Where's the petition to trim the student section down? And those who are paying to be on a waiting list and who will actually go to the game and be there ON TIME get their seats?
Petition Against GA Student Section
Students are the loudest section in the stadium and usually the only group that follows the "maize out" request. Why would you want to limit a group like that from getting tickets? You wouldn't be elminating sorority girls from getting tickets but kids who are genuinely fans.
Because 25% of them don't make noise because they don't show up?
Those who show up are louder than the empty seats.
Other than basketball, the whole Maize Out for football has been an overrated gimmick to sell season tshirts with the schedule on the back.
Does it provide an advantage? No, I don't think so. If an opposing team fears the color of the tshirts the fans are wearing, they are in the wrong division.
As a student, I love being part of the Maize Out. The fact that you can instantly tell where the student section is from any picture of the Big House is pretty cool.
No offense but the student "schedule" tshirt has always (well recently at least) been maize so...not hard to comply with that request.
Here you go
I just made one up. It is so easy to make a BS petition that means nothing.
Add a petition to revoke season tickets for people who sell their seats to opponents EVERY game. I will sign that one....
Sorry, but just because you're a senior does not mean that you're entitled to those seats. Only the most devoted fans should be entitled to those seats. Athletic department is not taking anything away from you that was yours to being with.
They only get those seats if they're seniors who have purchased season tickets for 4 straight years. I think that entitles them to better tickets.
Nope. Just because you came and talked to your friends in the stadium for 4 years does not entitle you to better seats. Don't pay money for tickets if you only want to talk to your friends.
What are you, a moron?
People who dropped $200 for 4 years straight for the privilege of one day sitting in the front row, dress up, being on ESPN and making some noise are no longer devoted fans?
The one and only problem I have with GA is that it is going to screw over the rising senior class. If this happened to me, I'd be furious. Since I graduated a couple of years back, I avoided it.
?Came and talked to your friends" for 4 years? Now you're making assumptions about what kids did and didn't do.
Don't push your bias on people.
I should say first few rows. You know what I meant.
By first few, you mean first 30 rows, right? Because I was in 28 as a senior. It's pretty random and getting in the first 5 rows is basically just winning a lottery. You have no gaurentee to get any seat.
I would have loved if my senior season wasn't the 3-9 Rodriguez debut debacle (we'll always have Wisconsin Rich!)
I would have loved to have a former/current president to be my commencement speaker. Nothing against Larry Page, but graduating in 09 instead of 08 or 10 was kind of a bummer.
I would have loved to graduate in a nice economy like the classes of 03-07.
Someone in life always gets screwed. If it wasn't this class it would have been a future class.
That's the spirit!
Guess what bro (I'm assuming you're a Greek or ex-Greek) I am a 5th year student and I have over 150 credits in my time at this university and I am SICK AND TIRED of people getting better seats than me (as a senior I had row 40) when those people DON'T GIVE A SHIT about Michigan football. I say FUCK those people. I don't care if you're a senior or a freshman or a State student. If you cant take a small hit and pregame from 9 am until only 11 am (GOD FORBID!) then gtfo. Seriously. I don't want to see you in the stadium. I don't care if you spent 450 dollars for the privilege of attending the social event in row 10 your last year here. You either care about Michigan football or leave. Stupid Greek fairweather fan.
Ah yes, another one of those "I hate you so you must be Greek" comments. These are flying like crazy these days.
This is the point which hasn't been brought up as every Junior/Senior seems to believe they will be given seats in rows A,B,C, etc. I only missed one game my 4 years at Michigan, senior year to take the EIT Exam. Yet I was still stuck in the 30th row my senior year watching people show up late and stake claim to their seats in the rows below. A part of me feels that if some seniors would've received their tickets in July and been stuck in rows 20-40 they would be all for GA to have a shot at getting front row.
No intelligent discussion ever started with "What are you, a moron?"
It removes the credibility of everything you say after, because you're broadcasting off the bat that you are incapable of considering a point of view different than your own.
I was a junior and had received 1st row seats (Not A or B though) in section 25 in 2011, so priority becomes negligible pretty quickly once you get pretty close to the field.
I had student tickes through undergrad and lawschool. The last three years were sweet tickets. I even started to post that on the main page thread. However, as I thought about it, I always got there at least 30 minutes early, often 45 minutes early. I probably would still have done pretty well.
