Our Naked Lunch: We are Penn State (or possibly ND)
William S. Burroughs described the contents of his book Naked Lunch - a book, utlimately, about abuses of power - as "brutal, obscene, and disgusting," but he believed the contents were important so that readers would see what was on the end of their "long newspaper spoons," i.e., the reality they missed as it was filtered through the media of Burroughs' day. The title was a reflection of his desire to deliver a lucid account - readers where to be given Burroughs' news naked and unvarnished.
I think it is time given the hand-wringing over this season (and not picking up Hand, to a much lesser extent) to take an unvarnished look at Michigan football in the last ten years. Why ten? Well, it's a nice round number and because it puts us well into the childhood of recruits so that the'yre unlikely to have formed a perception of a football program much before then. It's also just a pretty long time. It's hard to say that ten years' worth of outcomes is a fluke.
2003: Michigan goes 10-3, beats ND, OSU, and MSU, wins the Big Ten, and loses in the Rose Bowl. This was the last year in which Michigan beat ND, OSU, and MSU...Also, Chris Perry finished fourth in the Heisman vote, making him the last Wolverine to finish that high.
2004: Michigan goes 9-3, beats ND and MSU, wins the Big Ten for the last time since, and loses in the Rose Bowl, Michigan loses to OSU for the first of what will be seven straight times.
2005: The Year of Infinite Pain we called it. If we'd only known. Michigan suffers mass injuries, goes 7-5, and among the rivals only beats MSU. They then lose in the Alamo Bowl to Nebraska and a collection of scarecrows dressed up as referees.
2006: Michigan rebounds to go 11-2 but loses to OSU and is thrashed in the Rose Bowl. This is the last time Michigan was considered a national championship contender late in the season. Current high school seniors were roughly eleven years old when this happened.
2007: Michigan goes 9-4, loses to App State, loses to OSU, and wins the Citrus Bowl. Lloyd Carr then retires.
2008: Michigan goes 3-9 and loses to all of the rivals.
2009: Michigan goes 5-7, beats ND, and loses to OSU and MSU. No bowl for the second straight year.
2010: Michigan goes 7-6, beats ND, loses to OSU and MSU, and is destroyed in the Gator Bowl. RR is out. Hoke is in.
2011 Michigan goes 11-2, beats ND and OSU, loses to MSU, and wins the Sugar Bowl against Va Tech in a match-up that drew criticism on the grounds that some people believed neither team deserved a BCS bid. This is Michigan's only BCS bowl victory since 2000.
2012: Michigan goes 8-5, beats MSU, loses to OSU and ND, and loses its bowl to South Carolina.
Why did I bother to type all this out? That's a good question, and my answer (which may not cut it) is that I think some people don't realize what Michigan football is right now. Michigan football is Penn State - or maybe Notre Dame. History of great coaches (or at least one great coach)? Check. Large and passionate fan base? Yep. Lots of great history generally? Yep. Great stadium? That too. A long list of former All-Americans and NFL players? Sure. Very good school? Yes...All of that is great, but is Michigan a top football program right now? No, I don't see how you can say that. Again, a decade is a long time. You just aren't very good if you're having to make excuses for an entire decade.
I join everyone in wanting Michigan to return to the top. But I encourage you not to despair as if Michigan just recently fell from the top or is right now falling from the top. Michigan has not performed like a top-tier program for most of the last ten years. Michigan is like ND or PSU - once-great programs that are and have been shells of there former selves that occasionally, briefly pop back up into the elite only to drop back down again. There is no point in pretending otherwise.
Oscar Wilde wrote something about staring at the stars while lying in the gutter. Let's continue to stare at the stars, but let's have no illusions that we are, while not in the gutter, not too far out of it either.
EDIT: See NittanyFan's comment below for more on the PSU comparison.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:27 PM ^
That's all true. I've always thought we were basically ND.
