spoiler alert: i linked this
When it comes to consumer products, Apple is great for the style obsessed or the technologically incompetent and is priced accordingly.
Maybe I'm part of the technologically incompetent, but why are these other ones better than an iPad?
One of the most prominent is pricing - if you compare what you get for the cost, Apple comes out substantially behind in several categories - most easily seen in the iPad mini which is $130 more than the Nexus 7 and inferior in almost every way.
Another reason is that I don't like the relationship that Apple wants to have with controlling what I do and how I use their hardware once I have purchased it from them. They want to strictly control the user experience and, frankly, I think that is crap. I paid for it, I want to use it without regards to how Steve Job's ghost intended it to be used.
That doesn't make them better, it makes them different, and different people look for different things in their devices.
Some look solely at feature set, and will pick the cheapest option that meats their criteria. Others put a premium on industrial design, and will pay more for what they perceive to be quality design.
It's no different than, for example, cars. Some people don't care what their car looks like so long as it gets them from A to B and gets good gas mileage, others will pay a lot more for aesthetics or handling.
Well i can relate in terms of PC's etc.. I typically just laugh or cry when looking at friends computers / laptops they purchase from Mac..
I am glad I can build my own computers and save hundreds of dollars staying away from brand name builds, not just Mac's.
The prices are absurd... typically paying around 1000 just for the Mac Brand..
At least Mac Desktops have come down in price now that they use almost all PC related components like processors, video cards etc... Back in college it was F'ing miserable having to use the computer lab Mac's when working on my Graphic design projects.. Nothing was compatible, always crashed, just trash.. Least things are improving for them
I'm not sure this makes sense. When did Macs not use PC-related components? What were they using before they used processors and video cards?
you are not technologically advanced? It's only been a few years since they used ppcprocessors from Motorola.
Yes, I've been a chip designer in the Valley since 2001, I know. x86 processors aren't the only processors in the world.
So you're just being pedantic over the fact that a lot of people say "PC" when they should say "x86".
No, from what the poster had typed it honestly sounded to me like he thought until recently Macs didn't use components such as processors or video cards. If that's not what was meant I apologize for misinterpreting.
I suppose I have a fixed perspective and I am only answering insofar as how that makes them better for me. I didn't set out to prove that they were objectively better, but those are the reasons that stand out for me and why I fell on the side of the divide that I did.
I think it is somewhat hilarious that the bulk of this discussion has come down to a IOS vs Android debate when the OP explicitly stated that he was "not interested in hearing why I should buy an iPad"
Yeah, I guess it's kind of like starting a thread about Rodriguez at Arizona and saying "let's keep this about RR at Arizona, mmkay?" Not gonna happen.
OK - apple products are a little pricey, but they price points aren't crazy different, so let's say price doesn't make a huge difference as long as it's within reason. What's the difference between a Nexus 10 and an iPad? When two items are 500 and 600 dollars, most people will still buy whichever is better.
Can you elaborate on your second paragraph? Maybe this is me being technologically incompetent again, but how do they control your experience?
From my own personal experience people that hate Apple products and refuse to buy them, tend to think that they know more than the "Apple consuming" public.
Like the guy said, with PC or Android you can manually customize or tweak the hardware. Apparently people who buy Apple products, buy Apple products because they are too stupid to be able to do what PC/Android user do.
Did it ever occur to you that maybe people who buy Apple products do so not because they are stupid, but because they have no desire to manually customize or tweak the hardware?
No - we are all just too stupid to know any better. I remember a time when "user friendly" was a good thing.
The funny thing - the folks ripping people who buy Apple because it's cool, are doing so by saying they're too cool to buy Apple.
Yes, it did occur to me. I have an Mac Book Pro and Ipad. I also built my own computer (with help from a friend) that runs both OSx and Windows.
I got a MacBook Pro just for the reason because I really have no desire to tweak it. I didn't want to pay the same amount for a customized PC laptop like a Origin PC.
I built my computer mostly for gaming. When I got my MBpro, the video cards were integrated and getting 30 max fps was annoying.
Upon rereading your original comment I realized that I misinterpreted your line about Apple purchasers being "too stupid" to use Android as being your position as opposed to your comment on someone else's position. My bad.
What's the difference between a Nexus 10 and an iPad? When two items are 500 and 600 dollars, most people will still buy whichever is better.
It's a good question. From my research, I think it basically boils down to two things: simplicity (Apple) vs. customizability (Android...and if that wasn't a word before, it is now). Apple products (specifically the iPhone and iPad) are very simple, easy to use, and fairly static. What you see is what you get. And what you get works almost flawlessly.