GA will screw seniors and grad students who want to show up late. However, that is kind of the idea. I think it will probably work out, but a year two tweak could be to reserve one or two setions for seniors or grad students who alreay have bought at least three years of tickets.
Waiting in lines is not the determing factor in one's fandom. Making kickoff? Of course. But not waiting in lines.
I agree. I showed up for kick-off the every game as a student, but not a ton before that. I'm just not a huge marching band person, though I appreciate how great they are. I also didn't always live very close to the stadium. If this system were in place when I was a student, I would have had shit seats for most of the games.
There are not just "people who show up super early" and "people who show up crazy late or never come." There are lots of people in between. You are not a better fan if you get to the stadium 45 minutes before kick off as opposed to 5 minutes before kick off.
Honest question: What do you consider "shit seats"?
I don't know, 70+? I never got to the game a half an hour before it started, so I imagine getting in a handful of minutes before kick off would leave me up there, at least for the non-cupcakes.
Yes, I understand that showing up on time for Northwestern or Indiana or most of the non-ND OOC games will get you solid seats. But not for the rest.
I was someone that always tried to get in 15 minutes before kick to see the band. That was usually good for all the way up to row 30. Even closer if I tried. Of course, 15 minutes was right before the rush.
I really don't anticipate that rush getting moved up too far. Now maybe instead of 15 minutes early, I have to get there 30 minutes early for row 30. Maybe 45 minutes for the top two games. I really don't think that is terrible. You're not killing your pre-game by getting there 45 minutes before kick. It's not a huge adjustment and when you consider the positives, I think it is well worth it. Like I said in another thread - grab some airplane liquor bottles at blue front and enjoy the stadium. It's better than another 15-30 minutes of flip cup or beer pong. And this comes from a competitive fuck that loved his beerpong.
DISCLAIMER: As a student I was vocal about GA and even emailed Brandon several times. Hell, I even mentioned it in person to some other admins. So, I don't want to sound like a recent grad who is just saying things because it doesn't affect him - I wanted this when I was a student too.
Waiting in lines is not the determing factor in one's fandom. Making kickoff? Of course. But not waiting in lines.
You're not going to have to wait in a fucking line. I know just a few years ago I was the first to be OUTRAGED at things when they CHANGED but you're still going to get great seats if you walk into the stadium 30 minutes before kick. There will be no line 30 minutes before kick.
The only way you have to stay in line is if you want to be in the first 8ish rows. Somone in another thread noted that Paternoville took up ONLY the first 8 rows in State College. I bet at Michigan Stadium you can get into row 10 without standing in line for 1 minute by simply showing up 1 hour before kick. Only want to be there 30 minutes before kick? Then you get row 30ish for an average game.
POOR FUCKING YOU for having to sit in row 30 at Michigan Stadium and have to wait 10 minutes before the pre-game show begins.
But you are allowed to be a huge Michigan football fan and not a huge marching band fan. I never saw the pregame show because I never had any interest in it. That doesn't make me a bad fan. If I were a student now I would have to either get there early and sit through that or be stuck with seats near the top.
Is that the end of the world? Of course not. But a great part of a Michigan football game for me is the pregame entertainment outside of the stadium, and I would be upset if I had to forego that to sit in the stadium for a half hour before the game started.
That's fair enough, but you can still enjoy pre-gaming; just for 15-20 less minutes than year's past.
And, I would bet that if the student section fills up early, it will be just as fun as pre-gaming. Even if you're not normally a MMB fan (I, admittedly was), when the section is full and getting chants going building up that atmosphere for the banner run, then hell, I wouldn't trade that for any amount of pre-gaming.
EDIT: Also, over time this might just push pre-gaming up as parties will start to die down earlier than in past. So really, you wouldn't even be missing that much.
that the line for UTL 2 will be at least 10,000 people long by the time the gates open. The line for the bball NCG viewing was at least 5,000 people long... went from the stadium steps by crisler all the way through the parking lot and around keech and up to main
A: You cannot compare this to basketball. They are totally different seating situations.
B: Yeah, there will be a line for UTL. I don't think it will be as big as you think, but whatever. Just get in line or don't. Your choice.
Well of course that's easy for you to say. You're not the one who has to choose between tailgating with friends and family and not having to sit in the endzone. How about you join me in line and we can hang out and talk for 6 hours about how much of an abomination it was when the students didn't show up on time?
