OT: UVA suspends all fraternities after Rolling Stones investigative report on gangrape
Not sure this is an appropriate topic, but it could definitely have widespread implications. And, UVA's president is Teresa Sullivan (former UofM provost). Link: http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/uva-suspends-fraternities-following-rolling-stone-campus-rape-investigation-20141122
Anyway, for anyone interested in the original Rolling Stone report: http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/a-rape-on-campus-20141119
It's definitely a...strong move. I'm sure it will be critiqued in the coming weeks. Could lead us down a slippery slope--a pretty extreme move rather than an attempt to reform anything.
EDIT: this comes a week after WVU suspended all greek life following the death of a student related to hazing
http://www.nola.com/education/index.ssf/2014/11/after_pledges_death_west_virgi.html
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:24 PM ^
Wonderful... my son just applied there
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:31 PM ^
Alcohol combined with men who think women are nothing but walking vaginas makes for an atmosphere where rape is not uncommon.
The "brah" culture sickens me. It's everything that is wrong with American males and nothing good.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:43 PM ^
You know what I really enjoy? Blanket statements.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:51 PM ^
cold, cold winter nights.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:55 PM ^
If all you do is study in a library and work your ass off, wouldn't you like to get laid occasionally also?!?
The fact that 20 year old men should stop pursuing sex is one of the most absurd assertions I've heard in a while.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:21 PM ^
Uh... what? Nobody is villanizing colleges guys for trying to get laid. It's the whole doing it without, you know, consent issue.
November 23rd, 2014 at 4:55 PM ^
generalizes well past "college guys".
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:38 PM ^
Nobody is saying that young men shouldn't pursue sex.
Everyone is saying that young men shouldn't be forcibly acquiring it.
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November 23rd, 2014 at 4:22 PM ^
If we just legalize- you know what- then this all goes away
November 23rd, 2014 at 4:52 PM ^
Do you honestly think frat guys don't smoke weed constantly?
I would say if anything Marijuana makes a person more likely to do this type of stuff, due to it making you very horny.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:11 PM ^
Let's be serious here.
These are a bunch of 20 year old guys who spend every waking hour either in the library or at class. Excuse me if they want to get laid every once in a while to blow some steam off.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:19 PM ^
Let's be real here. There's a world of difference between "blowing off steam and trying to (consensually) hook up" and what happened at UVa, which was gang rape.
November 23rd, 2014 at 2:24 PM ^
You are absolutely right. Why do some young boys (real men wouldn't do this) feel this is o.k.? How messed up are we when educated boys think this behavior is o.k.? What if this type of thing happened to their female relatives?
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:26 PM ^
you clearly didn't read this article, and if you did and THAT is your response, I hope any future children of yours are daughters.
read the article, then realize that those of us that have just read your "boys will be boys" response.
November 23rd, 2014 at 2:13 PM ^
I was in a fraternity and while we had our share of drinking and some people who were into drugs it was no higher or worse than the rest of the campus. There was never even a sniff of sexual misconduct and if there would have been we would have reported that person.
November 23rd, 2014 at 4:13 PM ^
If you never generalize you will never come to any decisions
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:37 PM ^
Could be worse...at least it wasn't your daughter that applied.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:56 PM ^
Let's be real here......
You don't have to worry about your son actually being accepted.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:41 PM ^
Not sure what you mean there... if you're saying that it's a slam dunk that he'll get in, you are probably right
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:31 PM ^
Mick jagger or Keith Richards who led the investigation?
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:47 PM ^
Yep, having to move your lips while reading a few pages of text is pretty taxing.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:20 PM ^
TLDR? I think you mean "ignorance is bliss"
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:50 PM ^
Thanks for commenting!
November 23rd, 2014 at 2:27 PM ^
Michigan guy can be proud of, right? Why read?
November 23rd, 2014 at 3:05 PM ^
How bout you leave the blog then and never come back?
This blog is for intelligent fans who can read and if you had you'd be sickened. No respect for those who'd pacify this issue.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:35 PM ^
The response from the fraternity basically said the usual junk about frats being a scapegoat, and that it's unfair because this stuff happens all over campus.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:39 PM ^
So should we ban football after the rape scandals at Vanderbilt and now UT?
Blanket generalizations gonna blanketly generalize, I guess.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:17 PM ^
Sometimes generalizations are generalizations for a reason!
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:28 PM ^
Don't forget michigan. And that way we don't need to worry about who the next coach would be.
