well that's just, like, your opinion, man
That's one way to avoid football-related concussions.
Yeah, kid's a douche. Detroit, if they fire Schwartz...it's clear at this point that this regime's #1 issue IS. NOT. KNOWING. HOW. TO. SCREEN. KIDS. FOR. CHARACTER. I mean, tell me, who's going to pop up as the next arrest?
That would be awesome, but I think that even Martin Mayhew isn't that dumb. Nope, that's a Matt Millen move.
I don't think Mathieu plays WR.
No that would be an Al Davis move
He bypassed Janoris Jenkins because of character issues, so he's acutely aware of character issues being a problem. Unfortunately, he's had a pretty good season. When you strip down an entire roster and rebuild through the draft and affordable FA's, you run this risk.
Unfortunately, Schwartz was not the first choice as HC. No coach with name recognition wanted to take over an 0-16 team. If they knew Megatron would blow up, Stafford would be a top-10 QB and one of the best front sevens was here, Rex Ryan or some of the other available candidates may have jumped at the job.
Maybe we can outspend Dallas to get Sean Payton? Payton without Gregg Williams is a good get.
Sean Payton will be the Saints coach.
That's the Drew Sharp and Michael Rosenberg of the Dallas Morning News. They have no more credibility than me saying "Scotty Bowman should take over for Red when he retires." Because both came from the same place- our asses.
And if you think they should have gotten Rex Ryan, you'll probably have your chance. His seat is hotter than Schwartz's right now, and will likely be available.
But he was one of the hot coaching commodities that thought they could do better than the Lions.
I refuse to believe there's a Rosenberg equivalent somewhere. Drew Sharps are a dime a dozen, but wow, what did that poor hack writer do to you?
If Rex Ryan coaches in Dallas, he'd better keep his brother on the staff. The sports world deserves to see what happens when those two are working for Jerry Jones. They'd have to build another JerryWorld just to fit the egos.
People always say that the Lions skipped over Jenkins, but don't forget that he was taken early in the 2nd round. The Lions only bypassed him in that they took Reiff, a great prospect at a position of need, in the 1st.
You didn't say this, but I've seen a lot of people complain that the Lions took Broyles instead of Jenkins, totally ingoring the fact that Jenkins was gone by the Lions' pick in the 2nd round.
And it was known before the draft that Jenkins wasn't coming here unless something crazy happened like all the other CBs being taken in picks 1-22.
I find it funny that people would be upset about the Broyles pick thinking that Jenkins was still on the board. People really did that? Hilarious.
I think the Reiff pick was a good one. The Lions needed to attend to their OL. I'm definitely happy with it.
Mostly I've seen people who either didn't follow the draft or have forgotten where Jenkins was taken complain that the Lions passed up a CB to draft "just another WR."
EDIT: Not to mention, after the Burleson injury and the continuing nonsense with Young, that Broyles pick up isn't looking like too bad of an idea any more.
I would not like the Rex Ryan hire at all. He is a better coach than Schwartz, sure, but if we are firing Schwartz at the end of this season (which I doubt), it would be because the circus is finally getting out of hand more than the number of losses. The "rabid New York media" story angle that ESPN likes to trot out aside, Ryan has not yet shown that he can control (or even help Mayhew build) a team any better than Schwartz.
And Sean Payton is not coming here. If the Saint's somehow screw this up and lose him, then he'll be gone to Dallas. NO ONE outspends Jerry Jones...
before it spreads in the locker room.
Get rid of him. The guy has been underperforming on the field and a toxic personality. Broyles has shown to be a better target already, and without all the character issues.
You know, I commend Boise State for winning a bunch of games (against some high quality opponents) with a bunch of under-the-radar prospects; but you have to wonder if those guys stay under the radar for reasons like Young's behavior. I'm sure not every kid who goes to Boise State is this selfish, but yeah, this is one of the lamest things I've heard.