With Android, there's a lot more you can tweak and adjust, and you can have dynamic information instantly. The biggest example of this is widgets. On my phone, rather than just having an icon to launch my email app, my inbox actually displays right on the home screen. It updates dynamically as new emails come in, and I can start a new email right from the widget; without having to open up the app itself. Email is just an example, but you can do the same thing with tons of different apps. As far as I know, you can't get much more than the weather to display in real time on Apple products (correct me if I'm wrong).
Aside from that, things are really beginning to consolidate into virtual "ecosystems," especially as media and entertainment becomes more cloud-based. So as you become more integrated into one ecosystem, it becomes harder (and makes less sense) to branch off to another. As far as I know, there isn't much in the way of integrating music, movies, etc. you've bought through iTunes onto an Android device; and vice versa for media you've purchased through Google Play onto an Apple device. This isn't as much of a barrier for us since we only have smartphones and haven't bought a lot of media, but since we've had positive experiences with our phones, we really see no reason to take a step back.
That makes a lot of sense. Thank you for answering my question thoroughly without telling me I like Apple products because I'm too stupid to know what to do with anything else.
That said, it sounds like I am too stupid to know what to do with anything else, so I guess I made the right choice.
It's ok. Every society needs its simpletons. It gives us elitists reason to feel better about ourselves.
Oh I'm plenty elitist, just not when it comes to nerdery.
I'm much more at home talking about boats or watches or golf clubs.
I have no doubt about that - I've gotten the sense that you are one of the more well-established members of the board here. I was attempting to be sarcastic... you know, playing off the fact you bought an iPad.
I'll hang up now.
No, I caught it. But the last thing an elitest wants is for others to think he might not be elitest.
My perspective, not that anyone cares...
I have a lot of interests and hobbies. I love coffee. If someone were to tell my why I should buy a keurig I would tell them to go to hell, and I would then go brew a pot of coffee with my funnel, my thermometer, and my electric kettle. I love vinyl records, and I restore old turntables for relatives and friends.
Computers are not one of my hobbies, though I have mad respect for those who are computer whizzes, and I am completely incapable of troubleshooting my own PC. With macs, I have never been frustrated at not being able to fix a problem. For me, macs work, and they last a long time. It's an issue of comfort knowing that I will have a product that can work the way I want it to, even thou I have no knowledge of how it works. And I'm willing to pay a bit more for that security and perceived ease of use.
This is exactly the point that I think a lot of anti-Apple evangelists are missing: the concerns they have are not the concerns of the vast majority of people. Just like you would never consider buying a Keurig because of what you look for in a cup of coffee, but for the vast majority of coffee drinkers it's a perfectly reasonable solution.
Precisely. And I don't antagonize keurig drinkers for enjoying their coffee... It's just not my cup of...coffee.
Except that Keurig coffee tastes like shit, and is expensive.
And people who vehemently dislike macs would say they are shit and cost too much. I think the metaphor works well.
My perspective, also not that anyone cares, is that I think Apple usually puts out a great product that is easy to use (albeit somewhat limited in what it does), but I really don't like the way they do business.
For starters, they overprice the crap out of everything. They release iWhatever 2 about 3 months after the first one with minimal upgrades and people rush to buy it because it's the 'new' thing, even though it's barely superior to what they already own. They change charging cable ports on newer devices for the sole reason of making you buy a new charging cable. They aggressively sue other companies for curving their phones and tablets in a similar way. They make you use inferior apps (Apple Maps, anyone?) because they think their crap doesn't stink.
So I won't laugh at you for paying for an Apple product, but I refuse to buy anything they sell if there is an equally good competitor's product available.
This, there is a reason they are reffered to as Isheep.
Yes, it's because some people resort to name calling when they can't understand that what one person looks for in a device is not necessarily what everyone looks for.
Your responses seem to indicate you cannot imagine why anyone would not want an Apple product, but you then say not everyone wants the same thing.
Personally, I would rather never have an object which uses itunes because it really tries to control your content. and Apple seems quite draconian in terms of what and how you put on your hardware. I have hundreds of epubs I read and multiple formats of video files which I'm not positive about Apple supporting. I know android and am not interested in another operating system. so I would prefer an android. but I will say Apple seems to have more child oriented apps, which is attractive if you have a 4year old.
I think you're reading bias into my responses when none exists. My opinion is (and has been) that different people want different things in their devices. For some of those people Apple provides value that other device makers don't. For others Apple takes away flexibility that they care about.