What time and where did you have that line at Crisler? I was there too, and I walked right in.
Where to I sign to support the GA for students?
Im signing right here
Does GA suck? Yes. But someone needs to propose a better solution because the old policy was a disaster.
There were 5,000 no shows. GA won't fix that. The top rows will still be empty. But at least it will be better than before.
Things that would fix that without compromising a system tied to a seniority to a certain extent and tarnishing the game day experience? A point system, less tickets (somehow), etc. Those are the solutions that need to be proposed, not just "STOP GA AHHHH"
No they won't, because they won't be student seats anymore. 22,000 tickets will be sold for 18,000 seats. Voila, packed student section, DB laughs all the way to the bank.
This!!! Its a brilliant move by Brandon. Without the pesky seat numbers holding you back, they'll be able to sell more tickets for the same section and bank on either jamming them all in or hope people don't show.
Or go the airline route and offer to get them an extra ticket to the next game if they take a voluntary bump to the next game.
I suggest that they charge students FULL price with the previous seniority benefits in place.
All students entering the stadium prior to game time would get a refund equal to the original student discount. You snooze you lose.
This is in my opinion by far the best option. If you buy your ticket at full price you can freely decide whether/when you want to show up. If you want a subsidized price, there will be strings attached.
I think that's a fair plan actually. Not sure it would work, but you could have that apply to your next season or something. You need to pay full price for each time you showed up late the previous season. Although lots of students' parents buy their tickets, if a parent sees that their kid showed up late to every game the year before, they may be less willing to buy them again, opening up spots for the people who really want to go.
just my opinion, but I think paying extra the next season wouldn't have as big an impact as paying full cost up front. This way they have an actual incentive to arrive on time...if they don't, they don't get the refund.
If the impact is only felt after the fact you will likely just get less students getting season tickets the following year when they have to pay the penalty. That will open the door for more fans the following year, but that could just as easily be the same type student who wants to drink longer and come later. They in turn would likely not pay the penalty the following year which would (again) open that seat up for someone else...and on and on.
If you pay the full price up front with the promise of reimbursment I think the plan is far more likely to get the desired outcome, but that's just my opinion.
I have read this entire thread and this is by far the best solution I have seen thus far. I guess the iissue would be whether the full price upfront would be too much for most students to afford, but knowing they would be reimbursed might promt their parents to help them with the initial cost.
I'm starting my own petition. It states that any student who buys tickets and fails to use said tickets or show up for games before kick-off for three consecutive games will LOSE said tickets for remainder of season and all rights to buy future tickets. Forfieted tickets will be distributed to famillies of childern at Mott free of charge.
I'm calling it the "use em or lose em" policy
is exactly what they should have done. Not hard to keep track of if they put tickets on MCards at all, or I'm sure there's other ways. Doesn't harm anyone except for the people who caused the issues of late arrivals and absences in the first place.
And then instead of just allocating closer seats to seniors, make it a mix of credit hours + attendance/timeliness at previous games. A mix of reward for being a good fan and punishment for being a bad one.
Finally something I can agree with! But it seems most people here prefer the "sucks to be you" policy whereby rising seniors who have never ever once been late to a game get screwed over and have to camp out the night before to get section 26 for the Ohio game.
Try sleeping out overnight for the 1995(?) Duke basketball game in sub-freezing temperatures with no protection from the elements. It was the coldest I have ever been - we didn't take our winter coats off until halftime! - but it was also one of the fondest memories I have from college. Stop complaining, suck it up, get there early, and enjoy the atmosphere.
but face it, you're in the minority by far.
Not to mention, having to wait in line all morning makes it impossible to tailgate (I don't pregame, but I do tailgate with friends/relatives on the golf course, or at least, I used to...)
You get to have season tickets to watch UM football for 250 buck and you're crying because you might not get in the first 10-15 rows? Dude, I live 2000 miles away and they chances of me ever seeing a UM football game live are slim to none. I would gladly pay triple what you pay for season tickets for any seat in the big house to watch The Game. Unfortunately for me it would cost triple your triple for me to be able to do it so it won't happen anytime soon.