In general, I really don't like the direction the Lions are going. They have more talent now than they had a few years ago, but they've taken some risks on guys with questionable character (Fairley, Suh, Young, etc.) and it's biting them in the butt.
Pre Character Issue Lions:
On 3rd and 4, the other team gains 10 yards. The Lions look helpless.
Post Character Issue Lions:
On 3rd and 4, the other team is stuffed in the backfield for a 2 yard loss. The defense commits at least one of the following: Hands To the Face, Roughing the QB, Facemask, Late Hit. Team gets a fresh set of downs thanks to a 15 yard (+auto first down) call.
I have to say, I'm not enthused with the work of the defense staff or the HC here. This needs to be correct or seats need to get really hot, real fast.
As Ditka likes to say "you get what you tolerate" when it comes to behavior and penalties. Schwartz is firey and it costs his team. Look at the Thanksgiving Day Flag. It's OK to be emotional, but when you're emotional and wrong it costs your team.
The HC does it, and tolerates it from his players.
/I wish Schwartz the best, seemed like he had righted the ship, but either some people have to start gettting cut/benched/fined/something from the team, not just the league.
Serious question: how many of these guys had character issues prior to the Lions drafting them?
I remember Fairley being a really dirty player in college, but I don't remember Suh being nearly as bad as he is now. And I don't really remember any of these guys getting in legal trouble. The Lions are clearly at fault for not keeping their house in order, but I'm just curious as to how many were actually considered character issue guys at the time.
But what bothers me the most about him is his driving record. Dude needs to lose his license and/or get a driver.
We're not really privy to ALL the dirt that these general managers dig up prior to the draft, but Fairley had issues that were known to the public, and I never liked that pick. They've had guys getting arrested, getting multiple tickets, etc. and they have't done much about it. LeShoure has been arrested, Delmas, Fairley, etc. You have to make an example of someone and suspend them or cut them. Maybe this is a step in the right direction with benching Young, but they might need to go further than that...
They cut Berry in the offseason...Message sent!
I wouldn't characterize this as selfish, I would call it idiotic. A selfish motive would include the desire to be as successful as possible, which would help your team. Titus Young's behavior is just plain dumb, because it is detrimental to his career's success, as well as his team's success.
Ehh did those guys have character issues coming out out of college though or did it happen when they came to the NFL? I heard some rumblings about Fairely but I thought Suh was pretty well respected coming out of NU.
I have Broyles on my fantasy team. Boo-yah.
Although, it's a shame - as he's talented.
Haha same here. And guess who I dropped to get him?
What a tool. But on the plus side, at least Ryan Broyles is getting more playing time.
I don't understand the part about in-fighting among the coaches? Is there someone on the team defending Young's actions or character? WTF is going on up there?
Supposedly Shawn Jefferson (WR coach) and Scott Linehan (OC) were yelling at each other during the Green Bay game before realizing they were fighting over the same thing and they both wanted Titus benched. I chalk that up to the heat of the moment rather than actual disagreements.
Such an informative thread title.
Possible other thread title:
"OT-Titus Young. Wow, Titus Young purposefully lined up incorrectly because he wasn't getting as many looks as he wanted against the Packers. Anyone still want to see this diva in Detroit? http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/11/29/lions-benched-titus-youn... "
The anti-Roy Roundtree.
Or maybe he wasn't getting as many looks as he wanted because he was lined up in the wrong position...just sayin'.
I'd give him another chance but if he pulls anything like this again get rid of him.
I'm annoyed the Lions keep jeopardizing their chances in games with players acting selfishly. This was such a classless move by Young....
....and then a guy like Suh doesn't understand you don't have to KILL the quarterback when you hit him....just get him down and help the team or go for the ball force a fumble. It's like his one intent is to destroy the QB when he's in there and that's great as long as you do it within the rules.
Part of it on defense I think has to do with Gunther Cunningham. That guy is rough around the edges. Check out footage from Hard Knocks.
IIRC he is already on his 3rd chance.