What I'm arguing against is that bias you're accusing me of, the perception from members of either of those groups that the other group is composed of idiots. Both groups are making logical decisions, just based on different priorities.
can be read just fine in the Ipad using the Apple Ibooks app, and there are some free apps that also read epub files.
There are also apps that will play some video formats not natively supported by the Ipad. To my knowledge, though, it doesn't play Flash videos.
That said, if you know Android and don't want to learn another OS that's probably the best reason to stay with Android. It's a big reason why I've stayed with IOS.
I use a large piece of slate and chalk. You can find a piece of good slate at any stone quarry.
but that is one over priced archaic piece of hardware.
I have the Nexus 7 and I absolutely love it. Though I can't comment with any experience on either the Nexus 10 or the Transformer, I think that the Transformer Prime being on ICS almost makes it a deal-breaker in my mind, though I have read the hardware is excellent.
My best experiences with android have been on google products because the experience is unspoiled by manufacturer UI crap.
I have an iPad, you should get that.
Got one last year and love it. I don't even touch my laptop anymore. I never ended up purchasing the keyboard dock or the HDMI cable, just a nice case. As with most Android stuff it was very easy to root it and get it up to Jelly Bean so I didn't have to wait on Asus to release that. Streaming video works nice and it handles multiple apps running at once just fine, plus the battery life is great. You and your wife say you already have Android stuff, so because you're not technologically ignorant like the standard iOS user, you should be able to get the most out of it. Good luck either way, I don't think you can go wrong.
while i love my prime so many others have had issues with i don't think it is worth the hassle.
I am fortunate enough to get pretty much every device out there for my company. I am a huge fan of any Prime Tablet with the exception of the TF200 due to a design flaw that kills the gps and wifi reception.
Depending on what you want to do and how much you like to mess around with your toys will decide which one you want.
I believe the most user friendly are the iOS devices, they are also the least innovative devices of the three. iOS devices are pretty much tied to your computer via cable or wifi sync if you want to remove/add data to your device.(this doesnt include the iCloud but I am not getting into that)
Android devices are not very user friendly and take some technical skills to get used to them before you can really get a grasp on how comfortable you are with these devices.
I like the nexus 7 and 10 but not for enterprise use. The browser runs pretty clean and i like the device performance.
The Prime tablets are by far my favorite, I have a tf200 and Infinity with the docking station keyboard the infinity works flawlessly for me as I use a VDI anytime I am not in the office, which is very often. There is room for storage expansion via SD card, so right now I have 96gb storage on my device. The keyboard dock has a USB port and a slot for your Camera's SD card, something Apple foolishly neglects on its path to be the least innovative technology company that lives off of its marketing.
With the Android tablets you get the Google Play store vs the iOS App Store. I really like the User interface for the Google Play store when you are on your PC, to me its much more user friendly than Apples app store.
I know I jumped around a bit but just wanted to give my opinion, quickly, as I am long winded.
I'm a big apple guy but I recently purchased a Nexus 10. I wanted a device that was basically a widescreen media consumption device. I have Sling box so I can watch HD tv on my tablet in bed, Netflix, and Hulu Plus. The resolution on the Nexus is 2500 x 1600. The display is amazing. So far I'm loving the Nexus. I don't do any real computing or gaming, but the display alone was worth purchasing it for. It is very integrated with google and I'm really enjoying it.
In terms of watching TV in your bedroom, wouldn't it have made more sense (and been cheaper) to buy a TV for your bedroom? I know technology is great and everything, but I think you're overthinking this one.
my slingbox for the same thing. Nice to not have to wire or mount anything. Also comes in handy when you are watching live sports and have to take a poop.
But don't you want to watch it on a decent sized screen, not have to worry about internet connection, and so on? Can't you pause it to take a poop? What if there's a second person in your bedroom you want to watch TV with? Are you going to hold the ipad between you?
watch sports while the wife reads. Why pause when you can poop and watch at the same time?!
First and most importantly, when we bought our house we realized the cable in the bedroom doesn't work. We had the tech come out and he said we would have to open up the wall to find the problem with the cable. That wasn't going to happen. Second, I don't want to pay for another HD box. With the slingbox I get all the HD channels I get on my basement TV where I have my cable box. It saves me money not to pay the cable company. I can even access my DVR with the slingbox. Third, I can where headphones with the nexus very easily and cheaply. My wife would complain if a TV was on and she could here it.
The primary reason is because the cable in the bedroom is unoperable and I don't want to smash up our wall to attempt to fix. It works fine in the rest of our house.
Well OK, if there's no cable then there's no cable. That is a little different.
Go with the nexus. Much better guarantee that you will get timely updates.