IMHO, what separates us from Penn State is that the fans still expect to the team a national title contender on a regular basis, delusionally or no. (See also ND).
Granted, only ten teams can be top ten at the end of a given year, but it seems like Michigan should be as much in the hunt as many schools. We've got piles of money for coaches and facilities, a long tradition, lots of eyeballs in the stadium and on couches, etc.
On the other hand, what we don't have is (1) southern climate; (2) proximity to the new feeder states; (3) a nationally famous coach; or (4) a dominant winning record in kids' memories.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:33 PM ^
97, 99, 06, 11 - the only seasons in 2 decades the football team has 2 losses or less. And being realistic the 2011 and 1999 teams were not national title contenders. So it's really been 2 years out of 20 that UM has been relevant. The team has had 3+ losses in every other year since 1993.
I wrote a post about this a month ago - of college football's "blue blood" programs only Notre Dame has been more mediocre the past 2 decades, and yes that includes the 1 champsionship year which was sandwiched in between four years of 4 losses before and seven years of 3-5 losses after (save for 1999). There is no consistent 11-2, 12-1, 11-2 type of stretch for 4-5 years in our recent history like USC, Oklahoma, Alabama, OSU, et al has had. Or like Bo had in the 1970s. We are very much Notre Dame - we have one shining moment (us 97, them 2012) in between years of mediocrity. It will be another 3-5 loss season in 2014, and I guess we all hang onto hope for 2015. Because at UM it has now only become about "next year". And until proven otherwise Hoke is something in between Ron Zook and Charlie Weiss (both great recruiters.... )
November 14th, 2013 at 5:31 PM ^
So, we had a good 30 year run from 69 through 99. It does not surprise me that we have 10 to 15 years being down a bit. Alabama was so so for years before Saban turned them around.
I hope Hoke can turn our team back into B1G champions or at least a consistent 10 win team. I think this is possible even though we may lose for a while to Urban. But if we play hard every year against OSU, romp through the rest of the B1G and get a BCS bowl every year, then I would be happy with Hoke as coach. If we slip to being an annual 4 loss team after 2016, then I think we'll need a better coach.
All programs will have periods of down years and we are in the midst or hopefully nearing an end to to a decade of being down.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:33 PM ^
It's a bit more complicated than just being ND. I think the ND comparison is generally fair, but really we were 2nd rate B1G at the end of Lloyd's tenure, due to Tressel crapping on us every year. PSU has been pretty irrelevant for 20 years and the whole Sandusky thing is a shit pile we will not have to dig out of or rationalize. And to be fair, the whole SEC southern football thing has made pretty much everybody irrelevant over the past decade. What has USC done since Carrol left? Texas since 2005? Besides OSU who really has done anything of note outside the SEC in the past eight years? And they continue to get shit on by the SEC more times than not in bowl games.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:40 PM ^
If Penn State is irrelevant UM has been more so the past 20 years ... since joining Big 10.
1993: 10-2, 1994: 12-0, 1996: 11-2, 2005: 11-1, 2008: 11-2, 2009: 11-2.
PSU has more 2 or less loss seasons than UM in 20 years 6 to 3. That is 30% of their seasons in 2 decades versus our 20%. No, we are more irrelevant than PSU if you are being fair. Too many here are clouded by their maize glasses to see that. Trust me, I was surprised to see how many double digit win seasons they had married to 0,1,or 2 loss seasons. Why? Because Carr owned Paterno. But they have had 6 very good years in 20.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:39 PM ^
I see it a bit differently. The best comparison I can make is to MSU about 5-6 years ago:
- Transitioning away from a non-traditional offensive scheme
- Implementing a new defensive identity
- Playing a lot of young guys at key positions
- Competitive in games but not consistently dominant
- Defense-minded coach from the Lloyd/Mo and Saban/Tressel molds
This is obviously not a bad thing if Michigan follows the same trajectory MSU has, especially if the talent is better.