1. The fight during camp
2. Some other game related item that for the life of me I cant remember right now, but it happened this year
Dude is a punk and needs to go.
He punched a saints player last year in the Sunday night game and was benched the rest of the game, he also headbutted Janoris Jenkins in the season opener against the Rams and was benched as well.
He's had a multitude of chances to redeem himself to his coaches and teammates and continually comes up looking like a punk.
Are you serious? The fact that the Lions have not yet booted his ass off the team is an indictment of both the head coach and the management. But I would expect nothing less from the nearly 50-year dumpster fire that the Lions have been under William Clay Ford Sr. and Jr.
But really, I can't ultimately blame the Fords. They know that regardless of how crappy the product on the field is, 60,000+ gullible saps will fork over their hard-earned money for each home game. Every few years, after Lions have drafted one or two good players with their string of high draft choices, they'll manage to put together a deceptively promising winning season against an easy schedule, get into the playoffs, and lose in the first round. Like clockwork, the next season's schedule is much more difficult, and the combo of lousy player personnel decisions and mediocre coaching will sink them right back down to the lower levels of their division. And then the cycle repeats itself.
your post is spot on and is exactly how I see it. A+ to you sir.
He turned that cycle into a 9 year career.
he made me a fan forever from his Hard Knocks appearance
By the way, it was also mentioned that Young motioned Tony Scheffler over to a different spot when Scheffler was actually lined up correctly. Everyone thought when that came out that Young simply didn't know the play. Very interesting to hear he was probably trying to sabotage Scheffler personally, too.
Young might very well have cost the team the game, as I recall more than a few Stafford passes that went absolutely nowhere and it looked like someone ran the wrong route. That being the case, fuck that guy.
He is not even worthy of a bench spot on my fantasy. Shame on you, Titus.
Release him! That's very selfish and I can't believe he was purposely do that. He deserves to go.
That behavior is unacceptable coming from a professional who is being paid to do a job. He should have to return his pay for the week of that game for voiding the terms of his contract. Luckily, the lions don't even need him, as Broyles looks like the better player and better person going forward.
It's unacceptable coming from a peewee league kid.
Have to admit, drafting Broyles still looks like a genius move now, doesn't it? The O-line and secondary still need improvements, but both played sort of respectably well enough to beat both Green Bay and Houston, and with Burleson hurt and Titus being a dickhead, Broyles is awfully important these days.
It still doesn't. Secondary is still trash which was known at draft time. Burleson got injured, and Young was #3 anyway. You can find a #3 wr anywhere, but the Lions still have no #1 cb (Houston is a #2) plus the safety play has been horrible.
Can't be THAT horrible when the Lions rank #12 in Pass D in the NFL. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCatego...
They couldn't stop Houston if their lives depended on it. They let Green Bay march right down the field for the game-winning score the week before that.
"Young’s teammates understandably don’t have his back anymore; top wideout Calvin Johnson indicated after the Thanksgiving game that he anticipates the Lions moving forward with rookie Ryan Broyles and newly acquired Mike Thomas in the lineup." - from the article
It seems like that when you have players on your team saying things like this, which to me indicate that they are prepared and willing to move on without Young even without any official move from management, that you might be hard-pressed to keep someone like Young even if you thought he could gather himself together long-term. That being said, sabotaging your own team's offense because you aren't getting enough attention is politely called "shitty". If indeed Johnson's statements are the sentiments of many in the clubhouse, then it would seem to me that Titus Young has effectively alienated himself as it is for this and past incidents - I don't know how he could really be an effective contributor now.
So pretty much he was purposely throwing the game with his actions and sending others in motion when they weren't supposed to be. Don't cut him, but sign him to you practice squad as an interior offensive lineman and let Suh body slam him and groin kick him for a few plays. Then cut him.
Kids a douche for messing up on purpose despite getting payed millions. However, it's still Pettigrew that worries me the most. That guy can't even catch when he wants to.
Pettigrew usually catches the ball then fumbles after a couple steps.