My point is there are a hell of a lot of people who would gladly pay what you do and sit in the seats you sit in without a hint of complaint. They would arrive on time and stay for the entire game and cheer the bloody asses off. Now you expect those people to feel bad because you guys actually have to show up on time, or heaven forbid maybe even a little early to see a game? I would camp out for a week for the chance at good seats for the OSU game, I'm just sayin'.
This is what they do at the university of Oregon and Oregon state. I live in Eugene. Granted, the tickets are "free" and you get them the week if the game. Still, if you don't swipe your card (ie miss) two games you got tickets for, you lose privileges for the rest if the year. And if you do it the following year penalties get worse. No fing around at Autzen.
I am a student but I have no interest in signing that.
I'm in the minority, but I like GA seating.
I was tired of drunk people waltzing in during the 2nd quarter and moving all the way down to the lower seats.
Yes I'm a senior, and yes I am getting screwed out of the "good" seats from this, but I don't get what all the bitching and entitlement is all about.
If you want a good seat, show up early and quit bitching.
Did you show up early to the Ohio bball game this year?
That 3000 is barely half of the amount of no shows that Michigan students averaged last season per game. (5,434 per Twitter)
I'm tired of students feeling entitled to great seats simply because they're seniors. Most of these no-show kids end up going to 1 or 2 games (coming late and leaving early) and then they sell the rest of their tickets for a profit. I think it's silly that the school subsidizes their tickets if they're not going to even use them and then sell them to some ND or OSU fan on craigslist.
I'm surprised it hasn't been mentioned, but the "good" seats really aren't very good. I was on the 9th row last year, and because of the slow rise, you end up not being very high off the field. The seat I got around the 35th row for UTL was actually much better.
THIS. I waltzed in about 15-30 minutes before kickoff at least for every game last year, and settled in the ~30th row every time, which was completely empty at that time every game. Best seats.
If you can't show up early enough to get a good seat 7 Saturdays of the year you deserve a shitty seat.
What is the problem with Georgia's student section?
I'm in favor of GA, but I'm under no illusion that this will cause the stadium to fill up -- especially when they are bumping up the price on student tickets.
This will cause people to show up earlier for games in order to get good seats, which will mean that there will be more people at the stadium AT GAME TIME. However, if you can't get 25k students to show up without GA, you can't get them to show up with GA.
One possible solution: create a website for students to sell their tickets to each other. Right now, law students (I am one) post their tickets for sale on LawOpen. I'm sure there's an equivalent for undergraduates, medical students, business students, etc. However, if there was a place to offer up tickets to the full range of UM students (including those on other campuses), then it would be significantly easier to get tickets to those that will use them.
Penalties and such only adds to the confusion, and trimming down the waitlist undercuts the whole "hook 'em while they're young" philosophy. I am a HUGE fan now (as my profile name suggests, I'm from the East Coast where college football doesn't exist), and a large part of that is because the policies are so damn student friendly. I'd probably be a huge fan regardless, but having great seats in a huge student section doesn't hurt one bit.
As a former MLaw student, I have to admit that law students are the worst fans. 1Ls are too busy studying; 2Ls are often in other cities for interviews (or catching up on reading) and 3Ls are just so "done with school" that they rarely partake in student activities (and are prone to arriving late and leaving early).
That being said, as you alluded to, student tickets have a large amount of economic value since the tickets are highly subsidized (in addition, for key games, market value far exceeds face value).
Therefore, I support GA because it gives the most economic value (i.e., better seats) to those who show up on time (which is behavior which we should all value). Further, by taking away from the seniors (or 3Ls) the opportunity to sell "great seats" (since student GA tickets will now have the same face value and market value), this change will effectively diminish the economic value for those who simply want to profit off ticket re-sales and have no interest in attending the games.
I loved my sweet 30 yard line tickets during law school. (I was at Michigan for Undergrad too.). Michigan football was all that kept me sane during those three years. Didn't miss a game, and was never late.
Most of the law students you described didn't buy tickets anyway.
Dave Brandon and every major former ath. begged the students to show up to the game on time. Many schools count on students enhance the home field advantage. Unfortunately, getting too drunk the night before the game and sleeping off their hangovers was more important. Ironically, if the 3000 people that have already signed the "petition" had showed early for the game we would not be having this discussion. Fortunately there are plenty of people that are fine with the GA set-up.
that the 3,000 people who signed the petition are the same people who show up late for games? I signed the petition, and I have arrived 1h early to every game over the past 3 years
Nothing like entitled drunk students who think they deserve the best seat in the house for showing up late.