2008-2012 is unlike anything recordwise in Michigan football since the 60s. And when you step back and look at how there have been 3 head coaches over the last 7 years, the record (49-36 and 2-2 in bowls) is still respectable given the changes.
UM has been terrible against MSU and OSU in that time, and the perception of the B1G has hurt, but I can't help but think about how close this team is to 8-1 or even better. Yeah, I get that the offense has looked bad and they could also be 3-6, but I can't help but think that with only 16 seniors and over 20 freshmen and sophomores contributing this year, there is no place to go but up.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:45 PM ^
as a PSU fan, I can find a darn near EXACT Penn State doppelganger for each U-M season in the 2003-2012 era:
2003 Penn State = 2008 Michigan. Awful teams.
2004 Penn State = 2009 Michigan. Awful again, just a little less so.
2005 Penn State = 2011 Michigan. 11 wins for each, with a BCS victory although a non-scintillating one over an ACC team. PSU won the B1G.
2006 Penn State = 2004 Michigan. The worst comparison of the bunch, U-M did win 10 and win the B1G while PSU was a 9-4 4th place team.
2007 Penn State = 2005 Michigan. No win for PSU comparable to U-M's win over PSU. But both these teams were Alamo Bowl outfits.
2008 Penn State = 2006 Michigan. Top 5 team going into the Bowls that gets exposed as not quite elite by USC in Pasadena. PSU was B1G champion.
2009 Penn State = 2003 Michigan. PSU won 11 and finished in the Top 10. Underrated team of sorts. That was a very very talented U-M team, B1G champions and won 10, also underrated a bit historically.
2010 Penn State = 2010 Michigan. 7-6 and middle of the B1G!
2011 Penn State = 2012 Michigan. 8 and 9 win outfits that never won any truly big games, and lost in the post-season.
2012 Penn State = 2007 Michigan. Disappointing starts to the season, rallied to finish the regular season 8-4. No Bowl Game for PSU to compare vs. U-M's Citrus Bowl win.
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And to this point in 2013, no offense but it's continuing. 2013 Michigan looks extraordinarily average and non-inspiring. I'm familiar with a team doing the exact same.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:48 PM ^
I pay a decent amount of attention to PSU, because I have a lot of family members who are grads, but I didn't realize the comparison was quite so apt.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:27 PM ^
that comparison between seasons hit me one day during a long 10-hour drive. I actually got to use it on a message board!
I think the 9-game win streak have conditioned many to think "U-M >>> PSU", and while that was true 5-10 years ago those greater than signs have faded nto equal signs of late.
Given the scandal/sanctions, we SHOULD have "U-M >>> PSU" in the short-term future (next 3-5 years) but I'm not 100% that's a sure thing either.
Tough times, because I do miss the 1990s when both teams were very very good and our annual games always produced some quality football.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:43 PM ^
Dang, you know what? That doesn't seem all that bad honestly. I know it's not the dominance we once experienced, but for a decade largely considered the WORST in Michigan history, I'll take it. What matters most is that we rebound soon to become a consistent 10+ win team. Hopefully our recruiting will get us there.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:49 PM ^
It really is sad that people that this point would kill for going 10-3 with a bowl loss. Our ceiling is higher than that. Unfortunately osu has and will for the future have better coaching than us and that is why Tressel was going 11-2 or 12-1 most years and going to the national championship 3 times and WINNING the rose bowl. Something we haven't done in 16 years.
November 14th, 2013 at 7:15 PM ^
Bo did not win a NC but I thought his tenure was great. If Hoke could repeat this, I would be happy. I think too many fans have a pie in the sky fantasy about Michigan going on some sort of NC run like AL. Face it, we may be lucky to play in one NC in the next 10 years. I'm just hoping we can see a sustained period of 10 wins and BCS bowls.
November 14th, 2013 at 7:35 PM ^
you make it sound like repeating the Bo era will be easy. Check out his first six years: almost unparalleled. Yes, no NC, but you can argue that he might have had the finest six years in the modern era in that time.
