allowing you more time to impact the final score.
Agree to disagree.
it seems to me that the team in question would have to be a really good team and that it was their offense that was involved. It seems like a great team would have a easier time pretending not to be able to score and stil win than pretending not to stop the other teams offense. this would mean they would have to be comfortable in their superiority and always be ahead of the other team
April 18th, 2011 at 12:00 PM ^
So this is simply you telling us you know something that we don't. Thanks a bunch! You don't really tell us anything without providing relevant information, ie, school name etc. but again thanks a bunch. BTW, my dad can beat up your dad.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:01 PM ^
Please be Dan Enos. Please be Dan Enos. Please be Dan Enos.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:08 PM ^
The CMU spring game was on the 15th (last Friday).....
April 18th, 2011 at 12:11 PM ^
Please
April 18th, 2011 at 12:24 PM ^
That would make sense since the OP specifically stated it was a BCS College and not university. Down with the Michigan Agricultural College!
April 18th, 2011 at 12:01 PM ^
with our Defense or kicking game the last 3 years, did it? I am pretty sure we have firm evidence to refute those allegations (because the film don't lie.....).
April 18th, 2011 at 12:04 PM ^
Unless you're going to mention the school, it doesn't do any good to tell us this information. All you are trying to do is get credit for knowing ahead of time what is going to happen. Being vague doesn't help that cause, especially when there have been rumors of this floating around for several weeks now.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:13 PM ^
I haven't heard any rumors, but then again I get 99% of my info from here. Do the rumors suggest which school, seeing as the OP won't tell us? (I guess the easiest way is to look at schools that win a lot of games closer than they're supposed to.)
Also, what was Yahoo's timeline for their next story? August or something, right?
April 18th, 2011 at 12:58 PM ^
I think the rumor was posted here, but then taken down. I know that this wasn't the first I've heard of it, though.
I think the Yahoo story was supposed to drop in early summer, so that could mean pretty much any of the future months.
I believe there are two coming. One was going to be in I think May and it was sort of big but not really. The bomb was supposed to come in August. I am guessing this is the bomb.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:08 PM ^
Please tell me you live in Ohio.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:10 PM ^
So you talked to a coach who coaches in the same state of the school that will be busted? That slims it down to 41 states excluding Alaska, North Dakota, South Dakota, New Hampshire, Maine, Rhode Island, Delaware, Vermont, and Montana since these states don't have a BCS school. Thanks for the info dude.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:32 PM ^
Also Hawaii, New Mexico, Nevada, Wyoming, Idaho, and Utah (since the Utes aren't participating in the Pac10 until next year).
April 18th, 2011 at 12:40 PM ^
Good call, sir. I was thinking FBS schools, not BCS. 15 states instead of 9.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:11 PM ^
Hey guys, I heard from a trusted source some BIG news that is going to come out about a current, future, or former Michigan football player. I can't say who, what, or when, but it will be a BIG story.
Just one hint so when it comes out people will know I am not full of BS the player in question is/was/will be one of the more popular players on the team.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:13 PM ^
April 18th, 2011 at 12:13 PM ^
You mean that App. St. and Toledo aren't real???!!! Thank God!
April 18th, 2011 at 12:14 PM ^
My guess is you talked to Toledo's head coach. If true, that means Ohio State would be the only option.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:19 PM ^
I like where your head is at, but Cincinnati, technically fits the bill as well.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:28 PM ^
His father played at Toledo though, he lives in Toledo and could be a possible graduate. They are close to the program because they attend games VERY often. I just looked through his posts.
I also have his address, phone number, relatives, etc. Yes, it's creepy. Yes, I wanted to know that fucking badly.
April 18th, 2011 at 12:34 PM ^
New information found. Preed1 is a graduate of Eastern Michigan I beieve, which also unfortunately puts Michigan in the mix. I still suspect Toledo though since he's probably closer to that program.
Good stalking, though, if it were Michigan, I think he probably doesn't post it here or would be a bit more cautions (i.e. using language like "allegedly").
I also didn't realize you were proposing a serious guess with Toledo. I thought you were just throwing a non-BCS school in Ohio so that Ohio State was the only potential BCS school, thus why I posted Cincy.
In that case, you should threaten to post his address and phone number every day until he is willing to reveal more information.
I texted him twice but he didn't answer :(