You are gonna sit here and act like its every student that gets drunk and shows up late? Or that every student is some dumb freshman that doesn't show. The vast majority of us shouldn't be taken down with the drunk greek kids and no shows.
Sure, there was some GA seating before. But if a group of drunk sorority girls got to the game in the 2nd and told you to get out of their seats you tell them to F off.
The current system basically reserves those seats you earned until the game starts. You can sit with larger groups of friends all you like as long as you are moving further up to do it.
As a student that will be a Sr next year I am pissed. I spent 3 years up high, working my way down to better seats, just to have that essentially taken away thanks to some crappy minority.
You can still get a good seat. You will just have to be committed. I'm a freshman. I had to show up early to get good seats for basketball. GA ensures that the most committed kids get the best seats. If you want a seat down low, show up early.
I can be committed to Michigan and the football team without being at the stadium 3+ hours before the game.
I shouldn't be given the same chance at good seats as a freshman just because a minority of students show up late.
I'm sorry, do you really think you're going to have to be at the stadium three hours early or are you drastically talking in extreme hyperbole to try to prove an invalid point?
Why do you think you wont? 3-4 hours early for good seats to some basketball games with GA was not unusual at all. Why would it be different for football? In order to get the best seats, people will be there for a long time. Look at how it goes at PSU.
Yes, it will be different for football, obviously. In basketball there are 500 good seats and 1500 bad seats.
In football there is 2-3 rows of excellent front seats - maybe two hundred people. Then about 50 rows of seats that are pretty much the same, except the ones higher up are actually better.
It is totally not relatable to Crisler.
Plus, the inhabitants of Paternoville filled up the first 8 rows. That's it. Don't the rising seniors realize that they would have been very lucky to randomly get in the first 10 rows anyway?
the first five rows all around, and then rows 30-50 in sections 26 and 27. People will compete ferociously to get those, just like they competed ferociously to get in the Maize Rage in basketball.
it's not taken away you just have to show up early. you could get the front row seats if you really wanted...
Do what I did when I was a senior - get to the games 2 hours early with some friends and you can have any seat in the house. Sorry you don't like the policy, but I've been to too many games in the student section over the years where fair weather fans ended up kicking out hard core fans like yourself from the good seats halfway into the first quarter. F that.
unfortunately it seems like most people here don't give two licks about us rising seniors who showed up an hour early to every game over the past 3 years and sat in crappy endzone seats for 2/3 of thos years
I don't have a strong opinion either way on GA seating. But I do feel strongly that the OP should not post a petition and ask people either to sign it or quietly ignore it, as though this was his personal Facebook page.
Where is the petition to get students to show up to Michigan home football games so we don't look like a bunch of indifferent, entitled, ham 'n egger amateurs on national TV?
Or maybe John U. Bacon's article hit the nail on the head and that we're just looking at the erosion of tradition for the sake of profits and we just need to shrink the student section...
Because let me tell you, literally the only people who care about Michigan fans not showing up to games are other Michigan fans.
Well no shit Sherlock! That is because people want tickets to the game and the student section uses up valuable prime real estate. Those 5400 empty seats could be sold at a small discount and make the AD and fans pretty damn happy. That's called a win win situation, versus a lose lose which our current method is providing. Bring on GA and eventually restricting it, if people don't get their priorities straight. Get your head out of your butt!
Ohio State fans getting the O-H-I-O chant going full bore in our house sure did seem to appreciate it.
Well...yeah. I do think that's what a half-empty student section looks like. What else would it look like?
I mean, you don't see thousands of empty seats when the cameras pan around the stadiums at Alabama or Oregon.
And yes, I think you're right, only other M fans care...but that doesn't mean other people don't notice when kickoff happens and our student section looks like it's been pulled out of a Georgia Tech home game.
Sorry, I guess I don't really understand your point.
I think we need to shrink the student section by one section. I'm a student, and so many kids just don't care anymore.
I'm a freshman, and I buy tickets off of students not going for less than $20 all the time for friends from other schools who want to experience a game or friends back home. There's a huge supply of tickets. For the Northwestern game, I bought like 6 extra and had to turn people down offering me.