November 14th, 2013 at 8:26 PM ^
Hell with Bama...I think it's perfectly reasonable to complete with OSU. We haven't done that since 2003.
November 14th, 2013 at 5:51 PM ^
Michigan is it's own school/team and needs to own it's own problems. Football has been mediocre for a while (10 years give or take) and the hiring of Rich Rodriquez was a great opportunity to correct that...but then then half the fans & Michigan Men freaked out over a bunch of little stuff before completely losing their shit when a bad season arrived.
Rodriguez is a good coach who has built winning programs everywhere and he failed here because of us. In a couple more years, Hoke will probably post a couple more mediocre to shitty seasons before getting canned. By then Rodriguez will probably have Arizona trending towards the top of the Pac10. And then when we try to get a new coach who can actually impact the program, he won't come here because he have seen what an impatiently dickish bunch we can be. Karma sucks. Prepare for decades of middling teams and dwindling attendance.
Also, consider the changing context of college football. The moves towards expansion and national playoffs have a way of leveling the expectations across the board (nat championship or bust!)...but without necessarily levelling the playing field (ie., the SEC still cheats). In this emerging environment, Michigan might have been able to maintain some momentum if we were playing at a top level but given how we've fallen, we'll probably have to sell our soul to return to the upper reaches of relevance. OSU appears to be comfortable doing that but will we ever be?
Personally, for me, it's pretty much GAME OVER at this point. I don't want us to win by cheating. Maybe the traditional Big Ten/ Rose Bowl was something of a regional fiefdom but I was quite happy with that.
I guess the silver lining is that as the team continues towards mediocrity, attendance will inevitably drop and maybe tickets will be affordable again. In fact, I could even imagine reaching a point where tickets are practically given away because they have so damn many seats to fill now.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:27 PM ^
Yeah, Rodriguez failed because of us. It couldn't possibly have been the historically terrible defense that was showing no signs of improvement, going 6-18 in Big Ten play, the first major violations in our program's history, not winning one game against OSU or MSU, poor recruiting, Josh Groban, etc. Nope, it was totally the fans.
And decades of middling teams? Seriously? Michigan has never had even one decade of middling teams or dwindling attendance, and we aren't about to start now.
November 14th, 2013 at 8:34 PM ^
Except for a couple notable Rose Bowls, the 50's & 60's are almost entirely middling, including tons of empty seats in Michigan Stadium.
Lets not confuse your Rich Rod tut tuting with facts.
November 14th, 2013 at 8:57 PM ^
Ummm...I think someone is drinking the Kool-Aid pretty hard! If you don't think UM has had - at minimum - one decade of middling teams then we will simply agree to disagree. UM was not good at football for more than a decade prior to Bo showing up.
November 14th, 2013 at 10:21 PM ^
they wouldn't shell out the measly amount of $ to bring Casteel with him from WV, then hampered hiring a decent replacement with a sub-par salary level. This = GERG, plain and simple. Give RR $650,000 to hire an NFL caliber DC and...well....that would have changed things a lot, except old school M fans were so impatient that his tenure became toxic way too early and getting him a decent DC at that point wasn't even an option.
The fans are definitely partially to blame and will be again if they drive Brady Hoke out and we end up in transition again. I wasn't a fan of the hire, I think he is a SDSU level coach and would have stayed there were we not desperate as the search to hire a coach dragged on as we continued to be turned down (I think in part b/c of the toxic situation created by old school fans.....who wants to take over at M after they ran a coach off after 3 years? God forbid you come in and try to change anything) by every one we approached. You will never convince me that Brady Hoke wasn't somewwhere south of #7 on the candidate list. But......dumping him now and going into another transition state is not the thing to do.
Yeah...fans matter...they can negatively impact recruiting, hiring and in general the overall personality of a program in a profound way.