Bought a Galaxy Tab 10.1 in March. It took Samsung until August to spit out ICS for it and now Samsung won't update it to Jelly Bean. Sure, I can root it and use CM10 but I just bought the thing this year and they won't keep the OS up-to-date?
they get updates from Google, not the manufacturers. pure, unadulterated android goodness.
Well, that is unless Verizon is your carrier... took forever to get JB on my GNex. I know I could have rooted it and gotten the update much sooner, but I just don't feel comfortable enough right now rooting my phone.
The Transformer is going to give you an experience that more closely resembles using a computer, but with a touchscreen. If you plan to use it to write a decent amount, it's got a pretty sizable advantage with a pretty good built in productivity suite and the keyboard attachment.
If you want a cool touchscreen device for fun and recreation, the Nexus is a good way to go, as would a Kindle Fire or iPad. Those are all very similar devices, so I'd recommend going to an electronics store and playing with them all to see which you're more comfortable with.
What may also be worth a look is a Microsoft Surface. The RT is basically like the ones just mentioned except that it has a USB-host port, which is nice. The Surface Pro that's coming out in a few months will essentially be a full fledged Windows computer in a tablet form, which is awesome, and likely to be expensive.
I've had an iPad, transformer and nexus 7 and of all three I liked the transformer the best. The nexus 10 likely has a pricing advantage and will be updated more frequently, but of all the manufacturers out there Asus is probably the best at keeping software up to date. Add in the keyboard dock with more battery power and USB ports and I think it covers about anything a tablet user might need. That said, if it's just for reading, browsing, and media, save yourself some money and grab the N10.
What's the primary use you're getting it for? And is wired video out a necessity? I know the iPad can wirelessly stream video to an AppleTV, so I assume there are similar solutions for Android tablets.
Nexus 10 100%. I have a transformer prime and have had since march. Its a good tablet but support is horrible, lags on ocassion, many have wifi issues, gps doesnt work and Asus had to give out a free adapter for gps. Asus really shit the bed with it and released the 300 and the 700 soon after to fix the issues the prime had.
Get the Samsung. Asus will likely be making excellent tablets in another release cycle or two, but Samsung is still ahead of them right now. Asus will catch up though.
Regarding your specific issue of new OS releases, the Galaxy can easily run Cyanogen mod and let you control the updates.
My advice is give the 7" a chance. We bought a 7" Tab 2 and a 10" one. We ended up buying a second 7" one because we both wanted that size. Normally the tablet is held close enough to the user's face that the screen real estate is not an issue and the 7" is easier to hold, tuck into larger pockets when moving around, fits in purses with ease, etc.
I've really found the 7" tablet, coupled with a bluetooth speaker and a bluetooth keyboard to be ideal. For serious typing i just use the bluetooth keyboard and avoid having the on screen one take up real estate. You can buy a dock with HDMI for the Galaxy Tab line.
the software updates make it worth it.
just really wish you could add external memory.
the screen is supposed to be awesome and the new exynos processor is supposed to make it a very enjoyable interaction.
I would be cautious with the asus due to possible reliability issues.
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Please, for posterity's sake, tell me how you really feel.
My apologies. My 2 year old son got a hold of my phone and already figured out how to post to the blog. I applauded his efforts, but cautioned him about the fickle nature of the MGo community and point values.
than most of the posts here.
And isn't the question/answer "which one helps you to read MGoBlog the best?"
I'm mad I wasted time looking up all the Michigan rosters to figure out which #10 was getting was being called either "Gnex 10" or "Transformer Prime". I should've clicked on the link first.
Reading these comments, one thing comes to mind.....nerd alert!! Thanks UM, for producing some of the country's most astute observers of the subtleties of technology differentiation.
And just to clarify, I fully fit into this category. Just funny how a simple question can elicit so many serious remarks about Android product optimization versus Apple packaged user experience.
I strongly recommend the transformer prime. I absolutely love it. It has tegra 3 processor (and Nex10 doesn't) which is amazing for both performance and battery use. I have been extremely impressed by Asus, and will buy from them in the future. I'm about to go on vacation, and I love the fact that I have a keyboard with another 6 hours of battery so I won't run out of battery during the trip even if I use it nonstop during my 3 flights across the country.
While you may love your Nex4... the nexus lineup was actually made by different companies. There is no guarentee that the Nex10 is as good as your Nex4. I've heard great things about Nex7, but not so much Nex10.
You wouldnt be impressed with Asus if you had been an OG TF200 owner from the beginning. Even though I'm not a dev I have an account over at XDA and I would say that the only reason the GPS/WIFI issues got (semi) resolved is because we had access to an Asus employee.