I think with the rise of the Common App, there aren't as many entering fans as there used to be, and they don't understand the tradition. But they buy tickets anyway and contribute to the problem of apathetic students. Doesn't completely cover all the reasons why this is an issue, but I'd say it's part of it now. It's not like the RR years when you could just attribute it to a bad team.
When I was a student, I hated....H-A-T-E-D having to deal with any form of assigned seats. Like many die hard fans, I got to a number of the games 1-2 hours early and did the de facto GA thing so I could get seats in or around the front row on the 10 yard line. As the years went by, it became tougher to do this because too many whiny, fair weather students who couldn't be bothered to show up in time for the kickoff would start bitching to the ushers that people were in their seats. They would then proceed to take the seats in question and barely pay attention to large portions of the game.
I think this GA idea is great. Put simply, it rewards the students who actually give a shit about the team. Almost all of the students who go to the games live on campus and don't have classes on Saturday. There's really no reason to show up late, unless there are more important things for you to do on your college Saturdays besides watching football. And if that's the case, good for you - you're probably a more well rounded person than I am. But if you don't care enough to be there on time, then it shouldn't bother you if you have to sit in row 73 instead of row 2.
This petition is a joke. The people who are bitching about this could solve the problem by setting an alarm clock 30 minutes earlier on Game Day Saturdays. I will never ever EVER support a petition that justifies preferential treatment for fair weather fans who go to the games just because it's the cool thing to do.
You're in the STUDENT section fergodsakes......you're supposed to be the craziest fans in the building, not the younger clones of the apathetic, snobbish alumni in Section 20!
everyone uses the drunken student who shows up in the 2nd quarter to argue for GA, but what about the students who want to enjoy the pre-gaming, but still show up on time? when i was in school, we'd party on state street until 11:15, then head to the stadium. we were always on time (or early) and always cheering very loudly. i feel like this is the majority of students, and they're the ones that get screwed by this because now they have to choose between pre-gaming or good tickets.
i'm not trying to argue for the previous system either. as brian has suggested many times, give out points based on previous attendance. 1 point for making it to the game, another for being early. you can get points for non-revenue sports as well. i can't imagine that technology would be so difficult. that way, the avid senior still has preference over the avid underclassmen because he's had more years to accumulate points.
Call me crazy, but I always thought post-gaming was much more fun than pre-gaming, especially after wins. Its damn difficult to booze it up at 10am and then rally to tear it up that same evening. Anyway, your point is well-taken. Kids will just have to re-set their priorities or accept lesser seats if they choose to put an emphasis on pre-gaming.
students are 18-22 and their tolerance is high .... i had 30 games as an undergrad and was up by 6 or at the latest 7 for every game including UTL (had to pregame Gameday after all) and went out after every single one because its a football saturday. I also missed kickoff only once because I judged getting a friend the medical help they needed was more important than the 3 minutes against a MAC team that I missed (if hard but proper choice leads you to question my fandom, i will point out that i stood hrough the entire "08 nw game i`n which even though i dressed for the weather, I am not sure I have ever been as cold/wet/miserable)
Also Pregame >>>>>>>>> Postgame.
Aa has way too many out of town colleged aged kids to make going out special on saturday nights. The bars lines are massive and if you want to throw a party, randos who arent even students act like it is their right to drink your booze.
Again, this policy won't fix the issue of fans not showing and the only people it screws are the fans who love to preparty and could care less about the pregame stuff (I love and respect our band but Im not going to see them). There is a massive crowd of students who do the state or hill area pregames, leave around 45 mins before kick, and always make it into their seats around 15 minutes before kick. These are good fans, you are screwing them
I don't see this as an "or" decision. I would always go home, watch the 3:30 games (usually napping through the 2nd and 3rd quarters), then rally for the post-game celebration that night.
To be fair though, if kids are willing to skip the pre-game to get there early, I suppose they deserve the front row. It just sucks they have to make that decision. I loved every aspect of game day, and pre-gaming was a big part of that.
life isn't fair.
But it also doesn't cost much to implement MCard swipes, i imagine.
(Disclaimer - i graduated 2 years ago and was never late from 2007-2011 (yea 5th year), went to away games etc, so this change doesn't affect me)
It's just that it isn't much to ask for a better system with the increased price in student tickets.