In a lot of ways, I think we are getting everything we asked for and deserve. We drop or threaten to drop our support when the team loses...we point fingers and blame and want people summarily strung up.....we boo the team and the coaches from the stands. All acts of fair weather fans and quite frankly......we asked for this.
Support this coach and this team, even if they lose.
November 15th, 2013 at 7:43 AM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 6:36 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 5:59 PM ^
Is the OP suggesting that someone is going to make "Michigan Returning to Glory Since..." shirts? I saw one of the Notre Dame ones the other day and I don't find them nearly as amusing as I once did.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:05 PM ^
that as fans we always cloak the past in a "rosy" glow, so to speak.
The truth is....we are simply not a big time college football power anymore and have not been for a long long time.
We now have a coach who is (and his record clearly says it) mediocre and sub .500 and people are wondering why we are in so much trouble? Hoke is a nice guy. No doubt about it.
But he is not a great football coach on ANY level. He never has been. He never will be. He is what he is.
There are a few schools that have a true football catchet about them.
Alabama...OSU...Oregon...LSU...even Stanford and sometimes Texas are more known for football now than Michigan. We are in the weakest BIG Ten i have ever seen in my 55 years and we are still not even contenders for anything. Get used to it. We do not have the sort of coaching that will be bringing us back up with the true big boys of college football.
Ask ANYONE that knows diddly about college football to name the top 5 or even 10 coachs in all of FBS. I bet you not one will include our coach in that list.
We are middle-of-the-pack in the league and in the college football world as a whole.
Get used to it. Its not changing anytime soon.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:21 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 6:23 PM ^
I nominate this for the worst post of the year.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:31 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 9:56 PM ^
because it's not puppy dogs and rainbows?
because it is reality based as opposed to some blind optimism?
I am a true blue Michigan fan and always have been. My dad took me to my first game when I was 3, 44 years ago. I took my son when he was five and we have been going for 57 years. I still get mad and frustrated when they lose.
Through all this, I'm still a realist. The ruling body of college football always leans toward those that are currently succeeding until something forces them to change. Alabama and Nick Saban are working the rules to their advantage and everyone else is falling farther behind.
The B1G as a conference can't compete against the SEC's lack of rules and enforcement, whey do think Urban left. He knew he couldn't compete against Saban and Miles in the long run. Urban unfortunately has a stranglehold on the B1G right now and MSU is his toughest opponent right now.
Michigan and all it's traditions is falling farther behind. As much as I revere Bo and the history of the program, 18-19 yr olds don't care. They listen to Hip Hop and ear-splitting volumes and want crazy bold helmets and uniforms. The game and the culture have changed and the Michigan's and the Notre Dames are struggling to keep up.
The unfortunate truth here is that to keep up with the Bama's of the world you have to look the other way on some things. And you have to be willing cater to the trend of the day, moreso than clinging to the tradition that got you to this point.
I hate the current state of college football and the business it has become, but I love Michigan and will root for and cheer for the Wolverines until I die. That makes seasons like this and truthfully's decades like this very hard to deal with.
November 14th, 2013 at 10:13 PM ^
Exactly. Worst post of the year my ass. There are so many people that would rather see us go 9-3 if it means they can cling to anything that reminds them of the Bo years. It freaking disgusts me. They think it's ''unrealistic expectations'' for the team to get to 11 wins probably every other year.
November 14th, 2013 at 11:14 PM ^
With the facilities, the stadium and the best helmets in the game, we should be be able to get our fair share of top talent. I don't expect a Bama type run either, you can't unless you grayshirt. Which is point. If the B1G limits recruiting to 25/yr while Saban get 30 and 3 of them are 5-stars, we will all fall behind, including OSU.
Michigan can't even compete with OSU right now. Urban has the success and pedigree and the school has a win at all costs mentality. Michigan talks about B1G championships and OSU talks National Championships.