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November 23rd, 2014 at 1:31 PM ^
A serious investigation into what about male culture and sites of male culture (like fraternities or, yes, football teams) drive behaviors and attitudes of sexual assualt is vitally necessary. Does this happen everywhere? Yes, which is even worse. But, the "not all men" or "not all fraternities" responses, while not incorrect, are not particularly helpful in addressing the core problem. Such reactions deflections at best.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:33 PM ^
And calling it "male culture" isn't the full story either. There are plenty of young women voluntarily going to these parties, getting wasted of their own volition, and then ostracizing rape victims afterwards.
November 23rd, 2014 at 3:19 PM ^
that's fair. the original rolling stone piece makes clear that the social hierarchy of UVA pressured all parties involved toward a cover up. that said, the site of this incident is a frat house and the social hierarchy in question revolves around the social scene and socializing of and in frat houses. in order to reap the precieved benefits UVA has to offer both women and men are left with little alternatives to enterning these male dominated spaces. i might have chickened out and gone with "male culture" for fear of getting slammed for saying "rape culture." such terminology often sparks a kind of hostile screaming match i always hope to avoid. that said, this UVA story is incredibly troubling and i only hope some serious reflection and redirection can come from it.
November 23rd, 2014 at 5:14 PM ^
It's a charged term, to be sure, but I can't think of any story I've read in recent memory that illustrates how it works better than this article. It works on so many levels here: the "friends" who showed no empathy for Jackie and were more worried about their social lives, the guy who brought her there who acted afterward like nothing wrong had happened, and the institutional practices that served to conceal the extent of the problem, among other things.
November 23rd, 2014 at 3:57 PM ^
It's not a bad point. I remember there were similar rape allegations at a fraternity at UM last year or two years ago, at a mixer with a sorority. I remember overhearing two other girls from that sorority complaining to one another that the girl (their sorority sister) totally fucked them over by going to the authorities and that nobody would want to mix with them going forward. It's a much bigger issue than just guys.
November 23rd, 2014 at 2:05 PM ^
It's really not that complicated to see evolutionarily. All signs in humans point to sperm and mate competition throughout history.
November 23rd, 2014 at 4:18 PM ^
breaking free from evolution is the ultimate in evolving
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:48 PM ^
Sullivan's letter was certainly heartfelt...........One hopes that something positive comes of this.
Further, I highly doubt that she consented to being violated by seven (7) fraternity brothers that fateful evening. If prosecutions occurs successfully, those boys will have some time to spend thinking about their awful actions.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:53 PM ^
Course, she appointed an alum of the frat in question to investigate/reevaluate their sexual assault policies. And since the woman's account makes it sound very much like an initiation ritual...
Actual things she's done have been less impressive than her statements, let's put it that way.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:53 PM ^
the horrendous response of the student's "friends." didn't want to report the rape because two of the guys were rushing at other frats and didn't want to be ostracized. the girl asked her if she wanted to part of something that would paint uva in a negative light. jesus christ people can be sick fucks.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:26 PM ^
I was also appalled by that. "Look, I know you just got gang-raped, but telling people would really put a damper on our partying, so let's just keep it quiet, alright?" Great friend, right there.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:30 PM ^
Sadly, that's not an uncommon response.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:58 PM ^
Go to the police. Why is that not the standard advice from these admintrators to the victims. The response from the first victim's friends in the article borders on unbelievable, I can't imagine anyone saying something like, "She's gonna be the girl who cried 'rape,' and we'll never be allowed into any frat party again." after your friend calls you at 3 in the morning saying that she had been raped.
It's doesn't even matter if the university had an effective internal system to deal with these cases. Its all confidential and leaves a rapist out there, even if you expell the perpetrator. Why are schools being set up as the primary investigative bodies of campus sexual assualts, its like the Catholic Church scandal again, but this time it is being encourage by the government.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:10 PM ^
Yeah this is definitely something that should go to the cops, full stop. If these allegations are true, the perpetrators should be in jail, not expelled.
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:42 PM ^
Prison*
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:46 PM ^
*gaol
November 24th, 2014 at 11:57 AM ^
http://america.aljazeera.com/watch/shows/america-tonight/articles/2014/…
Also, the police can't change your dorm room, allow you to make up exams, or provide any of the other academic support victims may need.
But what should I expect, honestly.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:58 PM ^
* Unspeakable things have happened to women at UVa. It's likely worse than average in that area.
* UVa administrators (with eyes on the school's $) are afraid of getting sued.
- - -
In speculating on why UVa's culture is like that, I'd have to get political, which is against the rules here.
November 23rd, 2014 at 12:59 PM ^
What about the due process rights of the dozens of fraternities on campus not implicated in the story?
November 23rd, 2014 at 1:20 PM ^
"[N]or shall any person . . . be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law . . . "
Nobody is being deprived of life, liberty, or property. They're not even being charged with crimes. They don't have some kind of natural right to be affiliated with the University.