Instead of a 5 dollar GPS dongle they should have been offering a free upgrade to the new tab's they announced a month after the Prime went on sale.
This discussion is the exact reason why I love this website. Thank you.
In regards to the topic, I could not agree more with the OP. Spot on. People that use Apple productts are probably not aware there are better options out there, but they dont know because they dont care.
To each, their own.
Better is a subjective term, since what is better to one person may be worse to another. I think it's more accurate to say that people who buy Apple products do so because they place a priority on what Apple does well, while people who buy Android products do so because they prioritize what Android products do well. It's not that people who buy Apple products don't know there about other products, it's that they do not see them as better. And the reverse is true as well.
Simple answer: It depends on what you want it for.
If you need productivity and a keyboard dock, then the Transformer Infinity is the best you can get.
If you want the best screen on the market for media consumprtion with fast updates than the nexus is the way to go.
I'm browsing on a Nexus 10 right now, really love it. Converted apple fan boy
Just curious, but has the MGoBlog app been adapted for a tablet screen? Or do you just access it through your browser?
Cant answer your question specifically but the scaling of the app looks fine on my Prime but I do get a lot of force closes with the app that I do not get when browsing on my phone.
I'm not sure there is an Android App for tablet or not. But the IPad one is made for the tablet screen. But pretty similar. The creator wondered why anyone wouldn't just browse on one, and basically he was right. You get more of the functions through the browser. (Though still can't embed).
Works fine on Android tablet
Buy them all try them out take the ones back ya didnt want....
Keep an eye out for deals on the Asus TF300T.woot.com,1saleaday.com,dailysteals.com, etc....
The Nexus 10 is awesome but doesn't have HDMI if I remember correctly. I personally wouldn't buy a tablet without HDMI (despite miracast sounding really cool).
The micro usb is duel and works as hdmi.
First, I'm disappointed in those of you who claim Apple users don't know what's good for them in this discussion. I was a Windows user for years and suffered through the common complaints of crashes, frozen windows, etc., etc. After Sony, Toshiba and Dell, I finally made the switch to a MacBook Pro. Best decision I ever made on this front. I have now had two MBP's and have NEVER had a problem with either one of them. They are fast, efficient, easy to use, and reliable. Furthermore, they have software that takes care of my particular needs, whether it is creating presentations, creating word documents, consuming media, ripping/burning discs, surfing, making/editing movies, you name it.
I had an Asus Transformer tablet because I believed the iPad was overpriced. The Transformer was a good tablet. However, I can do more on the iPad. I have the 3rd generation, with a beautiful screen and all the apps I need, most all of which have been free. I have messed around on other Android tablets; I just like the tablet experience for most of the reasons already listed on this thread.
One of the reasons I prefer the iPad and MacBook Pro's is that, in my opinion, their touch interface is superior to the others. The touch screen on the iPad is the most responsive in my experience. The trackpad and ten finger usability on the Pro is the best experience in my opinion. There are advantages and disadvantages for sure, but I have never felt limited.
In fact, I have an Android phone, downloaded the free application- FoxFi, and now use my phone as a wireless hot spot for the iPad (for free since Verizon wants to gouge users who pay for a hotspot when you already have a data plan). I bought the Android Razr Maxx because iPhone was not 4G ready when I upgraded. Now, I believe the iPhone 5 is the best handset for my type of use. I'm not an Apple "fanboy," I simply love their products and believe their build quality is superior to most competitors. My MBPro is a brick of unibody aluminum for instance. I totally respect those who find Android or Windows to be best for them. I believe the Google Play store and Apple App store have most all of the apps anyone really needs.
***By the way, I also use Apple TV and Airplay to stream content to my 55 inch 1080p- television wirelessly, and Roku in other areas of the home. Yes, I do like my gadgets.
Better specs + Nexus=unfiltered Google experience. Screen is amazing, and has a great feel in your hands. Dev community will undoubtedly support the hell out of this thing as they have with all Nexus devices. And getting the latest updates to Android is a big deal. If you buy a tablet with a custom UI like Touchwiz or whatever Asus has you will have to wait months to get the latest Android.
BTW love then when presented with two choices, a bunch of people on here have to say "iPad." Obviously, you've done the research and know what you want.
The prime has a clean 4.1 jelly bean. I due prefer the nexus products (4 and 7 owner). With the full size tablet I have a prime with keyboard. It is wonderful for everyday use. I rarely use a laptop now. Gaming on prime with keyboard and ps3 control also rocks. Both great choices.
iProducts have Clash of Clans and that game is good. I should review all products like a 5th grader.