I'm happy with Rose Bowls and the occasional MNC game, but this program needs more of a killer instinct and Hoke needs more of an attitude. I hope things turn around by end of next year, but things look very tough right now. We have to beat NW Saturday or we'll lose recruits and things will start to slide. Borges better have a good game plan, Michigan needs to score at least 30 in Chicago Saturday.
November 15th, 2013 at 11:48 AM ^
Why? Seemed somewhat reasonable. I could have done without some of the language and ALL CAPS, but the points were salient.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:25 PM ^
Look back over the past 60 years. Easy to do - just Google national football championships.
The Big Ten doesn't have all that many National Championships over the years. It has never been considered the top conference since the late 40s. The idea that the B1G has slipped is all over the media, but that is very, very old news.
What makes it somehow an issue is the BCS. The conference was fine before 1998. The idea that a national champion somehow has to be crowned changed the game.
We are hardly middle of the pack in the league most years. We have a good program. We've had mediocre coaching the past 6 years, however. This team has had chances that it threw away in all of its losses this year. The problem is the coaching since 2008.
We were not a very big deal in the 50s, or for most of the 60s. We were #2 as recently as seven years ago, and Urbz had to lobby the media to have the BCS not simply rematch M and OSU in the NC game.
The program has had its ups and downs.
Yes we need an elite coaching staff to become elite. It's my belief that we had an offensive minded head coach with a good chance at making us elite, but he could only produce half a team. We now have a coachiing staff that is evidently clueless lately. I can't for the life of me figure out how that happened, but there it is.
Hoke and the staff need to be replaced. And I agree, it's not gonna happen soon.
November 14th, 2013 at 9:04 PM ^
The coaching at UM has been a problem for quite a bit longer than 2008. I know there are some serious Lloyd lovers on this site and - frankly - I have a lot of respect for Coach Carr. However, the reigns to the program should have been handed over to someone else once Tressel put a border around Ohio (and once Lloyd started wearing thin his relationships with key recruiting pipelines). In my mind, Coach Carr had the greatest success this program has experienced in the last 50 years; but, he has also sewn the seeds of the collapse we are in right now. Blurgh.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:19 PM ^
The facts are simple and they indisputable:
The vast majority of kids don't remember Michigan ever being near the top.
The vast majority of 4 and 5 star players want to go to the NFL
The vast majority of h.s. football players want to play in warm weather and not ever in snow and cold.
The vast majority believe the SEC is the ONLY conference worth a crap.
The vast majority see one or two teams in each of the other major conferences can compete with the SEC. I.E. OSU, Oregon, Stanford, FSU and maybe another I can't think of.
The B1G is OSU and then everyone else and it's REALLY obvious.
The media pushes all these 'facts' and the NDs and Michigans of the world slip deeper into the background.
Warm weather, cute girls and a fast track to the NFL doesn't include Michigan and ND anymore.
Let's face facts, unless the NCAA or some governing body levewls the playing field, it's the SEC elite, OSU and whoever else wants to skirt whatever rules they can to get ahead. If you play by the rules, you can't win anymore. Gray shirts, green handshakes and 'perks' make it almost impossible to field a competitive team to what Bama is producing every year.
Saban would be an IDIOT to leave Bama! Why leave, you have a perpetual motion machine. They sign more highly rated players than anyone else every year. Do the math, as long as 1-year schollies exist, Bama will always be in the top 2 or 3 in the country.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:30 PM ^
The OP is right in a way though. The Michigan and Notre Dame football cultures are almost scary similar. Both are top teams historically in their region and the fans know it. But many of the fans are old and would rather long for the days of old than getting with the times.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:24 PM ^
But we have the winningnest percentage all time!!!! Boom! M-Live'd!!!