Mayhew has made some head scratching picks in every round other than round one since he took over. In most drafts unless someone falls like fairley, the mock drafts and media attention caused by the draft pretty much does the work for you it's the later rounds that make or break a gm.. The second round is where the real work begins.
trade him and get a 6th rounder out of it
you got mega, broyles, and thomas, and burleson unless he gets cut...
the lions overall are seriously cap screwed in 2013
the lions need to get rid of Raiola, Peterman, KVB, AVRIL,Backus, Young,Logan
our running game has sucked since Raiola has become a starter, never reaching higher than 19th overall, including 6 seasons of 30th or below...
This team cannot run block in the interior worth a daaam...Raiola and peterman are horrible....Leshoure could be so much more if this team could power run block...Backus is dependable, but not worth 7 mil
this team has no pass rush, i appreciate KVB's attitude and leadership, but he doesn't get to the QB anymore and his cap number of 10.6 mil next season is a joke, and Avril is not worth 10 Mil, and has benefited from Suh and Fairley more than anything.
Logan is useless, and to me is a below average kickoff returner, who has no value as a wr .just get mike thomas to handle those duties to free up a roster spot.
Scott Linehan needs to go, his play calling has been atrocious this season
Matt Stafford seems to have regressed in regards to mechanics
and martin mayhew did not address corner or safety really ( waiting til the 3rd round for a corner your biggest need) and didnt even draft a safety...so instead he gets jacob toast lacey and decides to get the bum of the month club off the streets....some piss poor evaluation of team need i say
expect another crappy 2013 season., cap screwed and no corners for us yet again....
i agree with all the line stuff, backus will probably retire very soon and raiola too. avril has shown this season why he didnt get a big contract in the offseason but we need the outside pass rushers and we arent getting anything from them consistently so suh just gets doubled in the middle and the secondary gets lit up. I just wish our secondary could make it through the season healthy, delmas and houston always seem to get banged up and we have back ups playing all over the place, i think getting bently and greenwood back will help next yearand even green has improved somewhat as the season has gone on. I'd like either a top round saftey or a new center/guard from the draft because i think that would help out the corners a lot. but the lions will still be fucked cause of the old CBA
Breaking news: Titus Young was just fired from Burger King for purposely making customer orders incorrectly. When asked why, Titus said he was upset that he has seen limited time as a cashier.
Unbelievable! Young better have a lot of cash in the bank because good luck finding a decent job after getting fire from a football team for sabotage. Damn!
I made a comment on a Lions thread before the season started about how I'd rather not have Titus on the team because his style of play and actions on (as well as off) the field seemed to point to him being an immature little kid with no impulse control and a complete inability to ever learn how to a professional, let alone an adult. I was promptly flamebaited. Yeah, the kid has clear talent, but this information is only further evidence that Titus is just not the type of guy I'd like to have on the team I've chosen to root for.
Par for the course around here. You could post a comment critical of Matt Millen's GM abilities and there'd be some knucklehead who'd neg you.
Credit to Chris Petersen at Boise State (like he needs more accolades - that guy's awesome) for keeping this kid in check when Young was a student there. It's a Chuck Daly/Dennis Rodman type situation.
Kudos, Mr. Petersen.
Happy Trails, Mr. Young.
I am disappointed, but not totally surprised . I had a feeling it was a matter of time before he started to smell his own ass. I thought he was going to a John Taylor to Megatron's Jerry Rice, but I guess he's has too much if an overinflated view of himself. He should be benched ASAP.
How do you line up in the wrong spot on offense? Wouldn't Stafford have looked over and said WTF? Move over. I don't buy this at all. Explain this. So Titus is lining up incorrect all game, but with the season on the line Stafford threw him a ton of balls? Stafford hit Titus to get down to the 10 on the crucial drive, threw to Titus on the critical 3rd down when he was interferred. On the last gasp drive he threw at Titus twice.
1+1 is not equaling 2 here.
A player who repeatedly sabotaged plays? Following a number of other discipline/attitude infractions?