GA is definitely better than assigned seats. But there could be other changes to GA that improves it even more. Especially when it can reward students who do show up on time while not requiring them to line up 3 hours before the game.
I feel it's justified given the revenue they make, to ask for a little more than simply throwing a Full GA out there and say "life isn't fair".
I've never understood the whole "life isn't fair" thing. Isn't that an argument for correcting unfairness?
No, it's pointing out that no matter what system is in place, it will be unfair to somebody.
It's not about it being row 50 if we get there 15 minutes early. Its about the fact that we were forced to deal with being in row 70, 80, 90 for our first couple years, eagerly and patiently awaiting the games where we would be down in front. And now, in order to get what we have waited for, we need to miss 2 to 3 hours of pregame fun.
Dude i would have loved if they instituted a policy luke this while i was a student. Be glad you get to enjoy it as a student.
As for people showing up 6 hrs early... give me a break. I'll continue our long standing tradition of pregaming and leading the band into the stadium. Pretty sure that will work fine
I don't know about that with the pre-gaming. My MBA buddies seemed to think that getting that one last round in of flip-cup was important enough to be late. I disagreed and left early(establishing seating for the group), but it's a definite thing that if no consequences or even incentives are provided for showing up on time then this is the behavior you get. I like the GA idea, at least it's a step in the right direction.
I still don't get why everyone here is supporting going full GA or assigned seats.
How hard is it to implement MCard swipes to track attendance/on time record.
Combine that with GA seatings in blocks, where MCard record and contributions to the school (whether student is on other athletic teams, glee club, solar car, class standing, credits, volunteer etc, whatever AD deems appropriate) gives you the ability to select a certain block preference at the time you apply for tickets.
Then enforce GA by block. By the time the band takes the field (~20 mins before kickoff?), if a good seating block isn't filled up, then other students can move in and take those seats.
This ensures students who earned their preferred seating block/section won't have to show up 3 hours early to the game, while making sure they arrive at least 20 mins (or whatever cutoff time they set) early for the game to save those seats.
Boom. No line problem. No entitled students who show up late.
And when people consistently shows up late they don't get the ability to choose better blocks/sections/rows as MCard is tracked.
In addition, it rewards students who contribute most to the school, as long as they abide by the rules (arriving 20 minutes early.)
The false dichotomys, generalization, fights and general grumpiness of everyone throughout this whole discussion (going back to the fall when people complained about the students coming late) is ridiculous. Pretty much everyone looks bad. So of course I'm going to add my opinion.
I like General Admission. If I want a good seat, I can choose to wait in line, as long as it takes, and I'll get a seat generally where I want. If my priorities lie elsewhere, such as drinking, studying, hooking up, or whatever, I can do that instead, but then I'll have to live with the consequences. Like most everything else in life, there is a trade off. Nearly everyone complaining about not being able to pregame and get into the seats they feel entitled to are just trying to have their cake and eat it too.
All the conversation about this is way overblown, IMO. It will work itself out, just like at every other school that has GA student sections. It might take a year or two of adjusting, but eventually people will figure out how to time their entrance into the stadium for their desired balance of morning partying and seat. The biggest difficulty will be getting large groups (I'm thinking 5-8 housemates, plus friends, out of towners, significant others, and other hangers-on) to all enter at once so to sit together. Groups will likely be smaller as getting a large group of drunk college students to all decide to walk to the game together is like herding cats.
Finally, it will be interesting to see what the student ticket scalping market is like. As time goes by in the morning, a student ticket is literally worth less and less. People will no longer rely on grabbing a ticket for cheap from some freshman girl puking next to a house on Hoover on her way to the game, just to get in.
So there is a problem with people being rewarded for being first in line? I don't see anyone getting screwed except someone who wants to show up at half time and still have sweet seats. The student section is the loudest in the stadium but is unfortunately 6th loudest student section in the Big Ten. I've been fortunate enough to stand on the sideline at Penn State (a GA venue) and its downright scary loud. Nebraska, Wisconsin and Ohio State student sections are pretty damn loud too and ALWAYS packed. I sit across the stadium from the student section below the opponent sections and it's embarrassing when our student section is 1/3 empty for kickoff. Show up early = get sweet seats.
There are different gates you line up at that correspond to better seats for upperclassmen. I actually wouldn't be opposed to this.