November 14th, 2013 at 6:29 PM ^
The drama is getting so old here. Michigan is tied for 5th in BCS bowl appearances and has had a good to great team pretty much right up until Rich Rod. The program has been bad for about 5-6 years. That's what a bad coach can do. It happens to every program.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:35 PM ^
Except that isn't true. 10-3 is not great. Losing to osu 7 years out of 8 in the late Carr years is not great. 5th in BCS appearances is not great. Wisconsin has the same amount.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:56 PM ^
So what do you want? 11 wins every year? #1 in BCS bowl appearances? Obviously the OSU rivalry had already gone down hill by 2008, but what does a "good to great" program look like in your mind?
From 1997-2007, Michigan averaged 9.5 wins a year. You know what the great Alabama averaged during that time? 6.7. That's right, for over a decade, Alabama averaged less than 7 wins a year. Down periods happen to every program, and our has lasted about 5-6 years, which is pretty typical.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:59 PM ^
Um...yes....You realize we've only won 11 games 3 times in the last 20 years? That's pretty unacceptable.
November 14th, 2013 at 7:06 PM ^
Well that's not all that surprising considering 13-game seasons didn't even start until 2002.
I agree that the program has stunk since 2008. But this "OMG Michigan is a dinosaur program that hasn't won anything in 50 years and everyone else is passing us by!" is just moronic.
November 14th, 2013 at 10:11 PM ^
passed us by? Alabama, LSU, Florida, Miami, Texas, USC, Oregon, Stanford, Oklahoma, OSU and most recently MSU. All these programs ahve had a lapse somewhere, but they have rebounded and competed for national titles(except MSU). Michigan, much like ND gets by on it's history and tradition.
The "on a Michigam Man can coach Michigan" meme is a dinosaur. RR made many mistakes, but being a spread coach and offensive genius weren't among them. He wasn't given a chance and the torch ande pitchfork crowd ran him out before he could establish anything.
I hated the defense (or lack of it) that he had, and the smallish O Lines, but he certainly could find weaknesses in opposing teams defenses and exploit it. I think he would make the perfect OC. He was too honest for the media here and they crucified for it. It was a bad fit, but due to MArtin's screw-ups he was the only choice they could get.
Michigan used to be one of the premier jobs in college football, I think now it doesn't make the top 8. If Hoke and his staff can't turn this around in the next two years, this program is in serious trouble. Coaching changes make recruiting bvery hard and the SEC's hold on the south and OSU's success makes the midwest a gamble as well.
November 15th, 2013 at 12:18 PM ^
It's somewhat misleading when people throw out our record like we win a lot of games. News Alert: We play in the WORST conference in the country; and we have been playing in either the worst of one of the worst conferences in the country for a long time!
With our resources, infrastructure, financials, history, and brand - there is no way in hell we should ever lose more than 2 games a year in the regular season (3 max). The reason being is aside from OSU, we regularly play only one or two other good teams the entire season before a bowl game (some years that's ND; some years it's MSU, etc.).
A better measure of whether or not we are a "good" team is to look at our bowl record because that's a better equalizer of talent. We are 3-7 since 2003; 0-3 in the Rose; and, 1-0 in the Sugar. That's not very impressive to me.
Let's face it, we should be counting our lucky stars that we play in the B1G. If we played in the SEC, we'd be Tennessee now.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:50 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 7:02 PM ^
Sorry certain people can't handle the truth. I was one of those people during the RR years. I thought RR would succceed always even though people were calling for his head after year 2. I was proven wrong. Nothing I'm seeing right now on the field gives me any reason to believe we're going in the right direction.
November 14th, 2013 at 7:43 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 11:28 PM ^
I'm betting you'll be proven wrong again.
November 14th, 2013 at 6:43 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 6:46 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 6:47 PM ^
November 14th, 2013 at 6:59 PM ^
Carr basically had the kinds of teams you're talking about. B1G titles, occasionally in the MNC discussion. We've stepped back a little and it's going to take time to find the right coach to get us there again. Hoke may be the guy, and his recruiting definitely seems to suggest he is. I'm staying the course.