The guy is going on 69 years old. There is no MJ, Kobe or Shaq on this team. The Knicks are owned by a total bufoon. I give Phil 2 seasons tops before he is out of there.
OT: Phil Jackson to Knicks
You might be right about him being gone in two years, but he's one of the best coaches in NBA history (along with Pat Riley, Magic Johnson, and Lawrence Frank). I wouldn't bet against him being able to turn them into a good team by either giving advice or taking over as coach. And the Knicks do have some talent; they just can't seem to mesh together.
Lawrence Frank. Maybe he will replace Woodson with him? Thats half the battle right there!
I was so adament about it i needed to say it twice!!
Didn't he offer to come back to coach the Lakers if he only had to coach home games? And he didn't do a very good job advising the Pistons on their coaching search either. With his age, I'd stay away from him. I think he has this arrogance about him right now where he thinks he can half ass something and still get the job done.
It's all a big publicity stunt to placate the fans who are fuming (so much so they're planning a protest outside the entrance to the arena). Working under James Dolan is a no win situation. The Knicks would be better off if that Cowboy guy who owned the team in the movie "Eddie" with Whoopie Goldberg still owned the team.
Disagree about the Knicks talent.
Once you get beyond Carmelo, who can opt out after this year (and this move is all about convincing him to stay) the Knicks are remarkably talent poor for the amount of salary they have committed. They have $50 million committed next year to three frontcourt players that are breaking down and that no other team has remote interest in ($23 million to Amare and his uninsurable knees, $14.5 million to Chandler, who's breaking down, and $12 million to Bargnani). Add in $12 million committed to JR Smith and the $9 million committed to Ray Felton over the following two years (ie 2015-16 season) and you have a team with very little flexibility in the short term.
They've also shipped away all but one of of their draft picks in the next three drafts. They retain only their 2015 first round pick.
About their only decent assets beyond Carmelo are THJ and Shumpert, who are also the guys they should keep as they're on inexpensive rookie deals.
I guess Jackson can try to sell Carmelo on one more tough year and then the opportunity to build around him once they clear the terrible frontcourt contracts, (plus the additional money the Knicks can offer), but Carmelo should really think hard about Houston, with no state taxes and the chance to play with Howard and Harden.
Amen. The Knicks are going to remain an unsalvagable mess without a huge roster shakeup or bionic knees for amare. Even Shumpert has regressed (shooting 37%) and struggled with injuries this year. Maybe Tim can learn something from Phil but I don't see him winning a ring in NY any time soon.
He's going to be the GM. The question is whether or not Dolan gives him leeway to actually be a GM. This is the guy who thought that re-hiring Zeke would be a good basketball move. If he gets out of Phil's way, the Knicks roster might actually become something worth working with.
As long as Dolan is owner and/or intimately involved with the team, the Knicks will stink - he may be the worst owner in pro sports.
Red Auerbach, Pat Reilly, Phil Jackson, and Greg Popovich (as either coaches or GMs) collectively are responsible for the vast majority of championships in NBA history, and if their team didn't win the title that year they were most likely the losing finals team. You would be absolutely beyond incompetent as an organization if you were presented the opportunity to have one of them involved in your organization in some capacity and turned the offer down.
Simply having the name "Phil Jackson" associated with you in a basketball context is a major win.
...he just wants to be Pat Riley, I don't think he'll see this as a hinderance to his legacy. He's still got RINGZ.
Yeah, I'm not really getting why he's coming back. The Knicks are turrible, and not in the "underperforming" sense as much as they have a couple of decent NBA players and then pretty much nothing. Maybe Jackson gets them to the 2nd round of the playoffs, but without a massive overhaul you are relying on Melo, Chandler, and a revolving cast of young guys and washed-up veterans.
Age might not be an issue, especially if his younger assistants are working the practices. Physically, standing on the sidelines in a suit isn't too hard. Only thing to worry about is the game time excitement of the Knicks games, which haven't been too exciting lately.
But he still has them to show off, so...Phil wins.
Don't worry - I've been a Knicks fan for 27 (mostly miserable) years. Hardaway is a good young player, so he'll be long gone soon. We'll probably trade Hardaway and our 2020 and 2022 first round picks this offseason for Steve Nash.
he'll go the same road as David lee, Wilson Chandler, channing Frye, Jeremy lin and anybody else the Knicks have drafted who showed some talent only to be replaced by a ten-years-ago baller whose knee cartilage was long gone before people figured out the question to Allen iverson's reverse-jeopardy answer... I love the Knicks, but I hate how they go about the business of building a team!
It's been "well-documented" that rings deserve grains of salt? By whom? Pistons fans?
and i dont think his rings deserve grains of salt...He has had great players, That doesnt always equate championships. The egos he has managed, i dont think people understand that.
if his rings deserved to be taken with a grain of salt. However, he has never won a ring in this copacity.He has never put a team together, or shown that he is capable of doing so. This Knicks roster is a hott mess though. Any GM would have their work cut out.