Cut his ass. Anything less than that is absurd.
Raise your hand if you work at a company where you wouldnt be immediately fired on the spot for cause if you were discovered doing something to actively undermine the firm. As I thought....no hands up on this one.
This shouldnt even be a debate. The Lions should cut him and then demand all bonus dollars be returned and declare the contract null and void due to breach. There is no way that the coaching staff can command even the tiniest amount of respect from the other players if someone willfully trying to make the team lose is allowed to stay on board.
would rather have Titus Young Jr on my team
Considering the NFL is full of selfish players getting busted for DUIs, DWIs, physical abuse, blah, blah, blah, I'm not about to cut this kid over pulling the same crap that other players have done that's not putting someone's life at risk. That's what happens when you have kids go from living the entitlement lifestyle of big time athletics to the fast and rich lifestyle of the NFL.
Players routinely take plays off, "miss blocks" and yes stomp on players. They are all selfish acts. And the players on this team would welcome him back if he makes ammends because many of them have pulled crap before. Show me a player who would turn their back on Titus, that's picked up a stupid personal foul penalty to hurt his team, and I'll show you a hypocrite.
This isn't putting someone's life at risk, I guess, but this isn't his first taste of trouble:
There's no way that he should've suited up for the first game. Not only was the sucker punch gutless, but it was also against a team leader. I don't know what started all of it, but the sucker punch was wrong. And the discipline was once again weak. That's leading from behind.
I just think he has a redeemable career at only 23 and it can be done in Detroit. I don't think the pitchforks needs to be raised yet. If the report is true, they should've sat him the rest of the year without pay. Let him work his way back onto the team and if he can't do it, trade or cut him in the offseason.
Titus is supposedly spending practice picking up trash from the field. Has another player ever been punished in this manner? Just get rid of him already
I hear if that if picking up the trash doesnt get the point across to stop trying to actively undermine your team's chances for winning the Lions are prepared to get tough....I mean REALLY tough, tough, tough with young Titus and will have him do THIS:
I am all for guys with character issues if they come to play on Sundays.
They don't take away Super Bowl victories because one of your players smoked some crack.
This, though, is cause for immediate termination in any profession. Titus shouldn't be allowed in the facility. Walk him out. Ship him his personal effects.
WTF is wrong with people? Can't you just be happy playing football professionally and being a fucking millionaire? Jesus.
Thank you! Took the words out of my mouth!
Cannot have a guy on the team openly trying to sabotage the game plan. I heard on The Ticket yesterday that Titus might have a mental issue. He does, it's called being an idiot, which apparently is running rampant throughout society. Also, changing his name to Young Sr. Come on man, if you want attention (Ochocinco), start making some plays outside of garbage time! Lions need to cut this fool, or just figure out a way to make him a pro-bowler, then nobody would have to care.
He's taking initiative here- you have to do what you can to get out of that hopeless organization.
I don't have the points to start a new thread but I thought it may be relevant that Jonas Mouton is getting his first regular season game action since joining the league last year. Best of luck to him.
cool! best of luck to him
I thought he was on the bench because he couldn't catch the damn ball. Didn't think he needed to be a jerk to expedite that process; his play on the field was enough evidence.
Cut him. They should've done it immediately after the game. Too many guys getting in trouble and now we have a guy who is sabotaging our offense by being a total jackass just cause things aren't going his way.
Side note: how awesome is Broyles?? Criminally underrated in Madden 13, yet still catching TDs like crazy...
seems to have died down. people were up in arms about picking a WR and he's been really really good for us.
"Really really good for us" is questionable. I didn't have a problem with Broyles as a player, but the Lions didn't need a wide receiver. The biggest problem is the defense. The Lions have been drafting offensive skill players, defensive linemen, and Gosder Cherilus the last several years. Meanwhile, the secondary and linebackers aren't very good, and the Lions are 4-7.
So yeah, Broyles is playing well...but he's not helping us win many games.