I don't understand why everyone thinks that the people who were showing up late are going to continue to do so. Prior to GA seating, these people didn't feel they were missing out on anything (it's sad, but true). Now that there's a competition for seats, there's going to be a HUGE polarity reversal. People like being first in line. Not only that, but there's going to tons of cutting in line and saving spots for people who show up just before the gates open.
The people getting screwed are the people like me, who always show up 1h-45min early for every game, but am now going to have to show up 6 hours early and skip tailgating compltely in order to get the same seats I would have gotten under the old policy.
I know people that drive 4-5 hours to get to a noon game and they pull it off with no problems. I don't know how the hell someone that lives in Ann Arbor can't have their ass in the stadium by noon.
I didn't realize there were bad seats in Michigan Stadium. It's a freaking bowl fergodsakes. I remember going to the Wisconsin game in 1998 and sitting practically on the roof of Crisler Arena [Center], and it being the best day of my then young life. Everyone here is arguing back and forth and I understand both sides, but the fact of the matter is there have been way too many games, meaningful ones at that, where those top 20 rows have been embarrassingly empty. If I were a senior this year I would be just as mad as some of you are, but at some point you have to realize that, as usual, everyone gets punished for a couple people doing not doing the right thing.
...and it won't make one damn bit of difference. As students during finals week, I would think you all would have much better things to do with your time.
A good stadium seating cause would be to double the width of the aisles and have bench seating. They certainly can afford it, and it would make the game experience much more comfortable.
Worried about largest attendance? Add a couple rows to the top.
Getting in line 6 hours early doesn't necessarily mean you really care more. It means you have a lot of time to waste. There were people who literally did not know who Zack Novak was and yet skipped their classes to get in line for the Ohio basketball game (9pm start) at noon.
If YOU care more, get in line early. If you dont, show up late and sit in the nosebleeds. I feel like making a diagram...No, all the people who care will not be able to do their studying in line(although it sure would pass the time). However, MOST of the people willing to give their time to Hokeville will be those who care whether Michigan wins or loses.
how long you are willing to waste time waiting in lines, maybe you'd care to join me as I line up for UTL six hours before the game starts? Clearly, if you don't, you don't care about Michigan Football. We can talk about how dang awful it was when the students used to show up late.
You get dave to sell me tickets to UTL for $40 and I will sit right next to uou for six hours. Gotta warn you, I'm a snorer.
This is the way it has been since time immemorial. So the argument that "well the students are lucky to get those discounted tickets in the first place!" is just plain disingenuous. Maybe you think it'd be better off if they just got rid of the student section entirely?
I feel bad for all the upperclassmen who show up early or on-time for games to begin with, as they're really the ones who are getting screwed here. To everyone who would rather still be pregaming and chugging that last beer than see their team storm out of the tunnel, I feel zero remorse. They ruined it for everyone else.
I am a student at CMU but I attend a few Michigan games a year and I actually don't mind sitting up higher in the student section (usually only ticket i could get). It is still a really good view of the field.
I really do not care but I have a feeling the empty rows at the top are not going to change by this. Until the team is top 5 going in to the Big Ten schedule this isn't going to change. Here is a good one for you on the waiting list for tickets....... Season ticket holders get dibs on buying up to 8 more extra season tickets this year. It's in their email right now. The question isn't who cares more its about money because its a business
Why are people still debating this as if it's some complicated moral dilemma? It's very simple. GA seating is probably a good thing for the atmosphere of the stadium. It also screws over many good fans by forcing them to wait hours in line for something that they wouldn't have had to wait for before tha change, all because of the actions of a few thousand lazy fans.
Couldn't students hypothetically just skip over the so called "5,000 person line" by going to another gate to enter 5 minutes before the gates open? In the past I have entered as a student through the SW gate near Pioneer. It will be interesting to see if the athletic department took this into consideration and will only allow students to enter at the NE gate to keep it fair.
Assign seats as had been done in the past. Your ticket entitles you to sit in that seat ONLY if you enter the stadium a set time before kickoff (15, 20, 30 minutes?). After that time period expires, the rest of the seats at GA. Students who enter on time would get their tickets stamped at the gate. No stamp, GA.
Also, I understand many of you don't agree, but I think all the negging is a little much. Its a relevant topic and many people are against GA as well.
I downvoted not for the petition itself, but for the "don't post if you don't agree with me" thing you had going there.