I don't know if his rings deserved to be taken with a grain of salt either. However, he has never won a ring without having absolutely elite talent.
about a decade ago, name me an NBA team that has won the Championship without elite talent?
Since Bird and Magic entered the NBA, the teams that have won the NBA title all had elite talent.
Pistons had elite talent. To say they didn't is crazy. They shut down Kobe and Shaq. They were elite.
They were a great team, but unlike Phil's teams, they didn't have multiple first ballot HOFers.
I think Phil's rings should be taken with a grain of salt. In both of his stints, he showed up once the super team was already in place, and he coached them. He's a great coach, but I don't think he's the "ZOMG he's the best coach ever because 11 rings."
However I can name quite a few of the "best players in the NBA" and elite talents who have never won without an elite coach... many of them who were great but didn't win until Phil showed up:
MJ, Kobe, Shaq, Duncan, etc. never won a title without an elite coach. The last few titles without an elite coach took 3 of the best players in the league teaming up and possibly colluding to do so (Celtics and Heat)
Decides to unleash THJ. Seems like one of the few bright sports for the Knicks.
He will take it or he has taken it? If it's the former, that's no different than what was reported yesterday.
If he has in fact taken the position, then that's one hell of a mess to take on - some awful contracts, not a whole lot of draft picks to speak of, and a culture that some of the previous Dolan hires seemed to wreck, and by some accounts, a culture that Dolan himself had a hand in wrecking. It does not seem like the Knicks have the infrastructure for this to work all that well, but I could be wrong there.
What I know of James Dolan is limited, but how much authority would he be willing to give Jackson?
From what I've gathered, Dolan is hyper-involved in decision-making, mostly to the detriment of the team. Jackson will be a strong personality, but I expect this to be a short and tumultuous relationship between the two. Hell, the one time a decent GM tried to keep it going there (Donnie Walsh), he basically left saying they were going to crash and burn by wasting any cap space on guys like Amare and trading away the future for Melo.
He is a hell of a coach. Remains to be seen how good of an executive he'll be, especially with an owner like Dolan.
this really does for the Knicks. I think it would've been cool for him to end up with the Pistons, but he's practically an unknown quantity in terms of personnel decisions. AFAIK, the only front office-type work he's done was consulting with the Pistons on their coaching search. That ended with Mo Cheeks getting fired after a few months. If I were a Knicks fan (thank god I'm not), my reaction would be "meh".
Phil gives me hope. at least the hire indicates that they recognize a problem and are willing to throw something at it...
largely undisputed facts:
1. Dolan is a nightmare as an owner--really only Sterling is more so
2. The Knicks don't have great pieces--current roster, Anthony as free agent, few draft picks and high payroll.
3. Jackson--while an egotistical prick--is a great coach and far from a stupid man.
Jackson must see something I'm missing. He doesn't need the money. He shouldn't need the ego fix.
Either this becomes a quickly aborted engagement or I think better days are ahead for the Knicks.
Sterling is a better owner than Dolan. Dolan is the flagship franchise of the whole league and can't do anything with it. Sterling plays second fiddle (by no choice of his own) in his own city to an absolute juggernaut. Sterling has not been a good owner at all, but he's had more stacked against him, and right now he has one of the best teams in the league.
Sterling's a better owner, but a worse human being...
that was what i really intended
OK, that's an entirely different discussion and I thought we were just talking about their abilility to do their jobs.
And I'm not trying to defend Donald Sterling or James Dolan, but lots of really rich dudes are also big time assholes. This is not a new thing.
Sterling plays second fiddle (by no choice of his own) in his own city to an absolute juggernaut.
Actually it is his choice. He bought the San Diego Clippers and moved them to Los Angeles. Later, he turned down the chance to move the franchise to Anaheim and instead decided to share the Staples Center with the Lakers.
OK that's fair, but that's not what I meant. And being in Anaheim isn't really moving - the Angels still play in the Dodgers shadow, and the Ducks do as well, to the handful of people who care about hockey. LA and OC aren't really different cities when it comes to sports.
Either way, that move was a long time ago. He had the choice between being in a small market like SD, or being second fiddle in a huge market. Since most of SD has always been Lakers fans anyway, that's like a distinction without a difference, or however that saying goes.
Won't change a whole lot for at least another five years. Too much of a dumpster fire there.
Considering THJ is the next Michael Jordan, I disagree.
I don't see how on earth Jackson and Dolen can work together. Phil with his be chill-zen like mentality. And Dolen with his domineering, micro managing style.
Oh yeah, this will go well
The chipotle counter is the most intriguing aspect of it all to me. Thanks for confirming my dinner choice.
Phil Jackson, impersonating Marv Albert, while dressed in women's lingerie, saying "with authority!"
No rings for THJ as long as he's with the Knicks, he'll be gone before that ship gets turned around. This is either a paycheck while working in New York, or a move to get a job with another team. He will not work well with Dolan, nobody with a brain and self respect does, but it won't affect his coaching legacy so why not get the front office experience. If not within two days, then within two years he is working in the front office in LA. And the Knicks still suck.